Investing in real estate at 21 with $30k

Investing in real estate at 21 with $30k

Financial Advisor · Member since 2022 · 67 posts · 67 votes

I’m 21 years old and I have set aside $30k to use as a down payment for a rental property. I’m in California and am looking at Texas and the Midwest for an out of state property. I’m looking to create passive income and am thinking of a duplex. Cash flow is more important to me than appreciation. I’m currently in contact with a very good realtor in Wichita Falls outside of Dallas. It would be ideal if I could find a duplex for $120k. The realtor says finding a duplex for $120k will be difficult but not impossible. I’ve also thought about Indiana, Michigan, or Ohio. I see there are duplexes which go for $60k. 

I’m wondering also which is better for my situation (down payment or cash)? I actually have $60k saved but would prefer to use $30k for real estate. Does anybody have advice for a young person like me getting into real estate for passive income? I would like to create passive income so that I have financial freedom to travel the world with my family. 

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Patrick DruryBusiness Member
Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH & Cleveland OH · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
4y

@Michael A.
If your realtor is telling you that it's extremely difficult, I would assume that your expectation is too high for that market and they are trying to be kind. Even if you looked in Ohio as well you would be hard pressed to find a complete rehab for 60k. 150k-200k is a realistic price range for multi-family in Columbus. I would save up a bit more money and then look at picking up a rental out of state. 

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  • Real Estate Consultant · Seattle, WA · Member since 2022 · 1k+ posts · 784 votes
    4y

    You are on the right track and not using 100% of your savings is smart. You’ll need that cash when something comes up which it always does. Do you currently own or rent? At that age, you might be better off buying something local, moving in, and renting rooms so your housing expenses are zero. If you are handy, you can fix things around the house yourself as well. Then save more money and start scaling from there 

  • Drew SygitBusiness Member
    Property Manager · Royal Oak, MI · Member since 2012 · 13k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    4y

    @Michael A.

    We think the Midwest is a GREAT place for OOS investors to consider!

    YES, we may be a little biased, but check out our blog here on BP comparing Detroit to other cities and Deep Dives on Metro Detroit cities & neighborhoods: https://www.biggerpockets.com/...

    Your biggest question shouldn't be WHERE to invest, but HOW you will invest!

    Many OOS investors set themselves up for failure because they don't truly take the time to understand:

    1) The Class of the NEIGHBORHOOD they are buying in - which is relative to the overall area.

    2) The Class of the PROPERTY they are buying - which is relative to the overall area.

    3) The Class of the TENANT POOL the Neighborhood & Property will attract - which is relative to the overall area.

    4) The Class of the CONTRACTORS that will work on their Property, given the Neighborhood location - which is relative to the overall area.

    5) The Class of the PROPERTY MANAGEMENT COMPANIES (PMC) that will manage their Property, given the Neighborhood location and the Tenants it will attract - which is relative to the overall area.

    6) That a Class X NEIGHBORHOOD will have mostly Class X PROPERTIES, which will only attract Class X TENANTS, CONTRACTORS AND PMCs and deliver Class X RESULTS.

    7) That OOS property Class rankings are often different than the Class ranking of the local market they live.

    8) Class A is relatively easy to manage, can even be DIY remote managed from another state. Can usually allot 5-10% vacancy factor and same for maintenance.

    9) Class B usually also okay, but needs more attention from owner and/or PMC. Vacancy and maintenance factors should be higher than for Class A as homes will be older, have more deferred maintenance and tenants will be harder on them.

    10) Class C can be relatively successful with a great PMC (do NOT hire the cheapest!), but very difficult to DIY remote manage. Vacancy and maintenance factors should be higher than for Class A or B. Homes will have even more deferred maintenance and tenants will be even harder on them.

    11) Class D pretty much requires an OWNER to be on location and at the property 3-4 times/week. Most quality PMCs will not manage these properties as they understand most owners won’t pay them enough for the time required and even then it’s too difficult successfully manage them.
    ***Only exception is if an owner has plan & funds to reposition Class D to Class C or higher.

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/776/topics/960183-what-they-dont-tell-you-about-cheap-rental-properties?highlight_post=5562799&page=3#p5562799

    Also, SERIOUSLY consider - do you really have the time to be a DIY landlord or should you hire a PMC?

