Turnover is the real cost in LTR, MTR and STR. Here's how I compare them

Turnover is the real cost in LTR, MTR and STR. Here's how I compare them

John RacinePro Member
Rental Property Investor · Casselberry, FL · Member since 2008 · 224 posts · 114 votes

A lot of threads here this week come back to the same problem in different forms. A tenant skipped out, a deposit didn't cover the damage, a unit sat empty, or the cash flow came in thinner than the spreadsheet said. I've run long-term, mid-term and short-term rentals. For me, the biggest difference between the three isn't monthly rent vs. nightly rate. It's how often the unit turns over, and who pays for each turn.

Long-term: few turns, but the empty days add up.
I owned long-term rentals in Orlando for several years before I moved into mid-term and short-term. With a 12-month lease you might turn a unit once a year or less, and that's the big appeal. When it does turn, all of it is on you. My turns there usually cost under $1,000 in make-ready, which isn't bad. What hurt more was the time: it took over a week to get a unit back on the market, and that's a week with no rent coming in. People budget for the paint and repairs and forget to budget for the empty days. I suspect a lot of the "is cash flow really this hard" posts are really turnover posts.

Short-term: constant turns, but the guest pays for the clean.
STRs turn over all the time. That sounds like the worst of the three, but on my listings the cleaning fee is a pass-through: the guest pays it, and it covers the clean. So a normal turn isn't eating my margin. The abnormal turns are where the cost is. I had one guest leave the bedding in a condition where it couldn't be saved, and the sheets went straight in the trash. With that many turns, an occasional bad one is guaranteed, so I treat linen and supply replacement as a normal cost, not a surprise.

Mid-term: in between, and extensions make it better.
This is why most of my units now run as a mid-term/short-term hybrid. The calendar is set for 30+ day stays with 30–60 day minimums, and short stays only fill gaps of a few days to two weeks. That alone means far fewer turns than a straight STR. The other piece is keeping a 60-day window open after each mid-term stay so the guest can extend. One construction crew extended four times and stayed over 90 days. Every extension is a turn that never happened.

How I'd use this if you're weighing strategies

  • Count turns per year, not just monthly income. Then put a real cost on each turn, including the empty days.

  • Ask who pays for the turn. In an LTR it's you. In an STR the cleaning can be passed through to the guest. On my mid-term stays I do a mid-stay clean every 30 days and a deep clean at checkout. Both are built into the price, and the deep clean is built into the checkout turn time, so the calendar already blocks the days it takes.

  • Look at what would keep stays long. If nothing near the property creates 1–3 month demand, an "MTR" will turn like an STR without the STR rates.

For those of you who've run more than one strategy: what does one turnover actually cost you, and has that changed which strategy you favor?

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Diana KhanPro Member
Attorney · 10451 Mill Run Cir #755 Owings Mills, MD 21117 · Member since 2024 · 806 posts · 289 votes
7h
Quote from @John Racine:

A lot of threads here this week come back to the same problem in different forms. A tenant skipped out, a deposit didn't cover the damage, a unit sat empty, or the cash flow came in thinner than the spreadsheet said. I've run long-term, mid-term and short-term rentals. For me, the biggest difference between the three isn't monthly rent vs. nightly rate. It's how often the unit turns over, and who pays for each turn.

Long-term: few turns, but the empty days add up.
I owned long-term rentals in Orlando for several years before I moved into mid-term and short-term. With a 12-month lease you might turn a unit once a year or less, and that's the big appeal. When it does turn, all of it is on you. My turns there usually cost under $1,000 in make-ready, which isn't bad. What hurt more was the time: it took over a week to get a unit back on the market, and that's a week with no rent coming in. People budget for the paint and repairs and forget to budget for the empty days. I suspect a lot of the "is cash flow really this hard" posts are really turnover posts.

Short-term: constant turns, but the guest pays for the clean.
STRs turn over all the time. That sounds like the worst of the three, but on my listings the cleaning fee is a pass-through: the guest pays it, and it covers the clean. So a normal turn isn't eating my margin. The abnormal turns are where the cost is. I had one guest leave the bedding in a condition where it couldn't be saved, and the sheets went straight in the trash. With that many turns, an occasional bad one is guaranteed, so I treat linen and supply replacement as a normal cost, not a surprise.

