150 Flips in 2014!

150 Flips in 2014!

Real Estate Investor · San Clemente, CA · Member since 2012 · 148 posts · 123 votes

So I thought it would be cool to document my goal of buying 150 flip houses this and documenting my progress here for the BP community.

My reason for doing this is to help educate and encourage others, keep myself accountable, get additional ideas and feedback, as well as create additional business relationships that will help me achieve this goal and continue to grow my business, and help everyone in the process. ABUNDANCE at it's best!

I will start out in this post by giving a summary of where I am up to this point, and will give weekly updates on our progress, as we continue to push towards this goal, and I will be happy to answer questions anyone might have along the way.

Rules of Engagement!

1) Purchases are counted when we put them under contract.

2) Anything that falls through is taken away from the overall total.

3) So essentially the goal is to get 150 houses under contract (not including anything that falls through) in 2014

Where We Currently Stand

As of right now on April 9, 2014 in the morning we are at 27 houses. I specify morning because we are VERY close on a package of 4 that I am hoping we can tie up later today. Fingers crossed!

Here is the breakdown of each month so far on when we put those houses under contract, and how we acquired them.

I refer to my "Main Agent" who is just that, he is the agent we have bought most of our houses with in the past 3 years. Agent # 2 is another agent we work with and have purchased some houses with. Then I refer once to listing agent which just means she had the listing and we worked with her in buying the house. Then in regards to wholesalers I just go in order of when we purchased properties and referred to them as #1, #2 etc. Just for the record # order doesn't refer to my favorite wholesaler or those who we are necessarily buying the most from etc. :-)

January-6 total

14th Main Agent

15th Agent # 2

20th Wholesaler # 1

21st Wholesaler # 2

25th Main Agent

30th Main Agent

As you can see in January we had kind of a late start. I was not super excited about the fact that I set a goal to buy 3 houses a week and had 0 for the first 2 weeks! However we got back on track at the end of the month, and were close to reaching our weekly goals.

February-8 total

4th Wholesaler #2

4th Wholesaler #1

4th Wholesaler #1

4th Wholesaler #3

12th Wholesaler #4

26th Listing Agent

26th Wholesaler #1

26th Wholesaler #5

In February we started out strong. I don't think we actually put all 4 of those houses under contract all on the 4th but that is what Vanessa (my assistant) has on the spreadsheet so I'm sure they were around that time and that is when she documented them.

I felt like we were picking up momentum and were getting back on track, and had a good chance of getting caught up and reaching our 150 goal for the year, but then I had a 2 week buying drought, which got me incredibly frustrated!!! After some serious outside the box thinking, implementing new strategies and really rolling up our sleeves we ended the drought and bought 3 houses in one single day, which happened to be the same day I went to Disneyland with my family.

I don't have time to go into all the details here but I wrote a blogged about my frustrations and the details of overcoming them and then buying 3 houses in one day on my site if you want to read the details.

Also worth mentioning in February we bought a lot from wholesalers but my main agent who is one of our primary buying sources and had a goal of 5 for the month struck out! We also fell short on our large Direct Mail campaign we recently launched so once again we were behind on our goal but considering what didn't go the way we planned there was still hope for the goal of 150 if we could get back on track and get everything to come together.

March-7 Total

4th Main Agent

11th Wholesaler #1

13th Wholesaler #6

13th Wholesaler #6

19th Wholesaler #2

20th Main Agent

26th Wholesaler #7 (referred by #6)

I won't go into too much detail in March, but as you can see we fell short once again, with our main agent only getting 2 and our DM campaign just not being quite what we have planned for.

April-6 so far as of this morning April 10th

1st Wholesaler #1

2nd Wholesaler #1

2nd Main Agent

7th Wholesaler #8

7th Main Agent

7th Wholesaler #1

So far in April we are off to a great start with 5 houses under contract in only 10 days and hopefully we end up landing that package of 4 which would really help us begin to catch up and continue to gain some momentum!

Totals

So in total so far out of 3 months and 10 days, (or 14 weeks or 98 days) we have put a total of 27 houses under contract. Which means our average is about 2 a week which would put us on track for 100 for the year. So we are essentially behind by about 15 houses! YIKES! My main goal for now is to try to get to where we are averaging 3 a week and continue to implement new strategies, and build relationships to help us maintain that momentum and help us get caught up.

Summary

As you can see most of the houses we have purchased so far this year have been from relationships we have developed with agents and wholesalers which is actually pretty different from years past, but that is where we are at right now with our home acquisitions. I don't have time to go into more details on each deal or where an how our agents or wholesalers got these deals, but I will try to cover some more details on future posts as well as cover how we finance our deals, manage projects, systematize our business etc.

I know we are behind, and I don't know that we will reach our goal of 150, but we are not giving up! So far April is off to a great start, and we are continuing to build more relationships and implement more strategies to help us reach our goal for the year. At the end of the day as long as I can look back and feel like we did everything we could then I guess I can live with that, but right now I think we still have a decent shot.

