Do Hard Money hard money lending company
Investor · Baton Rouge, LA · Member since 2017 · 29 posts · 3 votes
Do Hard Money hard money lending company
Most Popular Reply
Investor · Joliet, IL · Member since 2013 · 44 posts · 19 votes
9yI do have some experience with Do Hard Money
It neither a positive nor a negative, its in the middle
I like them in the fact that it's a second set of eyes looking at the deal. I've tried to include them 3 times in a deal and and have yet to actually have them fund it. First experience they denied a property, said the crime rate was too high but I still went ahead with the property and now its a cash flowing cow. Tried to include them in another property but they denied again because it was too far away from civilization lol they called it agricultural land, which looking at hindsight, I'm glad they denied because the location was indeed awful (very specific buyer would have been needed) and I was just trying to make it work in my head. BAD idea. The last time I've tried to use them was a hot mess. They came in to do an evaluation of the property which costs $650. The evaluation process is supposed to take 3-5 days which is okay, I get it. It took 10 days to finally get the final evaluation report. They hire local people in subject property's area and the first person they hired was taking too long so they had to re-hire another evaluator which took another 2-5 days. And through out all this time, I HAD to stay on top of them. Not once did they say, "Hey Jonathan sorry that it's taking too long we're trying to solve the problem" It was always me emailing them (they have no direct phone line which is a HUGE inconvenience) saying "whats taking so long" "Can I have an update on the situation." And what really drove me nuts was that if I didn't say anything, they would have thought everything is okay and peachy, it's just a small set up but in reality I have investors money on the line and I want to know whats going. Not once did they send updates on where in the process of the evaluation they are in.
Long story short, they denied again and I ended up wholesaling it to someone who wanted to use it as a primary residence. When I finally got a hold of them during that 10 day time frame, we agreed that we can go "halfsies" on the $650 evaluation fee. They didn't hold their end of the bargain of 3-5 days and instead took twice as long and I thought that was fair to only have to pay $325. So we agreed that if the deal didn't get funded then I'd get my $325 back and if the deal went through then we'd leave this all behind and focus on the project. So a week goes by and no money was put back in my account. I finally get a hold of them on the phone after plenty of emails and they said we never agreed to such a thing, that theres no note of it on my file. By this time I've had it up to "here" with them so I asked to talk to higher management and they said the $650 is non-refundable and they have no control over who they hire. (In my head I'm thinking, so if i hire a bozo contractor and he just botches up everything, your telling me I have no control over that? That saying "sorry" to my investor is sufficient enough?) They wanted to make things right by adding another package to my membership which I don't even use. I expect excellence, and when I don't receive it, I get heated up. I don't tolerate mediocre people.
My advice to you. Stay on top of them. Get everything they say in writing including names (shame on me) and trust me when I say that a no direct phone line is a terrible inconvenience especially when you have a question or concern and you have to email it to them, wait until they view and respond, and then they email back or call you.
If you do get a project funded by them, please let me know how the process was. My experience could've just been a fluke.
I do however will give them 1 more chance on another project. I do still want to experience a HML on one of my projects.
Let me know what you think. Good luck!
25 Replies
- Investor · Joliet, IL · Member since 2013 · 44 posts · 19 votes9y
I do have some experience with Do Hard Money
It neither a positive nor a negative, its in the middle
I like them in the fact that it's a second set of eyes looking at the deal. I've tried to include them 3 times in a deal and and have yet to actually have them fund it. First experience they denied a property, said the crime rate was too high but I still went ahead with the property and now its a cash flowing cow. Tried to include them in another property but they denied again because it was too far away from civilization lol they called it agricultural land, which looking at hindsight, I'm glad they denied because the location was indeed awful (very specific buyer would have been needed) and I was just trying to make it work in my head. BAD idea. The last time I've tried to use them was a hot mess. They came in to do an evaluation of the property which costs $650. The evaluation process is supposed to take 3-5 days which is okay, I get it. It took 10 days to finally get the final evaluation report. They hire local people in subject property's area and the first person they hired was taking too long so they had to re-hire another evaluator which took another 2-5 days. And through out all this time, I HAD to stay on top of them. Not once did they say, "Hey Jonathan sorry that it's taking too long we're trying to solve the problem" It was always me emailing them (they have no direct phone line which is a HUGE inconvenience) saying "whats taking so long" "Can I have an update on the situation." And what really drove me nuts was that if I didn't say anything, they would have thought everything is okay and peachy, it's just a small set up but in reality I have investors money on the line and I want to know whats going. Not once did they send updates on where in the process of the evaluation they are in.
