Clayton Morris Podcast
Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
Clayton Morris Podcast
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Chris ClothierBusiness Member
Rental Property Investor · memphis, TN · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes@Aaron Mazzrillo you don't need my advice on a yes or no, but for the other readers on here, the biggest reason not to go on a show like this is to be sure you do not lend your credibility and voice before the other person has earned it. It makes sense for him to reach out to high influencers and ask for them to join him because it boosts his credibility. It makes more sense to do it on BP since his target audience is a new investor that does not know any better.
Being #1 on iTunes does not mean a thing and there are absolutely legitimate concerns raised by many, many seasoned investors and TK companies when reviewing his website and program.
On a separate forum, it was noted by someone who has known him for a while, that he is a good person and his wife is a very active writer on financial websites. So I am sure that they are not intentionally trying to hurt anyone. Unfortunately, his own website gives almost no information about anything. What it does say is that he started investing in real estate a very, very short 5 years ago.
That is not even enough time for any properties he has owned himself to build up any type of conceivable track record to build data from. That is not enough time for him to have learned the ins and outs and he has yet to experience a market shift. He has been investing during the sunshine and rainbows. Others have commented that they were told by him that he has no vacancies and has figured out how to keep costs at 40% of gross rents. All while keeping his rents at gross multipliers of what looks like 1.5+. The magic kicker for every experienced investor is that he is doing this on an average price point of $40,000 AND that is an all in turnkey price.
Any serious investor who knows about Turnkey real estate would never go on a podcast like this without taking serious objection to the fact that they have no idea what they are talking about. If any of those numbers are true, then he has somehow figured out how to go from newscaster to master real estate investor in five years and is outperforming even the best real estate investors and the top turnkey companies out there who have years of experience and knowledge on him.
Unfortunately, the reality is, his investors are in for a rude awakening when their expectations simply cannot be met over time. Again, I would want to give him the benefit of the doubt and just say he is using way too much spin and painting the wrong picture, but people are going to get hurt buying these properties at these prices expecting the type of results that have been attributed to him.
Last note ~ it is also a bad sign that many of the posters who have said good things have very few posts to their credit. Many have said they are brand new investors and I have yet to see someone post about actually having bought and owned with this company. I have not seen a post from him or anyone from his company so much of the spin is being created on here by people stating what they were told by him. It just doesn't look good.
38 Replies
- Residential Real Estate Broker · Graham, WA · Member since 2015 · 42 posts · 17 votes10y
Aaron he has done a podcast on bigger pockets I cannot remember what number it was but its worth checking out. His concept is finding your freedom number by figuring out how many properties you have to buy to have enough passive income to reach the number. He seemed pretty legit. His wife was also on another bigger pockets podcast.
- Investor · The Colony, TX · Member since 2014 · 192 posts · 66 votes10y
Clayton Morris seems pretty legit. As far a selling turnkeys, that's a good model for some people. You have to know your goals and be able to analyze the property - just like with anything else.
- Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes10y
Originally posted by @Shoshawna Merten:
Aaron he has done a podcast on bigger pockets I cannot remember what number it was but its worth checking out. His concept is finding your freedom number by figuring out how many properties you have to buy to have enough passive income to reach the number. He seemed pretty legit. His wife was also on another bigger pockets podcast.
I truly hope he's not claiming that as his ground breaking idea for the world. Some crusty old landlord told me back in 2002 when I first got into this racket, that to achieve financial freedom all I had to do was figure out how much I needed to survive every month, then get that in net income from rentals. We're not exactly talking Dave Ramsey philosophy with this pathetically simple concept.
- Investor · The Colony, TX · Member since 2014 · 192 posts · 66 votes10y
If you did a search you would find several posts dealing with him. This one has several people talking about having done business with him, and they all seem happy with the process:
- 10yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Aaron Mazzrillo his pitch is to buy 30 to 40k turn key homes in Indy and you hit it right on the head .. about how many do you need for financial freedom
there was a long thread on this about how dangerous his model is.. and he is attracting of course the beginner investor who knows no better, IE that is to buy a 30 to 40k all in rental in the mid west is buying squarely in the HOOD and the chance of financial freedom from someone buying these remote , IS well REMOTE at best , financial suicide at worst..
2 or 3 of the top Turnkey providers made long posts about why this is not a smart investment ... and part of the issue is Morris invests marketing scheme of doing the take away close.
