My Direct Mail Campaign Results Have Been Atrocious

My Direct Mail Campaign Results Have Been Atrocious

Wholesaler · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2012 · 259 posts · 147 votes

Hey There BPers,

Myself and my business partner have been spending a significant amount of time on our direct mail campaign and so far, our results have been subpar to say the least. We have sent out a total of 395 letters and received a whopping 5 responses. 1 was a prank call. 2 were of the "please remove me from your list" variety. Our one success was getting an appointment with a seller, so in reality we have had 1 good response out of 395 total letters. I'm hoping to get some insights and ideas/critiques for increasing our response rate. The details of our campaigns are below.

We have slowly been gathering addresses so our list is split up, one campaign is 149 people and the other is 246 people. We have sent the different groups different pieces to try and test what will get the best response.

The first group received a standard yellow letter stuffed inside of a handwritten (in blue sharpie) 6x9" manilla envelope (link). I also used some muscle car stamps instead of the regular American flag ones to hopefully make it seem more "friendly". Our response rate was 4 of 149. Here is a picture of the finished letter:

The second group of 246 received a different mailer altogether. We used an A6 invitation-style envelope that was handwritten in black ink. Instead of a yellow letter, we sent our message on standard white copy paper. This letter was placed in the mail on 10/19 and we've only received one phone call and one FB like from our efforts. Here is the copy:

"

21Reply
3,291 views

Most Popular Reply

Dev HornPro Member
Flipper/Rehabber · Arlington, TX · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
13y

Your list there is a good "core" list of houses for you guys to keep an eye on, but your list size is WAY to small to generate a meaningful flow of leads.

Buy a list of at least 1,000 ABSENTEE OWNERS and mail them postcards every month for AT LEAST 6 months.

See this reply in the discussion

364 Replies

Jump to latestLatest
  • Investor · Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2008 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    10y

    I can second @Dev Horn s

    recommendation of 

    @Sharon Vornholt blog, 

    I visit her blog often regarding marketing to sellers with direct mail, especially probate leads!

  • Investor · Essex County · Member since 2015 · 73 posts · 10 votes
    10y

    Hello BiggerPockets family,

    I am active wholesaler/Realtor and I must add that I have read every last single post on this thread! Definitely one of the most informative threads I've ever read on BP.

    I've closed a few wholesale deals this year using traditional beginner approaches from "driving for dollars" to lots of bandit signs. Even though I am actually closing deals, I still wouldn't say I have an actual business; its more of a hobby at the rate I am actually closing which is disappointing. However, I am closing on a deal soon (Hopefully this week) and want to put some of the profits to a strong direct mail campaign. My thoughts so far:

    1. 1000 Yellow Letters Red Ink

    2. 80-100% equity 

    3. Absentee owners (out of state)

    4. Max property value of 400k

    5. Repeat list forever

    6. Increase list by 500 leads after each closing.

    Any thoughts welcomed! Negative or Positive. I am here to learn!

    Neil

  • Goshen, KY · Member since 2009 · 835 posts · 683 votes
    10y
  • Goshen, KY · Member since 2009 · 835 posts · 683 votes
    10y

    @Neil J. - I would use posttcards.  I use 50-100% equity.

  • Investor · Essex County · Member since 2015 · 73 posts · 10 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Sharon Vornholt:

    @Neil J. - I would use posttcards.  I use 50-100% equity.

    Thanks for your input Sharon! Do you think I should start with more than a 1000 postcards being that they're half the price of yellow letters? Maybe 2000? I am willing to do things the right way and stick to it being that the funds used are from a wholesale deal. 

  • Goshen, KY · Member since 2009 · 835 posts · 683 votes
    10y

    If you can mail more I would if you can get that many from a good tight list.  Don't just add names to get your numbers up.  I omit zip codes that I don't want too.

  • Investor · Essex County · Member since 2015 · 73 posts · 10 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Sharon Vornholt:

    If you can mail more I would if you can get that many from a good tight list.  Don't just add names to get your numbers up.  I omit zip codes that I don't want too.

     I remember you've stated that in one of your previous replies. I will stay out of war zone ares. Properties in Northen New Jersey are a little pricey so I decided to go up to 400k.. maybe 400k is still a little too high, I will do more research on that. Also, when you slim down the list using property value do you recommend using the assessed value selection on listsource or the property value selection on listsource. This part confuses me.. theres two parts on listsource to determine your range of value. 

