How has a Real Estate mentor/coach helped you invest?
Zach CumminsPro Member
Real Estate Agent · Carlsbad, CA · Member since 2017 · 53 posts · 68 votesHow has a Real Estate mentor/coach helped you invest?
Most Popular Reply
Investor · Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2008 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes
6yHere is a summary how I got started in Real Estate Investing.
I was in a bar, and I just lost my job. I am 61 now, but at the time I was 25, fresh out of the US Marines. The year was 1983. Interest rates were high, over 10%.
At the bar was this smiling guy, and he said,
"Who just died?"
I looked at him. He must have smelled the self-pity on my face.
Here is what just happened to me.
I worked for a small firm in Constriction Engineering Products, Johnson Controls, that sold air and water control equipment to large apartment and commercial building contractors. My math and science background helped me.
But the J O B paid $400 a week and was an advance on future commissions. I had over $10K in commissions due to me, and asked my boss for my commissions now. He laughed, and said I would get paid when he got paid.
I got in an argument with him and he fired me.
So this guy at the bar said to me,
"Tough break. What are you gonna do now?"
"Look for work I guess," I replied.
So he says, "You like real estate?" You like solving problems for people?"
I was taken aback by that comment. Was this guy trying to hire me or what?
I smiled, and asked him, "are you looking hire someone?"
He chuckled, and said, "Well, I'm always looking for great salespeople that hustle."
Here's what happened. The man's name was Glenn, and he owned a real estate investment company.
He never called it a real estate investment company, he called " a place where we solve problems for people."
The thing that was amazing about Glenn as he knew a little bit about everything and I mean everything.
He knew about business, legal issues, tax issues, marketing, sales, promotion, networking, and most importantly he knew about people (psychology).
The first thing he did was tell me that I have two ears and one mouth, and I should listen more than I talk.
Second thing he did was have me read "How to Win Friends and Influence People" by Dale Carnegie.
Then he taught me how to set appointments was home sellers, go out to their home, and write up a letter of intent to purchase or lease.
He said to me, "your job is to bring me potential home sellers will consider a creative offer."
I was very confused the first few months working there. I did know what a wraparound mortgage was, or subject to, or subordinating notes, or lease option assignments.
So I stumbled along.
What allowed me succeed was Glenn had an awesome direct mail marketing machine, and even had an appointment setter, so I just needed to get my car and go talk to 3 to 4 sellers everyday. I'd use the same presentation with everyone. And I've get them all letter of intent to buy for cash or on terms.
One of the things Glenn told me was "some will, some won't, so what!"
What that means is that some sellers will do what you want to them to do, and some will not.
The law of large numbers cures all problems.
What surprised me even more is that some sellers would call the office, in 3 to 6 to even 12 months later, because they appreciated my first meeting with them.
Especially some sellers that were very angry with me in the beginning, called me names, said things like "you just try to rip me off!!"
In my first six months I must have seen 20 people a week, 80 a people month, almost 500 people in that six months. I think we did three to five houses a month grossing between $5000-$10,000 per house, and I didn't make that money, Glenn did.
The arrangement for pay for me was I would make $500 cash every week, that's cash. No benefits and no 401(k). Was it legal, I don't know. I didn't own the business. I was hired hand.
After a few months, Glen said "you're do a good job keep it up. I'm going to give you a few more duties. I want to be able to travel so you can run the office while I'm gone."
I was scared at first, having never run a business. I was like the security of a paycheck.
But I loved being able to make decisions, being the captain of my own ship.
I think what made me more pissed off than anything though was making $500 a week, and making bank deposits of 10,000, 20,000, even 30,000 a week.
So after to have years of making $500 a week cash, and living frugally, I said the following to Glenn,
"Glenn, I've "I learned so much here. You taught me about sellers, buyers, legal, tax, marketing, there is no way I could have learned this in school.
"I saved up some money and start my office. I wont compete with you. I'd like to give you four weeks notice."
Glenn leaned back in his swivel chair, smiled and said,
"Brian, you're irreplaceable here. You came to me knowing nothing and now you know everything you need to know. You never asked for a raise or a partnership stake in the business.
I can honestly say that without you over the last two and half years I would not have made the kind of money that I have. I have two things to say to you before you go onto greener pastures."
My God I was really nervous. What was Glenn going on to say?
"The first I want to ask you is, what took you so long?"
Then he laughed.
"I expected you to hang in there for about six months and move on.
You're really smart and you should have started your own business long ago."
"The second thing I want to tell you is I'm going to give you a bonus, (he takes out his checkbook, and writes this check out) "and I don't want you to look at it until you sit down to car and drive away, deal?"
I said, "deal!"
