Investor · Roseville, CA · Member since 2016 · 893 posts · 1k+ votes
9y
What about VRBO, Flipkey, HomeAway, Tripping.com, etc.? They may be more geared towards vacation homes but they are all still short term rental companies.
Investor · Roseville, CA · Member since 2016 · 893 posts · 1k+ votes
9y
What about VRBO, Flipkey, HomeAway, Tripping.com, etc.? They may be more geared towards vacation homes but they are all still short term rental companies.
Investor · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2016 · 107 posts · 62 votes
9y
As Jon mentioned HomeAway (which owns vrbo) are owned by Expedia which also owns search engines Hotels.com, Hotwire.com, trivago, Venere.com, Travelocity, Orbitz.
As a vrbo host our STR can be seen across multiple platforms. Personally, we get more leads from vrbo and longer stays from the guests than with Airbnb...that's just our personal experience, but we'll continue to use both platforms.
Manvel, TX · Member since 2014 · 309 posts · 127 votes
9y
@Jeff Graves, I was initially put off by the yearly VRBO fee, but as I've thought about it, that 3% from AirBnB adds up. How do your costs compare for the 2 platforms? Also, I've heard that VRBO brings in lots more inquiries from potential guests with questions who don't end up booking. As we all know, those kinds of inquiries suck up a lot of time. Has this been your experience?
Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2016 · 533 posts · 433 votes
9y
@Nick Winikoff is this marketing research for Vuepeer.com? Airbnb gets the brunt of my business but I think it has to do with the market my VR's reside in. I do receive about 10% of my short term bookings from Homeaway, however they do provide leads for longer term stays.
Investor · Fort Worth, TX · Member since 2016 · 107 posts · 62 votes
9y
@Leigh Ann Smith yeah the annual fee at vrbo is a much better deal than 3% for each guest booking.
Vrbo more inquiries that don't book? That may have been the case PRIOR to vrbo providing the Instant Booking feature, similar to Airbnb. I do get some inquiries that don't book, but even if I was booking 50% of those inquires...I'll take that because I'm getting more leads from vrbo than airbnb.
Frankly my responses to inquiries don't take that much time. Most are canned responses with a personal twist. I just copy and paste from a previous email I've sent.
Now, I'll be honest...I do promote my vrbo link, not airbnb's. For the most part I prefer vrbo's platform, and access to guests contact information...(not some dynamic email address airbnb generated).
Manvel, TX · Member since 2014 · 309 posts · 127 votes
9y
Thanks, @Jeff Graves! It might be worth it for me to try a year of VRBO and see how it goes. Our 2 tiny houses were booked pretty heavily Feb - April, but it's slowed up a lot for May. Fortunately I have a traveling nurse who has reserved one of the houses for 2 weeks of the month for the next few months (at a significant discount, but 2 weeks is great anyway).
Good point about the canned responses. I do that with AirBnB already. VRBO guests probably have the same kinds of questions. I have the templates on my phone, so I can respond fairly easily. I like the idea of direct access to the guest. I like to send my guests a link to a video showing how to drive in since it's a bit complicated, but I can't send it through AirBnB.
Raleigh, NC · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 5 votes
9y
@Michael Greenberg It's not necessarily market research for Vuepeer. More of a conversation starter on how people feel about the future of a growing industry.
The reason I asked the question is because even though there are other successful companies such as VRBO, HomeAway, Flipkey. Which all have huge parent companies Expedia for the first 2 and Tripadvisor for the last, Airbnb is far and away the largest and most successful.
Most people seem to be unaware of any other companies apart from Airbnb. I am curious if anyone has any interesting perspective on when the other companies will join Airbnb in its notoriety.
Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2016 · 143 posts · 68 votes
9y
a little bit off the topic. I am bit pessimistic about the whole short term rental business. in Seattle where I live, city is going to pass new law to restrict one listing for vacation short term rental. it's just matter of time they will shut it down completely. the biggest challenge of this business is government regulations.
Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
9y
Well, just looked at vuepeer and when doing a search under Atlanta for 1 person or even 2 , nothing comes up. Clearly, that would not exactly entice any potential guest to book with them and thus as a host I wouldn't add myself to the platform.
I understand that it's difficult to start, because you need all of it to function: host property, guests and name recognition. But.....
Investor · Roseville, CA · Member since 2016 · 893 posts · 1k+ votes
9y
@Nick Winikoff@Jeff Graves AirBNB is only 5% of my bookings and I utilize Evolve to feed all the major sites and handle all payment and booking details so that is another layer to think about. Have you reached out to look at partnerships with companies like Evolve @Nick Winikoff?
I think a bigger question will be how local, state and even federal laws will drive the STR business in the future. Those companies that pay attention to STR advocacy will likely become the favorites for those who are directly impacted by any lobbying efforts provided by those companies for their local regions. Just more food for thought. :)
Are you finding Evolve worth your 10% plus 2.5% in credit card processing? They sound good but they're from the west and I'm not confident in their east coast network. Do you only advertise on those two platforms?
In any case, I'm deciding if I want to 1) use VRBo etc and airbnb myself and hire out my cleaners 2) pay Evolve 12.5% for marketing and card processing and continue to hire out my cleaners or 3) pay a local Vaca PM 21% for marketing, conversing, booking, including the credit card costs.
#3 option will pay my first year's $399 fee for vrbo. Thoughts???
Google Portland, OR's grassroots movement to get the laws on their side, once they became educated to how much money they'd stand to make of them, they saw the light. Win-win but only after advocating and education. It's your business, wouldn't you do the same?
