Stop Asking for Help. Just Stop.

Investor · Saint Louis, MO · Member since 2016 · 970 posts · 1k+ votes

I've gotten so many investors asking me what areas, neighborhoods, ZIP codes I've worked in, it's ridiculous. STOP DOING THAT TO PEOPLE.

Do people have no shame when they are essentially trying to drink from the same watering hole? Do you realize how hard it is to find a niche market that works for you. Why do people just try to piggyback off of other hardworking investors who found their place in an already scarce market.

I'll answer any and all non-competitive questions that are thrown my way, but I hate it when people try to take my secret sauce.

Rant over

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Johnson City, TN · Member since 2014 · 586 posts · 705 votes

With all due respect, David, in this day and age there is nothing secret anymore. If I was so motivated I could determine what you ate for breakfast this morning. A motivated person can locate every deal you have made. When you post on a forum such as this you open yourself up for questions. Unfortunately forums are often just a venue for bragging and self promotion instead of an area for cultivating friendships and helping others. If privacy is such a big concern for you then just refrain from posting.

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Joe VilleneuvePro Member
Plymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
9y
Isn't this kind of like the ability to change channels when you don't like the show on TV?
Just delete and move forward. Anyone can ask anyone any question they want here. That's the point of this forum. If you don't like the questions, just change the channels.
78 Reply
David D Painter
Member since 2016 · 143 posts · 157 votes
9y
And I don't mind people asking a bit. Plenty of room for all of us. Met with a nice young fellow just starting out a few weeks ago and showed him most everything I do. I figured I could show him what example NOT to follow. Lol
33 Reply
Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
9y
depends on how they ask. Some just expect it. Others are polite and pleasant. Who are you going to engage with
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21 Reply
David Zheng
OP
Investor · Saint Louis, MO · Member since 2016 · 970 posts · 1k+ votes
9y
@Joe Villeneuve Of course I can do that. but out of the 40 private messages I've gotten since I posted a success story, 90% of them is simply. "where do you buy your places"

It's clutter and even if it only takes me 10 minutes to go through and delete everything, its still 10 minutes lost.

Like all REI, dont ask if you can't offer anything in return. Noone wants to do a deal with a noobie unless they have skin in the game, offer a return or some other concrete skill.

I just dont think people realize how competitive this market is getting. and people probably also dont realize that when they lose a deal to someone else, it potentially could have been the same person that asked them previously where they get their best deals.
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Johnson City, TN · Member since 2014 · 586 posts · 705 votes
9y
With all due respect, David, in this day and age there is nothing secret anymore. If I was so motivated I could determine what you ate for breakfast this morning. A motivated person can locate every deal you have made. When you post on a forum such as this you open yourself up for questions. Unfortunately forums are often just a venue for bragging and self promotion instead of an area for cultivating friendships and helping others. If privacy is such a big concern for you then just refrain from posting.
94 Reply
Joe VilleneuvePro Member
Plymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
9y
I look at it as another form of Networking. Sometimes it leads to nothing, sometimes it leads to something now...and/or down the road, with someone that was a referral by the person you would have deleted...or not wanted to ask you that question.
My biggest financial source came from a conversation I had with a newbie that asked me where he should start, and where the best markets were. I found out he had access to $1M in cash, from a private funding source (relative) that wanted this person to invest it in RE for them. The Newbie with the question was learning, and networking himself. I partnered with him, and the rest is history.
All because I didn't care that he asked me for a "freebie".
79 Reply
Jacqueline Coombs
Rental Property Investor · Grand Rapids, MI · Member since 2016 · 262 posts · 205 votes
9y
Helping others always pays off tenfold or more. Any time I get caught in scarcity thinking, it becomes "me against them" which leads to fear and competitive paranoia. My reality is a direct result of my thinking. I would rather think that there is plenty for everyone and network with an open mind than fall prey to fear and live in a "not enough for me" type of world. Who would ever trust me to do honest business with them in that state of mind? I would not. I have ultimately found that helping others make money leads to my making tons more in the end. Obviously, there are a lot of "takers" in the world but my responsibility is to be a giver regardless. And, being a "giver" helps me recognize other "givers" and my network ends up full of good people who all want to help each other succeed. My .02
85 Reply
Linda S.
Investor · Richmond, VA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
9y
Hi @David Zheng,
People want the get rich quick formula, and from an outsiders perspective--you have it! I will say--it secretly pisses me off how many people want to get in, with no skin in the game, or say they have no money for renovations.... I'm just like.. REALLY? Do you have any idea how expensive this game is??? I don't know the real estate failure rate, but I'd assume it's VERY high because of people like that.
Just come up with a nice, standard response to copy/paste to weed out the dreamers and help the people who maybe can. Maybe put on your profile and the email about not willing to disclose any information about your own business. Maybe push some books you enjoyed, or other resources, but again-- standard copy/paste email should help alleviate the issue! IMO BP is all about helping, forming friendships and learning from each other's experience.
Good luck! Oh, and btw-- I'm jealous of St. Louis's music venues, my sisters lives there and always brags about the great concerts!
6 Reply
Joe VilleneuvePro Member
Plymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
9y
Originally posted by @Jacqueline Coombs:

