Almost in escrow on a house in Cleveland. Would like input.

Almost in escrow on a house in Cleveland. Would like input.

Sacramento 路 Member since 2019 路 54 posts 路 24 votes

I am in the final stages of negotiations on a house in Cleveland. I have owned many rentals in California, but since I reached the conclusion that my beloved state is not the best place to invest at the moment, I started to look for opportunities in different states. My first idea was to find a sf property close to a university and rent it room by room to students. With that working premise I began to narrow my search to 4+ bedrooms, less than 20 years old and less than 1 mile from a university. I may have found the only 10 homes in the country that fit that description for under $150k. 


I became fascinated with Ohio, but while searching there I decided to consider unmarrying from the student rental. Anyway, the property I am about to buy is 2262 E 73rd Street, Cleveland. A few things I like about this property are that it is 20 years old, has a legal basement making it a 5 bedroom, and it is currently being rented room by room.  The current landlord does not allow pets, also a plus.

With 5 bedrooms available, 70% occupancy, and $400 per, I only get a cap rate of 6%. That's with $250/month toward maintenance and $200 pm. Hopefully I can beat the occupancy, room rent and maintenance, if not the pm.

We have agreed on $128.5k. The AC needs a $3000 repair. I will be paying cash.

There are currently two tenants paying $400/month each. The seller has offered to place a 3rd during escrow, but I declined. I want to vacate the basement, which currently has one of the tenants, and put in a door to the outside. Then I would like to make this an abnb apartment. In my view there are needs for strs in nearly every area. I won't be shooting for a sky high occupancy, just enough to net more than the $5-600 I could get with a longer term tenant.

If anyone wants to evaluate my idea I'd appreciate it.

Ryan
 

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Real Estate Broker 路 Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH 路 Member since 2013 路 30k+ posts 路 20k+ votes
3y
Quote from @Ryan Rock:

I am in the final stages of negotiations on a house in Cleveland. I have owned many rentals in California, but since I reached the conclusion that my beloved state is not the best place to invest at the moment, I started to look for opportunities in different states. My first idea was to find a sf property close to a university and rent it room by room to students. With that working premise I began to narrow my search to 4+ bedrooms, less than 20 years old and less than 1 mile from a university. I may have found the only 10 homes in the country that fit that description for under $150k. 


I became fascinated with Ohio, but while searching there I decided to consider unmarrying from the student rental. Anyway, the property I am about to buy is 2262 E 73rd Street, Cleveland. A few things I like about this property are that it is 20 years old, has a legal basement making it a 5 bedroom, and it is currently being rented room by room.  The current landlord does not allow pets, also a plus.

With 5 bedrooms available, 70% occupancy, and $400 per, I only get a cap rate of 6%. That's with $250/month toward maintenance and $200 pm. Hopefully I can beat the occupancy, room rent and maintenance, if not the pm.

We have agreed on $128.5k. The AC needs a $3000 repair. I will be paying cash.

There are currently two tenants paying $400/month each. The seller has offered to place a 3rd during escrow, but I declined. I want to vacate the basement, which currently has one of the tenants, and put in a door to the outside. Then I would like to make this an abnb apartment. In my view there are needs for strs in nearly every area. I won't be shooting for a sky high occupancy, just enough to net more than the $5-600 I could get with a longer term tenant.

If anyone wants to evaluate my idea I'd appreciate it.

Ryan
 

1. It's in the hardcore ghetto. See all those vacant lots? That means fixing up the houses would cost way more than they are worth so owners walked away. Then the city eventually tore them down as vacant houses like that get used as trap houses and places to hide dead bodies etc...

2. You are paying way too much for it.

3. Rent by the room means your tenants are transient junkies, felons or hookers.

4. Getting a quality property management company to work for you in this neighborhood will be next to impossible. All of the bigger firms, (mine included) would turn down this putting this property in their portfolio. Neighborhood is too crappy, makes it too hard to retain employees when you are sending them into bombed out slums.

5. There is nothing good about you making this investment other than the fact that you'll probably call me to sell it at a loss in 6 months.......That's not really all that good for you, but it's great for me so I say go for it lol.

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  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant 路 Summerlin, NV 路 Member since 2014 路 45k+ posts 路 66k+ votes
    3y

    why would anyone air bnb a basement in a house full shared tenants ???  that sounds like very poor accommodations.  Are you sure anyone would rent that as a str.  I tried the shared housing on low end units its a nightmare your dealing with tenants with very limited income and almost always a ton of drama.

