Long Distance Investing

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Long Distance Investing

Stephanie Barthelemy
Investor · Baltimore, MD · Member since 2020 · 23 posts · 15 votes

Hello Bigger Pockets world!  My wife and I are new to investing, and we are looking to invest long distance in Baltimore, MD.  We are looking for advice for long distance investing from experienced investors, any guidance would be appreciated.

Thank you in advance!

Greg Barthelmy

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Stone Jin
Rental Property Investor · Chandler AZ and Sylvania, OH · Member since 2009 · 708 posts · 561 votes
5y

@Stephanie Barthelemy

We live in Phoenix and invest in Ohio.  Make sure you have solid boots on the ground, a good realtor and network with local investors.  We actually self manage the majority of our portfolio from 2300 miles away.  I can collect a check and call the plumber just as well as a PM.  The boots on the ground fill in the pieces where I can't perform remotely such as unlock a door or collect a lock box.

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  • Frank Scappaticci
    Member since 2019 · 14 posts · 4 votes
    5y

    I think avoiding C and D class neighborhoods is important to invest out of state. You just won’t manage the hassles as well as a local investor. I also avoid rehabs over 15k unless I really trust the Contractor in that market. I try to win on price and not on the rehab if I am not going to be there to to manage it. Some people call that “wholetailing” now I suppose.

    0Reply
  • Bob S.
    Real Estate Consultant · Cleveland · Member since 2020 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    5y

    @Stephanie Barthelemy  simply make sure you have a team/ PM  around you with your best interest in mind,  

    All the best 

    2Reply
  • Mike WebberPro Member
    Real Estate Agent · Reston, VA · Member since 2020 · 84 posts · 53 votes
    5y

    @Hanna M.

    Probably because you could buy a row of houses for the price of a single family in Northern Virginia lol I was flirting with the idea of investing in Baltimore but I had to shake myself and remember what I'd be signing up for. It is easy to get excited by the prices I think haha

    1Reply
  • Anthony Rosa
    Rental Property Investor · New York City · Member since 2019 · 703 posts · 538 votes
    5y

    Since you aren't there you will need to trust whoever you hire to take care of property 100% or you will get robbed blind! Understand what you're getting into before you do it.  If there's any doubt don't do it. You need to do the best you can to make sure you sleep good at night. 

    1Reply
  • Sophie Wang
    Member since 2017 · 4 posts · 1 vote
    5y

    @Stone Jin

    how is Toledo.good return.?

    1Reply
  • Steven Foster Wilson
    Rental Property Investor · Columbus, OH · Member since 2017 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Larry Regas:

    I am new to real estate investing. My wife and I are currently starting to poke around and look for 5-20 unit multi-family properties in OH and AZ. We live in the SF Bay Area so we need to look elsewhere to invest as it is too expensive here. What other cities should I be looking into for cash flowing apartments?  

    Ive been cold calling quite a bit here in Columbus OH, I actually put my clients in contract with an 8, 6, and 5 unit. Prices can vary widely based on neighborhood, but overall their seeing cap rates of 10-12+

    1Reply
  • Seth Hochberg
    Member since 2020 · 120 posts · 135 votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Ari Hadar:

    Do you use and count on rentometer? 

    How do you evaluate the fair market value /arv? 

     @Ari Hadar

    Rent and ARV are two very important numbers and you just have to put in the work to find them. Take this with a grain of salt as I'm a new investor to Baltimore as well.

    Rent: Scan apartments.com or craigslist.com and see what similar homes are renting for. A step further would be to reach out to these places and ask the property managers whether they're struggling to rent at that price or finding it easy. A step further is to have an excellent property manager who should know this data. Rentometer is great but it's only on piece of data. It'll give you a ballpark but they can easily be off and you need to verify those numbers anyway.

    ARV: is easier to find. Go to Zillow.com, or Redfin.com (I find Redfin has more data) and look in the exact area of the home you're interested in and look at homes sold in the last 3 months. If there aren't many close by, bump it to last 6 months or last year. Most places looking within a mile radius will do the trick, but in Baltimore, you really want to find homes within a block or two. Any further, you need to know the area well and likely it is very different. And then just look at the most similar homes (bedrooms, bathrooms, total area, similar finish) and those are your comps and likely the same comps an appraiser will make to determine the ARV.

    0Reply
  • Remington LymanBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2017 · 6k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Steven Foster Wilson:
    Originally posted by @Larry Regas:

    I am new to real estate investing. My wife and I are currently starting to poke around and look for 5-20 unit multi-family properties in OH and AZ. We live in the SF Bay Area so we need to look elsewhere to invest as it is too expensive here. What other cities should I be looking into for cash flowing apartments?  