Helping others always pays off tenfold or more. Any time I get caught in scarcity thinking, it becomes "me against them" which leads to fear and competitive paranoia. My reality is a direct result of my thinking. I would rather think that there is plenty for everyone and network with an open mind than fall prey to fear and live in a "not enough for me" type of world. Who would ever trust me to do honest business with them in that state of mind? I would not. I have ultimately found that helping others make money leads to my making tons more in the end. Obviously, there are a lot of "takers" in the world but my responsibility is to be a giver regardless. And, being a "giver" helps me recognize other "givers" and my network ends up full of good people who all want to help each other succeed.
My .02
Worth more than .02 Jackie.
16 Reply
Sam Shueh
Real Estate Agent · Cupertino, CA · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
9y
Anyone on this investor social site should be open minded. I get calls on pocket listing, must sell to them first. I responded you bring the documentation and come to the law firm. I will see what I can do after you are qualified.
2 Reply
Steve Vaughan
Rental Property Investor · East Wenatchee, WA · Member since 2014 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
9y
Can't have it both ways @David Zheng
Look at me, I leveraged up over $200k or whatever. I did this...
Wait, don't bother me. Why are you bothering me?
LOL, dude. You get what you get.
32 Reply
David Dachtera
Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
9y
@David Zheng,
If you publish your success, people are going to ask what worked for you. It may or may not work for them.
You might tell them something in terms of your own understanding, but their understanding may be quite different.
There's a reason why you can walk past billionaires on the sidewalk all day long: they choose to remain anonymous.
31 Reply
Michaela G.
Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
9y
I agree that many newbies don't know where the boundaries are. I like to help, if I have some knowledge that someone is seeking. But I have the right to pick and choose what I give on.
I have won my knowledge through the school of hard knocks and have gone through ups and downs.
Some things people just have to figure out for themselves, like who the good contractors/handymen are. I'll gladly give on an electrician or plumber of HVAC guy, who are only at my rehab for a fews days. But don't ask me for my handman, who's supposed to be on my site every day. If I were to share his name, then he'd get too busy for my projects.
So, I think there's a fine line, that many newbies simply don't know not to cross, because they don't have the experience and don't know how hard won that information or contact is.
6 Reply
Joe VilleneuvePro Member
Plymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
9y
Originally posted by @Michaela G.:

I agree that many newbies don't know where the boundaries are. I like to help, if I have some knowledge that someone is seeking. But I have the right to pick and choose what I give on.
I have won my knowledge through the school of hard knocks and have gone through ups and downs.
Some things people just have to figure out for themselves, like who the good contractors/handymen are. I'll gladly give on an electrician or plumber of HVAC guy, who are only at my rehab for a fews days. But don't ask me for my handman, who's supposed to be on my site every day. If I were to share his name, then he'd get too busy for my projects.
So, I think there's a fine line, that many newbies simply don't know not to cross, because they don't have the experience and don't know how hard won that information or contact is.
Agree 100%, but I would like to add this:
I bet you asked a lot of the same questions when you were a Newbie. I think we all did.
14 Reply
Michaela G.
Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
9y
Originally posted by @Joe Villeneuve:

