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Fort Myers Beach, FL · Member since 2016 · 225 posts · 124 votes
8y

Memphis Investment Properties Turnkey Case Study

Disclaimer: I am an investor/customer of M.I.P, I do not work for them nor being compensated in anyway, just sharing my experiences with other investors.

Providers Involved:

Norada Real Estate Investments

Memphis Investment Properties (M.I.P)

Reedy and Company Realtor, LLC – Real Estate Broker and Property Management for M.I.P

Bemortgage – Lender

Lipscomb – Insurance

The Prep:

  • I originally came across M.I.P through Norada (Marco Santarelli, BP contributor and has his own podcast).
  • I was assigned an advisor who gathered my goals and situation and we worked together to identify two markets to look at Memphis TN, and Birmingham, AL.
  • I’m am an out of state investor living in Colorado and have two other properties in Texas (not turnkey) and have been a BP member for some time.
  • I attended an investor Tour in May in Memphis to check out the area. It was hosted by M.I.P and we toured properties, meet lenders, insurance agencies, and other provider doing business with M.I.P

My Criteria/Situation:

  • 100K Purchase price
  • Good working-class B, B+ area
  • 3/2/brick house
  • Was looking for 1% rent to purchase ratio
  • Conventional financing with 20-25% down payment
  • Utilized 401K loan for down payment and closing costs

The Purchase:

During the M.I.P Property tour in May, they handed out flyers with properties for sale reserved for visitors that weekend. I put down $3K deposit on a house during the first day of the tour.

Below is the Performa and the initial picture of the house. Additional pictures, comps, and a list of renovations were provided, no costs, just items they would do. We had seen a similar house on the tours. M.I.P is willing to replace HVAC’s, roofs, windows, etc. when needed, but they will minimize the renovations based on the age of major items, etc.

This house needed a new HVAC/condenser, but the roof and floors were in average condition.

This house was set to be empty June 30, and close August 45 days later, this did not happen as planned.

Timeline of events:

  • Property Tour May 17-19
  • Deposit on May 18, 3K for $95K purchase
  • May 21 Purchase Agreement signed electronically
  • June 30, the house will be vacant (renovations start)
  • Was notified in early July tenant would not leave
  • July 17 house syndicated on Zillow, Realtor.com, Trulia etc. (pictures of current house pre-renovation listed along with a second house-MISTAKE)
  • July 23, tenants move out and return keys
  • Aug 31 First set of renovations complete, mostly cosmetic
  • Through Sep I negotiated with Norada and M.I.P to improve the renovations, I was not satisfied with work nor scope, they agreed to all items and improved the unit through Sep while it was on the market.
  • Sep 12 Appraisal came in for asking price of $95,000, cost $495
  • Sep 18th Third Party Property Inspectors found items, M.I.P fixed all issues, Cost $295
  • Sep 28th, closed on the property, no tenant yet

Closing:

  • The closing was smooth, mobile notary came to my house
  • All paperwork initially was signed via DocuSign, but ended up signing everything in front of the mobile notary at the end again
  • Electronic copies were available post-closing
  • No issues with wiring money, etc.

Post-Closing:

  • Home is still empty, Reedy and Company Realtors, LLC is now the Property Management company
  • Pictures of final renovations were provided after many inquiries
  • House rent rate was lowered to $965 after sitting vacant all summer at $1065
  • I was not sure why they raised the rent so high during the closing process. A friend of mine noted that some do that to actually discourage renters during the renovation process, so they can finish and have access. Others note that the marketing department wants to raise the rents for the benefit of all. I do not think this was a major strategy killer, but the house sat empty during peak rental time (Summer before school started) and is still vacant at a price above Proforma.

