Anyone else feel like the forums are losing value?

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Anyone else feel like the forums are losing value?

Peter TverdovBusiness Member
Developer · New Brunswick, NJ · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes

I find myself browsing these forums less and less as times passes. Biggerpockets is such a machine now and while there is lots of useful advice, it's primarily aimed at newbies (who can't use the search function mind you). It's difficult to find worthwhile discussions or more advanced discussions and it wasn't that way a few years ago. The podcasts feel mostly the same (hey, I pyramided my way to 50 doors!). Anyone else feel this way? I've considered upgrading just so I can post in the forums with more serious folks but it's getting tougher to come on here and have discussions IMO. So many tire kickers or people asking ridiculous questions. 

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Ian Jaeger
Dallas, TX · Member since 2019 · 32 posts · 202 votes
6y

So this is going to sound odd.  You've become one of the 'village elders' here on BP based on the fact that you've seen and heard most of what's been posted; and you've posted over 1200 times yourself, so you've obviously been party to some great conversations.  

Based on my experience on other forums (for wildly differing subjects than this) my transition into the known voice position put me in the same situation, I felt like I wasn't getting anything out of the forum anymore... but the reality was that I was the one now putting back into the forum what I had taken out earlier.  It was my obligation to go back through and help all the people who were 'new' figure it all out; and faster than I did because now I had the forum information and ability to easily pinpoint valuable discussions for others.

You may not be getting much out of BP, but I can assure you that others are probably getting much out of you.  So please don't leave or get discouraged... it's all part of the cycle!

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  • Dan K.
    Investor · San Antonio, TX · Member since 2013 · 88 posts · 44 votes
    6y

    @Shiloh Lundahl

    Really appreciate your insight into your growth as a REI. I was pro for a awhile but then stopped as I focused on growing my business. I stepped away from BP for 2-3 years.

    I think I hit a plateau. I got to 50 doors but I'm having difficulty getting to the next level. Part of the reason is that for every door it requires more of my time and I don't have any more time to put into REI.

    Looking to "scale " without putting in more time as I already put it plenty and because that's what my family is telling me. They say I'm already putting too much time in REI.

    I think I need mastermind group.

    Any suggestions ?

    Thanks

    2Reply
  • Erik Stenbakken
    Investor · Nortnern Colorado · Member since 2020 · 157 posts · 131 votes
    6y

    I'm a relative newbie to BP (but not to REI).

    I can't speak to "the way it was" but will speak to my perspective of "the way it is." I've seen many posts where new folks get the "Geez, can't you just search for that?" answer. So… I ask relatively few questions, and do lots of searching. FWIW, an answer to my question given 4 years ago **might** not have the same answer today -- but I hesitate to ask because, after all, it's been asked before. It would seem that while some were new and enjoyed GETTING answers, it appears to be boring to GIVE answers. From where I sit, it's still awesome to GET answers when you're a newbie. 

    Yes. There's lots of self-serving "I can do that for you" answers. But is that so bad? What if the poster really DOES need help getting something done/ advice/ etc? Yes. As with any interaction on the Internet, it's caveat emptor, but even that has learning opportunities (let's hope not much in the way of losing money). 

    I cannot speak for others, but I'm still finding things to learn here and am grateful for the forums.

    1Reply
  • Kai Van Leuven
    Investor · USA · Member since 2015 · 325 posts · 447 votes
    6y

    @Peter T.

    BP pros and cons

    Pros:

    Differing perspectives ideas

    24 access for Real Estate Junkies

    I get something out of every podcast. Even if it’s just what the masses are doing and I do the opposite

    Cons:

    Too much groupthink. Newbies trust and regurgitate information.

    Too much emphasis put on scaling and not quality of purchase

    Profit motive: Too many posters want to leverage the site for self interest (turn key, lenders, agents). I understand the motive but I think it is annoying.

    2Reply
  • Account Closed
    Houston, TX · Member since 2019 · 39 posts · 13 votes
    6y

    @Ian Jaeger great comment!! Thank you for continued effort to provide value to the forum!

    0Reply
  • Chad McLeod
    Member since 2019 · 58 posts · 60 votes
    6y

    The search function doesn’t really work, IMO.  If I click on forums and type in Dallas and the first result is like 4 years old, that tells me it doesn’t work.  And that’s just an example, btw, but I’ve quit using the search function because that happens all the time.

    As for people asking questions that have already been answered — again, if the search function worked correctly it would be easier to find the answer.  Now, I agree they should look for an answer first, but it’s hard to find an answer the way things are. Also, there is a HUGE difference between having multiple threads on the same topic, and actually having answers in those threads.  Just because you see the same topic more than once doesn’t mean it was really answered. Case in point — lots of threads with people asking for PM recommendations in Cleveland, but very few actual answers.

    Lastly, I agree with the others about the cheesy salespeople.  I stopped asking questions about markets because it’s usually just a bunch of realtors trying to get my business without giving any real info.  Yeah I get you want business, but if the only time you post here is touting your market when someone asks about it, you’re essentially just spamming threads.  For whatever reason, Columbus, OH seems to be the worst of the worst.  I like to imagine it’s the Alcatraz of bad salespeople.  Only the worst of the worst get sent to Columbus.  Ok, I’m joking, but man some of them are really bad.