I have to admit that it is pretty hard to put myself out there like this. No doubt there will be days/weeks or even months when I fall flat on my face, but having this accountability and support will help keep me going and hopefully everyone else can learn from my failures and successes along the way.

I know there are probably a lot of questions and a lot I didn't cover, but I think this post is already long enough so feel free to ask any questions you have and I will do my best to answer them in this thread.

I'm not sure what the exact outcome will be but I'm looking forward to sharing my journey and experiences with you along the way!

150 houses or BUST!!!

27Reply
1,087 views

Most Popular Reply

Jerry W.Pro Member
Moderator
Investor · Thermopolis, WY · Member since 2012 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
12y

@Justin Williams , I have no position yet on your model. I just wanted to post about how I liked your answer to the negative posts on your business model. It was professional, and you did not turn it into a personal attack. Very intelligent and classy.

See this reply in the discussion

284 Replies

Jump to latestLatest
  • Chris ClothierBusiness Member
    Rental Property Investor · memphis, TN · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    11y

    @Bill Gulley - I have commented on and voted for you comments many times in the past 5 years.  Like any other poster on here, some of your posts I like and some I don't, but I think I had told you in the past that I respected a lot of what you had to say - even though we were not always on the same page.  Hell, I think you told me I was full of crap once and I invited you to come visit anytime and take a look for yourself.  I even offered to take you for BBQ while you were in town verifying for yourself.  This thread and your comments here make me take pause and wonder why you are even getting involved.  It makes no sense for you to even be commenting when you haven't read his thread and the attacks, even though I know you will say you are not attacking, serve no purpose.  None!  You are not assisting anyone with your  comments.

    You don't know me from Adam and there is no need for you to care, but a lot of comments I have read from you lately including this one make me think it is time to stop paying attention to what you are saying.  

    BTW, go back and read your profile.  You list some pretty big numbers in there.  High volume for the amount of time you say you've been in the business.  Congratulations on the volume of deals you've done.  One thing made me laugh while I read it.  I was thinking about something my younger brother had said many years ago and then I remembered something you have said right here on BP.  He has a degree in real estate from the University of Mississippi.  He wanted to drop out because he worked for our company while going through school and constantly complained that at his young age, he knew more about real estate learning from his family than any of his college professors knew.  You had said on here that those that can't do it....teach it.  Then I saw that you taught real estate at the local college....how ironic.    

  • Chris ClothierBusiness Member
    Rental Property Investor · memphis, TN · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    11y

    @Ophelia Nicholson 

     - sorry for your thread being highjacked!!  Keep posting and keep sharing and IMO you don't owe anyone anything.  Share whatever you want to share and hold yourself and your goals accountable.  Grow your business and if you benefit from building relationships on here - more power to you!  Keep it up.

  • Involved In Real Estate · Hyattsville , MD · Member since 2011 · 298 posts · 256 votes
    11y

    @Chris Clothier  Please don't make me out to be the villain here as I can feel the horns in my head growing as I speak.. And please don't for a second give the impression that all the people you mentioned are here PURELY for the purpose of writing and or giving back..

    The truth of the matter is I can name quite a few in the list that get benefits from being on here and posting their experience- Whether that benefit is additional business, sales of a product, people to help fund deals, new investors to form JV partnerships or some just really want to say hey look at me I'm pretty darn awesome.. Now this thread is not for me to call out anyone so I'm not going to bring in other people who have no need to be involved.

    Now just because I don't have a blog or I'm not on here going these are my latest rehab pictures- Here are my numbers doesn't mean I have a problem giving back and or helping someone- As anyone who has ever contacted me off board has seen - I am always available by phone or text and I've even met a few new investors off here asking absolutely nothing in return.  Now I can totally start documenting everything going on in my life from now on- Because who knows I maybe the next HGTV star waiting to happen or a book deal might be close for me.  As a matter a fact let me get off this post so I can go write up how someone can be just like me- Even if in my mind I don't think I'm accomplishing anything great enough to write about!!

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    11y

    Sorry you took it so hard @Chris Clothier  and it's not all about Justin, I commented early on in this thread and questions weren't really answered.

    If you'd like to discuss my 40+ years playing in RE, part time and full time, be happy to take that to another thread, truth is, I was slacking (I thought) much of that time. Yes, at one time I taught several business classes, RE was one of them. I was a part timer then and another time starting the mortgage company, it's where I found some of my office staff! But, then I got too busy doing, so I quit teaching, but enjoyed it. BTW, I've been approached by those I know in the world of academia to teach again, I'm leery as I know the commitment required and after all, I am retired, but, I might do something to kill the boredom......might mean less time on BP, so some could celebrate that.

    Now, I don't recall telling you that you were full of crap, if I did, you must have been (LOL) :)

    I can see where your brother was coming from, he was lucky to be in a family that was active in the industry he was interested in, I think too, that unless you're expecting to climb the corporate ladder, grad school won't help that much in RE investing, it didn't do that much for me.