Long story short, they denied again and I ended up wholesaling it to someone who wanted to use it as a primary residence. When I finally got a hold of them during that 10 day time frame, we agreed that we can go "halfsies" on the $650 evaluation fee. They didn't hold their end of the bargain of 3-5 days and instead took twice as long and I thought that was fair to only have to pay $325. So we agreed that if the deal didn't get funded then I'd get my $325 back and if the deal went through then we'd leave this all behind and focus on the project. So a week goes by and no money was put back in my account. I finally get a hold of them on the phone after plenty of emails and they said we never agreed to such a thing, that theres no note of it on my file. By this time I've had it up to "here" with them so I asked to talk to higher management and they said the $650 is non-refundable and they have no control over who they hire. (In my head I'm thinking, so if i hire a bozo contractor and he just botches up everything, your telling me I have no control over that? That saying "sorry" to my investor is sufficient enough?) They wanted to make things right by adding another package to my membership which I don't even use. I expect excellence, and when I don't receive it, I get heated up. I don't tolerate mediocre people.
My advice to you. Stay on top of them. Get everything they say in writing including names (shame on me) and trust me when I say that a no direct phone line is a terrible inconvenience especially when you have a question or concern and you have to email it to them, wait until they view and respond, and then they email back or call you.
If you do get a project funded by them, please let me know how the process was. My experience could've just been a fluke.
I do however will give them 1 more chance on another project. I do still want to experience a HML on one of my projects.
Let me know what you think. Good luck!
- Investor · Baton Rouge, LA · Member since 2017 · 29 posts · 3 votes9y
Hello Jonathan,
I really appreciate the thorough and objective answer. I have heard they are strict on the items that can "stop the deal". Did you ever pay the $2500 or $3000 they require to be a part of their program or did you just pay the $650 for the evaluation?
Also, how did their calculator compare to Bigger Pocket's calculator?
- Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 12 posts · 3 votes9y
I would stay far away from Do Hard Money. I had a similar situation with them. I did have contact person's name, and documented conversations. We were told they would do the deal. The time frame promised to perform the inspection was missed, and when they did finally complete their inspection, declined to loan. We ended up loosing our earnest money on the deal because we couldn't perform. Should have never put all our "eggs" in their basket. We should have had a back up lender. Lesson learned.....
- Flipper/Rehabber · Chicago, IL · Member since 2013 · 319 posts · 153 votes9y
Had a similar, not exact same, situation in the past with paying the $650, them taking too long to get the BPO completed, me getting frustrated and deciding to just wholesale the deal-I actually got half of my money back though. The no phone line made communication with them a very slow process, and if your personality type is like mine and you are moving at a fast pace, then this also will be frustrating. There are HML all over the place, just take the time to research them before paying for any application fees. I unfortunately just had to eat part of my fee and move on. The best option is to locate a private lender, take them to lunch and detail your experience of what you've done and what you plan to do, and see if you can get them on board to fund your deals. My business has been much stronger since I made that connection, and the ease in getting my deals funded is much easier. I've removed all of the application fees, BPO's, and other items that can really make the process more tedious.
- Investor · Joliet, IL · Member since 2013 · 44 posts · 19 votes9y
I actually did pay the 2k membership which is why I was upset with them. I figured paying that amount of money would give me complete excellence. I was wrong.