Mid-term: in between, and extensions make it better.
This is why most of my units now run as a mid-term/short-term hybrid. The calendar is set for 30+ day stays with 30–60 day minimums, and short stays only fill gaps of a few days to two weeks. That alone means far fewer turns than a straight STR. The other piece is keeping a 60-day window open after each mid-term stay so the guest can extend. One construction crew extended four times and stayed over 90 days. Every extension is a turn that never happened.

How I'd use this if you're weighing strategies

  • Count turns per year, not just monthly income. Then put a real cost on each turn, including the empty days.

  • Ask who pays for the turn. In an LTR it's you. In an STR the cleaning can be passed through to the guest. On my mid-term stays I do a mid-stay clean every 30 days and a deep clean at checkout. Both are built into the price, and the deep clean is built into the checkout turn time, so the calendar already blocks the days it takes.

  • Look at what would keep stays long. If nothing near the property creates 1–3 month demand, an "MTR" will turn like an STR without the STR rates.

For those of you who've run more than one strategy: what does one turnover actually cost you, and has that changed which strategy you favor?

@John Racine, I agree that turnover costs can really change how profitable a rental is. Beyond cleaning and vacant days, I'd also consider the cost of dealing with property damage or disputes when someone moves out. Those expenses can add up quickly, especially when they're unexpected.

In my experience working with previous clients as a real estate attorney in Maryland, I've seen how important clear lease terms and property condition records can be for landlords. For example, having photos and documentation from move in and move out can make it easier to address damage concerns and security deposit disputes when they come up.

I appreciate you breaking down the differences between these rental strategies, @John Racine! It's a helpful perspective, and it connects closely to the landlord tenant matters I work with. Happy to stay connected!

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  • Diana KhanPro Member
    Attorney · 10451 Mill Run Cir #755 Owings Mills, MD 21117 · Member since 2024 · 806 posts · 289 votes
    7h
    Quote from @John Racine:

    A lot of threads here this week come back to the same problem in different forms. A tenant skipped out, a deposit didn't cover the damage, a unit sat empty, or the cash flow came in thinner than the spreadsheet said. I've run long-term, mid-term and short-term rentals. For me, the biggest difference between the three isn't monthly rent vs. nightly rate. It's how often the unit turns over, and who pays for each turn.

    Long-term: few turns, but the empty days add up.
    I owned long-term rentals in Orlando for several years before I moved into mid-term and short-term. With a 12-month lease you might turn a unit once a year or less, and that's the big appeal. When it does turn, all of it is on you. My turns there usually cost under $1,000 in make-ready, which isn't bad. What hurt more was the time: it took over a week to get a unit back on the market, and that's a week with no rent coming in. People budget for the paint and repairs and forget to budget for the empty days. I suspect a lot of the "is cash flow really this hard" posts are really turnover posts.

    Short-term: constant turns, but the guest pays for the clean.
    STRs turn over all the time. That sounds like the worst of the three, but on my listings the cleaning fee is a pass-through: the guest pays it, and it covers the clean. So a normal turn isn't eating my margin. The abnormal turns are where the cost is. I had one guest leave the bedding in a condition where it couldn't be saved, and the sheets went straight in the trash. With that many turns, an occasional bad one is guaranteed, so I treat linen and supply replacement as a normal cost, not a surprise.

    Mid-term: in between, and extensions make it better.
    This is why most of my units now run as a mid-term/short-term hybrid. The calendar is set for 30+ day stays with 30–60 day minimums, and short stays only fill gaps of a few days to two weeks. That alone means far fewer turns than a straight STR. The other piece is keeping a 60-day window open after each mid-term stay so the guest can extend. One construction crew extended four times and stayed over 90 days. Every extension is a turn that never happened.

    How I'd use this if you're weighing strategies

    • Count turns per year, not just monthly income. Then put a real cost on each turn, including the empty days.

    • Ask who pays for the turn. In an LTR it's you. In an STR the cleaning can be passed through to the guest. On my mid-term stays I do a mid-stay clean every 30 days and a deep clean at checkout. Both are built into the price, and the deep clean is built into the checkout turn time, so the calendar already blocks the days it takes.

    • Look at what would keep stays long. If nothing near the property creates 1–3 month demand, an "MTR" will turn like an STR without the STR rates.

    For those of you who've run more than one strategy: what does one turnover actually cost you, and has that changed which strategy you favor?