I got to my car, exhale, and take the check out of my pocket.
It was for $15,000.
Back in 1985 that was a lot of money.
In the memo I remember what was written,
"for my good friend Brian."
```````````````````````````````````````````
With everything I learned over that 2 1/2 years, it didn't take me long to be profitable.
I got a modest office space, with neighbors that were white-collar professionals, and attorney and CPA.
I had a secretary part-time for 3 months, then full time.
And Glenn even took me to lunch every week, said he missed me.
That first business was very special to me.
I have had several businesses since then, but that first one was my favorite.
````````````````````````````````````````````
My wish for all that reads this is
I hope you find your "Glenn" and
you bust your tail working and reading.
And learning.
30 Replies
- Real Estate Agent · Carlsbad, CA · Member since 2017 · 53 posts · 68 votes6y
I love it @Peter Johnson thank you! I especially enjoy hearing from people like yourself that invested before it became “cool” with HGTV shows. I appreciate you jumping in with your input!
- 6yTwana RasoulBusiness MemberReal Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
@Zach Cummins mentors/coaches can be amazing but also I personally find it silly when a beginner takes their entire savings of $20-$40k and “invest” in a coach to learn how to invest in real estate. Better to use that money to just invest in something. There are always others who are willing to share their knowledge where you want to invest and can help shorten the learning curve and tell you what to look out for.
Anyway let me know if you want to sign up for my personal coaching course. Limited time sale for 1 full week of coaching, only $45,000.00. ;) JK of course.
Best of luck!!
Compass5122 Reviews - 6yShiloh LundahlPro MemberRental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
@Zach Cummins Yes. I would say my business partner has been a great mentor to me. I also paid for coaching and have made some really great relationships that have also contributed a lot to my success.
- 6yShiloh LundahlPro MemberRental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
@Zach Cummins A lot of people here on BP are very negative towards coaching, at least paid for coaching or mentoring. However, a lot of people I know that have been able to scale successfully and relatively quickly have done it with coaching. But many of these successful people were successful before they got into real estate. They had a success mindset. And many of them started out with cash already.
- 6yJoe VilleneuvePro MemberPlymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
Originally posted by @Shiloh Lundahl:
@Zach Cummins A lot of people here on BP are very negative towards coaching, at least paid for coaching or mentoring. However, a lot of people I know that have been able to scale successfully and relatively quickly have done it with coaching. But many of these successful people were successful before they got into real estate. They had a success mindset. And many of them started out with cash already.
I've collected my training/knowledge/education/experience/etc...any way I could...and can, get it. You're going to have to pay for it one way or another. The most important point here isn't how you got it, but that you never stop getting it.
- Real Estate Agent · Carlsbad, CA · Member since 2017 · 53 posts · 68 votes6y
@Shiloh Lundahl did you start out with a partner or a mentor first? And when did you decide to pay for coaching? Did you already have a portfolio in place?
If all of this info is explained in your podcast episode, I’d be happy to go back and listen to it!
Thanks for the insight!
- 6yJonathan GreeneBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Madison, NJ · Member since 2016 · 6k+ posts · 7k+ votes
You shouldn't be paying for coaching until you actually know what you are doing. Coaching is best, especially for REI, once you are doing business and want to make that business better. Too many people think early coaching will unlock some magic, but you can find all that info online for free or at local REI meetups. If you need a push to get started, that's inside of you, you don't need that from a coach. A good REI coach will evaluate your business and help you make adjustment to increase your deal opportunities and closing percentage while increasing your spread on each deal. Also, if a coach or mentor ever asks you to invest with them, hard pass. You do those deals when you know everything and who you are dealing with. Learn all you can for free in books, here, and at meetups, get the business going on free advice and hustle and smarts, then look for reasonable coaches who can tweak small things for big gains.
- 6yShiloh LundahlPro MemberRental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
@Zach Cummins A few months ago, and then again this morning, I read some posts from people who made big mistakes, although very different mistakes, when it comes to investing in real estate. They chalked it up to the cost of learning. But truthfully, it was the cost of not having a coach or mentor to tell them not to do what they were doing. Not because the mentor or coach would be negative toward them getting into real estate but because they were making big mistakes. Here are the links to the 2 posts.
$1 Million in Rentals - How Much In Reserves? In this post, the author Whitney shared about how he purchased 3 properties totaling around $1 Million in value and he was able to buy them with 90% leverage.
My First Flip Bankrupted Me [Part 5] In this post, Spencer shared his experience feeling anxiety as the property that he bought an out of state was not rehabbed correctly by a contractor and how he had to reach out to parents to help bail him out and now he had to sell his car just to stay afloat.