IE people posting that to just get a phone call with Morris ( because they are so BUSY) you have to now wait until November.. LOL.. So what you have is a NEWBIE turnkey guy selling hood rats to newbie buyers who don't know that a 40k all in home in the mid west is a pretty tough investment
- Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2013 · 210 posts · 149 votes10y
Are we really going to go through this again? It's funny, I'd like to know why this Clayton guy doesn't come on here and speak for himself.
In my opinion I wouldn't waste my time with him. He's not some big investor out here in Indy. He's just trying to play on a market that is HOT right now like everybody else.
- Investor · Weston, WI · Member since 2016 · 105 posts · 114 votes10y
@Aaron Mazzrillo, I also really enjoyed his BP podcast. What does he want to talk to you about? It seems like being on someone else's podcast is a great way to market yourself and set yourself up as an expert. If I were in your shoes I would pursue it as it is may potentially bring some business your way.
- 10yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Eric M. ergo the danger of Podcast irrational exuberance and or propping someone up who really is not an expert at all.... LOL good marketing though
- 10yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Eric M. and I am not talking about Aaron.. FYI
- Investor · Weston, WI · Member since 2016 · 105 posts · 114 votes10y
@Jay Hinrichs, LOL, I had to reread your comment to see what you were referencing. Out of curiosity, would you discourage @Aaron Mazzrillo from doing the podcast?
- Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes10y
Originally posted by @Eric M.:
@Aaron Mazzrillo, I also really enjoyed his BP podcast. What does he want to talk to you about? It seems like being on someone else's podcast is a great way to market yourself and set yourself up as an expert. If I were in your shoes I would pursue it as it is may potentially bring some business your way.
I do quite a bit of speaking every year. I won't speak at clubs or events that have the latest guru pitching his/her hot new way to acquire real estate for pennies on the dollar... if you'll come to his/her weekend seminar.. where he'll/she'll try to sell you into coaching... where you'll learn the real secrets. I'm not putting my name on that garbage. It helps them build credibility more than it will help me prevent people from making catastrophic financial mistakes.
Turkey investing may be right for some, but that percentage is so tiny compared to the overall number of people getting suckered into it. In my market, a turkey house is what we call a retail flip. So, the big question is; if the house is turnkey, why not sell it to an owner occupant who pay top dollar?
The answer is simple; there isn't enough local demand and the person selling the property can make even more selling it to an uneducated investor. They make more on the front end, they make more every month by offering management and maintenance services. Why would anyone ever want to buy a house where the locals don't even want to own it and why would someone pay more for the thrill of owning it?
- Vallejo, CA · Member since 2013 · 1 post · 2 votes10y
Originally posted by @Aaron Mazzrillo:
Originally posted by @Eric M.:
@Aaron Mazzrillo, I also really enjoyed his BP podcast. What does he want to talk to you about? It seems like being on someone else's podcast is a great way to market yourself and set yourself up as an expert. If I were in your shoes I would pursue it as it is may potentially bring some business your way.
I do quite a bit of speaking every year. I won't speak at clubs or events that have the latest guru pitching his/her hot new way to acquire real estate for pennies on the dollar... if you'll come to his/her weekend seminar.. where he'll/she'll try to sell you into coaching... where you'll learn the real secrets. I'm not putting my name on that garbage. It helps them build credibility more than it will help me prevent people from making catastrophic financial mistakes.
Turkey investing may be right for some, but that percentage is so tiny compared to the overall number of people getting suckered into it. In my market, a turkey house is what we call a retail flip. So, the big question is; if the house is turnkey, why not sell it to an owner occupant who pay top dollar?
The answer is simple; there isn't enough local demand and the person selling the property can make even more selling it to an uneducated investor. They make more on the front end, they make more every month by offering management and maintenance services. Why would anyone ever want to buy a house where the locals don't even want to own it and why would someone pay more for the thrill of owning it?
I think he's #1 on the charts on the front page of itunes as of right now. He focuses on passive income through rental property, not just turnkey. He talks to all kinds of investors, CPAs, Tax Attorneys, etc, to give a broader understanding of real estate investing to his audience.
Even Brandon Turner was on his podcast just recently.
You paint the picture like he's a slimeball or that you're too good to put yourself out there.
- Real Estate Agent · Madison, WI · Member since 2015 · 328 posts · 88 votes10y
@Aaron Mazzrillo The issue is that in those neighborhoods not many are looking to owner occupy (renovated or not) so the other buyers will still be investors anyway. Those numbers sound like Milwaukee several years ago see Meeran's podcast #72? It certainly worked there at that time but like @Jay Hinrichs said 30-40k in the midwest now usually means rough houses in rough neighborhoods.