  • Goshen, KY · Member since 2009 · 835 posts · 683 votes
    10y

    I use property value.

  • Investor · Essex County · Member since 2015 · 73 posts · 10 votes
    10y

    Thank you so much for the info Sharon! People like yourself are the reasons why the BiggerPockets forum is so successful. 

    Neil

  • Brie SchmidtBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Chicago, IL · Member since 2013 · 6k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    10y

    Save your time and money and hire @Jerry Puckett to do it for you.

  • Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2015 · 113 posts · 28 votes
    9y

    @Neil J. Did you ever think of doing PPC? I get 90% of my deals from online!!

  • Investor · Essex County · Member since 2015 · 73 posts · 10 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Brie Schmidt:

    Save your time and money and hire @Jerry Puckett to do it for you.

     Hello Brie,

    I will definitely look into it! He appears to have a lot of great feed back and recommendations.

    Thank you!

  • Investor · Essex County · Member since 2015 · 73 posts · 10 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Jesse Burrell:

    @Neil J. Did you ever think of doing PPC? I get 90% of my deals from online!!

     Hi Jesse,

    I am not to familiar with "PPC"? Can  you please go over some details?

    Thanks!

  • Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2015 · 113 posts · 28 votes
    9y

    @Neil J. Do you have a website? If you do "Paid Per Click" aka PPC which you can do on google or bing. You pay the search engine to promote your site at the top of searches. Such as "sell my house fast New Jersey" ect... My company is pretty much online only and we stopped doing the mail almost a year ago. Our ROI is much higher spending our money online.

  • Investor · Essex County · Member since 2015 · 73 posts · 10 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Jesse Burrell:

    @Neil J. Do you have a website? If you do "Paid Per Click" aka PPC which you can do on google or bing. You pay the search engine to promote your site at the top of searches. Such as "sell my house fast New Jersey" ect... My company is pretty much online only and we stopped doing the mail almost a year ago. Our ROI is much higher spending our money online.

     Wow, this is definitely a marketing strategy I need to look into. This is my first year into real estate fulltime so I am trying to build a business model as I close deals. I just feel like I am all over the place and I'm looking for the most effective way to consistently get leads. "PPC" will definitely be on my list now!

    Thanks Jesse!

  • Real Estate Agent · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2015 · 149 posts · 75 votes
    9y

    @Jesse Burrell I have a site set up through OnCarrot, would appreciate comments if you could www.valterrahomes.com . What are you spending on PPC relative to what you were spending monthly on direct mail? I have wanted to spend more time doing SEO, but don't have much time outside of work to put the hours into backlinking and building the presence up.

    @Sharon Vornholt I have a few questions if I may. I can get a farm from a title agent. We have a few zip codes we want to target SFR and 1-4 unit long term. With 18,000 records, I want to mail 1,000-2,000 initially in 500/week cycles (1% response rate would generate 5 motivated calls per week). This is in Pittsburgh

    Could you share some insight on how to narrow down the list to go from 18,000 to a few thousand mailers, to limit throwing money away. The farm list I can receive for free only supplies public information. There is no equity % computed like on Listsource.  I was thinking along the lines of 

    • ZIP: Lower priced zip codes with cash investor activity as per MLS cash transactions
    • Bedroom: 3 bedroom minimum - best opportunity for end buyers of any flip or rental deals , as opposed to 2Bd
    • Bathroom: 1br minimum - possible opportunity to add bathroom (value) 
    • Property Type: SFR, Duplex (Triplex and Quad market is for investors, aka lower volume and harder to offload)
    • Last Sale Date: Either before 2011 (owners with equity for those who have owned longer term post recession) or before 2003 (the national average of length of homeownership - 13 years)
    • Owner Occupied: Absentee Owned 
    • SF: 1,000-1,250 minimum 
    • Optional
      • # Stories: 2 + Basement or 2.5 + B minimum 

    Also, my partners and I currently work full time for the time being and we're trying to figure out a way for us to handle visiting property during the day more consistently. Do you have an idea what we could do to follow up with leads quicker to do property walk-throughs? 

    Also currently I'm planning on sticking with my Google Voice number to handle the in-bound calls. I'll have to follow up at lunch/after work currently with leads. It's part of the reason I don't want to send more than 500-1,000 PCs a week because I'd have trouble following up with more than 10-15 calls a week. 