There are much more to these stories, however, the common thread that I saw with both of them is that they didn't consult a mentor or coach in their strategies in acquiring these properties.
Here are a couple of things a coach would have told them to save them from their mistakes. To Whitney: It is awesome to be able to get $1 million in real estate with so low of a down payment while keeping a good amount of money in reserves. However, if you want to scale, the bank is going to look at your DSCR (debt service coverage ratio) which will tell them that you are not cash flowing enough money to service your debt and still have enough left over to make enough of a profit and that you are over leveraged on these properties. This will limit the banks appetite to lend you more money. What Whitney should have done is bought some houses wholesale and then done basically the same thing. But this time he would only be leveraged at around 75 - 80% and he would be cash flowing more and have a better DSCR and he could continue to scale.
As for Spencer, a coach would have told him not do the out of state deal unless he had more in reserves. He would have told him the hard money terms were really poor and he would have encouraged him to do a deal with another investor in the area first to get to know the area and build a team of people that do a good job and that he could trust. Spencer jumped in but didn't watch over the contractor who ended up doing a horrible job that had to be redone and he ended up losing 30k in the deal along with months and months of time.
The costs of not working with a coach or mentor that is experienced in the type of investing and the market that one wants to invest in is really, really high. And it is unnecessary.
So for all of the people who say coaching isn't worth it, I would ask, if you are successful without coaching, how much more successful could you have been with it. For me, I would not be where I am today without coaching and mentorship.
- 6yShiloh LundahlPro MemberRental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
@Zach Cummins I started by buying one rental in my neighborhood in 2010 when the market was depressed. Then I didn't do anything again until the end of 2014 when I bought the commercial building that I have my therapy practice out of. Then I got the desire to do real estate again and I asked a buddy of mine that had done several real estate deals if I could do a deal with him. He said that I could be the money guy and be the private money lender on the deal. So we did that deal together and he made over 40k and I made about 13k. I was excited about it and then I wanted to do another deal so I jumped into a deal by myself after watching a lot of HGTV. I lost 5k on that deal and it took me 6 months. I did another deal with another investor and I made 9k on that deal.
My wife then signed us up for an expensive real estate training course that has since gone out of business. We learned everything we could from that course and from the year long coaching program and we started doing more deals with my buddy and on our own.
In 2017, after attending another 3-day training on Lease Options, we switched our investing model from flips to lease options. That 3-day training for around $300 has made my partner and me over a million dollars each.
I now work with other investors and help them get properties in Arizona or answer their questions about rentals or lease options.
- 6yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Shiloh Lundahl my age group started with Dave DelDotto and Carlton Sheets.. the issue with paid training not all of it is created equal..
Along with real estate illusions of just let me teach you and you will be rich in no time..
really depends on the student.. you can have 25 taking a class and 5 will excell 15 might trundle along at 5 will do nothing.
its not easy without capital or access to partners with capital when your starting out.
- 6yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Originally posted by @Twana Rasoul:
@Zach Cummins mentors/coaches can be amazing but also I personally find it silly when a beginner takes their entire savings of $20-$40k and “invest” in a coach to learn how to invest in real estate. Better to use that money to just invest in something. There are always others who are willing to share their knowledge where you want to invest and can help shorten the learning curve and tell you what to look out for.
Anyway let me know if you want to sign up for my personal coaching course. Limited time sale for 1 full week of coaching, only $45,000.00. ;) JK of course.
Best of luck!!
you invest with a coach or mentor when you can easily stroke a check for it.. and if it does not work or you dont like the busienss you not in debt and its just water off a ducks back.
- Investor · Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2008 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes6y
Here is a summary how I got started in Real Estate Investing.
I was in a bar, and I just lost my job. I am 61 now, but at the time I was 25, fresh out of the US Marines. The year was 1983. Interest rates were high, over 10%.
At the bar was this smiling guy, and he said,
"Who just died?"
I looked at him. He must have smelled the self-pity on my face.
Here is what just happened to me.
I worked for a small firm in Constriction Engineering Products, Johnson Controls, that sold air and water control equipment to large apartment and commercial building contractors. My math and science background helped me.
But the J O B paid $400 a week and was an advance on future commissions. I had over $10K in commissions due to me, and asked my boss for my commissions now. He laughed, and said I would get paid when he got paid.
I got in an argument with him and he fired me.
So this guy at the bar said to me,
"Tough break. What are you gonna do now?"
"Look for work I guess," I replied.
So he says, "You like real estate?" You like solving problems for people?"
I was taken aback by that comment. Was this guy trying to hire me or what?
I smiled, and asked him, "are you looking hire someone?"