    @John Racine, I agree that turnover costs can really change how profitable a rental is. Beyond cleaning and vacant days, I'd also consider the cost of dealing with property damage or disputes when someone moves out. Those expenses can add up quickly, especially when they're unexpected.

    In my experience working with previous clients as a real estate attorney in Maryland, I've seen how important clear lease terms and property condition records can be for landlords. For example, having photos and documentation from move in and move out can make it easier to address damage concerns and security deposit disputes when they come up.

    I appreciate you breaking down the differences between these rental strategies, @John Racine! It's a helpful perspective, and it connects closely to the landlord tenant matters I work with. Happy to stay connected!

    • John RacinePro Member
      OP
      Rental Property Investor · Casselberry, FL · Member since 2008 · 224 posts · 114 votes
      7h

      Thanks so much @Diana Khan 😃

  • Member since 2023 · 165 posts · 57 votes
    7h

    John, this is exactly the math we run. We operate 236 doors in Memphis, mostly single-family, and turnover and vacancy cost us more than repairs — so we price the turn, not just the repair.

    Our rent-ready turnovers run on a 21-day scheduling system. The day a move-out is known, the clock starts: inspection, photos, scope, and the contractor is already lined up. We find and test contractors months before something breaks, in small paid steps, so we are not scrambling when a unit is empty. Every empty day is rent we never get back, and a slow turn is usually a scheduling problem, not a repair problem.

    On your question: one turnover costs us the lost rent for the empty days plus the make-ready, and the make-ready is the smaller number. Keeping stays long starts before move-in — screening for verified repeatable income and consistency between the story and the paperwork, not just a credit score.

    What part of your turn takes the longest — the clean, the repair, or finding the next tenant?

  • Michael K GallagherBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus OH · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6h

    very interesting perspective thanks for putting this together. I'd be curious if there is any data even anecdotally how included the cleaning fee in the rate impacts vacancy vs having the pass through charge? or is that fairly common and customary for people using these types of rentals?

  • John RacinePro Member
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Casselberry, FL · Member since 2008 · 224 posts · 114 votes
    4h

    @Rosina Persaud, on my long-term rentals it was the repairs. The clean was quick and finding the next tenant wasn't the bottleneck, but the repairs are what kept a unit off the market for over a week. On mid-term the clean isn't the slow part, because the deep clean is already blocked on the calendar. The slow part is lining up the next 30+ day guest. That's why I keep the extension window open and let short stays fill the gap so the unit doesn't sit empty.

    Your 21-day clock is smart. Starting it the day you know about the move-out is the step most small landlords skip.

    @Michael K Gallagher, I do both, depending on the clean. The turnover cleaning fee is a pass-through, and that's pretty common on both STR and MTR. The mid-stay cleans are different. On my mid-term stays there's a clean every 30 days, and I build it into the monthly rate instead of charging it as a separate fee.

    I'd expect length of stay to be the big factor in how much the fee matters. On a 1–2 night booking the cleaning fee can be a large share of the total, so a high one can cost you short bookings. On a 30-day stay it's a small slice of the month. Airbnb also shows guests the total price up front now, so the fee ends up in the number they compare either way.

  • Noah WrightBusiness Member
    USA, Nationwide · Member since 2024 · 475 posts · 150 votes
    2h

    You're right to budget the empty days and not just the paint, and that same gap shows up again when you go to finance. On a long-term rental, the DSCR programs I see usually qualify off the lease or the appraiser's market rent, so a week of vacancy between tenants doesn't make it into the loan math. It still comes out of your real coverage, which is why a deal that clears the lender's ratio can feel thin month to month. Short-term works the other way. When there's a full year of booking history, many lenders that take STR income work from trailing twelve months of actuals, so every slow turn and blocked night is already inside the income they count. On a short-term rental the gaps between guests cost you twice, once in cash and once in what the lender will credit.

  • John RacinePro Member
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · Casselberry, FL · Member since 2008 · 224 posts · 114 votes
    1h

    @Noah Wright, good point. It's the part of turnover most people never connect to financing. If the lender is working from the trailing twelve months, it makes sense that a slow turn costs you twice on an STR.

    It's also why it pays to shop around for a DSCR lender when you finance a short-term rental. Some will underwrite off AirDNA projections, and others have much stricter requirements on what income they'll count. They can come up with very different numbers on the same property, so it's worth knowing which kind you're talking to before you apply.

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