    I'd love to have some BBQ with you! Didn't recall the invitation, but if I get around your neck of the woods we might just do that!

    I think you may have missed my point, I think when someone starts a thread title the meaning of the words matters, not deals contracted, but closed.

    We all have different tolerance levels for hype, fluff and puffing, mine is rather low.

    I'm not so naïve not to understand that people comment on BP trying to make an impression that will lead to money in their pocket, that's fine.

    You're right, I really don't have a dog in the fight, but I disagree that my comments haven't made valid points to be considered, including those that K. Marie found so offensive, especially for our newbies to consider when reading material on the internet. Have to admit, there are some real unethical wheeler dealers types on here, it's sometimes hard picking out who, but Chris, you already mentioned one.

    BTW, there are a few on here that when I see their posts, I skip them, read them before and just find irrelevant babble so, feel free to do the same with my posts. Most of my posts don't really apply to seasoned PMs so I don't think you'll miss much. I wish a few more would skip my posts too.  :)

  • Chris ClothierBusiness Member
    Rental Property Investor · memphis, TN · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    11y

    @Bill Gulley - You and I can continue this chat another day so as not to take up anymore space.  It would have been good to meet you last weekend in San Francisco if you could have made it out or maybe at some point in the future at a BP event.  It is hard to spot ethics and shenanigans online, but when you meet people face to face you can get a real good idea of who are real and who are not.  I know each of the people I mentioned personally and have met them all...none would I consider unethical or shady.  You make it difficult not to like you so I will take your advice and just ignore the commentary that I think is off kilter and comment on the rest.  You did say I was full of crap on a forum several years ago (you have 11,000+ so I would not expect you to remember them all) and we both laughed it off and you are always invited for BBQ anytime.  

  • Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    11y

    Congrats again Justin! Tell us more about Houston when you have a chance... less competition? Thanks, Matt

  • Investor · Central Valley, CA · Member since 2012 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    11y

    I am sympathetic to this! A few weeks ago I posted detailed numbers for a "title rehab" deal, but it took me two months to get around to it. It was profitable and somewhat typical of what I do. I was dragging, though, because I was going to have to figure out how to make the spread sheet and how to post it here (SO not my forte). And most of the readers wouldn't understand or care about the details of working an HOA lien/lawsuit/foreclosure/title flaw/eviction/subject-to deal anyway. I don't blog, I don't coach, I don't partner....so there was nothing in it for me. However, it was a pay it forward post for all the spreadsheets and detailed numbers that J Scott from 123flip and Danny from Flipping Junkie post on their site. I studied those numbers for months and it gave me the courage to do some of the rehabs myself instead of selling them to the rehabbers. I very much appreciate the posts where rehabbers go over budget or have deals that won't sell! Those posts don't necessarily teach anyone how to avoid the mistakes. But rather the reality of the risks and how people persevere. I've lost money on deals. You can't be in this business for the long haul and only have rosy deals to show for it. The goal, for me anyway, is to be in it long enough and be busy enough so that a bad deal can be accommodated

    Even if Justin is posting his progress for the sole purpose of generating traffic to his site (which I don't know much about), I'm still interested in knowing what is going on in his investing business.

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    11y

    I am absolutely crushed that you have yet to be impressed by me! :) Joking aside, and realizing these comments above are not directed at me specifically, I must point out that while I may be a big fish here on BP. I am not a big fish in the entire ocean and I don't need to be. I will also point out that I have no program to sell, no books to sell, no coaching to sell and yet, I have spent well over a thousand hours on BP and more offline helping others who ask via email. Have I received even 10% of that back in any financial form? NO. So why do I do it? I have no need to have anyone tell me how great I am, I have a wife and Mother for that.  Have I made a Jv partner, received private money, made friends, go educated from someone else on the site, ABSOLUTELY! But those items (not counting the friends which I value more than money) have not returned my investment of time and money into this site. I too am anti guru and giving here gives me a sense of pride and payback for all those who have fleeced others, call it my personally retribution.

    I have posted many of my deals in great detail, including the bad ones where I lose. If that sharing helps others, great, that is what it is for, if I get someone to invest in a project, then great, I got a small piece back on top, and I am sure the lender receiving their profits gained something too!

    I am not sure how I missed this thread for so long, but I must say there has been quite a bit of flack shot in the air, not sure why the need to war. I am much less impressed by quantity and more impressed by quality and results, that said, even if 150 flips with $20k profit each, still equates to $3M in a year. That is impressive and worthy of a big fish token here on BP. If Justin gets users to send him wholesale deals because of his sharing here, then great, as he should. If he gets more funding or more of anything for his efforts, great, as he should. If he was here peddling some guru crap, I would be the first to fire a missile behind all the flack. But that is not the case here by my estimation. I have been on podcast shows, including BP and Justin's (just for disclosure sake) so according to Bill, I must be a newbie or a small fish looking to impress newbies. (No worries Bill, I am not being serious here, I know who and what I am and I take no offense to your comment above). I do however want to point out that some of us (at least I can speak for myself) do much of this on a public forum for some sort of satisfaction (I pointed out my specific goal above) and any good fortune that happens to follow.