He chuckled, and said, "Well, I'm always looking for great salespeople that hustle."
Here's what happened. The man's name was Glenn, and he owned a real estate investment company.
He never called it a real estate investment company, he called " a place where we solve problems for people."
The thing that was amazing about Glenn as he knew a little bit about everything and I mean everything.
He knew about business, legal issues, tax issues, marketing, sales, promotion, networking, and most importantly he knew about people (psychology).
The first thing he did was tell me that I have two ears and one mouth, and I should listen more than I talk.
Second thing he did was have me read "How to Win Friends and Influence People" by Dale Carnegie.
Then he taught me how to set appointments was home sellers, go out to their home, and write up a letter of intent to purchase or lease.
He said to me, "your job is to bring me potential home sellers will consider a creative offer."
I was very confused the first few months working there. I did know what a wraparound mortgage was, or subject to, or subordinating notes, or lease option assignments.
So I stumbled along.
What allowed me succeed was Glenn had an awesome direct mail marketing machine, and even had an appointment setter, so I just needed to get my car and go talk to 3 to 4 sellers everyday. I'd use the same presentation with everyone. And I've get them all letter of intent to buy for cash or on terms.
One of the things Glenn told me was "some will, some won't, so what!"
What that means is that some sellers will do what you want to them to do, and some will not.
The law of large numbers cures all problems.
What surprised me even more is that some sellers would call the office, in 3 to 6 to even 12 months later, because they appreciated my first meeting with them.
Especially some sellers that were very angry with me in the beginning, called me names, said things like "you just try to rip me off!!"
In my first six months I must have seen 20 people a week, 80 a people month, almost 500 people in that six months. I think we did three to five houses a month grossing between $5000-$10,000 per house, and I didn't make that money, Glenn did.
The arrangement for pay for me was I would make $500 cash every week, that's cash. No benefits and no 401(k). Was it legal, I don't know. I didn't own the business. I was hired hand.
After a few months, Glen said "you're do a good job keep it up. I'm going to give you a few more duties. I want to be able to travel so you can run the office while I'm gone."
I was scared at first, having never run a business. I was like the security of a paycheck.
But I loved being able to make decisions, being the captain of my own ship.
I think what made me more pissed off than anything though was making $500 a week, and making bank deposits of 10,000, 20,000, even 30,000 a week.
So after to have years of making $500 a week cash, and living frugally, I said the following to Glenn,
"Glenn, I've "I learned so much here. You taught me about sellers, buyers, legal, tax, marketing, there is no way I could have learned this in school.
"I saved up some money and start my office. I wont compete with you. I'd like to give you four weeks notice."
Glenn leaned back in his swivel chair, smiled and said,
"Brian, you're irreplaceable here. You came to me knowing nothing and now you know everything you need to know. You never asked for a raise or a partnership stake in the business.
I can honestly say that without you over the last two and half years I would not have made the kind of money that I have. I have two things to say to you before you go onto greener pastures."
My God I was really nervous. What was Glenn going on to say?
"The first I want to ask you is, what took you so long?"
Then he laughed.
"I expected you to hang in there for about six months and move on.
You're really smart and you should have started your own business long ago."
"The second thing I want to tell you is I'm going to give you a bonus, (he takes out his checkbook, and writes this check out) "and I don't want you to look at it until you sit down to car and drive away, deal?"
I said, "deal!"
I got to my car, exhale, and take the check out of my pocket.
It was for $15,000.
Back in 1985 that was a lot of money.
In the memo I remember what was written,
"for my good friend Brian."
```````````````````````````````````````````
With everything I learned over that 2 1/2 years, it didn't take me long to be profitable.
I got a modest office space, with neighbors that were white-collar professionals, and attorney and CPA.
I had a secretary part-time for 3 months, then full time.
And Glenn even took me to lunch every week, said he missed me.
That first business was very special to me.
I have had several businesses since then, but that first one was my favorite.
````````````````````````````````````````````
My wish for all that reads this is
I hope you find your "Glenn" and
you bust your tail working and reading.
And learning.
- 6yJoe VilleneuvePro MemberPlymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
Dam*@Brian Gibbons They only let me vote once for the above essay. Sorry.
As I'm reading it, I'm smiling, and going back to how I started...and got to where I am today. The path had a lot of similar stops, and people...just the specifics are different.
The bottom line is you can and will learn the game of REI from more than one teacher..and they all can contribute something positive to your education...paid or free. I will add that I attended more than a few paid weekends, and some of them I walked away thinking it was a lot of what I had already been taught. REinforcement os a good thing though.