    Cleveland has some nice 2 to 3 to 4 units which run as standard small plexs and you can buy those on the WEST side of town for 130 to 200k.. rents will be 700 plus per apartment..  just sayin..

    I think your looking at a ton of management hassles trying to shoe horn folks into shared living. 

  • Rental Property Investor 路 Brooke Park Drive 路 Member since 2018 路 1k+ posts 路 2k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Ryan Rock:

    I am in the final stages of negotiations on a house in Cleveland. I have owned many rentals in California, but since I reached the conclusion that my beloved state is not the best place to invest at the moment, I started to look for opportunities in different states. My first idea was to find a sf property close to a university and rent it room by room to students. With that working premise I began to narrow my search to 4+ bedrooms, less than 20 years old and less than 1 mile from a university. I may have found the only 10 homes in the country that fit that description for under $150k. 


    I became fascinated with Ohio, but while searching there I decided to consider unmarrying from the student rental. Anyway, the property I am about to buy is 2262 E 73rd Street, Cleveland. A few things I like about this property are that it is 20 years old, has a legal basement making it a 5 bedroom, and it is currently being rented room by room.  The current landlord does not allow pets, also a plus.

    With 5 bedrooms available, 70% occupancy, and $400 per, I only get a cap rate of 6%. That's with $250/month toward maintenance and $200 pm. Hopefully I can beat the occupancy, room rent and maintenance, if not the pm.

    We have agreed on $128.5k. The AC needs a $3000 repair. I will be paying cash.

    There are currently two tenants paying $400/month each. The seller has offered to place a 3rd during escrow, but I declined. I want to vacate the basement, which currently has one of the tenants, and put in a door to the outside. Then I would like to make this an abnb apartment. In my view there are needs for strs in nearly every area. I won't be shooting for a sky high occupancy, just enough to net more than the $5-600 I could get with a longer term tenant.

    If anyone wants to evaluate my idea I'd appreciate it.

    Ryan
     

     Thanks for the heads up. Sent my offer over for 130k.   Jk

  • Sacramento 路 Member since 2019 路 54 posts 路 24 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:

    why would anyone air bnb a basement in a house full shared tenants ???  that sounds like very poor accommodations.  Are you sure anyone would rent that as a str.  I tried the shared housing on low end units its a nightmare your dealing with tenants with very limited income and almost always a ton of drama.

    Cleveland has some nice 2 to 3 to 4 units which run as standard small plexs and you can buy those on the WEST side of town for 130 to 200k.. rents will be 700 plus per apartment..  just sayin..

    I think your looking at a ton of management hassles trying to shoe horn folks into shared living. 


     i appreciate that input. my experience with renting to families is that they try to take over and become territorial. 

    No pets allowed currently and I think it will be easier to keep it that way.

    . The drama part is a good point. 

    For your rhetorical question about the str basement I'll answer rhetorically. have you seen some of the crazy stuff people rent on abnb?

    After I try this if it doesn't work I can easily switch to a different business model

  • Sacramento 路 Member since 2019 路 54 posts 路 24 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Account Closed:
    Quote from @Ryan Rock:

    I am in the final stages of negotiations on a house in Cleveland. I have owned many rentals in California, but since I reached the conclusion that my beloved state is not the best place to invest at the moment, I started to look for opportunities in different states. My first idea was to find a sf property close to a university and rent it room by room to students. With that working premise I began to narrow my search to 4+ bedrooms, less than 20 years old and less than 1 mile from a university. I may have found the only 10 homes in the country that fit that description for under $150k. 


    I became fascinated with Ohio, but while searching there I decided to consider unmarrying from the student rental. Anyway, the property I am about to buy is 2262 E 73rd Street, Cleveland. A few things I like about this property are that it is 20 years old, has a legal basement making it a 5 bedroom, and it is currently being rented room by room.  The current landlord does not allow pets, also a plus.

    With 5 bedrooms available, 70% occupancy, and $400 per, I only get a cap rate of 6%. That's with $250/month toward maintenance and $200 pm. Hopefully I can beat the occupancy, room rent and maintenance, if not the pm.

    We have agreed on $128.5k. The AC needs a $3000 repair. I will be paying cash.