    It appears that Justin has laid out some specifics on acquisitions after getting reamed for not doing so. Good for him, if he wants to put details of any of these which sold and show all numbers, good for him, if not, it is his choice, I would not hold it against him. That said, I would suggest he do as it will likely generate more good fortune his way.

    Good evening BP Nation, and happy investing.

  • Investor · Central Valley, CA · Member since 2012 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Will Barnard:

    It appears that Justin has laid out some specifics on acquisitions after getting reamed for not doing so. 

    Continuing to post here after getting "reamed" says a lot to me. BP is a tough crowd and wants details.  I'm in agreement as I always want details.  Bill says he didn't and won't read the thread.  So how could he know the content he is being so critical of? The thread has been ongoing since April and there has been a lot of updating on the acquisition strategies.  But more importantly, Justin has answered everyone's questions.  So it's useful and relevant to the people following it and asking those questions, mainly focusing on acquisitions.  For those that wish there were more pictures and details on the rehabs....that's not Justin's project here.  He already has the experience necessary and machine in place to do the rehabs.  He needs product, like so many other rehabbers in So Cal. I don't need to see any of Justin's rehabs (no offense Justin).  I'm pretty sure I know what most of them look like.  Unless you are extremely high end (Will Barnard) or a rehabber specializing in period homes, there isn't much new under the sun in California rehabs under $500-600K.  You get a lot of the same granite and painted cabinets in rehabs under $300K.  Unless it's terrible or defective, it all sells right now.

    Let's take the thread for what it is.  It's someone that is heading a business and updating a diary on the number of homes purchased this year for rehabbing, and how he did it. The man doesn't owe us any photos or rehab analysis.  It doesn't make him less legit if he doesn't post profit details. There are many successful people here who don't post profit numbers. Let's try not make it so inhospitable that high volume investors don't want to post here.

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    11y

    @Will Barnard 

    I have no idea what brought you here to mention me, I never implied anything about you or addressed you. Good for your wife and mom, most of us have had at least one to pump our egos.

    Justin "sharing" is that what all this is about, or is it marketing under the radar as some marketing ploy?

    I've already said, if he's doing it, good for him! What the hell Is the issue?

    Many here love hype, I don't.

    When my original questions are answered, and we see actual meat of the transactions, then I'll say there is a contribution that actually informs, so far what I read is hype.

    Again Will, have no idea why you mentioned me, I guess it was from Chris calling in the guru bunch to disagree with me, many here like to jump on that bandwagon, and I could care less. Don't know how you got mentioned with the guru crowd, but guess you did.

    Peace, love and here's to ethical postings! :)

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    11y

    @Chris Clothier 

      Congrats on a great year.. Unlike Bill G I did peruse the thread to get a flavor for it before posting... I wanted to make one comment that I think would put perspective  those that do high volume in flipping and for those that can get some lessons learned.. And that perspective is how much capital and or access to capital one needs to be a volume player if they are TRULY doing what Chris and Justin are doing.. Which is buying rehabbing then reselling the assets to investors.

    To deliver like Chris does and I am going to assume based on what I read Chris's deals are CLOSED out the door deals to 3P investor clients. Here is what he needs in the way of a pipe line and capital.. And this is something people can look at and scale to their size or what size they want to be.

    Chris needs at least 4 months of inventory to keep the machine moving.. He needs fresh buys, he needs starting rehab  middle rehab finish rehab sales then time to close sales as I am sure many are financed. So to execute LIke MI does he needs about 200 homes more in the pipe line and bought paid for and rehab funds available. So lets say he buys average home for 50k Wholesale I have not looked at the MI inventory but what I hear in the industry and from what Chris post is they have top end inventory... So lets say the very nice rehab Chris must do to command the sales he enjoys is 25k on average per house. So he needs basically 200X 75k of liquid capital turning.. or 15 MILLION out at any one moment.. that's a very decent sized operation obviously and one who has been in the business like I have for years knows how darn hard it is to cobble that kind of money together and keep it together account for it all and cycle it.  At the end of the day this type of operation takes a pretty large staff of qualified individuals.  But as he post it can be done if you can scale and you have access to capital at reasonable rates and large dollar amounts.

    Now TAke Justin if he is working SO cal and flipping a 100 homes he may be buying wholesale at 150 to 200k and needs average of 50k  ( just rounding up here)  he also would need 15 MILLION to 20 MILLION in capital to run his company. Now he might do it with less overhead because his volume is down... When I did fix and flip in Portland I did 75 to 100 a year with 3 supers and the rest were subs a comptroller and 2 other books keepers.. I bought all the inventory personally at court house steps.. I would have some bid for me when I needed to be in multiple counties but it was me and one other..  I know how hard it is to run this type of operation. And For Chris even doubly so because of security issues in some of the mid west markets.