In total I paid a lot of money for all the education I got, and in the end I got more than I paid for. I don't regret any of the training I ever took (some more/less than others). My only regret is I don't have (maybe I should say make) the time to do more of them, because learning should never end.
The ultimate cost/return of/on your REI education will be measured on how big your "box" becomes, and how many times you hear others tell you how you are always "thinking outside of it". In the end, it's that box that provides your opportunities, and that box is the one thing in life that has no limits.
- Investor · Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2008 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes6y
REI is alot of things, but most of it is PEOPLE. To get people to like you, and trust you.
You must WORK ON YOURSELF.
Take one of these every week and meditate on the saying.
Tape it to the bathroom mirror at eye height.
Say it OUT LOUD 5 times (yes your wife - husband - dog - cat - boyfriend - girlfriend - kid(s)) will laugh at you.
But you are working on your sub conscious, your "mind talk"
Here you go.
``````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````````
“Everything you want is just outside your comfort zone.”
“Don't let the opinions of the average man sway you. Dream, and he thinks you're crazy. Succeed, and he thinks you're lucky. Acquire wealth, and he thinks you're greedy. Pay no attention. He simply doesn't understand.”
“It's a tough business if you don't know what you're doing. But it can be extremely lucrative and very rewarding when you learn the ropes.”
“I count him braver who overcomes his desires, than him who conquers his enemies, for the hardest victory is the victory over self. ARISTOTLE”
“FIVE-STEP SUCCESS FORMULA
Determine what you really want.
Set a specific goal to obtain it.
To be effective, this goal must include a specific time frame and plan for its accomplishment.
The goal should also be written down and studied regularly.
Gain knowledge about your goal—listen to tapes, talk to experts, go to seminars to learn about it.
Associate with people who share your goals and attitudes while avoiding those who don’t.
Don’t stop until you get it.”
“How many millionaires do you know who have become wealthy by investing in savings accounts? I rest my case.”
“There is no security in this life - only varying degrees of risk. Yet millions unquestioningly sacrifice their lives on the altar of security.”
"The future you see is the future you get."
"Your life~the way it looks today is a result of your choices...What will you choose today for your tomorrows?"
"Success will come when you choose to feed your dreams and starve your doubts."
"Don't let the opinions of the average man sway you. Dream, and he thinks you're crazy. Succeed, and he thinks you're lucky. Acquire wealth, and he thinks you're greedy. Pay no attention. He simply doesn't understand."
"Life is a mirror. You get what you see. If you project anger into the mirror, that is what you get back. If you project joy into the mirror, it reflects joy right back to you. Failure for failure. Success for success. What you project is what is reflected back to you."
"Words transform. Speak only with a good purpose. Say only things that serve you and others. Choose your words wisely."
"In todays uncertain economy, the safest solution to be wealthy, be in total control and enjoy freedom for you and your family is to have multiple streams of income."
"Your current thinking got you here. Only new thinking will get you out."
"Don't wait to buy real estate. Buy real estate and wait."
"Successful people rely heavily on their mentors. Ordinary people don't. It's that simple."
"Don't think of your goals - think FROM them. Tap into your genius.'
"Fear begins to melt away when you begin to take action on a goal you really want.'
"Whatever you focus on, expands. If you see the world through your dreams, prosperity materializes before your very eyes. If you see the world through your fears, poverty multiplies all around you."
"Creating success is a tug of war between your mind and your heart-your fears and your dreams. If your fears win, you lose."
"Your goal, as a creative investor, is to launch your ship into financial orbit ... and then put it on automatic pilot."
"Many things can make you rich, but only a few things can enrich you."
"Sit me at the keyboard of any computer in the world with access to the Internet, and in just 24 hours I’ll earn at least $24,000 in cash."
"Rejection reveals your character."
"The fundamental level of success is doing the hard things first - If you go for the feared thing first, then the rest of the day is easy."
Stories are the shortcut to the heart.
"No matter what your product is, you are ultimately in the education business. Your customers need to be constantly educated about the many advantages of doing business with you, trained to use your products more effectively, and taught how to make never-ending improvement in their lives."
Without knowledge and a workable plan, you are gambling, with little or no chance of success.
"Pursuing your passion is fulfilling and leads to financial freedom."
"As I became more mature I realized that failure is part of success."
"If you really want to do something, you'll find a way. If you don't, you'll find an excuse."
"One of the greatest gifts you can give to anyone is the gift of attention"
"Be grateful for what you have, while in pursuit of what you want."
"We must teach our children not to spend their money a dollar at a time. If you spend your dollar at a time, you'll wind up with trinkets instead of treasures."