    There are currently two tenants paying $400/month each. The seller has offered to place a 3rd during escrow, but I declined. I want to vacate the basement, which currently has one of the tenants, and put in a door to the outside. Then I would like to make this an abnb apartment. In my view there are needs for strs in nearly every area. I won't be shooting for a sky high occupancy, just enough to net more than the $5-600 I could get with a longer term tenant.

    If anyone wants to evaluate my idea I'd appreciate it.

    Ryan
     

     Thanks for the heads up. Sent my offer over for 130k.   Jk


     i wish you werent kidding almost 馃槃

  • Real Estate Broker 路 Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH 路 Member since 2013 路 30k+ posts 路 20k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Ryan Rock:

    I am in the final stages of negotiations on a house in Cleveland. I have owned many rentals in California, but since I reached the conclusion that my beloved state is not the best place to invest at the moment, I started to look for opportunities in different states. My first idea was to find a sf property close to a university and rent it room by room to students. With that working premise I began to narrow my search to 4+ bedrooms, less than 20 years old and less than 1 mile from a university. I may have found the only 10 homes in the country that fit that description for under $150k. 


    I became fascinated with Ohio, but while searching there I decided to consider unmarrying from the student rental. Anyway, the property I am about to buy is 2262 E 73rd Street, Cleveland. A few things I like about this property are that it is 20 years old, has a legal basement making it a 5 bedroom, and it is currently being rented room by room.  The current landlord does not allow pets, also a plus.

    With 5 bedrooms available, 70% occupancy, and $400 per, I only get a cap rate of 6%. That's with $250/month toward maintenance and $200 pm. Hopefully I can beat the occupancy, room rent and maintenance, if not the pm.

    We have agreed on $128.5k. The AC needs a $3000 repair. I will be paying cash.

    There are currently two tenants paying $400/month each. The seller has offered to place a 3rd during escrow, but I declined. I want to vacate the basement, which currently has one of the tenants, and put in a door to the outside. Then I would like to make this an abnb apartment. In my view there are needs for strs in nearly every area. I won't be shooting for a sky high occupancy, just enough to net more than the $5-600 I could get with a longer term tenant.

    If anyone wants to evaluate my idea I'd appreciate it.

    Ryan
     

    1. It's in the hardcore ghetto. See all those vacant lots? That means fixing up the houses would cost way more than they are worth so owners walked away. Then the city eventually tore them down as vacant houses like that get used as trap houses and places to hide dead bodies etc...

    2. You are paying way too much for it.

    3. Rent by the room means your tenants are transient junkies, felons or hookers.

    4. Getting a quality property management company to work for you in this neighborhood will be next to impossible. All of the bigger firms, (mine included) would turn down this putting this property in their portfolio. Neighborhood is too crappy, makes it too hard to retain employees when you are sending them into bombed out slums.

    5. There is nothing good about you making this investment other than the fact that you'll probably call me to sell it at a loss in 6 months.......That's not really all that good for you, but it's great for me so I say go for it lol.

  • Sacramento 路 Member since 2019 路 54 posts 路 24 votes
    3y

    don't sugar coat it! 

    I really appreciate this input. 

    You're right, there are vacant lots in this area. I didn't see any noticeable blight nearby on the video calls or searching google earth, which I realize isn't necessarily updated. I have heard that newer houses like this were built in areas as you describe with incentives from the city. Does that ring true to you? That seems consistent with what you are saying. The age of the home caught my eye but I'm not ambitious enough to be the guy who tries to turn a bad neighborhood around.

    Where would be a better part of Cleveland to look?

    I've also found a place less than a mile from University of Akron. It's also 20 years old. I think it could realistically be rented to students. What do you think of that area? 

  • Investor 路 Malakoff, TX 路 Member since 2017 路 2k+ posts 路 2k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Jay Hinrichs:

    why would anyone air bnb a basement in a house full shared tenants ???  that sounds like very poor accommodations.  Are you sure anyone would rent that as a str.  I tried the shared housing on low end units its a nightmare your dealing with tenants with very limited income and almost always a ton of drama.

    Cleveland has some nice 2 to 3 to 4 units which run as standard small plexs and you can buy those on the WEST side of town for 130 to 200k.. rents will be 700 plus per apartment..  just sayin..

    I think your looking at a ton of management hassles trying to shoe horn folks into shared living. 