    So hats off to you boys.. Job well done.

  • Specialist · Memphis, TN · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    11y

    And Jay you need a small army to make all that happen.  

  • Real Estate Investor · San Clemente, CA · Member since 2012 · 148 posts · 123 votes
    11y

    Wow! This party is just getting good! ;-)

    I would second @Chris Clothier comment about if anyone wants to come hang out and BBQ you are more than welcome. You can get to know me, my family, 3 kids, my story, why I started educating, come visit my acquisitions team in my office, head down to San Diego, and visit with my assistant, shoot you can even go visit my mom in Riverside and ask her about the 2 times I have made her cry since she has worked for me. Ask her what it is like working for me, ask her about the transactions she funds, paperwork she signs, and even ask her what it was like giving birth to an 11.6 lb baby breach!

    If you stay a few days you might even hear more about my goals and dreams for the future, you might hear about some of my personal and family struggles, (including some pretty serious ones just this year) and probably MUCH more than you would ever want to know bc I can be a gabber. I could tell you about the deal I lost $50,000 on earlier this year and about 3-4 that I just talked to Vanessa (my assistant) about today that we will probably just about break even on or lose a little bit (but are happy to just get out of)

    Then if you stay an extra day we can get into even more detail with my education business, and you might learn that the first 9 months I spend about 60 hours a week working on it with a negative monthly profit, and at one point (ok more than one point) considered throwing in the towel and calculated the cost of returning everyone's money to them. If you stay a few days my wife might tell you about some of the therapy sessions she has had to give me as I have continued down this path.

    We all have stories, back grounds, reasons why we do things. I don't blame anyone for any of the comments they have made here. I'm sure you have your reasons so even though (as my wife can attest to) I can be overly sensitive I'll try not to take it to heart. I'm sure you are great people just trying to say and do what you think is right. You don't know me or my intentions and there are those who do take advantage of others (especially in this industry), so although I would prefer you actually read the entire thread, listen to my podcast, or talk to anyone who actually knows me personally before making accusations I can see where the assumptions would come from.

    I've been investing full time for about 7.5 years now. In my first 2 years I spent over $40,000 on programs that promised the world and delivered very little in return. (I even won a car from one of them but it was never actually sent :-( )I don't regret joining those programs bc I met some great people and learned enough to help me get to the next level, and find great resources like some of the local RE clubs here in So CA, and great forums like this one. However I could/would never recommend them to anyone else bc I know they were mostly hype and their one and only objective was 1) How much money could they get out of my pocket, and 2) How often could they do it.

    We all know of people out there who charge you $25,000 to let you come to as many "free" seminars as you can only to bring in 10 pitch masters and up-sell the heck out of you! (on products they often don't even use or believe in themselves) Not to mention then if you REALLY want to learn "the SECRET" you have to up the Annie to the $40,000 program.

    Oh and then there's the program where "hey we're on TV" so we will send someone else to your town (they will hit all of them) to sell you on their program of $40,000 and then send you to some guy (college kid in a cubical) to "teach" you out of a manual.

    So I totally get it. We have all seen it so we are skeptical. However once again I would hope that we would do just a little more due diligence before being too quick to point the finger bc there really are some great educators out there who although do run a business and want to make a lot of money, really do care about providing value and I am grateful for them bc I would't be where I am today if they weren't willing to figure out how they could create a business out of education and thus allow them to do it often and do it well.

    You will be very hard pressed to find anyone (oh I'm sure they are out there) who listens to my podcast, has heard me speak, been to one of my seminars, or knows me personally that would have anything negative to say about me. ok I guess that isn't totally true lol. I'm sure there is plenty to say negative about me, but you can talk to just about anyone in my program and they will tell you (well I hope at least) that I have given (and continue to give) them 1,000% more than they ever paid for.

    Also I have to mention that there are some of you on here who are saintly! I am not for one second going to pretend that I would be able or willing to spend even close to the time I spend on here or the time you spend on here if I didn't feel like there was a direct and VERY selfish benefit to me! and if the benefit were only one of the many items I get from sharing with others it just wouldn't be worth it. My hat is off to all of you who give so selfishly. I wish I could say with 100% honesty that I am doing the same thing but it wouldn't be completely true so I won't try to make seem that way.

    Like others have mentioned they "would" document more but they have NO benefit so they DON'T do it.

    I recall being in that position a few years ago. I would speak at investment clubs when asked. (@Aaron Mazrillo/Ryan Skalla's club being the first many years ago) after a while I kept hearing about this blog called Bigger Pockets. In all honesty at first I thought it was probably full of a bunch of arrogant snobs (I mean just the name itself) but was blown away once I checked it out and all of the amazing things people were sharing.

