If you are starting out, DO NOT pay for mentorship

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If you are starting out, DO NOT pay for mentorship

Twana RasoulBusiness Member
Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes

It is pretty amazing to find just how many people are offering "mentorship" for 10s of thousands of dollars to newbies who want to get into real estate.  What is more amazing is the amount of people actually buying these programs that can't even afford it.  All the information is free on the internet.  Paying such a large sum of money to a "mentor" starting out most likely means you are lazy and you are not willing to put in the effort/work.  There are so many opportunities for you to learn online absolutely free and/or work free for others while learning in exchange.  Reach out to members in your local community or on BP and provide them some sort of value and in return you can learn from them.  

If you are really having a tough time and need some more guidance I would gladly meet up with anyone in the San Diego Area for about 20 mins over coffee.  This offer will be for anyone that reaches out and sends me a private message this month (Feb 2019) only.  I specialize in buy/holds locally as well as OOS and have done close to a dozen deals thus far.   I don't sell anything and I get absolutely nothing out of this.  I work a W-2 in the local construction industry during the week.

Happy Learning & Investing !

Twana Rasoul

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Joe VilleneuvePro Member
Plymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
7y

You know what you know, and you don't know what you don't know.

It amazes me that people won't think twice about paying for a college education, taught by professional teachers, as opposed to professionals at what they are teaching, and yet are offended when asked to pay for education for handling millions of dollars, and their future, and legal issues, etc...specific to REI, taught by teachers that are pros at what they are teaching.

Not all teachers/mentors are right for everyone, or are worth what they are paid, but I bet there are nowhere near as many people that would want their money back from college, that would expect their money back from a REI Mentor.

Yes, I mentor, and charge.  The main reason I charge is to make sure that my students are serious.  My time is valuable, and I don't want to waste it on someone "kicking tires".

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  • Tiara Elise Hatley Williams
    Wholesaler · Memphis, TN · Member since 2019 · 26 posts · 27 votes
    7y

    I agree. I'm trying to spread awareness for bird dogging. If you can find the right investors, you can earn while you learn and the investor gets to scale their team. I'm not against mentorships, but if you can't afford them, bird dog

    12Reply
  • Dan H.Pro Member
    Investor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    7y

    I understand where the OP is coming from but I believe that proper education is a sound investment.  I am not associated with any RE mentoring group.

    I can learn anything myself.  The internet is full of information.  However, while there is a lot of information on the internet, not all of the information is good information.

    An investment in yourself that can help you succeed and eliminate costly mistakes has value.  Being able to join a large network that has some successful RE investors has value.  Your time has value.  Eliminating costly mistakes has value.

    The difficult part is

    • Determining if the value is worth the cost.
    • Finding the class that offers you  the most.
    • Recognizing dollars spent on education is dollars that are not initially available to you to start your RE investment pursuits.
    • Recognizing your strengths/weaknesses to determine if a class is the best for you.

    I am largely self-taught on my RE investing and have never paid for a class and have done alright.  Would I have done better if I had paid for a course and the associated network contacts?  No way to know.

    It is my view that some people will benefit from paid training and for other people it is a waste of money/time. 

    22Reply
  • Ryan J. Shope
    Rental Property Investor · Bellevue, WA · Member since 2017 · 33 posts · 11 votes
    7y

    Thanks for sharing this! Are you investing in the SD market or somewhere else?

    3Reply
  • Joe VilleneuvePro Member
    Plymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
    7y

    You know what you know, and you don't know what you don't know.

    It amazes me that people won't think twice about paying for a college education, taught by professional teachers, as opposed to professionals at what they are teaching, and yet are offended when asked to pay for education for handling millions of dollars, and their future, and legal issues, etc...specific to REI, taught by teachers that are pros at what they are teaching.

    Not all teachers/mentors are right for everyone, or are worth what they are paid, but I bet there are nowhere near as many people that would want their money back from college, that would expect their money back from a REI Mentor.

    Yes, I mentor, and charge.  The main reason I charge is to make sure that my students are serious.  My time is valuable, and I don't want to waste it on someone "kicking tires".

    30Reply
  • Frank Wong
    Real Estate Broker · Bay Area · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    I disagree. I think having a paid mentor is important to a new real estate investor.  Yes, all the information is out there for free.  You can search Google, BP, Youtube and find lots of info.  The problem is dissecting the information and the time needed to learn.  How do you know if this is right or wrong?  There is a lot of incorrect information circling around.  How much money has that cost you to learn on your own?    

    If a mentor can cut my learning curve in half and streamline my success I would be happy to pay them $10k for the information.  The big factor for me is the time.  I want to cut the BS and problems that I would have run into without the help.  I understand there are a lot of gurus out there charging $40k.  That to me is excessive, but the cost is really up to the individual. 

    Remember a smart man learns from his mistakes but a wise man learns from others. 

    28Reply
  • Lydia R.
    Investor · Austin TX · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    I agree with @Frank Wong. I think there is a difference between a mentor and a guru who promises things they have no intention of delivering on and make all their money “teaching” and no money actually investing.