    Good luck with whatever you decide😊

  • Andrew FreedBusiness Member
    Investor · Worcester, MA · Member since 2020 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    4y

    @Michael A. - I second house hacking something local. If you can supplement or eliminate your housing expenses, that would have a much larger effect on your savings rate than an out of state duplex that maybe might cash flow $300-400 a month. I completely understand the concept of cash flow and I never advocate for buying something that does not cash flow once you leave, however I've built a majority of my wealth on mortgage paydown, tax benefits, and appreciation. Cash flow is a defensive mechanism to keep your property and maintain it while the other levers are truly what build wealth, at least that has been my experience. 

  • Financial Advisor · Member since 2022 · 67 posts · 67 votes
    4y
    Quote from @Andrew Freed:

    @Michael A. - I second house hacking something local. If you can supplement or eliminate your housing expenses, that would have a much larger effect on your savings rate than an out of state duplex that maybe might cash flow $300-400 a month. I completely understand the concept of cash flow and I never advocate for buying something that does not cash flow once you leave, however I've built a majority of my wealth on mortgage paydown, tax benefits, and appreciation. Cash flow is a defensive mechanism to keep your property and maintain it while the other levers are truly what build wealth, at least that has been my experience. 

    @Andrew Freed

    Thanks for your explanation. In Los Angeles it’s pretty expensive. Not too many options with only $30k. When you say you make money from appreciation, are you selling the home and getting the money or are you borrowing from it to buy a new house? 

    I see there are turn key companies in the Midwest which sell 40k houses that you pay full cash for. They cash flow like $500-$600 a month. But they’re in low income neighborhoods and the houses are tiny boxes that don’t appreciate.  I’m leaning most towards getting a property in Wichita Falls TX. That town is appreciating fast because many folks are moving there and it’s not as expensive as Dallas. 
    what do you think is better duplex or single family? 
    lastly, I just got this account on bigger pockets. Are we allowed to give out social media to maybe connect over a phone call? Thanks  

  • Financial Advisor · Member since 2022 · 67 posts · 67 votes
    4y

    Thanks to everyone for the replies. I’m wondering the pros and cons of Texas vs midwestern states.  

  • Investor · Member since 2021 · 591 posts · 695 votes
    4y
    Quote from @Drew Sygit:

    @Michael A.

    We think the Midwest is a GREAT place for OOS investors to consider!

    YES, we may be a little biased, but check out our blog here on BP comparing Detroit to other cities and Deep Dives on Metro Detroit cities & neighborhoods: https://www.biggerpockets.com/...

    Your biggest question shouldn't be WHERE to invest, but HOW you will invest!

    Many OOS investors set themselves up for failure because they don't truly take the time to understand:

    1) The Class of the NEIGHBORHOOD they are buying in - which is relative to the overall area.

    2) The Class of the PROPERTY they are buying - which is relative to the overall area.

    3) The Class of the TENANT POOL the Neighborhood & Property will attract - which is relative to the overall area.

    4) The Class of the CONTRACTORS that will work on their Property, given the Neighborhood location - which is relative to the overall area.

    5) The Class of the PROPERTY MANAGEMENT COMPANIES (PMC) that will manage their Property, given the Neighborhood location and the Tenants it will attract - which is relative to the overall area.

    6) That a Class X NEIGHBORHOOD will have mostly Class X PROPERTIES, which will only attract Class X TENANTS, CONTRACTORS AND PMCs and deliver Class X RESULTS.

    7) That OOS property Class rankings are often different than the Class ranking of the local market they live.

    8) Class A is relatively easy to manage, can even be DIY remote managed from another state. Can usually allot 5-10% vacancy factor and same for maintenance.

    9) Class B usually also okay, but needs more attention from owner and/or PMC. Vacancy and maintenance factors should be higher than for Class A as homes will be older, have more deferred maintenance and tenants will be harder on them.

    10) Class C can be relatively successful with a great PMC (do NOT hire the cheapest!), but very difficult to DIY remote manage. Vacancy and maintenance factors should be higher than for Class A or B. Homes will have even more deferred maintenance and tenants will be even harder on them.

    11) Class D pretty much requires an OWNER to be on location and at the property 3-4 times/week. Most quality PMCs will not manage these properties as they understand most owners won’t pay them enough for the time required and even then it’s too difficult successfully manage them.
    ***Only exception is if an owner has plan & funds to reposition Class D to Class C or higher.

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/forums/776/topics/960183-what-they-dont-tell-you-about-cheap-rental-properties?highlight_post=5562799&page=3#p5562799

    Also, SERIOUSLY consider - do you really have the time to be a DIY landlord or should you hire a PMC?

    Good luck with whatever you decide😊

     @Michael A.  -- @Drew Sygit has provided you with some EXCELLENT info here--and his post really shows his experience.

    Congrats on saving up some cash and being ready to buy property.

