Hi BP!
Are there realtors/investors here who are investing in a sober living? I'm thinking of starting to invest in this niche.
And if you'll be from PA (and Pittsburgh specifically) that's even better.
Thank you in advance,
Shai
but first, you should know that there isn't such a thing as getting a manager who is "recovered". A prospective manager would say that he/she has been sober for x number of years and would say that they are "in recovery". There is a reason why it is "One Day At A Time". Liv-in managers are peers to the other residents and they can relapse themselves.
regarding your question, the main reason might be that people in recovery and in the industry would question anyone's motives. There is a long history of people getting into the sober house business for the wrong reasons. There are lots of horror stories. People in recovery are a vulnerable population.
I forgot to mention that another place you would learn more is by getting the certification training by PARR, the Pennsylvania Alliance for Recovery Residences or by the local NARR chapter, if you are looking to invest in a different state.
Best of luck with your investing.
Hi @Shai Flax!
I know a little about sober houses, particularly in Massachusetts. The best way to start is to become involved in the local sober community where your property is located. Reach out to sober house managers, go to local AA meetings and find out more about the people involved. (I am assuming that you don't have direct experience with addiction and recovery, or have experience as a therapist.)
You will not be welcome as a sober home operator, yourself. But, I'm sure that a sober home operator would be happy to lease from you at above market rent. You could be asked to perform some intial remodeling to customize or maximize the potential and you "may" also have above average repairs to maintain your property. A great lease with an option to renew could provide you with a long term tenant, if it's the right fit. You will also want to be able to break the lease if the sober operator is doing a poor job in managing the residents.
There really is a need for more of these houses in every community and you would be doing a service to your community.
Thank you for your answer.
I do not have an experiance in this world and I'm not a therapist.
I would love to know why I won't be welcomed as an operator, assuming I won't manage it myself and have a recovered on site manager.
Thanks.
but first, you should know that there isn't such a thing as getting a manager who is "recovered". A prospective manager would say that he/she has been sober for x number of years and would say that they are "in recovery". There is a reason why it is "One Day At A Time". Liv-in managers are peers to the other residents and they can relapse themselves.
regarding your question, the main reason might be that people in recovery and in the industry would question anyone's motives. There is a long history of people getting into the sober house business for the wrong reasons. There are lots of horror stories. People in recovery are a vulnerable population.
I forgot to mention that another place you would learn more is by getting the certification training by PARR, the Pennsylvania Alliance for Recovery Residences or by the local NARR chapter, if you are looking to invest in a different state.
Best of luck with your investing.
Hello Shai!
I am near Pittsburgh and am interested in this concept. Please keep us posted if you make any headway! I suggest starting first with the Housing Authority in your area and asking if there is a housing specialist you could speak to for options. That was my first step for learning more about the various different agencies in my area that are looking to make partnerships with landlords.
@William P. Thanks for the advice!
A sober living house is a value added service. Keep in mind that there is a lot more to it than a typical rental. You will need to furnish the place. This means having a bed for every resident. You be responsible for all the utilities. You will have to have a set of very clear rules, consequences for breaking them, and a way to maintain oversight. The resident manager, house manager will assist but at the end of the day it will be your responsibility to ensure the goal of having a sober living environment is met. There are many other considerations it is a worth while venture if you are looking for more than cash flow. Helping people should be the real goal, the cash flow will be a result if it is well done.
@Shai Flax I'm looking at doing the same.
Hi I saw that you posted about starting sober living houses and was wondering if maybe you might be interested in investing in starting a new sober living house? If so what type are you interested in a halfway house or a three quarter house? Also are you looking for it to be a Male or female residence? I have tons of contacts 5hat are in recovery in Allegheny, Butler, Washington County, Lawrence, & Beaver Counties. A majority of my contacts are located in areas where there are a large number of NA/AA mtgs everyday. I've lived in both types of housing and I've also volunteered at them too, I've been Sober for 8 years and I know the ins & outs of these types of homes how they need to be set up, maintained l, the type of staffing or Monitoring they require, the amount of rent to charge (3¼ Houses only.) a 3¼ house will house around 2 or more ppl per room a large hoom could hold as many as 20,and each individuals rent is typically around $350-$500 a month. (depending on the quality of the home) and halfway homes are even more profitable considering all the tax write offs it also depends on whether it's a non-profit or for-profit facility depending on that you could have a number of charitable options when it comes to taxes as well. With the opioid epidemic as severe as it is these days these facilities are desperately needed especially in Western PA. I'd be willing to be the person that sets up the house, find either a live-in house manager (if it's a 3 house) or hire staffing (for halfway house) I definitely would love input but if that isn't what your interested in and you prefer a more hands-off approach that is fine too. I would love to hear back from you if you are still interested in this please either email or call/text me anytime to discuss further!!
I look forward to hearing from you soon hopefully!!
-Lacey Tommaney-
Hi I saw that you posted about starting sober living houses and was wondering if maybe you might be interested in investing in starting a new sober living house? If so what type are you interested in a halfway house or a three quarter house? Also are you looking for it to be a Male or female residence? I have tons of contacts 5hat are in recovery in Allegheny, Butler, Washington County, Lawrence, & Beaver Counties. A majority of my contacts are located in areas where there are a large number of NA/AA mtgs everyday. I've lived in both types of housing and I've also volunteered at them too, I've been Sober for 8 years and I know the ins & outs of these types of homes how they need to be set up, maintained l, the type of staffing or Monitoring they require, the amount of rent to charge (3¼ Houses only.) a 3¼ house will house around 2 or more ppl per room a large hoom could hold as many as 20,and each individuals rent is typically around $350-$500 a month. (depending on the quality of the home) and halfway homes are even more profitable considering all the tax write offs it also depends on whether it's a non-profit or for-profit facility depending on that you could have a number of charitable options when it comes to taxes as well. With the opioid epidemic as severe as it is these days these facilities are desperately needed especially in Western PA. I'd be willing to be the person that sets up the house, find either a live-in house manager (if it's a 3 house) or hire staffing (for halfway house) I definitely would love input but if that isn't what your interested in and you prefer a more hands-off approach that is fine too. I would love to hear back from you if you are still interested in this please either email or call/text me anytime to discuss further!!