Some Observations:

  • Closing costs came out to be much higher than the proforma estimate
  • Taxes were spot on
  • Property Mgmt. fee spot on
  • The vacancy is listed at 4%, even though PM says I takes an average of 45 days to rent, so it’s a broad average I’m assuming after tenant leases or across all their properties.
  • They advertise 2-year leases during the tour and most turnkeys are rented prior to closing, not the case for my property, still vacant
  • One inquiry has come in for a family whose house burned down, but they want 3-month lease smack in the middle of winter for another renewal, not optimal
  • Neither the marketing department nor PM inside Reedy was very proactive as far as communication. I had to get Norada involved too many times to push them to email me back. This is probably my major complaint as this is totally controllable. As an out of state investor all we can expect is communication since we are trusting the process 100%.
  • The delay in closing was also probably controllable since it was their tenant to remove. This caused me a rise in interest rates and the second hit to my credit since it had to be pulled twice over the period of closing.
 Proforma EstimateActualNotes
Closing Costs$2854$4086%43 higher than the estimate
Pre-Pays$0$734I was told that M.I.P does not try to estimate pre-pays
Interest Rate5.25%5.375%I put 25% down, the delay in closing caused me to obtain a higher interest rate
Property Taxes$97$97Spot on (2017 records)
Insurance$40$52I used Lipscpomb, M.I.P .recommendation
Vacancy4% (14.6 days a year)Since tenant vacated 26% (95 days)Since my ownership 5% (21 of the 95 days)
    

Overall Summary:

Overall, I would recommend Norada and M.I.P. My experience was not perfect, but most items come with the territory in my mind. You must do your due diligence and expect delays.

My major complaint was lack of proactive communication. I work in the I.T. field were daily, weekly communication is the key to working in a remote environment. I have come to expect that from anyone who is in partnership around my investments. I did express my disappointment many times in lack of communication and it improved a bit after closing. I do not hold any one individual at fault, I believe its part of the system, they are overly busy and have to multi-task quite a bit. I think they should be upfront that you might not hear from them for days or weeks sometimes.

I would be more than happy to talk to any investor about my first Turnkey investment. I will most likely do this again because I'm not an expert in BRRRR, Wholesaling, or Fix and Flips. I need consistent CoC, Tax relief, and mortgage pay down, etc.

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58 Replies

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  • Investor · Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2015 · 130 posts · 102 votes
    11y

    Hey @Laurence Walsh-Hodson,

    I have actually purchased 4 properties from them before and am in escrow on a few more with them now.  I have had a great experience working with them so far.  Let me know if you have any other questions!

    Lance

  • Rental Property Investor · Laguna Niguel, CA · Member since 2015 · 142 posts · 98 votes
    11y

    @Laurence Walsh-Hodson I have not used Narada but have heard good things. Marco Santarelli actually has a podcast you might want to check out called Passive Real Estate Investing.  I believe Narada is a marketing company that just connects you with good providers who actually own properties. There are some bad marketing companies out there but Narada seems to be one of the good ones and could be valuable to a new investor. I'm sure you can find some people on here who have used him.

  • Real Estate Agent · Santa Clarita · Member since 2015 · 57 posts · 11 votes
    11y

    Thanks David. I will check out the podcast.

  • Real Estate Agent · Santa Clarita · Member since 2015 · 57 posts · 11 votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Lance Robinson:

    Hey @Laurence Walsh-Hodson,

    I have actually purchased 4 properties from them before and am in escrow on a few more with them now.  I have had a great experience working with them so far.  Let me know if you have any other questions!

    Lance

     Thanks Lance. Good to know. What area/city did you invest in?

  • Toronto, Ontario · Member since 2014 · 615 posts · 172 votes
    11y

    @Laurence Walsh-Hodson

    I have not bought a property from them yet, but  in all my interactions with them, I find Marco very professional. 

    Good luck

  • Investor · Calgary, Alberta · Member since 2015 · 1 post · 3 votes
    11y

    hey @Laurence Walsh-Hodson

    My name cliff lere I have actually purchased properties with Norada real estate closed two properties end of this past October on the 26 in Indiana. I also had a first hand chance to sit down with Marco, great gentleman who definitely overdelivers and is always available for  any questions. He also has a myriad of resources and team at your disposal to ensure you are successful. He is the real deal for anyone especially beginning or looking to grow their portfolios in a straightforward streamlined process I recommend them, I plan on purchasing another 10 properties through Norada within the next coming months. If you have any questions message me and my email will be provided and contact for any questions you may have about the experience. But I guarantee you start now and you will be glad you did.