    I tried to get more involved but it was just difficult to do on a regular basis and still run my business. (you can check some of my few previous posts from a few years ago) but would just get too busy to keep it up. I started a blog as well to share my journey but that just didn't last too long either. I would have a lot of people reach out to me who wanted to learn but I just didn't have the time or system to help them all and still take care of my family, grow my business etc. Once again the "selfish" person in me just couldn't justify keeping it going for the little value it gave me in return.

    I've always loved sharing/educating. It's been a passion of mine for years, so when I was finally in a position to choose more of how I spent my time I decided to really go for it. But this time I knew I had to set it up the right way and do something that could really last and have an impact. I knew I had to actually create a business out of it. But what would everyone think? Would they hate me? Think I'm a sell out? Taking advantage of people? I mean after all that is what people do in this industry right?

    That's what investors do right? Take advantage of people and "steal" their houses..."A bunch of Vultures is what they all are"...(I think we know otherwise...)

    After much debate and back and forth, I finally decided to go for it, and see what I could come up with. Could I really come up with a program that offered tremendous value without taking advantage of others and really give more than anyone asked?

    I wish I could say I crushed it! They came in droves! My prices were soo good that the word just spread like wild fire and everyone signed up! Not so much! If you think RE investing is hard try starting an education business. Anyone who has either done so or tried will know exactly what I am talking about, just like those of you who who have either had success or are working towards success in your RE business know just how hard it is.

    I am happy to say that I have stuck with it and am VERY happy to say the past few months have turned a profit and last month was a GREAT month for my education business! It might be up there with the hardest I have ever worked in a single month, and I really appreciate my family for being so supportive and understanding. It's not easy going to teach a seminar knowing you are missing your son's football and daughter's soccer games, but sure feels great to help others on this crazy path to financial freedom which we are all striving for.

    Once again if anyone wants to come meet up with me, get to know me personally, do an "audit" of sorts you are more than welcome to. I'm pretty much an open book, and you'll probably learn a lot more about me than you care to.

    @Bill Gulley  For you I will extend a personal challenge if you are up for it.  I would like to fly you down to San Clemente to be a guest in my home.  Come get to know my staff, learn more about my operations, (I might even show you my financials both from my house flipping and my education business.), Learn more about what I am trying to do and why, my past struggles  Even more importantly hopefully you will get to know me and my family a little better, and what we really stand for.  I can tell you are a great guy and really care about people so it would be my honor to have you as a guest.  Let me know if you accept and we'll set a date and book flights.  I really hope you do!  

    Have a great Friday everyone!  Keep pushing, and most importantly enjoy the ride! :-)   

  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    11y

    @Chris Clothier 

      And Chris may I also recommend the perfect personal conveyance machine since your Memphis to Dallas and Houstan

    http://www.tbm.aero/index.php/tbm-900/tbm-aircraft/overview

    And there still might be section 150 bonus depreciation if you close on one before years end... Just think of the big MI intials on this machine you would be styling....

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    11y

    @Bill Gulley Perhaps you misunderstood my post. I hate fluff too and am usually first or second to blow it away as you are. I didn't mention you for anyone else or because of gurus, I am pretty positive we both feel the same about that crap and the garbage that promotes it. I am also not on any wand wagon here. I was merely saying that IF Justin receives anything back from his thread, good for him, he should for his time. I also wanted to point out that your statement, though NOT directed at me, was not quite accurate. Like I said, I can't speak for everyone but I can speak for myself. I have given to this site more than almost everyone on here and will likely never get back anywhere close to what I put in and that is ok. I don't do it for ego, I don't do it because I have some underlying product to sell, I do it to put my middle finger up to the guru crooks and for the bit I do get back, majority of that being some great friends and people I can learn and grow with. It was you and I together making an attempt to help others on BP in the private rooms long ago here on BP, I believe we have similar goals, to help others here and big fish or small fish, it matters not, it is the thought and effort that counts.

    No matter how old you are or how experienced you are, there is always something new to learn. I am sure you know that. If you feel there is no real content or meat in this thread, well that is your opinion. I think many would disagree as I read several posts (between all the nonsense) that had details, info, and advice.

    Doing 100 deals is quite an accomplishment no matter how you look at it. Based on some of the numbers Justin posted, I can see he is averaging right around the 80% rule. Some were 77%, others 83% and everything in between. Some were asking for specific profit margins or final numbers. From my perspective as an experienced renovation guy, I can read between the lines and see what he has done thus far. He mentioned several deals where he will only break even or lose on, that is typical in any larger operation and will likely occur even in small operations over time, no matter how good you are. I have lost on deals and have shared those details. I have gained on deals and have shared those details. Hopefully others learned from them.

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    11y

    @Justin Williams 

    Thank you for the invitation, but I'd have no interest in going through your books since it's none of my business, but the other aspects were gracious of you.

    What I'm getting upset about now is that you seem to be in competition with Dion and I for the longest post on BP! (LOL :) )

    Seriously, everyone needs to understand me a bit more I guess, since I'm not going to change at my age, I'm one who hates the sin, not the sinner, so to speak.