    10Reply
  • Timothy W.
    Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

     People have voted with their fingers in this thread and the original poster has double your upvotes.  Maybe it's time to listen to the market rather than attack it.

    3Reply
  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Timothy W.:

     People have voted with their fingers in this thread and the original poster has double your upvotes.  Maybe it's time to listen to the market rather than attack it.

     So what? The guy under him doubled *his* votes with his post about the value of BP. All that and a buck will get you a cup of coffee at Dunkin donuts. BP has 1.5 million members. Even if only 5% of them participate on any kind of regular basis - and the figure is higher - that's 75,000 members. Show me what other RE forum & website is providing that kind of experience. Oh, that's right. You can't, because it doesn't exist. If it did, you would be there instead of here complaining about BP. 

    Life is too short for whining and crying. If you don't find value here and think that it's all about the monetization and gurus and shams, you should leave us uniformed peons behind and go start a better site. 

    Podcast Guest on Show #243
    Skyline Properties
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    3Reply
  • Timothy W.
    Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    "Show me what other RE forum & website is providing that kind of experience."  Easy when the whole basis of "experience" is just a numbers game of how many people are "registered":  Facebook.  

    1Reply
  • Tianya Jackson
    Member since 2020 · 5 posts · 0 votes
    6y

    @Dennis Cosgrave Thank you for not forgetting that you were once a newbie.  Some people are now experienced and it's oh the newbies this and the newbies that, stupid question this and stupid question that. You don't know what you don't know.  So because you ask questions or the opinion of experienced investors, that you mean you don't read or take the time to research on your own?  This is the sort of thing that will have BP losing members and money, but I guess those Like @Peter T would be happy as the stupid questions from the newbies would no longer be.  Take some advice from some of the other long time investors and think about paying it forward.  Again, you were once a newbie also.     

    0Reply
  • Gary Dawson
    Flipper/Rehabber · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2020 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    6y

    @Ian Jaeger

    Great insight Ian, I am new to BP

    and am overwhelmed by the information.

    0Reply
  • Amit M.
    Rental Property Investor · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    forums 

    getting

    boring

    —————

    3 bitchy words

    0Reply
  • Amit M.
    Rental Property Investor · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    Ok, more seriously, for some veteran posters it’s one of those “it’s not you, it’s me” breakups. It’s not that the forums have necessarily devolved (after all you pick and choose which to read and engage in.)  It’s that when you first signed up, 1- you probably had a lot more to learn, and 2- everything was new and novel. Now, many veteran posters are old pros, with diminishing returns (except for business lead generation or entertainment purposes.) I know that personally I’m finding less and less posts useful.

    0Reply
  • Matthew McNeil
    Rental Property Investor · Boise/Portland · Member since 2017 · 709 posts · 742 votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Jimmy Stewart:
    Brevity is the soul of wit. Too much egotistical bloviating.

    Polonius, in act 2, scene 2 of Hamlet right?

    In case you missed it, this is a RE investing blog. Not a Shakespeare idiom blog.

    0Reply
  • Aigo Pyles
    Flipper/Rehabber · Memphis, TN · Member since 2020 · 758 posts · 285 votes
    6y

    I'm only new here. But I can see that each day there are only few discussions/topics.

    0Reply
  • Jody Sperling
    Omaha, NE · Member since 2020 · 611 posts · 665 votes
    6y

    There is an enjoyable irony to this thread in that after five pages of replies, everything that can be said, probably has been said on the topic, and the fact that so many people replied here gives weight to the truth that the forums are cyclical. You begin by taking, evolve into giving, and repeat. 

    For all the people who mentioned building a network, I find that the most valuable aspect of posting and replying to questions. And the podcast, though full of useful information on how to become a better real estate investor, has always been first and foremost about inspiring and reminding me of why we do what we do.

    Where else outside of BP (and a few facebook groups) can we openly talk about how amazing real estate investing is without other people's eyes glazing over and snores rumbling from their chests?

    0Reply
  • Peter TverdovBusiness Member
    OP
    Developer · New Brunswick, NJ · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Nat C.:

    @Peter T.

    I’ve been on BiggerPockets since 2013 and at that time it was a much smaller community and I feel it was much better back then. With the higher quantity of people, there’s come a lower quality.

    There were some highly experienced and qualified professionals who used to be active almost daily, who are now inactive. I’ve spoken to some of those members and they basically said the high standard of the forums is no longer there.

    There is still some exceptional talent and expertise on here and there’s been many new additions which we are lucky to have. But at the same time, I feel the rookies and wannabes are far outnumbering the experienced professionals.

     Thanks Nat. That captures how I feel.

    [email protected]732-289-3823
    0Reply
  • Shiloh LundahlPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y

    @Dan K. I don’t want to hijack this thread by going into too much detail about how I scaled my business; but I will share a few things.  If there is more that you would like to know after reading this then feel free to send me a direct message and I’ll chat with you in more detail outside this thread.