@Pamela Baker okay so it sounds like theres a trend of them not sticking to their time line. Good to know but not good that it keeps happening. Thanks for your input Pamela
@Larmon Cummings Jr I'm the same way when it comes to moving fast. I like to make moves fast and the emailing process was slowing me down and killing me. I will definitely try another HM and/or a private lender. Like I said I just wanted to experience a HML so I can have "limitless" money sort of speak but lesson learned with Do Hard Money
- Investor · Joliet, IL · Member since 2013 · 44 posts · 19 votes9y
@Pamela Baker I make sure I have multiple exit strategies going in. As I was under contract, I was already advertising to wholesale and I was raising the funds from private investors JUST IN CASE these bone heads would say no. There was plenty of meat on the bone with my property and I was closing either way either to flip, buy and hold, or wholesale. I knew it was a good deal. But yes lesson learned with these guys and I'm sure you've learned not to put all eggs in one basket. =)
- Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 12 posts · 3 votes9y
Yes, Jonathan, I too have learned my lesson. My experience with Do Hard Money was over a year ago. I've learned since then to have back up plans. Its a shame that this company is still up to the same old thing a year later.
- Real Estate investor professional · Suwanee, GA · Member since 2016 · 233 posts · 81 votes9y
Originally posted by @Jonathan Frausto:
I do have some experience with Do Hard Money
It neither a positive nor a negative, its in the middle
I like them in the fact that it's a second set of eyes looking at the deal. I've tried to include them 3 times in a deal and and have yet to actually have them fund it. First experience they denied a property, said the crime rate was too high but I still went ahead with the property and now its a cash flowing cow. Tried to include them in another property but they denied again because it was too far away from civilization lol they called it agricultural land, which looking at hindsight, I'm glad they denied because the location was indeed awful (very specific buyer would have been needed) and I was just trying to make it work in my head. BAD idea. The last time I've tried to use them was a hot mess. They came in to do an evaluation of the property which costs $650. The evaluation process is supposed to take 3-5 days which is okay, I get it. It took 10 days to finally get the final evaluation report. They hire local people in subject property's area and the first person they hired was taking too long so they had to re-hire another evaluator which took another 2-5 days. And through out all this time, I HAD to stay on top of them. Not once did they say, "Hey Jonathan sorry that it's taking too long we're trying to solve the problem" It was always me emailing them (they have no direct phone line which is a HUGE inconvenience) saying "whats taking so long" "Can I have an update on the situation." And what really drove me nuts was that if I didn't say anything, they would have thought everything is okay and peachy, it's just a small set up but in reality I have investors money on the line and I want to know whats going. Not once did they send updates on where in the process of the evaluation they are in.
Long story short, they denied again and I ended up wholesaling it to someone who wanted to use it as a primary residence. When I finally got a hold of them during that 10 day time frame, we agreed that we can go "halfsies" on the $650 evaluation fee. They didn't hold their end of the bargain of 3-5 days and instead took twice as long and I thought that was fair to only have to pay $325. So we agreed that if the deal didn't get funded then I'd get my $325 back and if the deal went through then we'd leave this all behind and focus on the project. So a week goes by and no money was put back in my account. I finally get a hold of them on the phone after plenty of emails and they said we never agreed to such a thing, that theres no note of it on my file. By this time I've had it up to "here" with them so I asked to talk to higher management and they said the $650 is non-refundable and they have no control over who they hire. (In my head I'm thinking, so if i hire a bozo contractor and he just botches up everything, your telling me I have no control over that? That saying "sorry" to my investor is sufficient enough?) They wanted to make things right by adding another package to my membership which I don't even use. I expect excellence, and when I don't receive it, I get heated up. I don't tolerate mediocre people.
My advice to you. Stay on top of them. Get everything they say in writing including names (shame on me) and trust me when I say that a no direct phone line is a terrible inconvenience especially when you have a question or concern and you have to email it to them, wait until they view and respond, and then they email back or call you.
If you do get a project funded by them, please let me know how the process was. My experience could've just been a fluke.
I do however will give them 1 more chance on another project. I do still want to experience a HML on one of my projects.
Let me know what you think. Good luck!
I must say that you provided a very good and thorough feedback experience with this hml.