Investor · Roseville, CA · Member since 2016 · 893 posts · 1k+ votes
9y
@Nancy Bachety Good point Nancy! They are a west coast company but their model is seems regionally independent from what I can tell. I guess the big question would be just making sure their call center is open and flexible to east coast hours of operation.
For me it's worth it because it simply a matter of my value in time and still fits in my cash flow analysis. Basically I don't have to worry about anything until the guest opens the front door and then I'm on and all the money flows in and out correctly and all the guests questions are answered by them prior to the stay. They also do a nice job of the automation of the process which fits into my operational workflow very well.
There customer service is super responsive and they will even ask the uncomfortable questions to guests that I do not want (e.g. I have a 30 year old age policy to book and if look on Facebook and they do not look 30, they will go thru the due diligence of making sure they are).
I have had a couple of slow tickets requests the last few months but I think that had to do with the fact they are trying to catch up to their business demand. I have also noticed that every since VRBO was bought by Expedia, they have had to change some of their policies that I do not like, BUT, since I'm grandfathered in I don't have to follow those yet.
I like that my property shows up everywhere I look (AirBNB, VRBO, HomeAway, Expedia, etc.) however I often do my own due diligence on each site to make sure everything looks good. They are fast to respond to fix any issues.
Take from that what you will, if you would like to have a deeper discussion feel free to PM me and we can setup a call to discuss further. I'm actually meeting with a friend right now who is asking me similar questions. :)
Could you please tell me the dates you put into the search in Atlanta? Or possibly the type of browser you are using?
@Jon Crosby : What we are trying to startup is a search engine that brings all these companies together in one convenient place. We do not handle any payments or host any properties.
Raleigh, NC · Member since 2017 · 27 posts · 5 votes
9y
@Harrison Liu I think your right that government regulation will eventually slow the rapid growth. But if you look specifically at Seattle's case they are still allowing short-term rentals on the surrounding islands that have always been supported by short-term rentals. I suspect that these rules will be challenged in court, because why should some people be allowed to do it and not others.
Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2016 · 143 posts · 68 votes
9y
@Nick Winikoff
don't get me started on progressive socialist city council of Seattle. Republicans here actually proposed Seattle forms it's own county so that people will have a normal life in king county, lol. if any influence, it is Seattle pushes neighbors to follow its policies, no the other way around. give you another example, city council is considering landlords disclose to tenants where they spend rent money collected from tenants. it is absurd and insane.
I searched St Augustine FL June 24- 30 2 guests and got no results.
BUT, as I have been personally torn between how best to self-manage or PM my STVR, I couldn't help but think that there's got to be a better way. Why join and sign up for so many options? Why so many platforms? Some hosts even build their own website. Why can't I write an app that aggregates all of them?
I think your business model has a lot of merit and potential.
Now, if I could only find my rental on Vuepeer.com....
As per Augustine FL, we don't have any listings there simply because none of our partners has hosts listing on their properties in St. Augustine. We are working hard to acquire as many partnerships as possible to give the most diverse selection of properties around the world.
Flagstaff, AZ · Member since 2017 · 17 posts · 9 votes
9y
I use VRBO and Airbnb. I think the yearly fee for VRBO is worth it, but they also charge a credit card transaction fee for each booking, which is about 3%. VRBO has adopted some of the features that Air has, like the Instant Book. It seems like Air is more "Traveler" friendly than "Host" friendly. My bookings seem to be around 50/50 for each listing. Some months it's all Airbnb; other times VRBO. My short-term (1-4 month) rentals and inquiries have all come from VRBO.
I am also wary of government regulations. Luckily, my state passed legislation that disallows cities to outlaw vacation rentals. Which is awesome. However, my rental is under an HOA so I constantly have in the back of my mind that they might regulate vacation rentals. At that point we would just rent long-term.
But my advise is to use both platforms to advertise your rental. More exposure. And a $399 yearly rate really isn't that bad, especially if you can cash flow $1000 a month.
When you say partners, who do you mean? the usual rental platforms and/or others like them? Sounds like a future "Bigger Pockets" for vacation rentals. VRMB (Matt Landau) does a nice job of promoting the industry.
I found about 6 vacation rental property managers in a few seconds last night when I was searching for one in my area. I didn't like any of their property search tools. Of course, I'd have to turn to one of the big ones if I wanted to rent a week. Relying on only one platform can work well for someone who isn't seriously or actively renting.
Do you need permissions from the platforms to pull their listings onto an aggregator's site? How does vuepeer get paid as an aggregator, and how would the listing platform make their money?
Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2016 · 533 posts · 433 votes
9y
@Nick Winikoff Understood and an interesting topic for discussion. IMHO and limited marketplace exposure Airbnb's market strategy appears different than the other Expedia / TripAdvisor companies, and they appeal to a different crowd. I see millennials and younger generations booking via AIrbnb and a more mature crowd booking through the Homeaway (I get nothing from anyone else and refuse to use Booking.com any more). It is becoming somewhat of a crowded space, yet still growing - for now. As with all business, it begs the question: "At what point will it saturate and margins begin to suffer?" Airbnb scares me though (love/hate relationship) as I believe they are wiggling their way closer to the guest and working hard to keep Hosts (their customers) at arms length. However, I also believe there are opportunities for "boutique" booking sites (possibly Vuepeer - it would be interesting to understand how you differentiate yourself)and solutions like Evolve as @Jon Crosby described, however they too are getting closer to the guest and from what I understand have acquired properties of their own. As for "mainstream" it's all about funding, marketing and "scalability"; Airbnb has all three.