"You are what you are today because of the choices you made in the past"
"Don't wish it was easier, wish you were better. Don't wish for less problems, wish for more skills. Don't wish for less challenges, wish for more wisdom. The major value in life is not what you get. The major value in life is what you become. Success is not to be pursued; it is to be attracted by the person you become."
"If you want to have more, you have to become more."
"Asking is the beginning of receiving. Make sure you don't go to the ocean with a teaspoon. At least take a bucket so the kids won't laugh at you."
"If you don't change what you are doing today, all of your tomorrows will look like yesterday."
"Your life does not get better by chance, it gets better by change."
"Make sure the outside of you is a good reflection of the inside of you"
"One of the first things successful people realize is the old adage, “If it is to be, it is up to me.” That is, for you, the fact that your success and your course is up to you. This doesn’t mean that you do it all alone. It simply means that you take responsibility for your life and your career."
"How sad to see a father with money and no joy. The man studied economics, but never studied happiness."
You cannot change your destination overnight, but you can change your direction overnight.
"Never begrudge the money you spend on your own education."
"Your family and your love must be cultivated like a garden. Time, effort, and imagination must be summoned constantly to keep any relationship flourishing and growing."
"Success is nothing more than a few simple disciplines, practiced every day."
"Don't set your goals too low. If you don't need much, you won't become much."
"Be a student, not a follower. Take interest in what someone says, then debate it, ponder it, and consider it from all angles."
"Don’t join an easy crowd; you won’t grow. Go where the expectations and the demands to perform are high."
"The challenge of leadership is to be strong, but not rude; be kind, but not weak; be bold, but not bully; be thoughtful, but not lazy; be humble, but not timid; be proud, but not arrogant; have humor, but without folly."
"Only by giving are you able to receive more than you already have."
"You must either modify your dreams or magnify your skills"
"Don't ask for security, ask for adventure. Better to live 30 years full of adventure than a 100 years safe in the corner."
"At the end of each day, you should play back the tapes of your performance. The results should either applaud you or prod you." I didn't have a mentor when I got started and no one in my family were really in real estate either. I asked a lot of questions whenever I found an expert in person, but other than that I just jumped in and figured stuff out along the way. I bought traditional MLS properties, REOs, and from the county courthouse auction during the very bottom of the market. The best education is doing something yourself and I've been a hands on landlord/investor for going on 17 years now.
That being said, I certainly wish I had a mentor along the way. I didn't make too many mistakes, but there were some pitfalls I could have avoided with a mentor's advice. Now that I'm an agent, I tend to be a "mentor" figure to all of my clients and make sure they have a solid foundation of knowledge to get started. I'm also a formal mentor to new HomeSmart agents and I show them how to get started in real estate in exchange for a cut of their commission on the first 3 transactions.
- Rental Property Investor · Woodstock, GA · Member since 2017 · 517 posts · 772 votes6y
Most successful people have a coach at some point. But it's key for when you bring in the coach.
My thought process:
1) First, read about 50 books on RE and make sure it is something you want to pursue
2) Talk to (on phone, PM, whatever) about their business, what their day is like, etc.
3) Start trying to put together some deals
4) Once you're there, bring in a coach
Paying $50k to a coach when #1: you don't know if you even want to do RE...and #2: you don't fully understand it...is a waste of time.
It's like hiring Babe Ruth to teach you how to hit when you don't even know what baseball is. Learn the game first, then bring in the coach to make you better
- Member since 2020 · 19 posts · 5 votes6y
@Jonathan Greene that's exactly what I have been doing. Decided that REI is the way I want to go, and simply dove into the books, audiobooks, forunes, etc, to educate myself from the top down.
Obviously a lot of education will come with actually doing it, but, a solid foundation can be built with a coach.
- 6yShiloh LundahlPro MemberRental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
@Zach Cummins the danger of setting sale with your real estate investing ship across the sea is that inevitably you will run into rough waters and if you don’t know how to maneuver in those waters your ship may sink. The best thing is to have an experienced captain at the helm to guide you through these rough waters until you become familiar with the sea and can navagate the waters well enough on your own.
In my opinion, what’s even more dangerous than getting into rough waters when your naively navigating your investment ship is when everything goes fine and you make it to your destination just fine. You begin to believe that you are an expert mariner and that you will always get to your destination just fine. This is the most dangerous part because you then invite others into your ship to come along for the ride and you don’t notice the other ships led by experienced captains coming into harbor because you are too busy touting your horn of successful voyages. You sail out into the open seas with your boat load of hopeful sailers. Then comes the swell... then panic sets in. Your ship gets torn to pieces with several casualties.I just commented on a post that was just started by Tony Robinson entitled Completed My First BRRRR (With $0 Down). As of right now it has over 200 responses and nearly all of them are positive; except for mine. He shared that he got a property for 100k using bank financing for the majority of the purchase and the 55k rehab and it then valued at 230k and he was able to refinance everything out and still make $175 a month in cash flow. It is a classic BRRRR. So why did I say anything critical about his post? Because he did it on his own with out the guidance of a mentor or coach who could have helped him maximize the profits of the deal. He chalked the mistakes he made to "your first deal is meant to teach you." The problem is with out the coach or mentor you make make improper conclusions from the mistakes made. He then responded to my post saying that he was happy with his success in the deal and that he wanted to do the deal to show other investors a track record before he takes their money to invest it in a large multifamily deal. One successful deal doth not a track record make. The naive leading the naive.