    Ive been cold calling quite a bit here in Columbus OH, I actually put my clients in contract with an 8, 6, and 5 unit. Prices can vary widely based on neighborhood, but overall their seeing cap rates of 10-12+

     Dude you need to keep those bigger multifamily properties for yourself! Those are rare to come by in Columbus, Ohio

    [email protected]614-541-8475Podcast Guest on Show My Job Laid Me Off, So I Replaced My Salary with Rentals
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  • Jennifer WardPro Member
    Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2017 · 94 posts · 42 votes
    5y

    @Stephanie Barthelemy, so far you have received great advise! I echo those who recommended to find a property manager first. If they are a good one, they typically have many of the other contacts to build your team.

    One other piece of advise I haven't seen yet is to join the local REIAs and join several REI Facebook groups for Baltimore. I invest in Indy but live in Denver. I got lucky that there is a specific fb group for OOS investors in Indy. Maybe you can find something similar for Baltimore.

    Before I bought my first property in Indy, I visited for two days and had my schedule packed with different PMs, Realtors, and a few contractors. The professionals in Baltimore will likely take you more seriously if you meet with them in person. Of course that is is harder to do now.

    Best of luck with your OOS investing endeavors, feel free to contact me with any questions.

    0Reply
  • Ari Hadar
    Investor · Member since 2020 · 401 posts · 86 votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Seth Hochberg:
    Originally posted by @Ari Hadar:

    Do you use and count on rentometer? 

    How do you evaluate the fair market value /arv? 

     @Ari Hadar

    Rent and ARV are two very important numbers and you just have to put in the work to find them. Take this with a grain of salt as I'm a new investor to Baltimore as well.

    Rent: Scan apartments.com or craigslist.com and see what similar homes are renting for. A step further would be to reach out to these places and ask the property managers whether they're struggling to rent at that price or finding it easy. A step further is to have an excellent property manager who should know this data. Rentometer is great but it's only on piece of data. It'll give you a ballpark but they can easily be off and you need to verify those numbers anyway.

    ARV: is easier to find. Go to Zillow.com, or Redfin.com (I find Redfin has more data) and look in the exact area of the home you're interested in and look at homes sold in the last 3 months. If there aren't many close by, bump it to last 6 months or last year. Most places looking within a mile radius will do the trick, but in Baltimore, you really want to find homes within a block or two. Any further, you need to know the area well and likely it is very different. And then just look at the most similar homes (bedrooms, bathrooms, total area, similar finish) and those are your comps and likely the same comps an appraiser will make to determine the ARV.

    Thank you for your thorough answer. How long does it take to do one comp. Sometimes it's hours and you can't figure out if it's right. 

    I have 2 agents that give me comps but i don't find pm to do it yet. It's a bit tricky for them to communicate with me without me hiring them unlike agents. 

    0Reply
  • Ari Hadar
    Investor · Member since 2020 · 401 posts · 86 votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Jennifer Ward:

    @Stephanie Barthelemy, so far you have received great advise! I echo those who recommended to find a property manager first. If they are a good one, they typically have many of the other contacts to build your team.

    One other piece of advise I haven't seen yet is to join the local REIAs and join several REI Facebook groups for Baltimore. I invest in Indy but live in Denver. I got lucky that there is a specific fb group for OOS investors in Indy. Maybe you can find something similar for Baltimore.

    Before I bought my first property in Indy, I visited for two days and had my schedule packed with different PMs, Realtors, and a few contractors. The professionals in Baltimore will likely take you more seriously if you meet with them in person. Of course that is is harder to do now.

    Best of luck with your OOS investing endeavors, feel free to contact me with any questions.

       Good idea to look for the core4 in advance and especially pm for comps. 

     The FB group for Cleveland that i found is not so helpful and active and maybe oos investors can be good idea.. How did you market and made it active? Reia is one hour a month paid so it needs to be checked. 

    Video call/zoom replace actual visit when you are far or out of the country. 

    How do you remote flip in indi when the prices very low and not much left after the flip?

    0Reply
  • Michael Johnson
    Investor · East Hampton, NY · Member since 2017 · 8 posts · 2 votes
    5y

    Hi Stephanie! How exciting! We invest in properties all across the country ourselves. From Seattle to East Hampton, NY and down to south east Florida. My advice would be to do your research. Don’t be afraid to call listing agents and ask them their opinions on said properties you’re interested in and the locations. I’ve definitely been told on many occasions that certain property locations were not desirable investment locations from those agents. Of course we do our own investigating and run our own comps with market history and projections. We’ve always met with contractors and hire them when needed for maintenance purposes or even simple tasks. It’s not hard to manage from other cities and states. Good luck and Happy Investing!

    0Reply
  • Hanna M.
    Member since 2018 · 22 posts · 20 votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Stephanie Barthelemy:
    Originally posted by @Hanna M.:

    Why Baltimore? I ask because I live in the DMV and am familiar with the Baltimore market. I work in real estate. I wouldn't touch Baltimore with a ten foot pole, honestly. I now invest long-distance in the Southern US instead of Baltimore or DC even though obviously investing locally would be logistically easier. The landlord/tenant laws in Baltimore and DC are an absolute nightmare and only getting worse since Covid. People are also flocking out of cities during the pandemic, making rents shoot down in the short term. In order to cashflow in Baltimore you're mostly looking at C/D properties with neighborhoods you wouldn't want to get out of your car in (just trust me on this). Really wondering why you chose that market.