    Cliff lerebours 

  • Alex CraigBusiness Member
    Real Estate Professional · Memphis, TN · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    11y

    I have sold a few properties through Marco and it has been a win-win relationship for all involved.

  • Pharmacist · The Villages, FL · Member since 2014 · 96 posts · 36 votes
    11y

    This is good to hear. I have been listening to the podcast and it sounds great, but I was nervous as I have not done any deals yet. I may contact those of you that have done deals if I have any questions as well! Thanks!

  • Real Estate Agent · Santa Clarita · Member since 2015 · 57 posts · 11 votes
    11y

    This is great information. Thanks everyone.

  • Investor · Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2015 · 130 posts · 102 votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @David Hodge:

    @Laurence Walsh-Hodson I have not used Narada but have heard good things. Marco Santarelli actually has a podcast you might want to check out called Passive Real Estate Investing.  I believe Narada is a marketing company that just connects you with good providers who actually own properties. There are some bad marketing companies out there but Narada seems to be one of the good ones and could be valuable to a new investor. I'm sure you can find some people on here who have used him.

     This is correct.  They "promote" other companies and properties (which is a good thing because you have a bigger team and more people to yell at.) Norada is also involved in actually flips and selling in certain markets though too. So they do both.  Marco has never tried to steer me towards his properties over others or towards certain markets over others other than for my own criteria which I like.

  • Investor · Scottsdale, AZ · Member since 2015 · 130 posts · 102 votes
    11y
    Originally posted by @Laurence Walsh-Hodson:
    Originally posted by @Lance Robinson:

    Hey @Laurence Walsh-Hodson,

    I have actually purchased 4 properties from them before and am in escrow on a few more with them now.  I have had a great experience working with them so far.  Let me know if you have any other questions!

    Lance

     Thanks Lance. Good to know. What area/city did you invest in?

     No problem - glad I could help, please message and connect if you have more questions.

    From him I have purchased 4 in Indianapolis and am in escrow now on 2 in Kansas City and 1 in Houston.

  • Real Estate Agent · Santa Clarita · Member since 2015 · 57 posts · 11 votes
    11y

    Very cool. Thanks.

  • Real Estate Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2015 · 19 posts · 5 votes
    11y
     @Laurence Walsh-Hodson

     Thanks  for bringing this company to my attention. I'm trying to do my due diligence on turnkey properties and turnkey associated companies and this one seems to have quite a lot of information to provide with podcasts and blogs.  Wish us luck on finding our own properties soon!

  • New York, NY · Member since 2016 · 44 posts · 13 votes
    9y
    Lance Robinson hey lance, where did you purchase real estate with norada? I'm interested in buying a place in Dallas.
  • Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2015 · 127 posts · 21 votes
    9y

    Im also interested in getting more information..

  • Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2015 · 127 posts · 21 votes
    9y

     How much would it be to start investing..

  • Specialist · Orange County, CA · Member since 2008 · 2k+ posts · 623 votes
    9y

    @Will Bert -- that's a good question, and I hate to say "it depends", but it does based on your investment criteria.

    Generally speaking though, you could acquire a decent single-family rental property for as around $12,000 down plus closing costs.  That would be a $60,000 property, often in a B, B-, C+ neighborhood.

    Keep in mind that it might be a great property for some investors, but not for you, and vice-versa.  It comes down to what you need or want.

    Hope that answers your question.  If not, let me know.

    Continued success!

  • Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2015 · 127 posts · 21 votes
    9y
  • Real Estate Coach · Austin, TX · Member since 2018 · 56 posts · 52 votes
    8y

    I have experience with this group. 

    Strong Points: Coordination. They do have a smooth process down and are in several markets. 