Too many new investors look at a success story like that and think that’s exactly what I want to do. I’m going to go do that, and without guidance and support, they get into bad deals, just to do a deal, and it sets them back weeks, months, or even years(yes I’m talking to you @JD Martin). I really liked @Brian Gibbons story of his mentor and the lessons he learned from him by working for him for years. That is a real mentor. That is the real story of long term success.
And just so you know, I don’t think it is absolutely necessary to have a mentor or coach to be successful. But it is likely necessary to be ultra successful.
- Investor · Northbrook, IL · Member since 2017 · 352 posts · 295 votes6y
@Zach Cummins I started in real estate while getting my master's degree in architecture when I was 21. Let's just say that was a while ago. I have been blessed with both mentors and coaches. My mentor was also my professor whom I worked for for 6 years. I got to learn a tremendous amount about real estate development, architecture and contracting. I started my own firm when I was 28. I soon realized I needed a coach.
Here in lies the distinction in my mind between a mentor and a coach. A mentor teaches you the business. A coach teaches you how to own the business. There is a huge distinction between being an employee and an owner. Much more at risk not only for yourself but also for those that work for you. A completely different set of pressures to learn to navigate.
Well you could say, I only want to be a (1) person show. That is fine too, however, you still need to understand the market, risks, positioning your company, etc that most employees don't have to think about or deal with on a daily basis.
My mentor taught me a great deal in 6+ years. My coach has taught me an immense amount over 20 years. Most of what my coach has taught me is NOT real estate specific, but rather business specific. I look at my business totally different today than I did when I first started in in 1998.
Did I pay for being a mentor and having a coach. Certainly. I took the job with the mentor at a lower salary because I knew how much I would learn in a short amount of time. If I hadn't worked for my mentor, no way I start a real estate development, design build firm at 28. Have I paid my coach - yes, because I valued his time and wisdom. The payments were used for a scholarship fund he created. Do I consider my coach to now be a friend - without a doubt. I also know my business would not be where it is today if I had not invested with my coach. I do agree with @Jay Hinrichs that just because you pay for coaching doesn't mean it will work. I have taught college architecture. Everyone pays to go to school, yet not everyone applies themselves the same. You still have to do the work, but a mentor or a coach can help you avoid mistakes that could cost you more than what you have paid them.
- Investor · Member since 2020 · 324 posts · 278 votes6y
For me it's Accountability and a Solid Roadmap. There is soooo much information out there and it's overwhelming when you start. New investors and investors looking to branch out can spend months, even years looking at all the "options" and never pull the trigger. Having a mentor has helped me stay on track and pushed me to do more.
I think there are lots of people out there that just sell, sell, sell and that's not even bad if the client will do the work. The issue is they keep thinking that if they buy one more thing it gets easier. I think we've all learned that it takes time and a whole lot of work to get successful at this. So having a mentor that can guide you and keep you accountable is key to success and has pushed me to accomplish all I have over the years.
- Investor · Corpus Christi, TX · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes6y
Never invest more than you can afford to lose without losing sleep.
There is never a shortage of coaches espousing the need for coaching. With the claims they make, they should be able to prove with documentary evidence that said claims are true. They should also be able to provide plenty of "students" who achieved a level of success due to their coaching, not just noobs who are excited and will espouse the benefits of using their coach even though they have not themselves achieved any investing goals. I'm not knocking coaching but this industry if overwhelmed with fraudulent coaches / investors so due diligence is of paramount importance. In this business, I tell everyone this. Believe none of what you hear and only half of what you see. It will serve you well to remember this.
- Real Estate Agent · Carlsbad, CA · Member since 2017 · 53 posts · 68 votes6y
@Twana Rasoul Yes I would not be open to $20-40k investment on a coaching, I'd much rather put that into my own investments. I also think coaching applies if someone is looking to truly build a long-term business vs. a small rental portfolio. Someone wanting a coach is wanting to scale and build, and I suppose they have to determine what that scaling and building is worth to them!