I look forward to hearing from you soon hopefully!!
-Lacey Tommaney-
Hi. I'm in Texas. Do you know where I'd start to began to rent properties to Sober Living (type.) of homes?
Thank you in advance.
@Shai Flax currently looking into this avenue as well. I’m currently a medical professional, and have therapists in my family. I am looking in the Columbia county area Bloomsburg. Interested to see your story, and what happened with your idea.
Yes I am very interested in this REI space myself. I am underwriting properties 4+ BR's and 3+ Baths with no HOA's and the COCROI/Cash Flow is really good. I'll link to a current house I am underwriting and I would buy FHA and live in the basement mother in law suite as a house hack. Then I'd affiliate with Oxford House Sober Living organization for some help with oversight and infrastructure but essentially would rent our all 5 bedrooms as double occupancy for men only and charge $150/week per bed. The oxford house model requires that all tenants pay equal share of the rent per week + utilities no matter how many beds are filled so if all 10 beds are not filled then the weekly rent/utilities goes up for the remaining tenants so its super predictable and consistent for the landlord. The COCROI is 85% and cash flow is $1900/month after PITI and 5% capex/5% repairs. No need for vacancy or prop mgmt contigencies. Also, the oxford house has strict rules for each tenant with 10pm curfew, weekly drug testing, weekly required AA/NA meetings, and required job/school. If any tenant fails a weekly drug test then they are immediately booted from the house no questions asked and they cannot come back until they attend a 28 day rehab and show commitment to sobriety. Also, the landlord signs the lease with "oxford house" rather than individuals so if someone gets booted for cause then there is no eviction protections or delays.
Yes I am very interested in this REI space myself. I am underwriting properties 4+ BR's and 3+ Baths with no HOA's and the COCROI/Cash Flow is really good. I'll link to a current house I am underwriting and I would buy FHA and live in the basement mother in law suite as a house hack. Then I'd affiliate with Oxford House Sober Living organization for some help with oversight and infrastructure but essentially would rent our all 5 bedrooms as double occupancy for men only and charge $150/week per bed. The oxford house model requires that all tenants pay equal share of the rent per week + utilities no matter how many beds are filled so if all 10 beds are not filled then the weekly rent/utilities goes up for the remaining tenants so its super predictable and consistent for the landlord. The COCROI is 85% and cash flow is $1900/month after PITI and 5% capex/5% repairs. No need for vacancy or prop mgmt contigencies. Also, the oxford house has strict rules for each tenant with 10pm curfew, weekly drug testing, weekly required AA/NA meetings, and required job/school. If any tenant fails a weekly drug test then they are immediately booted from the house no questions asked and they cannot come back until they attend a 28 day rehab and show commitment to sobriety. Also, the landlord signs the lease with "oxford house" rather than individuals so if someone gets booted for cause then there is no eviction protections or delays.
I own and operate a real estate brokerage in Phoenix, AZ. We specialize in several niche areas including:
We work with many different clients in this space including Oxford House. To help our clients, we have developed proprietary software for real estate investors operating in these spaces. The software continuously checks the MLS for properties which meet both the metrics of the treatment organization (Oxford House, for example) as well as our clients cost, income, and ROI metrics, to see which homes satisfy both conditions.
For example:
Our software checks for properties which meet all of the above criteria, so that our clients can purchase them and offer them as an Oxford House.
We originally developed the software to help SFR funds on Wall Street underwrite and acquire SFR assets. However we simply decided we didn't want to be in that space and exacerbating the problems those funds have been causing in Phoenix, so we instead retooled it to help investors in this space. We feel much better about operating in these spaces and using our software to help the community! :) The software is 100% free, we simply would like to be the brokerage on the purchase or sale of any properties it finds for our clients.
For dispositions, we have a wide network of clients in the sober living, residential treatment, and halfway house spaces. As such, when a client wishes to sell a property, we already have a large database of potential buyers. This is extremely helpful because no matter the niche our investors operate in, many of these facilities have the same underlying needs—particularly a high bedroom count, locations with walkable proximity to employment opportunities, strong public transit, no HOA, etc.
If anybody is operating in these spaces in Maricopa County, AZ, or wishes to, please contact me!
Aaron Gough
Hi! I’m an addiction recovery specialist with 15 years experience with a passion for specificity around substance use disorders in order to see better results. You can categorize the sober living or recovery house as a level one all the way up to a level four depending on what services are offered. I am open to joining you on these ventures, boots on the ground, with a particular interest in specificity to opioid use disorder and requiring that the residents opt into medically administered medically assisted treatment versus self administered or no medication. This allows us to operate with strategic unity and group residents demographically, as well as where they are in their recovery journeys. Let’s do it! Best, Alexandra
Hey Shai — I’ve been in this space for a while and can confirm there’s definitely demand for quality sober living in most markets. The key is finding the right structure: some folks buy and operate directly, while others lease to an experienced operator (often at above-market rents). Both models work, but they require different levels of involvement.
If you’re looking at Pittsburgh, I’d suggest connecting with the local NARR affiliate (PARR in PA) to understand certification standards. That’ll give you a solid foundation and credibility with referral partners.
Happy to share more about how we structure deals or what to look out for if you want to chat specifics.
@Aaron Gough
do you recommend just a typical landlord policy for an Oxford House or commercial insurance?