    As @Sergey A. Petrov mentioned, you might be better off first buying a local house hack, and THEN transitioning to out of state properties.  A house hack will teach you invaluable lessons about property management that you can then apply to future OOS investments (even if you have a good PM for your OOS investments, the property management skills you get from doing a house hack will help you more effectively manage your PM at the OOS property).

    Also, a house hack is usually a more straightforward, easier strategy than an OOS investment. If you're a newbie, you may want to start off with the easier strategy first before graduating to more advanced strategies like OOS investing. In other words, if you're a beginner skier, don't try to go down a double black diamond on your first run (instead, start off on the easier terrain so you actually have a chance of success).

    Good luck out there!

  • Real Estate Consultant · Seattle, WA · Member since 2022 · 1k+ posts · 784 votes
    4y

    $30k gets you into an $850k property with an FHA 3.5% downpayment. Being a first buyer (making an assumption here) you might even find a grant or another downpayment assistance program

  • Financial Advisor · Member since 2022 · 67 posts · 67 votes
    4y

    @Sergey A. Petrov @Leo R.

    Thanks for the replies. Would you recommend getting fha loan for a house in Los Angeles or a Condo? 
    Also, my Situation is difficult because I am self employed and only have a one year job history. I don’t have a tax return yet because 2022 hasn’t ended yet. This year I’ve made a little over $100k. I have a 750 credit score though. I’ve thought about using a family member as a co-borrower. The realtor I spoke with in TX said that she could make it work because she is also a mortgage lender. And she can look at 12 months of bank statements instead of 2 year job history. 

    What do you guys think of my situation? I’m sure i could find a property somewhere in LA area for under $800k and put $30k down. Getting prequalified may be the problem. I also don’t know of any good foreclosure websites to use that are free. 
    I want to do this in an efficient and reasonable way based on my situation and age. 

  • Real Estate Consultant · Seattle, WA · Member since 2022 · 1k+ posts · 784 votes
    4y

    Talk to some FHA lenders and get prequalified. I bought my first condo when I was barely 21 and definitely wasn't making anywhere near $100k. Get on the phone and start calling lenders, they are out there

  • Investor · Austin, TX · Member since 2021 · 9k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    4y

    Buy a flip. Put a down payment on a hard money loan and have enough to cover your draws. Leverage your cash 

  • Lender · UT · Member since 2022 · 28 posts · 13 votes
    4y

    @Michael Anderson Use little or none of your own cash when possible. Imagine if you could buy apple stock without using your own money, but you get all the appreciation and dividends. That's what real estate offers! 😁

    I agree with investing out of state, I live in Utah and have one rental property so far in Illinois. Bought for 75k and rents for $850! Great areas for cash flow and low prices. Being a loan officer in 49 states gives me a unique angle sometimes on different markets, and I currently like Illinois and Ohio for your situation. (Or similar states/markets.)

  • Investor · Lincoln, NE · Member since 2019 · 11 posts · 0 votes
    4y

    What about mobile homes? 

  • Bay area, CA · Member since 2021 · 383 posts · 306 votes
    4y

    I have made out-of-state investments. I know the mental dilemma and challenges of it. As a beginner, you better find good people to lead you as I did. Message me and we can connect. I will share my story and then you can see if you want to go with that path. 

    If cash flow is a priority, definitely midwest win over Texas. But which deal is passive and safest with good cash flow, that's where having experience is essential. 

    --Ruchit

  • Investor · Member since 2021 · 591 posts · 695 votes
    4y

    @Michael A. re: house vs. condo...I generally avoid condos because they have HOAs that control what you can and cannot do with the property. Many HOAs have banned renting, and it's reasonable to assume that even an HOA that currently allows renting may not allow renting in the future. ...if you do go with a condo, you'll want to read up on property ownership within an HOA, and you'll want to review that condo's HOA contracts very carefully.

  • Andrew FreedBusiness Member
    Investor · Worcester, MA · Member since 2020 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    4y

    @Michael A. - Yes, feel free to DM me or find me on Linkedin. I have utilized the appreciation through lines of credit to expand my portfolio. I definitely don't want to get rid of my sexy first liens at 2-4% interest. 

  • Darin MoonBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2020 · 18 posts · 5 votes
    4y

    @Michael A. let me know if you want to see some properties in Indiana. I and an agent/investor/property manager in the area. Id be happy to get some multi unit properties in front of you and we can discuss the cash flow potential here in the Hoosier state. 