    Downside: All of my properties are performing under 9% cash on cash ROI.... This backs out vacancy. If you factor vacancy allowance I'm barely hitting 7% ROIs. They mark up their properties way too high. Their investment advisors are a bit sneaky too as I had a bad experience in Huntsville. Marco is polished but it is becoming more clear they are simply trying to squeeze every last penny out of a deal. I am not having a hard time selling these underperforming properties as I need to hold them for 3+ years to make up for the closing costs. Overall I wish I hadn't invested with them.

  • Reston, VA · Member since 2014 · 74 posts · 24 votes
    8y

    @Thomas Staub Thank you for your honest feedback. That is unfortunate as I am currently researching them and other turn key providers. Do you have experience or properties with other turn key providers as well? Are they also under performing?

    Also, you mentioned all of your properties are under performing, how many properties do you have with them that are under performing?

    Thanks

  • Investor/RE Broker · Eugene, OR · Member since 2014 · 3k+ posts · 968 votes
    8y

    @Aaron Hall  Keep in mind that Norada is primarily marketing properties for on the ground providers.  Each provider is different in each city.  Whenever you are vetting a turnkey company, make sure you know who the actual provider is and vet them and the people involved as thoroughly as possible.  I think that should include a visit to the market to meet the people, see their rehab work and the neighborhoods they are investing in.  There is nothing like a face to face.

    Turnkey markets are generally quite tight for anything like a true deal now. Best to find a quality provider, and be prepared to set your expectation as realistic to today's markets for ROI on turnkey offerings. With 20% down conventional loans, that is mostly going to be realistically 7-10% cash on cash range in the best cash flowing metro markets (mostly in the Midwest) when you are buying in B neighborhoods.

  • Real Estate Coach · Austin, TX · Member since 2018 · 56 posts · 52 votes
    8y

    Larry nailed it right on the head. 

    @Larry Friedundefined

  • Reston, VA · Member since 2014 · 74 posts · 24 votes
    8y

    Great, thank you @Larry Fried and @Thomas Staub for your valuable input.

  • Developer · Nashville, TN · Member since 2016 · 484 posts · 406 votes
    8y

    I had the pleasure of meeting Marco earlier this year at a conference in San Diego.  We both knew who each other was, as we are somewhat competitors.  Conversation was very kind, polite, and insightful.  I found him to be very open.  And although Norada is a marketing company for other local providers, Marco was obviously a very straight up guy.

  • Mike D'ArrigoPro Member
    Turn key provider · San Jose, CA · Member since 2010 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    8y
    Originally posted by @Thomas Staub:

    I have experience with this group. 

    Strong Points: Coordination. They do have a smooth process down and are in several markets. 

    Downside: All of my properties are performing under 9% cash on cash ROI.... This backs out vacancy. If you factor vacancy allowance I'm barely hitting 7% ROIs. They mark up their properties way too high. Their investment advisors are a bit sneaky too as I had a bad experience in Huntsville. Marco is polished but it is becoming more clear they are simply trying to squeeze every last penny out of a deal. I am not having a hard time selling these underperforming properties as I need to hold them for 3+ years to make up for the closing costs. Overall I wish I hadn't invested with them.

     Thomas, you don't say why you feel the properties are under performing and for how long. Are you not getting the rents that you expected, are expenses higher than projected or are vacancies higher? you said that if you factor in a vacancy factor that your only hitting 7%. Well what is the true vacancy? When you measure the actual performance of your portfolio you use true expenses and vacancies not projections or factors. Is this is an ongoing trend or just short term? I think you need to be more specific. Like any investment, real estate returns fluctuate over time. For how long would you consider them under performing? You said that they mark up their properties "way too high". What are you basing that on? Didn't you get an appraisal? If so, did they appraise for less than the sales price and if so, why would have closed on them and not cancel? Lastly, you said that their investment advisors are a "bit sneaky" however, you offered no explanation for why you feel that way. I think you need to provide far more specifics on your experience when you make these claims. 

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