Agree 100%, but I would like to add this:
I bet you asked a lot of the same questions when you were a Newbie. I think we all did.
When I started, 25 years or so ago, there weren't all of these gurus or internet websites. I wasn't even a member of any REIAs. Just had some books from Dave del Dotto and went out and did it ;-)
5 Reply
Ujwal Velagapudi
Investor/Agent/Entrepreneur · Dallas, TX · Member since 2016 · 464 posts · 564 votes
9y
I've received similar questions, and have offered to drive around all my properties sharing some of my experiences with some folks I've met through BP. At this point I'm simply looking to share my experiences if I can help someone else get started. If it leads to something mutually beneficial, that's great too.
At the same time I will be reluctant to help/respond elaborately to someone asking repeated thoughtless questions without doing any legwork on their end at all. Likewise, I try to educate myself a bit in the specific topic I'm interested in discussing before I message anyone.
9 Reply
Joe VilleneuvePro Member
Plymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
9y
@Michaela G. Not sure I agree about the boundaries. As much as I understand the importance of not wasting time, I think about all the "wasted time" that built my network.
That deflected question or request, that I answered or fulfilled, became an important part of my network as I guided them forward...either by their participation, a referral from them, or both. I'm thinking about one right now from BP that brought me a string of Networking (buyers, contractors, "boots on the ground" our of state, funding, etc...all from a specific question, from a Newbie, like, "where is the best place to invest in Michigan?".
Funny, but I haven't seen that Newbie here in a long time, but I do want to thank him for helping me build my success.
6 Reply
Justin Fox
Software Developer · Vidor, TX · Member since 2015 · 922 posts · 639 votes
9y
Man, my wife only kind of wants my secret sauce. You go play boy!
By the way, can i get yo handyman's digits?
12 Reply
Mike ReynoldsPro Member
construction · Nacogdoches, TX · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
9y
So, what zip code DO you recommend?
Just kidding of course. I agree with the canned response to most of those questions but you never know what it could turn into do I wouldn't burn any bridges yet.
1 Reply
Teddy Smith
Real Estate Broker · Wilmington, NC · Member since 2016 · 236 posts · 126 votes
9y
I experience this same thing with real-estate agents too.
This is why I work from home now and very rarely attend events. So many desperate *** people....
1 Reply
Shana Prymicz
Naperville, IL · Member since 2017 · 11 posts · 38 votes
9y
As a newbie on here, I see both sides. However, why post a success story if you do not want to be questioned? I've seen a lot of this of this site, many complaints about people asking questions or for help from more senior investors. I thought that was the mission of this website is to learn from each other, help and network.
Is there really a threat here? Honestly? I'm sure you're smart enough to realize who to give your time to and who not, just like any role in your life. I've seen at least 3 posts like this since I joined. Extremely negative.
35 Reply
Nicole A.Pro Member
Rental Property Investor · Baltimore County Maryland and Tampa Florida · Member since 2013 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
9y
Yeah, I won't be able to agree with you there, David, for reasons many others have covered already. I do understand that it can get old to be asked the same generic vague questions over and over, but I am more than happy to tell people where I invest. Just because someone knows where you invest doesn't mean they're going to come in and swoop up all your deals! If it was that easy, anyone who even hears about RE investing being lucrative would do it. Not everyone has it in them. Not everyone wants to invest in the same thing.
However, being a first-time seller, I can tell you that I find it annoying when people ask me "what's the lowest you'll take" rather than just giving me an offer. If they ask me that, I either don't answer or I say "Well, I'm sure you saw the listing price. Feel free to send an offer and we can talk." Typically I hear nothing after that.
10 Reply
Christopher Blanco
Real Estate Consultant · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2016 · 511 posts · 345 votes
9y
This is really a terrible attitude. First off, is it really so hard to just ignore, block, or otherwise not engage the people you find so bothersome? Second, when you first started off, did you do EVERYTHING on your own or did you ask people for help, advice, and pointers on where to start off? I wonder how many people you "bothered" to get your first and subsequent deals.
Its amazing to me because I tried to go it alone, for 3 months I tried not to bother anyone. Know how many deals I found? 0, none, nada. I decided one day to start "bothering" people (most of us call this networking.) In that time frame I have had 4 deals come from people I have ~~"bothered"~~ networked with. If you want to do this on your own, I suggest you stop posting in Bigger Pockets and find somewhere else to get your ego stroked.
53 Reply
Joseph M.
Flipper/Rehabber · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 732 votes
9y
I wonder though , even if you did share the neighborhoods and zip codes that you invest in how many would actually even do a deal in your area . Locating a good zip code or neighborhood is just one piece of the puzzle . Are these people that live in your same city ? If they are trying to invest from out of state they are even less likely to have success .
2 Reply
Susan Knight
Conway, SC · Member since 2012 · 114 posts · 44 votes
9y
@David Zheng, I am a newbie and IF and When I get to your level, I will never forget where I came from. If I asked where you buy your properties, it would be just a learning interest. In my area, outskirts of Myrtle Beach, I am interested in what property types people are investing in, areas, some are good and some bad. Fortunately, I know many of the good and bad. But it would be a learning experience. By the way, I wasn't one of those you mentioned asking, but as being new to Real Estate Investing, I would love to meet with people in my area doing the same thing. If there was a deal I came across and couldn't manage, I would definitely throw a colleague a bone to take the deal, if they treated me with respect. It is all about networking and growing friendships and partnerships, IMO. Now if they are asking to take business away, a newbie will have a hard time doing so with someone who already knows there way around the Real Estate market investing. As far as skin in the game. I would donate my skin for education and experience.
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