- Rental Property Investor · Honolulu, HAWAII (HI) · Member since 2011 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes10yI am not a fan of under 60k turnkey homes. You can't finance them... Well you can but the fees and inspections and trouble is just not worth it. I think it's questionable to buy these via 401k loan and Heloc. Jay Hinrichs I made a turnkey passive podcast and don't try to sell anything. Except maybe a book one day. Let me know you think.
- Investor · Fairhaven, MA · Member since 2016 · 100 posts · 88 votes10yAaron Mazzrillo I have listened to the Investing in Real Estate podcast with Clayton Morris. I actually heard him first in a technology podcast (his W-2 job was/is as a newscaster). Listening to his podcast is what got me interested in real estate investing. Granted, I am a 'newbie', but that podcast led me to BiggerPockets, and your perspective might help others who listen to the podcast.
- 10yChris ClothierBusiness MemberRental Property Investor · memphis, TN · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
@Aaron Mazzrillo you don't need my advice on a yes or no, but for the other readers on here, the biggest reason not to go on a show like this is to be sure you do not lend your credibility and voice before the other person has earned it. It makes sense for him to reach out to high influencers and ask for them to join him because it boosts his credibility. It makes more sense to do it on BP since his target audience is a new investor that does not know any better.
Being #1 on iTunes does not mean a thing and there are absolutely legitimate concerns raised by many, many seasoned investors and TK companies when reviewing his website and program.
On a separate forum, it was noted by someone who has known him for a while, that he is a good person and his wife is a very active writer on financial websites. So I am sure that they are not intentionally trying to hurt anyone. Unfortunately, his own website gives almost no information about anything. What it does say is that he started investing in real estate a very, very short 5 years ago.
That is not even enough time for any properties he has owned himself to build up any type of conceivable track record to build data from. That is not enough time for him to have learned the ins and outs and he has yet to experience a market shift. He has been investing during the sunshine and rainbows. Others have commented that they were told by him that he has no vacancies and has figured out how to keep costs at 40% of gross rents. All while keeping his rents at gross multipliers of what looks like 1.5+. The magic kicker for every experienced investor is that he is doing this on an average price point of $40,000 AND that is an all in turnkey price.
Any serious investor who knows about Turnkey real estate would never go on a podcast like this without taking serious objection to the fact that they have no idea what they are talking about. If any of those numbers are true, then he has somehow figured out how to go from newscaster to master real estate investor in five years and is outperforming even the best real estate investors and the top turnkey companies out there who have years of experience and knowledge on him.
Unfortunately, the reality is, his investors are in for a rude awakening when their expectations simply cannot be met over time. Again, I would want to give him the benefit of the doubt and just say he is using way too much spin and painting the wrong picture, but people are going to get hurt buying these properties at these prices expecting the type of results that have been attributed to him.
Last note ~ it is also a bad sign that many of the posters who have said good things have very few posts to their credit. Many have said they are brand new investors and I have yet to see someone post about actually having bought and owned with this company. I have not seen a post from him or anyone from his company so much of the spin is being created on here by people stating what they were told by him. It just doesn't look good.
- Investor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2015 · 53 posts · 34 votes10yI did not hear his BP podcast, but I did hear the one with his wife. My sense of it is that they are both fairly new (as someone else said-5 years in) to RE investing and excited about the idea of financial freedom. I think they're both smart people who will probably shift their strategy soon to something other than turnkey pigs in the hood. But I guess they'll have to learn that themselves. I wish he wasn't acting as a turnkey operator already and had some more experience under his belt, because there are definitely people who will get burned by his current strategy.
- Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes10y
@Chris Clothier - Great post.
- Gautier, MS · Member since 2016 · 8 posts · 7 votes10y
This is a great thread. I am new to investing and his podcast caught my attention. It all sounded too good to be true. I am naturally a skeptic that over analyzes much of the time. The best thing that podcast did was lead me here to BiggerPockets.
Since joining BP, I have learned so much. Much more than anything provided on Clayton's podcast. He never even mentions analysis, but it is broken down clearly here. Brandon's rental property book has been so beneficial. The support that I get from this group was worth listening to the earlier podcasts
- 8yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Chris Clothier @Aaron Mazzrillo I know this Is a year old post but it only took a year of selling this junk for this to start to implode....as you know Morris was touting himself as a turnkey when in fact he was subbing everything out and is simply a marketer like a Maverick or other west coast marketer making a fee for bringing clients to the rehab contractor who was acquiring and in charge of rehab and happen to own the management as well.