    I had a mentor when I first started and he was a local investor that I met at a REIA who liked my hustle and eventually took me under his wing. What I learned was invaluable.

    Personally I think the people who compare paying for real estate education to paying for college do that because they charge 5 figures for “education” and are trying to justify an outrageous price. I dont think education should put anyone into debt, that money would be better spent investing in real estate.

    I mentor new wholesalers all the time and I charge a couple hundred bucks only to separate those who are serious from those who heard some night commercial promising yachts and six figure paychecks with no cash and no credit.

    There is so much misinformation out there, yes you can look up anything on Bigger Pockets or the internet in general but that doesnt mean its accurate. Newer people get conflicting information all the time and dont know what to believe and what not to.

    Thats just my two cents.

    20Reply
  • Leonardo A Afanador
    Flipper/Rehabber · Hamilton Township, NJ · Member since 2018 · 8 posts · 24 votes
    7y

    @Twana Rasoul

    I am a long time lurker first time poster. I am seeing all these judgemental posts on biggerpockets that I simply don't understand.

    My fiance convinced me to join a mentor program. Us "lazy" people have full-time jobs, and have spent the past three months studying at night and every weekend through this program. I still think is expensive, but at least I am getting guidance on what to study as oppose to wasting my time on the web trying to decipher information that might not be organized in a a coherent manner or even correct. We are hard at work on getting deals and will pay the course with some of our profits. Was this the best choice? It was for us and that is the whole point

    So please get off your high horse

    19Reply
  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Tiara Elise Hatley Williams I agree with you.  I'm seeing first hand people in San Diego taking advantage of newbies trying to start in Real Estate with $0 to their name and they are fooling them into opening lines of credit to pay for their class in excess of $10k, $20k.

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Dan H. Thanks for chiming in.  

    I'm all for education but I'm seeing first hand people in San Diego taking advantage of newbies trying to start in Real Estate with $0 to their name and they are fooling them into opening lines of credit to pay for their class.  Education is great but does someone with no money to their name and potentially in debt need to be taking a $20k course to learn Real Estate?  Part of it is these "mentors" preying on these individuals and the other large part is people not being honest with themselves and being suckered into getting rich quick or financially independent quickly.  Very few are truly willing to put in the level of hard work needed to succeed along with the patience.  I would venture to say that an extremely small number of mentees actually put in the work and at minimum make their money back let alone be successful.  

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    Hi @Ryan J. Shope I invest in San Diego and Mid West

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  • Tiara Elise Hatley Williams
    Wholesaler · Memphis, TN · Member since 2019 · 26 posts · 27 votes
    7y

    @Twana Rasoul right! My husband and I spent our entire savings on a "Flip Houses with $0 Down" course just to learn that you need good credit and a rich uncle to get a loan lolx. If it was truly $0 or wholesaling or bird dogging in the course, it wouldn't have felt like a rip off. Plus, we were supposed to get mentorship, and the mentors wouldn't return our calls after about 2 weeks. We didn't even get any insight from them. I learned more for free than i did with the course. BUT after closing a few deals, I do think every wholesaler should buy a course or get a mentor. 

    Regardless, no one should fish for naive beginners like that. Bird dogging is the way to go in my book. After 3 months, I closed a deal and made $1500. I started wholesaling after that

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Joe Villeneuve I agree with you on education, it is extremely important, but I personally am not a big fan of formal education and I personally have quite a bit of it.  There are great mentors out there and there are those who get quite a bit out of the paid mentorship even though a lot of the costs I've seen are extremely high.  from what I've seen locally, the programs are designed to maximize profit and not necessarily the success of the students and the mentors have been far from experts who have actually "been there done that".  On the other end, a large number of newbies are going into this to quickly change their lives.  True hard work and patience doesn't seem to be all that popular and most make excuses and lie to themselves and lack self-awareness.  

    If you are providing more value than what you are compensated and your students are going on to become better and a success then more power to you and you would be in the minority.

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    Hi @Frank Wong I appreciate your perspective.  I've recently seen first hand 20 year olds with no job and no money be suckered into paying 10s of thousands into a mentorship program to kick their career off in real estate.  Aside from the "mentors" luring these guys and gals in there with promises of making a lot of money in a short time, these students to me are trying to get out of actually working hard and being patience and think these programs are a short cut for hard work and patience.   

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  • Joe VilleneuvePro Member
    Plymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
    7y

    The problem here, is thinking you pay a Mentor...and you automatically start making millions.

    Why would anyone not assume you need more education after your Mentor starts you off (and hopefully doesn't drop you after the formal training is over)? Are you assuming that because you paid a Mentor, that's all you need?  Did you expect that when you paid (assuming here) at least 5 times as much for a college education?...or, did you expect to learn more after graduation?

    The best Mentorship Programs set up their students to move forward...and help them, at no extra charge...and based on my experience, that has not been the minority.