    I’ve mentioned on the forums that I went through one of those expensive guru training programs and hired a coach for a year. That program, along with the coaching aspect, really helped springboard my growth as far as being able to scale my real estate business. There were 2 main things that really stand out to me that my coach taught me about scaling and he repeated it to me every week on our phone calls. He said, in order to grow a real estate business you need to use other people’s money, and you need an assistant.

    I, just like you, was working a lot - both at my therapy practice and at trying to manage a real estate business. I was trying to do it all myself because I didn’t want to pay someone else out of my profits to do things that I could do, and I didn’t think that I could afford it. So I was killing myself trying to do everything. For example, I was going over to the property that we had just rehabbed and put on the market to sell and I was mowing the lawn during a lunch break. It took a mentor to sit me down and tell me that I make over a hundred dollars an hour for every therapy session I did and that I could work one extra hour a month providing therapy and I could pay for someone else to mow the yard at my property for a month and I could save myself 3 hours and a lot of frustration trying to mow the lawn with an old, broken down lawn mower. The same went for spending hours on hold trying to work with utility companies to get the power and water turned on at a property and then spending a morning at the property waiting for the technician to arrive to turn on the power or water. 

    After hiring an assistant to take care of and manage all of the little details that were taking up a ton of my time but that could be done easily by another person, my life became much more free and I could spend time doing the higher dollar activities that was difficult for an assistant to do such as finding good deals and raising money. And in the end, having an assistant do those takes for me made me much more money then doing the tasks myself.

    Hopefully these ideas are helpful to you as you work on scaling your business.

    480-206-1209Podcast Guest on Show #287
    0Reply
  • Richard Dunlop
    Investor · Detroit, MI · Member since 2014 · 755 posts · 462 votes
    6y

    BiggerPockets is still a valuable resourse even after 8 years!
    They've done an excellent job except for calling Detroit and Michigan so wrong!

      They were 540 degrees off of reality.
               (That is 180 degrees with an extra complete spin;

                  your still pointed the wrong way with an extra dose of dizziness!)


    My only complaint is it seems a shame that you have to leave the site to be able to do a real search.
    But the search engines do a good job; here is a sample search when I was looking for a specific post of mine that was five years old.
    sample search here


    I do intend to reactivate Pro and once again participate

    4Reply
  • Brian Ploszay
    Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    Perhaps you can graduate to networking events that have more seasoned local investors.  For me BP is social media, but with a real estate focus.  There are groups like this on Facebook, but this is larger.

    The real estate market might have some strong changes in the next two years.  I'd like to gauge national investor sentiment.  BP is a sounding board for investors.

    1Reply
  • Sam B.
    Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2015 · 270 posts · 217 votes
    6y

    I learned a lot on here when I got started but if you spend more than a month reading you're probably wasting your time. None of this stuff is very complicated and to whatever extent it is, you won't sort through it by reading about it, you have to do it.

    Also a lot of the advice by actual experts has been replaced by amateurs trading advice among each other about how to do things none of them have ever actually done.

    3Reply
  • Jimmy Stewart
    Real Estate Broker · Bossier City, LA · Member since 2014 · 4 posts · 6 votes
    6y
    One reason the BP audience aren't getting anything out of the forum is because most posts go too deep into personal nonsense. Granted the rules and regulations for real estate vary from state to state and city to city but overall it's not rocket science. If you feel your story is so much more important than everyone else write a book. Otherwise, provide references for further reading, if you need to, but get to the "flipping" point!




    4Reply
  • Guy Gimenez
    Investor · Corpus Christi, TX · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    @Nat C.

    Like any other forum, social media platform, etc...it quickly gets overwhelmed with people promoting their coaching programs and many others who have limited experience but want badly to become a coach. My philosophy is believe none of what you hear and only half of what you see. Verify everything regardless of who is providing the information. 

    3Reply
  • Zeke Liston
    Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    Hi @Chad McLeod, I see that you're interested in the Columbus market, that's great ;) Haha, just messing.  

    2Reply
  • Joe SplitrockPro Member
    Moderator
    Rental Property Investor · Sioux Falls, SD · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 18k+ votes
    6y

    I have also noticed that the BP Facebook groups are attracting as much or more activity than the forums. That has drained some people out of the forums.

    There is also a cycle that occurs. If you look back to the early days of BP, the people posting the most have mostly moved on. They either grew their business and decided the forums were not a good use of time or they lost interest in real estate. 

    Personally I still learn new things every day that I visit the forums. Real estate is evolving, so to meet the new challenges requires staying informed. 

    I find it interesting when people comment that BP has somehow sold out or become commercialized. Any content that is free is generally supported by advertising. Sometimes it is well hidden, so you don't even know you are being advertised to. The only way for BP to offer such amazing content and to pay the staff of people supporting it is through advertising.

    3Reply
  • Martin Grizzanti
    Investor · Rochester, NY · Member since 2015 · 499 posts · 169 votes
    6y

    network=networth

    2Reply
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