WEll that company Oceanpointe got shut down by the Indiana AG and as we all know to have the AG shut down a business means there is not only SMOKE but FIRE....
in the meantime there have been post after post of clients that bought these t**ds and one even posted a u tube of a house he paid to rehab that any of in the business could tell in 10 seconds it was never rehab to any real standard we would adhere to and most likely virtually nothing was done to it.. the owner popped in and wanted to inspect gave notice the PM was late saying his car broke down and then conveniently forgot the keys to the place..
But you guys nailed it day one... Aaron in his way.. and Chris with his deep experience in the space.
but even with all these post of real time heart breaks there are still post of others saying Hey I want to buy one .. REALLY just amazes me.
- Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes8y
Just for the "Official Record," I am not absolutely 100% anti-turn key strategy. For the RIGHT person, I think it is a phenomenal way to to build wealth. What I am fully against is the average Joe/Jane wanting to be an investor SOO BAD that they see this as the easy way to jump in and and get some points on the board. This is absolutely not what turn key is. It takes LOTS of due diligence and a plane ride (or more) to find the right operator, in the right market, selling good houses that will rent to people with real jobs. Demographics should be looked at. Chamber of Commerces consulted. Population trends pondered over. Area employment considered, etc. I do believe Memphis Invest has been around long enough to be that company. That being said, I don't know much else about them other than my prior business relationship with Kent (which was great) and conversing with Chris here on this site, but I don't believe Kent is that involved in that business. I don't know.
There are LOTS and LOTS of wannabe turn key sellers selling absolute garbage in horrible neighbors. The product is marked up way to high, the rehab subpar and the tenants worse than those that qualified for subprime loans back in 2005. These people prey on inexperienced investors.
If I had a full time job that I really liked and made good money doing it AND I was looking for a way to get some deductions I would absolutely consider doing turn key deals and I have actually done them back when I had a very lucrative 6 figure income, absolutely no overhead and definitely no time to be out shopping for rentals. Upon hearing my tax guy tell me I had a $40,000 quarterly estimated tax payment due soon, I asked what can I do to mitigate the tax robbery I was being a victim to. He said, "Get yourself some real estate." So, I bought some turn key and some new construction out of state. Some was OK. Some was complete garbage. All in all, I don't think it worked out well for me, but I didn't commit to the due diligence I should have before I wrote the checks. Therefore, I speak from experience when I say it is absolutely a risky investment. If a person does not know the market they are buying in he/she will absolutely be clueless if what he/she is buying makes any sense at all.
If turn key appeals to a person, then go for it. Just make sure you check references, look at the history of the operator and don't be to quick to make a decision. It isn't like paying money for a seller to call and the deal is done on the phone now or never. With turn key, time is definitely on the buyer's side. - 8yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Aaron Mazzrillo what was happening to these folks that responded to Morris pod cast is
1. Oh sorry we are so busy we can't talk to you for 3 months your call is scheduled at 10am 122 days from now you better be there..
2. pitch.. we sell 50 a month you need to make up your mind in 22 minutes or it will be gone.
3. send over property after upsell pitch... buyer calls back that looks good... Morris.. OH sorry that sold so if you really want one you have to pick it the second we send it over and get your deposit in. ( REALLY)
4. sloppy closings.. Morris turns out to just be a marketing agent the actual seller in INdy was or is called Oceanpointe ( now put out of business by AG)
5. Send oceanpointe the money to rehab..
6. Oceanpointe won't communicate and morris has no clue rehabs take 2 to 6 months.
7. clients show up and rehab is an utter complete JOKE
8. houses never rented etc etc.. all homes in the worse and cheapest areas of town..
Pathetic... And yes turn key done right is a viable option.. buying low value assets in any Major MSA as I have said for years now is ONLY appropriate for Pro's and locals.. begineers take a HUGE risk..
But then again... greed of returns does funny things to people.. they read the post here and this guy is getting a 20% return this guy a 12% .. well what they don't know is those people if they are getting it are 90% of the time local.
Thanks for chimming in you could have skipped the IRS quartly payment stuff though tomorrow is another fun day .>>> and you probably did what I did and paid your entire state tax end of DEC OUCH>
- Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes8y
@Jay Hinrichs Don't forget the phone call from Ocean Pointe that was posted.
- Investor · Riverside, CA · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes8y
Originally posted by @Matt K.:
@Jay Hinrichs Don't forget the phone call from Ocean Pointe that was posted.
On this site? I'd like to listen to that. Do you have a link?
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