    Darin-Moon Sycamore Realtors4.817 Reviews
    Sycamore Realtors and Managment
  • Kyle MccawBusiness Member
    Property Manager · Keller, TX · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    4y

    @Michael A. I am an active investor and property manager in Wichita Falls. You should be able to find a solid rental there in your price point. Do not be tempted to purchase a cheap house because it looks like great cash flow. I've seen too many out of state buyers purchase the 1940 build wood frame duplexes. What looks like $600 cashflow ends up eating the owner alive in maintenance. Not to mention the low end tenants bring a whole other level of problems.

    FYI, W.F. has a large number of rentals that should, in my opinion, be torn down.  

    McCaw Property Management4.4900 Reviews
  • Rental Property Investor · Centreville, VA · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 799 votes
    4y

    @Michael A. Working with turnkey companies is the good strategy to work in the mid west markets to build a portfolio. I used that strategy to scale in the past 3 years 

  • Lender · Farmington, CT · Member since 2015 · 542 posts · 321 votes
    4y

    @Michael A.

    good for you! happy to see you getting started like this. my advice, buy a multifamily you can add value to with hard money and then do a cash out refi and take the money and do it all over again. in essence... do a BRRRR!!

  • Real Estate Broker · Huntsville, AL · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 872 votes
    4y

    I'd recommend the Midwest because you will be able to scale faster but please remember that you will need ample reserves. A good agent will be able to bring you a solid property here given your circumstances. Hit me up for more info.

  • Jonathan KlemmBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Contractor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    4y

    Hey @Michael A. - Come invest here in Chicago!  We have lots of properties at low prices.  Sometimes it's easier to flip a few properties to create some capital and then use that to invest in rentals.

    I think the key to out-of-state investing is putting together a rockstar team.  Definitely happy to connect you with those around us to get you up and going.

  • Patrick DruryBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH & Cleveland OH · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    4y

    @Michael A.
    If your realtor is telling you that it's extremely difficult, I would assume that your expectation is too high for that market and they are trying to be kind. Even if you looked in Ohio as well you would be hard pressed to find a complete rehab for 60k. 150k-200k is a realistic price range for multi-family in Columbus. I would save up a bit more money and then look at picking up a rental out of state. 

  • Victor SoBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Chicago, IL · Member since 2017 · 325 posts · 193 votes
    4y

    @Michael A. A lot of good advice here. I househacked my first duplex 5 years ago in a Chicago suburb called Niles. The property was in a A-/B+ area and needed an extensive rehab. I bought it for 320K with a fha 203K loan and put ~15K down. This renovation loan included the rehab costs and we put roughly 85K into the rehab. I also put in some swear equity. Fast forward 5 years later, the property is fully rented with great tenants, has appreciated to over 450K, earns me a few hundred bucks in cash flow, and great tax benefits. 

    Come to Chicago! 

    Victor So Real Estate LLC517 Reviews
  • New to Real Estate · Danville, PA · Member since 2022 · 23 posts · 13 votes
    4y

    Hey Michael, I’m not familiar with your area at all but wanted to let you know I’m 24 and just purchased my first duplex to house hack. Cost was 127k, after all expenses I’m about 15k out of pocket. This includes inspection, appraisal, down payment, closing costs, etc.. just wanted to reach out because i struggled for almost a year to find a deal that made sense. This made the most sense for my situation. I’m hoping & projecting to have enough saved within 12 months to purchase a larger multi family in my area to house hack again. Taking all numerical factors into consideration. With interest rates rising deals seem to be just slightly easier to find than when I first started looking. If you want to connect, bounce ideas back and forth, or just help each other with suggestions feel free to reach out! Best of luck to you! 

  • Rental Property Investor · Mississippi Gulf Coast · Member since 2022 · 206 posts · 168 votes
    4y

    Michael, I could not avoid replying as your name is the same as my son who also lives in the LA area.  There are lots of good recommendations on this site.  Before you jump in anywhere be sure to have six months of reserves.  This is critical.  Stuff happens, that's the life you are getting into.  

    If you have sufficient reserves to start, you will not have to take money from your current income to support your investment. There are lots of basic business strategies that are part of being an investor. Treat your project as a real business from the start. File for an organization e.g. LLC. Open a business checking account and a savings account. Obtain a "business" credit card, don't use your consumer card. Always keep your business accounts separate from your personal. When you close on the property flip it into your organization for protection.

    You live in an extremely expensive area both in terms of property cost, property taxes, and income taxes.  You are right to invest elsewhere.  I made my first pile of money when living in CA years ago and took it with me when I moved to the Mississippi Gulf Coast where property here costs far, far less.  A couple employed at a fast food place working full time can own a house here.  

    Good luck "son".
     

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