    How do you manage your marketing lists? Currently I'm planning on having one master spreadsheet where I continually add and delete bad contacts and can check for duplicate addresses. But before jumping full cannon ball into the pool, I want to be sure there's not another more efficient method to do this. 

  • Goshen, KY · Member since 2009 · 835 posts · 683 votes
    9y

    @Austin Mudd - what list are you getting?  You can't get everyone.  How about out of state AO's?  Don't worry about in state. They could be your neighbor that has a house 10 miles away in another county.  Forget about sale date and go for 50-100% equity.  

    I would start out with SFH only personally. If you add multi's keep them in a separate list.

    You have got something wrong to be getting that big of a list.  I omit bad zip codes and only get 2 counties where I work.

  • Specialist · Hollywood, CA · Member since 2016 · 81 posts · 59 votes
    9y

    @Neil J.Hey Neil I am in the same boat. I have not actually began my marketing ad campaign, but I am all over the place in deciding a solid strategy which will produce the highest ROI in my market. It would be nice to talk to someone tackling the same obstacles to get an insight. Shoot me a message and let's chat if you get the chance.

    Best, 

    Blake Dalessio

  • Real Estate Agent · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2015 · 149 posts · 75 votes
    9y
    Originally posted by @Sharon Vornholt:

    @Austin Mudd - what list are you getting?  You can't get everyone.  How about out of state AO's?  Don't worry about in state. They could be your neighbor that has a house 10 miles away in another county.  Forget about sale date and go for 50-100% equity.  

    I would start out with SFH only personally. If you add multi's keep them in a separate list.

    You have got something wrong to be getting that big of a list.  I omit bad zip codes and only get 2 counties where I work.

    Hi Sharon, it's a farming list pulled from a title agent. I basically tell him to pull me all SFR and 1-4 units in zipcode X Y and Z. From there (I have that list of all SFR and 1-4 units), I can now filter down the list from 18,000 to a smaller number. I pulled 7 ZIPs, but plan to initially target 3 ZIPs for now, but still wanted to see what the list looked like for the other 5 ZIPs.

    The reason I mentioned sale date is because the list pulls public property data, so there is no 50-100% equity 'variable'. But by logic, a house last sold in 2005 should, unless HELOCs, etc were taken out, have more equity than a house sold in 2012. A house sold before '86 should be mortgage free by now. Am I correct with this assumption? 

    I think it's interesting that you don't care about in-state absentee owners. Could I hear your opinion why? Have you found it to be not worth your money? 

  • Goshen, KY · Member since 2009 · 835 posts · 683 votes
    9y

    Re; in state AO's- they generally aren't motivated unless they are 3 hours or more away. I only get out of state for that reason.

    I get all my lists from Listsource because I can get equity.

    Getting all homes in an area doesn't give you any motivation as far as the seller goes. You are looking for one thing; a potentially motivated seller. 

  • Trevor MauchPro Member
    Investor · Roseburg, OR · Member since 2014 · 141 posts · 149 votes
    9y

    @Austin Mudd hope all is well man! 

    I wanted to reach out here really quick. Ya if you're looking at the PPC marketing side of things just let us know and we can help you through that my man. Just hit us up on our next mastermind call and we'll walk you through it and help you w/ the strategy in your market. 

    We've got ya Austin! 

    @Sharon Vornholt Keep crushing it gal! Always love what you're doing on your podcast :-) 

  • Goshen, KY · Member since 2009 · 835 posts · 683 votes
    9y
  • Arlington, VA · Member since 2015 · 15 posts · 5 votes
    9y

    Is anyone using Cole Realty Resources for your direct mail lists? For just under $1,000 I can get data for an entire region. Not just address, last sale date and estimated value, but also cell numbers and email addresses. I'm sure it doesn't slice and dice as well as ListSource, but with the added benefit of cell #'s and email addresses (for targeted FB advertising), it sounds pretty good. Thoughts? 

  • Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2016 · 63 posts · 2 votes
    9y

    ppc does not work!

  • Investor · Oxnard, CA · Member since 2014 · 438 posts · 187 votes
    9y

    @Daniel Johnson

    Why do you say that?  Are you saying that it didn't work for you, or that it doesn't work period?

Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.