Out of state small MF investing

Out of state small MF investing

San Diego, CA · Member since 2019 · 37 posts · 16 votes

I am looking to invest out of state, small MF 2-4 units. South and Midwest. Any input as to where are good emerging markets to invest or to start? Any input, tips and connections with turn key providers or brokers are greatly appreciated.

Parameters: turn-key (as I am very busy), good PM in the area, 1. 10% cash-on-cash return, after additional capital expenses. 2. Clean/decent condition of interior note that I might be willing to invest in modest cosmetic fixes such as new appliances, paint, carpet, etc. But no remodels or major repairs needed in year 1.

3. Newer construction. 2000+ is great, 1990 is OK. 1980 would take some convincing. 4. Reasonable commute to large centers for employment.  5. 3+ beds; 2+ baths. I would say that 4/2.1 would be ideal. 6. Modern features such as a functional 2-person master bath, social kitchen, attached 2+ car garage, central heat and/or AC, non-gold features, etc. 7. Clean, decent, functional yard (low cost of upkeep, so no pool and probably no water feature) 8. B neighborhood or better, and on a decent or better street. 9. Attractive curb appeal.

Appreciation

1. Stable-or-better outlook for the economy 

2. Low cost of living in the city

3. Diversified economy

4. Non-Extreme climate

5. Property doesn’t have any significant negatives (high road noise, power lines, hills, odor, etc.)

6. Housing market trends must make sense

7. Decent or better city to live in.

8. A decent sized city or larger 

Thanking someone from BP (forgot your name), sorry- we have similar taste in finding MF parameters. Thanks in advance.

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Developer · Charlottesville, VA · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
6y

@Salome D. I would not advise you to go out of state for small properties like this. It’s not worth the time, energy, effort and cost. One bad deal will cost you way more than you can make. Cheap properties are cheap for a reason and are not always the best option. I know your area is expensive but there are still deals to be had of you focus and stay consistent. Acres of Diamonds.

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  • Developer · Charlottesville, VA · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y

    @Salome D. I would not advise you to go out of state for small properties like this. It’s not worth the time, energy, effort and cost. One bad deal will cost you way more than you can make. Cheap properties are cheap for a reason and are not always the best option. I know your area is expensive but there are still deals to be had of you focus and stay consistent. Acres of Diamonds.

  • Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    Do MF come in 4/2 with 2 car attached garages?

    Eta - i reread and see op is talking about duplexes....  IMO  Buy local in a market you know and understand   This is the best way to succeed   

  • Rental Property Investor · Honolulu, HAWAII (HI) · Member since 2011 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y

    @Salome D.

    Yes MFH is better than SFH but learn SFH first.

  • Realtor · Bakersfield, CA · Member since 2018 · 9 posts · 3 votes
    6y

    @Salome Ditmars Is there a particular reason why you would want to invest outside of California ?

  • San Diego, CA · Member since 2019 · 37 posts · 16 votes
    6y

    @Mahavir Gill many reasons, super expensive pricing, prop taxes and no cash flow. Those are major ones. I don't have time to rehab. I'm a busy mom and career woman. 

  • San Diego, CA · Member since 2019 · 37 posts · 16 votes
    6y

    @ Lane I have 2 SFH for 5 years now here in southern Cali, no cash flow, actually negative but I'm doing it for appreciation.

  • San Diego, CA · Member since 2019 · 37 posts · 16 votes
    6y

    @Mary M. this is the way to go, small family in a nice area with decent cash flow. Thanks.

  • Investor · Great Neck, NY · Member since 2016 · 679 posts · 467 votes
    6y

    @Salome D.

    Just my overall opinion but if your buying for appreciation while taking a hit every month you may want to re-strategize. Secondly I have to agree with @Greg Dickerson.  The most efficient way to invest out of state is to go a bit bigger.  How many more units really depends on where you are financially.  I highly recommend talking to someone who has invested out of state successfully this way you "learn the ropes" before just dipping in.  It alleviates years of unnecessary mistakes and gets you contacts in the area which in turn give you more resources for growth.  

  • Realtor · Bakersfield, CA · Member since 2018 · 9 posts · 3 votes
    6y

    @Salome Ditmars We see decent opportunities for cash flowing small multi-families in Central Valley, California ( Fresno, Kern and Tulare Counties).

    Most imp issue in my mind is trying to find newer units with attached garages. Older units have lower occupancies even in similar locations

  • Ivan BarrattBusiness Member
    Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2015 · 764 posts · 953 votes
    6y

    @Greg Dickerson Acres of diamonds indeed! Truly a great story/lesson! One many should heed! I tend to agree with you. Small cheap deals out of state are often a terrible model. For the best returns; stick to home and find opportunities. For the busy, career minded, parent focused; consider partners. #syndication.

  • Rental Property Investor · San Diego · Member since 2019 · 109 posts · 87 votes
    6y

    @Salome Ditmars I guess my initial thought is that if you want to be so hands-off, why not invest passively in a syndication? Depending on the deal, it‘d probably tick all the boxes you’re after from a returns perspective.

    Of course in many syndications, you have to be an accredited investor, but if you own two SFHs here in SD that you bought 5yrs ago, there’s a decent chance you’d qualify. Just a thought...