    What I perceive as a sin certainly isn't by, yes, I'll say it, younger members, those with fewer times around the block, it's a lack of communication and probably much my fault as I don't really like to type and say things along a short path,

    I just hate hype, I'm pretty conservative, I don't like flaunting success or money in people's faces, I know it's not necessary to sell or convey ideas or teach. I'm very well off and I've been lucky along with some hard work. There are a couple members on BP that can't make a post without implying their (real or imagined) wealth, how gosh. When someone can really, buy, sell and donate the change of others, it's not a bragging point in polite and more sophisticated company. It's like a salesman who uses flash cash to impress others, a roll of one dollar bills with a couple hundreds wrapped around the wad.

    Our young members, who have not been around wealth take the perception of money to heart like a starry eyed groupie at a rock concert. Some business maturity will set in over the years and find that there is honest money and rather dishonest money, mine is pretty clean, so it can be accomplished.

    RE has earned a bad rap, worse than used car dealers, operators and investors have brought it upon themselves and it all boils down to a bit of disrespect of the industry out of a lack of knowledge, that stemming from those starry eyed groupies being too lazy to learn being overcome by greedy selfishness, in other words, not interested in learning what might be seen as nonproductive aspects of the industry.

    So, my distain for gurus, hating the sin, is due to the predatory nature of their marketing and what they promote, much with a total disregard to ethical or even legal aspects of our industry.

    It's not always the person, it's sometimes just being unaware of industry expectations, rules, laws and standards, but to a few, they may be aware and simply don't care as it just makes their monetary goals more difficult.

    Justin, I'm not putting you in any box with a label, I'm sure you have great skills, you're educated and probably a great family guy, none of my comments here are meant to be personal, my concerns have been with the presentation of some of these aspects, not your overall business goals.

    I really don't like feeling like an old man shaking my cane at kids playing, but playing outside the doors of a funeral chapel may require some cane shaking, if so, I'll shake my cane.  

    Didn't really shake my cane here, just pointing out some reality and don't mean to impede your cause.

    Your goals are lofty, I hope you reach them and go further, you're lucky to be able to operate in markets that will support that level of business and apparently family support to achieve your goals. It's not something that I see as being replicated by just anyone or anywhere. If you can pull wholesale deals from folks here, great, that's what we're here for, to promote business, I just have a more conservative approach to reality. Good luck :)      

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Will Barnard:

    @Bill Gulley Perhaps you misunderstood my post. I hate fluff too and am usually first or second to blow it away as you are. I didn't mention you for anyone else or because of gurus, I am pretty positive we both feel the same about that crap and the garbage that promotes it. I am also not on any wand wagon here. I was merely saying that IF Justin receives anything back from his thread, good for him, he should for his time. I also wanted to point out that your statement, though NOT directed at me, was not quite accurate. Like I said, I can't speak for everyone but I can speak for myself. I have given to this site more than almost everyone on here and will likely never get back anywhere close to what I put in and that is ok. I don't do it for ego, I don't do it because I have some underlying product to sell, I do it to put my middle finger up to the guru crooks and for the bit I do get back, majority of that being some great friends and people I can learn and grow with. It was you and I together making an attempt to help others on BP in the private rooms long ago here on BP, I believe we have similar goals, to help others here and big fish or small fish, it matters not, it is the thought and effort that counts.

    No matter how old you are or how experienced you are, there is always something new to learn. I am sure you know that. If you feel there is no real content or meat in this thread, well that is your opinion. I think many would disagree as I read several posts (between all the nonsense) that had details, info, and advice.

    Doing 100 deals is quite an accomplishment no matter how you look at it. Based on some of the numbers Justin posted, I can see he is averaging right around the 80% rule. Some were 77%, others 83% and everything in between. Some were asking for specific profit margins or final numbers. From my perspective as an experienced renovation guy, I can read between the lines and see what he has done thus far. He mentioned several deals where he will only break even or lose on, that is typical in any larger operation and will likely occur even in small operations over time, no matter how good you are. I have lost on deals and have shared those details. I have gained on deals and have shared those details. Hopefully others learned from them.

    Agreed! I was referring to Chris mentioning the crowd, I won't say more, don't need to.

    My posting here is really two fold, one is to try to educate between the shouting of poor concepts, ideas, attitudes, perceptions and just bad advice with hopes that those entering on in RE give more consideration to dealing at a higher, more professional level, as it's better for everyone. Secondly, my experiences in housing matters have probably made me more aware of the "public good" aspect of RE and turning out bad players just isn't in the public's best interest or that of the industry as a whole.

    It's all good Will. :) 

  • Chris ClothierBusiness Member
    Rental Property Investor · memphis, TN · Member since 2009 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    11y

    @Jay Hinrichs - You came remarkably close with your numbers!  You overshot by a little, but not much.  We turn a little faster than I think you accounted for!  Truth is, as an individual I am a real estate investor, but as far as my business is concerned, I am just an entrepreneur.  I no longer get to do the fun things anymore because we have built a team to do all of the hard stuff.  Now I do the not so fun stuff like meetings!!!  Not as much fun as getting dirt under my fingernails like I used to. 