     Hi Hanna,

    We're open to other places. We just have been there a lot and got pretty familiar. We met some great, knowledgeable realtors who know the market and we can see a strategy there. Plus it's not that far from were we are in Brooklyn, NY.

    I would think long and hard about the landlord/tenant laws in Baltimore, especially the lead laws. Consult with a good L/T attorney. Nothing against OOS investing, I do it myself, but why not choose a more landlord-friendly market? Note also that the population there has been in slow decline for at least 30 years.

    Look, I get the appeal of the city (the prices certainly look too good to be true coming from NY or DC), I looked at investing in Baltimore for the same reasons you are, and I live even closer. But given everything that's gone on recently I'm glad I passed on the market. There are good real estate agents pretty much everywhere, you could find them in any area.

    0Reply
  • Noreen R.
    Investor · Miami Florida · Member since 2020 · 18 posts · 12 votes
    5y

    @Stone Jin this is great advice thanks for sharing!

    0Reply
  • Noreen R.
    Investor · Miami Florida · Member since 2020 · 18 posts · 12 votes
    5y

    @Stephanie Barthelemy my husband and I are looking to the same but from Canada and looking to invest in the US market so thank you for posting this question! Good luck to you both :)

    0Reply
  • Noreen R.
    Investor · Miami Florida · Member since 2020 · 18 posts · 12 votes
    5y

    @Matthew McNeil This is great thanks for sharing!

    0Reply
  • Stone Jin
    Rental Property Investor · Chandler AZ and Sylvania, OH · Member since 2009 · 708 posts · 561 votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Sophie Wang:

    @Stone Jin

    how is Toledo.good return.?

    It depends on what you think is a good return.  For some people it may be 5% and some 20%.  It's a good investment city for us.  

    0Reply
  • Del Crockett
    Rental Property Investor · Washington, DC · Member since 2019 · 13 posts · 2 votes
    5y

    @Hanna M. What areas down South do you invest? Same boat - live in DC area and have been researching Baltimore b/c it’s close by but not falling in luv with the idea like I have when investing OOS in the past. I have property in Austin but looking to expand South/Southeast.

    0Reply
  • Hanna M.
    Member since 2018 · 22 posts · 20 votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Del Crockett:

    @Hanna M. What areas down South do you invest? Same boat - live in DC area and have been researching Baltimore b/c it’s close by but not falling in luv with the idea like I have when investing OOS in the past. I have property in Austin but looking to expand South/Southeast.

    I like AR, TN, TX and parts of FL.  

    0Reply
  • Dan BurstainBusiness Member
    Real Estate Agent · Austin, TX · Member since 2014 · 360 posts · 331 votes
    5y

    No safer place to invest with some of the best, if not the best, return on investment in the US right here in Austin.  I might be biased since I am an Investment Realtor here but have put my money where my mouth is having 6 rental properties here in Austin and about to buy #7.

    [email protected]512-588-3260
    Dan Burstain, Investment Realtor51 Review
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    2Reply
  • Cameron Casey
    Wholesaler · Member since 2020 · 5 posts · 0 votes
    5y

    Understand the areas, work with local wholesalers and network with local investors.

    0Reply
  • Tyler Jahnke
    Rental Property Investor · Oakland, CA · Member since 2016 · 341 posts · 643 votes
    5y

    Hey @Stephanie Barthelemy - without reading through the 3 pages of replies, this may have already been said, but long-distance real estate investing all comes down to your relationships and TEAM on the ground in your investment market.

    Spend the upfront time and effort to build those strong relationships on the ground once you decide the market you want to invest in. Hop on the phone, get on Zoom calls, fly to your maket, shake hands, show people you are serious, and you'll eventually find the right people to work with.

    Best of luck!

    -Tyler

    2Reply
  • Jordan Murrell
    Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2020 · 162 posts · 113 votes
    5y

    @Stephanie Barthelemy

    Hi there Stephanie,

    Welcome to bigger pockets forums. We currently live in Las Vegas and invest in Memphis TN. First couple properties I purchased sight unseen. We identified our core 4. Lenders, property manager, realtor and contractor. We were able to rely on their knowledge and guidance to our properties that way. Definitely read David Greene’s long distance real estate investing book!

    Goodluck!

    0Reply
  • Justin Reed
    Wholesaler · Member since 2020 · 140 posts · 89 votes
    5y

    @Stephanie Barthelemy Thanks! I haven't actually, but you should try it! Feel free to hit me up if you want any help and I can point you in the right direction.

    0Reply
  • Aigo Pyles
    Flipper/Rehabber · Memphis, TN · Member since 2020 · 758 posts · 285 votes
    5y

    Congrats! Make sure you have a good team in that area. 

    0Reply
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