- Investor · Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 885 votes9y
@Charles Stewart II @Jonathan Frausto @Pamela Baker @Larmon Cummings Jr
Maybe I missed it, but did they FUND ANY projects or are they just making a living BS-ing people?
- Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 12 posts · 3 votes9y
Ken, I can't speak for anyone else, but they did not fund anything with me. They took the money and denied funding; never even went to the property. We asked before sending money if they thought they could do the deal. We were assured it could be done and within the time frame. Turns out they could not do either. Mind you, this was couple years ago. Maybe they've revamped by now; I dont know, but I would proceed with caution.....
- Investor/Landlord · Farmington Hills, MI · Member since 2011 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes9y
If there are any REIAs in your area, even if you have to drive an hour or so to attend, do so. It is quite likely there will be private lenders or potential private lenders in attendance. Some of them will be undercover. Share your experience, your plans, your deals and they may reveal themselves. They have money and want to lend (traditional sources of interest are abysmal right now). If they are new to the game they are just waiting for someone to make them comfortable partnering with them. Do that. Get a great deal under contract. Assure them their mortgage will be recorded. Make sure there is hazard insurance on the property. Buy them a lender's title policy, if necessary, maybe even a life insurance policy on yourself if need be. I assure you that most potential lenders will not require you to do all of this but they will be impressed that you offered to. Private lenders can make your path much easier if you take the time to nurture the relationship.
- Investor · Baton Rouge, LA · Member since 2017 · 29 posts · 3 votes9y
I really appreciate all of the input.
- Lender · Berkeley, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 549 votes9y
I don't know anything about the firm "Do Hard Money" (DHM) other than I think it's a terrible name.
However, I do these type of loans, and here's what I can add.
First, without knowing their source of funding, I have to figure they are being funded by deep pockets/funds, etc. Those funds have certain parameters which must be met, and as much as the DHM sales people probably want to push through every deal, they are restricted from doing so by those investors. Probably a good thing since even the OP mentioned not every deal a great one. In fact, we had a deal recently where a borrower was taking out the smallest loan we provide, and he expected to make around $33-38k in the deal. After assessing it was clear to us he'd make around $8-12 and that's over 8 months! Inevitably, we told him this; he went forward anyway after saying something like, "I have to learn somehow..."
Sales guy was happy, but it's a deal hardly anyone is making much on, and you still have to perform all of the same work as you would for an experienced client with who borrows a lot more. Yet on this deal the borrower barely fit into our financiers parameters, and so now, when we see that it's really close, we'd probably pass because not only is it difficult on our end, there's a real chance on a low-level loan it can all fall apart, and the borrower might give up. Untenable scenario for all.
So I can only imagine if you're trying to loan all over the country, unless the money is your own, or the financier of the HML itself is lax, there have to be some tight standards. I honestly cannot imagine doing this nationally because you would have to maintain so many relationships. Not saying we wouldn't want to, but we would have to expand our own workforce so greatly.
DHM might be a massive outfit, for all I know, but with many large companies customer service isn't exactly wonderful.
As for them not being straight up with you about any number of things, that's really unfortunate. I would always want to tie in the manager/boss of the person you're dealing with because you'll find out a lot quickly. For if the sales-person is unethical, one has to hope her/his boss is not. And if the boss stands by a dishonest sales-person, then you know it's rotten from the top.
You can apply that to almost any sales deal. I always try to get someone above who I'm dealing with involved in a transaction.
Good luck!
- Investor · Brownville, ME · Member since 2017 · 83 posts · 35 votes9y
This thread might have saved me 650 bucks. Thanks all.
- Investor · Chandler, AZ · Member since 2015 · 409 posts · 214 votes9y
HA HA HHAAAAAA!!!
that's what I'm sayinnnn
enjoy!!!
- Rental Property Investor · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2016 · 227 posts · 287 votes9y
Guys, the fact that a business is owned by someone of a particular religion doesn't make it appropriate to bash on that religion. There are plenty of unscrupulous people in all religious communities.
- West Bloomfield, MI · Member since 2017 · 18 posts · 3 votes8y
I am glad this thread is here. I almost gave them $3000.