Thanks again for your input! And... I will decline on your $45k coaching ;p
- Real Estate Agent · Carlsbad, CA · Member since 2017 · 53 posts · 68 votes6y
@Shiloh Lundahl It seems it really depends on the coaching! Thank you for sharing the links to those posts! I am currently listening to your episode. Thank you for all of your response and insight into your investing history!
I completely agree with needing an experienced captain to navigate the waters. We do have 2 rental properties even though we have had them for years doesn't mean I am an experienced investor, like you said "You begin to believe that you are an expert mariner and that you will always get to your destination just fine." I know this isn't the case. But NOW, I am looking at the scaling and building of our business and portfolio. Someone may look at my profile and see that I'm a Realtor, however that business is Residential real estate business helping someone purchase a home is different than helping someone purchasing an investment property!! But we are now making that serious effort of scaling and building like I said.I think its very important to distinguish with coaching/mentoring what our goals and aspirations are longterm. We see our long term goal focus on buy and hold and potentially BRRRR strategy. Did you ever run into issues with coaching/mentoring on difference in investment strategy?
Quick question regarding Covid-19, how has that affected your business strategy with rental income and lease option?
- 6yShiloh LundahlPro MemberRental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
@Zach Cummins I hope my passion about speaking up about coaching isn’t coming across as me thinking everyone needs coaching. Because I don’t think that. The majority of investors on BiggerPockets have five properties or less if they have any properties at all. People don’t really need coaching if they are going to stay at that level. But if they are going to build a sizable portfolio of 50 or more properties, I believe coaching will help someone get there faster and help them be aware of things that they otherwise wouldn’t know about.
For instance, the world of banking is very important to understand if you are going to use leverage to grow. And to grow to 50 plus properties that are on average of 100k each, you’ll either need 5 million dollars to buy them, or you’ll need to understand creative financing really well, or you’ll need to learn how to work with banks to get them to trust you enough to lend you millions of dollars on those properties.
I get tiered of people who only have a few properties speak poorly about coaching. They often say it is a scam or that the coach will just take your money and not teach you anything or that you could learn everything you need to learn about real estate though reading books and listening to podcasts. Personally, I disagree with that. I think that there are some things that you learn though certain associations that otherwise would be very difficult to learn from a book or podcast.
Here is an example, I coached 3 different people in buying 5 properties over the past 6 months. Each property was purchased at a discount, I helped (or am still helping) them line up funding that allowed them to take cash out of the refinance without needing to wait the 6-12 month seasoning period. I helped them set up the lease options and step into 20-30k in equity with each property. These were all people I know who had lent money to me on deals in the past that wanted to get some properties themselves so I helped them get the properties and they paid me a fee for that. It would have been very hard for them to do everything pertaining to those deals without making costly mistakes (especially with the financing) had I not have shown them and walked them through it. I don’t say this to make myself appear great. I say this to make a point that they were able to leverage my experience, and my connections in order to help them build equity faster then they probably would have done on their own. So they saved time and gained equity (increased their net worth) by working with someone experienced more so than if they had done it in their own.
This is the value of a coach. A good coach will help you increase your net worth by working with them. But most importantly, the investor has to do the work.
- Investor · Palm Bay, FL · Member since 2014 · 49 posts · 25 votes6y
I had been interested in Real estate most of my life. In my younger days Just after leaving the Marines I read "Nothing Down" and Carlton sheets materials but lacked the confidence in Early 20's to do much other then get a RE license. I dabbled a bit before the 08 Crash and made some off of flips but about 7 years ago I got serious. I retired from 25 years of nursing and began to do this full time with my wife Sue. Sue is a RE Broker now as well. I had done about 40 full rehab's and I always wanted to scale my business but what I found was that I was on an endless "Hamster Wheel" and I knew I had to do something to break this cycle. I never believed in Guru's and still don't, but I went out seeking mentor and bumped into Greg Dickerson here on Bigger Pockets. Whenever you pay a coach (I at least for me) You just hope you didn't just get taken. But nothing could be further from the truth and I had no Idea of the value I was getting. 10 Days after working with Greg he saved me twice what I paid him on a single transaction. Greg was able to dial right in on what was holding us back. I took some things on faith and made more changes and immediately we started growing again. Since I working with him I have stopped the endless cycle of buying from wholesalers and built my own lead systems. 2 days ago I got a contract that will make me 10-20 times what I paid my mentor just a few months back, and I sit on the top of the search engines like the companies that we used to buy from. It is the best investment I ever made in my business. It has been a great experience. I can see huge growth in my company for the first time in years and a Greg is becoming a good friend as well. Thank you @Greg Dickerson
Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.