    Yes, he'd be frequently dealing with the police as well as the tenants.
  • Real Estate Broker 路 Cleveland Dayton Cincinnati Toledo Columbus & Akron, OH 路 Member since 2013 路 30k+ posts 路 20k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Ryan Rock:

    don't sugar coat it! 

    I really appreciate this input. 

    You're right, there are vacant lots in this area. I didn't see any noticeable blight nearby on the video calls or searching google earth, which I realize isn't necessarily updated. I have heard that newer houses like this were built in areas as you describe with incentives from the city. Does that ring true to you? That seems consistent with what you are saying. The age of the home caught my eye but I'm not ambitious enough to be the guy who tries to turn a bad neighborhood around.

    Where would be a better part of Cleveland to look?

    I've also found a place less than a mile from University of Akron. It's also 20 years old. I think it could realistically be rented to students. What do you think of that area? 


     You had video calls with someone in Cleveland who didn't notice that they were in the middle of a warzone? I'd probably stop working with that person and give The Ultimate Guide to Grading Cleveland Neighborhoods a read.

  • Real Estate Agent 路 Cleveland, OH 路 Member since 2020 路 67 posts 路 83 votes
    3y

    Hi Ryan- I would second what Mr @James Wise mentioned. This property is not in an area that I would recommend investing in. You could very easily purchase a good property in a typical C class area with that $131.5k. Even if you lose your earnest money --- I would recommend you get out of this contract as fast as you can... and definitely do not take the advice of whoever gave the green-light on this one. If you are looking for good advice then check out the Holton-Wise property group youtube channel. I would be more than happy to help place offers as well since I am investor focused agent here in Cleveland and like to think I have some integrity and at least enough market knowledge to not recommend an area like this. 

  • Sacramento 路 Member since 2019 路 54 posts 路 24 votes
    3y
    Quote from @James Wise:
    Quote from @Ryan Rock:

    don't sugar coat it! 

    I really appreciate this input. 

    You're right, there are vacant lots in this area. I didn't see any noticeable blight nearby on the video calls or searching google earth, which I realize isn't necessarily updated. I have heard that newer houses like this were built in areas as you describe with incentives from the city. Does that ring true to you? That seems consistent with what you are saying. The age of the home caught my eye but I'm not ambitious enough to be the guy who tries to turn a bad neighborhood around.

    Where would be a better part of Cleveland to look?

    I've also found a place less than a mile from University of Akron. It's also 20 years old. I think it could realistically be rented to students. What do you think of that area? 


     You had video calls with someone in Cleveland who didn't notice that they were in the middle of a warzone? I'd probably stop working with that person and give The Ultimate Guide to Grading Cleveland Neighborhoods a read.


     Now that you mention it, I did hear someone yell "incoming" in the background. I couldn't find Fairfax by name in your guide, but I do see that 44103 is grade F. I guess I will rescind this offer. The seller has been dragging her feet. I didn't make an EF deposit yet. 

  • Sacramento 路 Member since 2019 路 54 posts 路 24 votes
    3y

    I just rescinded my offer. Thank you to those of you who gave me new information. I'm disappointed but I think I dodged a bullet with your help

    -Ryan

  • Real Estate Agent 路 Cleveland, OH 路 Member since 2021 路 383 posts 路 361 votes
    3y

    I'm glad to hear you chose to rescind your offer here. Everyone brought valid points to why this was doomed to fail. I am a proponent of Fairfax's come-around, but this one was a little too far into rough of it. On top of what everyone else had said, I have an investor who bought a duplex in a better area over there for FAR less and is converting it to an good old fashioned LTR from the room-to-room boarding house it was before. They wanted to keep the occupied units occupied while the other ones were brought to market shape, but no PM would touch it. They don't want to manage a boarding house because of the turnovers, low rents, and huge headaches. So you very likely would've been left to choose to manage from across the country, or have a shady PM step in.

  • Brandy RollinsPro Member
    Rental Property Investor 路 Cleveland, OH 路 Member since 2023 路 11 posts 路 6 votes
    3y

    @Ryan Rock looks like Mr Wise is telling it straight LOL!!

    My guy, this deal SUCKS. This neighborhood is awful and your house is literally next to the projects. I鈥檓 sure someone already said this, but the tenants will be a nightmare and there鈥檚 no way anyone would book this as an Air BnB.

    I love your idea but this is not the neighborhood for it. 

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