- 8yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
AS a semi experienced lender myself.. this business model that Do Hard money put together is quite the thing.. 3k for turn downs.. but I have seen threads were people did get funded so in my mind they do fund.. however I suspect if there was any audit of the company the majority of their income would come from the turn downs not points on the loans.
lets see who their target is when you offer lending with no money down.
you basically get those starting out with the least experience other wise they would have money to put down.. So we can't blame the folks who lost money.. they simply did not know what they did not know and on top of that beginners many times really don't know what a deal is.. @David Weintraub As David alluded to... So this company sucks 3k out of folks then says well we are taking a huge risk here with new rehabber and 100% financing and this deal does not work.. but thanks for the 3k and the 650. for each submission.. its just another guru technique frankly.. Just like guru's that sell coaching and training.. that's really most of what is happening here for the 3k you get their booklet on how to flip houses..
- Hard Money Lender · West Jordan, UT · Member since 2015 · 105 posts · 75 votes8y
Disclaimer : Director of PR for DoHardMoney.com
@Jonathan Frausto- please contact me directly here at BP, and I will also reach out, so that we can further address your situation
@Jay Hinrichs @David Weintraub- we don't "suck" $3000 out of people, what they purchase is more than a "booklet" and your use of those words in that way is inflammatory at least.
Once again - enrollment in our 100% Financing System is not required to obtain a loan. We fund deals for people not enrolled in that system. However, the tools and resources available to those in that program, WHEN USED PROPERLY allow them to be much more likely to find deals that meet our criteria (we have data that shows loans to those borrowers have over 60% less risk and over 15% more profit than those to borrowers not enrolled)
We don't "charge" $650 for every deal we turn down. We only "charge" that $650 when the borrower specifically authorizes us to do so. In order for evaluations to be done on a property the deal first must be run through our software. Then, if the borrower submits the results to us for discussion with a team member a determination will be made as to whether or not to even proceed with the deal. If someone is just plugging in information and giving up because it says it is a bad deal and never reaches out to get a better understanding of why the deals they put in are not acceptable they are not using the system as instructed. A member of our team will discuss the potential risks and profit of a deal and we will never recommend going forward with evaluations on deals that are deemed too risky or with too little profit. Sometimes a member still wants to order evaluation of the deal and authorize the $650 for that against our recommendation. As you know, many new investors get emotionally attached to initial profit estimates of deals they review, they've not yet learned to walk away from a deal. Particularly if they spent what they feel is a great deal of time finding that deal and don't want "start over" If they've agents or partners of some kind that stand to make money whether or not the deal is profitable those people can sometimes exert influence as well.
There are instances here on BP where people have posted that we've "turned down" all their deals when we can show that they've only submitted one or two, if any, through the point of even speaking with a member of our team. Almost without exception when we review these accounts and speak with these people on the phone we discover they've only tried 1-2 ways of finding a property (most often the MLS) and they've not tried the strategies most recommended within the program that they enrolled. They've not reached out for help to understand why "all of the deals" they put into the software don't qualify. They don't participate in the daily conference call opportunities provided to ask their questions. There are instances where people have complained that our process "took longer than promised" when we've been waiting on something from them in order to proceed. And yes, there are times when we have taken longer than we originally said we would, the problem or delay is on our end, and we take responsibility for those.
There are instances where posts here have claimed that we turned down a deal that they then got funded elsewhere, which would of course would happen from time to time. We turn down deals in which we see too much risk or too little profit, other lenders (particularly those asking for a down payment) may not care whether or not their borrower makes money on the deal.
Should anyone have specific questions I would invite them to reach out to me here so that I can address specific situations and questions.
- Hard Money Lender · West Jordan, UT · Member since 2015 · 105 posts · 75 votes8y
sorry @David Weintraub i didn't mean to imply that you had misstated our business- and I can't fix the post :(
- Lender · Berkeley, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 549 votes8y
Originally posted by @Jacque Fairbourn:
sorry @David Weintraub i didn't mean to imply that you had misstated our business- and I can't fix the post :(
don't worry. i didn't read it.
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