  • San Diego, CA · Member since 2019 · 37 posts · 16 votes
    6y

    @Kyle Smith also thinking of passive investing. But I won’t put all mg eggs in one basket. Still wants a buy and hold and semi-involved. I thrive at being busy and challenged.

  • Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2016 · 530 posts · 398 votes
    6y

    Good goal. To speak for, I think you can find a lot of opportunities in the Midwest. We are beginning to generate some competition to equate to core markets but still pockets and sub-markets within where you can find add-value. Cannot speak upon new construction.

    Are you currently investing in San Diego? How is the market there?

  • Rental Property Investor · Brighton, CO · Member since 2015 · 37 posts · 36 votes
    6y

    @Salome Ditmars I had SFH rentals for years in a Denver. For many years, minimal cash flow. Finally sold and bought multifamily in Ohio.

    You do need to carefully research areas and ensure there is an honest and reliable property management firm. Long distance means they can play on the fact you can’t see what’s going on with your property.

  • Real Estate Agent · Kansas City · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    @Salome Ditmars

    If you are interested in Kansas City market let me know. Fits most of this parameters. I love OOS investors!

  • Mike D'ArrigoPro Member
    Turn key provider · San Jose, CA · Member since 2010 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    @Salome D. Indianapolis and Kansas City or both strong cash flow markets, however, for MF, I would recommend KC over Indy. Most of the MF units in Indy are in old, rough neighborhoods that don't attract quality tenants. The most important thing is to be sure you are in a solid neighborhood. MF can have some challenges that you don't have with single family so buy in the best area that you can.

  • Specialist · Tampa, FL · Member since 2012 · 933 posts · 492 votes
    6y

    @Salome D. not sure how profitable investing in small multis out of state would be. Typically the smaller you go the closer to home you want to be. Unless you have trusted sources as boots on the ground in those markets and your familiar with those markets. The smaller multis may not even make sense to hire a PM to manage. The numbers may not work out. Im not saying this is true for every smaller multi, but usually this is the case. The further away from home base you go you typically want to go larger because you have the economies of scale working for you.

  • Investor · Wichita, KS · Member since 2014 · 47 posts · 15 votes
    6y

    @Salome D. We are based in Wichita, Ks, much of what you are looking for can be achieved here. Happy to chat on a call sometime if you want.

  • Rental Property Investor · St. Paul, MN · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    I would not buy small properties out of state. By what you describe of yourself, I would suggest digging into investing in a syndication, being a hard money lender or buying notes. 

    This article will help you find good markets

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/member-blogs/10145/83188-finding-emerging-markets

    This is a guide on syndication

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/member-blogs/10145/83067-limited-partner-s-guide-to-investing-in-the-right-deal

    This is a guide on investing out of state

    https://www.biggerpockets.com/member-blogs/10145/74387-keys-to-out-of-state-investing-oos

  • Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2019 · 53 posts · 62 votes
    6y

    Indianapolis contains lots of strong cashflow opportunities! As far as turnkey, I have noticed that many of these do not give investors the return they typically look for. You mentioned you were busy, and although turnkey seems like the best way to go, since there is no value being added the returns are usually ate up. In my opinion, turnkey properties are a good way to build up equity, and benefit from appreciation over time. If you are looking for high returns, then I would encourage you to invest in a place where you can add value and gain instant equity from the ARV. There are tons of B/C class properties in areas that are turning around, but they need some rehab.

    To help you with time, you should have a competent team in place consisting of a broker who is knowledgeable on the values in the area (and MF investments!), a contractor, and a property manager! My team and I, specialize in investment properties around Indianapolis. We are all native to the area, and have kept up with the changes going on around the city. Our team has a portfolio consisting of 40+ units in Indianapolis, and nearby cities. These properties range from SFR to a 19 unit complex. Let me know if we can provide some help!

    Excited for you to get started!

  • Investor · Indianapolis · Member since 2019 · 108 posts · 69 votes
    6y

    @Salome D., I like what @Ivan Guillen is saying here.  MF can be difficult in Indianapolis, not always, but many of these MF properties are in tough areas.  You need someone to help you evaluate.  Indy is primarily a SF market.  @Ivan Guillen mentioned that many of these need rehab.  IMO this is true.  The struggle here is finding a competent contractor.  What you may need is an independent seller, and independent contractor, and an independent broker or agent to verify.  If you put all of your eggs into one basket, you can get information that may be compromised.  But yes, overall Indy is a great market.  

    I would also add that @Mike D'Arrigo always has some good points and is a very sharp investor.  

    Best wishes!!

  • Mike D'ArrigoPro Member
    Turn key provider · San Jose, CA · Member since 2010 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    @Richard Bonisa thanks for the call out.

  • Property Manager · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2019 · 20 posts · 9 votes
    6y

    @Ivan Guillen, @Salome Ditmars, Would agree with Ivan on Indy MF info. Not a ton of SF A/B+ homes in area meeting 1% rule. You can find some really good cash flow properties here in INdy. Reach out Salome if we can help with anything!! Few emerging markets around here. Good luck getting started out of state!!





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