    @Bill Gulley , I took the time to read some of your other commentary on the BP site.  You do a great job of answering questions on here and have absolutely provided value already.  If you ever have the time to detail your experiences - good or bad - I am sure others would find great value in it.  If it popped up on my alerts I would certainly read it.  

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    11y

    Awhhhh, pass the kleenex, it is so nice when everyone kisses and makes up! :)

  • Real Estate Investor · San Clemente, CA · Member since 2012 · 148 posts · 123 votes
    11y

    11/2/14 - 12/6 Update

    We've averaged a deal a week for the past 5 weeks which puts us at 98 so far for the year.  We actually had a couple others that look like they may not pan out so I won't include those.  

    So with only a few weeks left to the end of the year obviously we aren't going to reach our goal of 150.  We won't even reach the 125 like I had thought we would a few months ago.  

    I don't think anyone likes not reaching their goals especially when you tell them to the world and post it on a forum like this.  However I don't have any regrets.  I have no doubt that if I didn't have the goal of buying 150 houses this year I would not have pushed myself/my business in the way we did and tried to find new ways to buy houses, and we would have inevitably ended up purchasing far less than we did.

    In a few weeks I'll do a final accounting of where we ended up and post the final results for the year, give some final words, and lessons learned and we'll put this thread to bed.  

    Merry Christmas everyone!   

  • Ronald PerichPro Member
    Investor · Granite City, IL · Member since 2014 · 658 posts · 301 votes
    11y

    @Justin Williams Merry Christmas to you, too. I know you'll be spending some quality time with your family this year. Just remember to not talk shop all of the time :)

    Now that you have some more of your family involved in the REI business, it may be more difficult than ever!

    And once again, thanks for being so open and honest with your posts and with your podcasts.

  • Investor · Middletown, NJ · Member since 2014 · 19 posts · 6 votes
    11y

    Justin thank you for sharing you goals and journey.  I'm a new investor and I guess the bigger lesson I got from your experience is to set goals and work diligently to accomplish them. I'm excited to see your end results.  GOOD LUCK & stay motivated.

  • Ronald PerichPro Member
    Investor · Granite City, IL · Member since 2014 · 658 posts · 301 votes
    11y

    @Yonelle Baptiste I don't think @Justin Williams has even been accused of being unmotivated :)

  • Real Estate Investor · San Clemente, CA · Member since 2012 · 148 posts · 123 votes
    11y

    2014 Final Results!  

    Houses put under contract - 102 

    As mentioned before we didn't reach our goal of 150 houses. Although we ended up buying more "in house" deals this year (especially the 2nd half) we didn't end up buying as many through the MLS or through wholesalers as I had anticipated. Rather than feel disappointed that we didn't reach out goal of 150 I am glad we were shooting for that or we probably wouldn't have focused as much as we did on direct sellers, and thus purchased far less.

    We also adapted our buying criteria and increased our margins which I feel really good about.  There were probably 20 or so houses that we declined towards the end of last year that we would have purchase the year before because either the spread wasn't large big enough or it just didn't meet our new criteria.  When you are a home buying addict saying no to some of those houses can be tough, but I'm not much of a gambler and would rather sleep well at night even if it meant buying less houses :-)  

    We also brought on 2 new buyers and entered 2 new markets towards the end of last yea which I feel like actually ended up brining our numbers down last year but now that they are more trained and we are more familiar with these new areas I am hoping that we can really hit the ground running in 2015! :-)  

    I've had a lot of people ask me about my 2015 goals, and to tell the truth (even though it is not like me) I have haven't made them yet for this year.  As mentioned above there have been a lot of changes in the past couple months and I really want to see what happens in the next 30-45 days because this will help me determine what I think is realistic for us to do this year.  I would absolutely love to hit 150-200 this year but we have been so focused on making sure we are buying right, keeping ourselves out of trouble, going into new areas and new strategies and new buyers etc that honestly just pushing buying as hard as I possibly can hasn't been my #1 focus in the past couple months.  I do still want to buy at least 100 and would love to do more but am going to wait and see what happens here in the next month or two before I determine that.  

    All right that's a wrap for this post!  If anyone has any final questions I'm happy to answer them, but other than that, it's time to put this thread to bed!  

    HNY everyone! :-)  

  • Investor · Farmington, UT · Member since 2011 · 314 posts · 179 votes
    11y

    @Justin Williams Props for creating this thread and sticking with it. I know you had a lot of people throwing mud at you and trying to discredit what you were doing here. "It's not the critic who counts... or the one who points out how the strong person stumbled, or where the doer of a deed could have done better.. the credit belongs to the person who is actually in the arena..." 

    Back to the arena. :)

Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.