    5Reply
  • Dan H.Pro Member
    Investor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
    7y
    Originally posted by @Twana Rasoul:

    @Dan H. Thanks for chiming in.  

    I'm all for education but I'm seeing first hand people in San Diego taking advantage of newbies trying to start in Real Estate with $0 to their name and they are fooling them into opening lines of credit to pay for their class.  Education is great but does someone with no money to their name and potentially in debt need to be taking a $20k course to learn Real Estate?  Part of it is these "mentors" preying on these individuals and the other large part is people not being honest with themselves and being suckered into getting rich quick or financially independent quickly.  Very few are truly willing to put in the level of hard work needed to succeed along with the patience.  I would venture to say that an extremely small number of mentees actually put in the work and at minimum make their money back let alone be successful.  

    Like many things there are various different levels of quality to the various RE education programs.  However, to group all RE education offerings as not being worth the cost is were I take exception.  In addition, there are few things that I think are more worthy of going into debt than educating yourself in an area that you plan on using that knowledge to generate income.

    If you are indicating some RE education is crap, that is true.  If you are indicating some RE education is not worth the cost, that is true.  However, if you are indicating that there is no RE education worth the cost to anyone, that is certainly false.

    The challenge is finding a RE education that matches the students' needs at a fair cost. 

    My criteria:

    • Must be taught by experts.  The teachers should be practicing what they teach.
    • Should have processes in place that can be leveraged by the students.
    • Should come with network for life.  You pay for the coarse you should be able to make contacts that will benefit the student forever, not just for the length of the class.
    • Should be priced fairly.  The providers of the course should be making money off what they teach, not by what they charge to teach. 

    If a RE course could meet each or my criteria then I would not be adverse to a new RE investor taking on a small amount of debt to learn what can save them time and money (i.e. reduced mistakes).

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    Hi @Lydia R. I'm sure good mentors do exist, from what I've seen thus far these programs are made to make a lot of money and not necessarily sincere about their intentions to have successful students.  A lot of students may be better off buying their first deal with their only $40k and making a mistake than falling for some BS mentor for that same $40k who couldn't truly care less about their success.

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Leonardo A Afanador There is just a lot of people being taken advantage of.  If that is working for you, I wish you the best of luck with the program and wish you success in your real estate endeavors.

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Tiara Elise Hatley Williams Sucks that you went through that but I am pumped that you closed your first deal after that, that is awesome, Congrats!  I hope you make all your money back ten fold!

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  • Lydia R.
    Investor · Austin TX · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    @Twana Rasoul I agree! I dont think programs that cost 10s of thousands of dollars should be peddled to people who cant afford them. I think its completely unethical for these gurus to prey on peoples desire for financial independence and promise them things they wont ever deliver. I certainly dont believe that people who just want to learn and get started should go into substantial debt in order to learn. Taking advantage of people who can barely afford life is always wrong in my book.

    2Reply
  • Tiara Elise Hatley Williams
    Wholesaler · Memphis, TN · Member since 2019 · 26 posts · 27 votes
    7y

    @Twana Rasoul thank you! And we did already lolx. That happened 2 years ago and we've closed several deals since then. 

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Joe Villeneuve aligning expectations and charging a fair amount would be a great start as well as the "program" or individual(s) truly trying to add value to the students.

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Dan H. I do believe there are programs out there that are effective.  Truly aligning students needs with actual experts at a fair price seems to be a problem more often than not.  Thanks for breaking down your criteria, I think that will be very helpful to those looking into programs that don't understand exactly what they should be looking for in a program.

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Lydia R. I think you said it beautifully

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  • Twana RasoulBusiness Member
    OP
    Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    7y

    @Tiara Elise Hatley Williams haha that is great to hear! Thanks for sharing, I will be sure to check it out :)

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  • Braden C.
    Real Estate Investor · FL · Member since 2011 · 586 posts · 360 votes
    7y

    One of my favorite hobbies is competing in BBQ competitions with a couple of buddies. Our first competition was filled with ideas we got from youtube videos and blogs. These were all free and it seemed like we knew exactly what to do. We finished that competition DEAD LAST.  

    Over the next 12 months we did a lot of practicing and invested in taking a class with one of the best BBQ teams in the country. We won the same competition the next year out of 30+ amateur teams. Now we compete in the professional division 5-6 times per year and do very well. 

    The investment we made from a professional with years of experience was what made us a team of guessing what works to a team of knowing what works. We put in the legwork of practicing but he gave us the steps and "how-to" on what exactly works. Could we have figured it out on our own? Maybe. Would it have taken A LOT longer? Definitely. 

    When I started in real estate I was working for a decent sized wholesaling company and split deals 50/50 with them. They taught me the business and in return they received 50% of each deal I did. The two years I spent there I brought in over $250k personally which means the company made $250k by educating me. That was and probably always will be the absolute best $250k I will ever spend. 

    Choose your mentor/coach wisely, but don't hesitate to invest in one. 

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