Real Estate Agent · Cedar Creek, TX · Member since 2010 · 161 posts · 63 votes
10y
I guess it's all dependent on your personality type, I wouldn't self manage a single property, I don't want the phone calls and I don't want to be a bill collector.
Investor · TX · Member since 2015 · 393 posts · 290 votes
10y
We self manage 6, and I hold down a full time job. I do all the renovations whenever we acquire a new property or have a vacancy. Never have been one to pay someone to do something I can do myself.
Rental Property Investor · Digital Nomad, USA · Member since 2016 · 8 posts · 5 votes
10y
great question @David Zheng! I am trying to figure out the same thing for remote property management and your post is very timely for me. I have learned that there are automated ways to have the rent and maintenance calls come in via portals, but there still need to be local contractors available to do the work in a timely manner. I am wondering if there is a hybrid where the $$ comes directly to owner, the maintenance requests come in over web portal and can be easily communicated to subs, and turn overs are handled by local property management companies. Input welcome.
San Jose, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
10y
As a resident manager, I managed 25 units. Once I got rid of the problem tenants I inherited and got my own tenants in that I'd vetted myself, it took on average 13 hours a week to manage 25 units.
It's easy. Don't rent crap, that way you don't get many service calls.
When you do get a service call, decide whether it's something you can do, or whether you need to arrange your handyman, your appliance repair guy, AC guy, plumber or electrician. Pick your battles.
I won't even get involved in the call out, I'll pass the tenant number to my contractor and they will make a suitable time for an appointment. If no appointment can be agreed on, then I will attend the property whilst the contractor is onsite. As much as I have some great people I can call on that I do trust, I still have a responsibility to the tenant to keep their stuff safe.
Investor · Saint Louis, MO · Member since 2016 · 970 posts · 1k+ votes
10y
@Anna Myers I totally understand your situation and many people have walked that path in front of you. I personally wouldn't invest and manage out of my immediate area especially with the 5 properties I have...yet. When my capital and emergency funds are very high and I have a lot of properties (probably 15+) I will consider management. I think the key in getting good contractors is using them and seeing their work over and over, which is why I wouldn't just hire anyone in a place im not familiar with and can't visit to view their work all the time.
Specialist · Lakewood, CO · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
10y
Anyone that owns and self-manages has an investment and a job. Those that sub out property management have an investment and a smaller job. Real estate will never be fully passive, but it all depends on your own personal goals, time, and experience. There is no right or wrong.
I personally self-manage 4 units with a full time job and it is no problem. I could likely do around 20 with the same job. In my last position, I would barely be able to handle 1 unit because of how much I worked. Again, it's all about the individual situation.
@Account Closed What site did you use for screening? Share your thoughts about the provider. Thanks.
It was a company that had a contract with the local apartment association. So, members got a discount to use them. They were full service screening and collections. This is the one we used:
I just ordered their credit/eviction/criminal reports online, which was cheaper - after they came to inspect where I kept tenant files, etc. I did the employment, landlord, references checks myself. But, they do everything, for a fee. I'm not sure if they only offer their services in California. You'd have to check.
Rental Property Investor · Oakland, CA · Member since 2014 · 730 posts · 1k+ votes
10y
I have a full time job (40 hours, sales at a high tech company), and I self manage 18 units, spread over 6 properties.
The key is training the tenants to text message repair requests (which I copy and paste to my handyman) and only call me for emergencies
San Jose, CA · Member since 2015 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
10y
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
I have a full time job (40 hours, sales at a high tech company), and I self manage 18 units, spread over 6 properties.
The key is training the tenants to text message repair requests (which I copy and paste to my handyman) and only call me for emergencies
Yes! Texting is the way to go with tenants. I let everything go to voicemail. I usually checked it right away, but sometimes you want time to consider what your response will be, and it keeps the tenant to the point and succinct. It's especially handy when a tenant is angry and just wants to vent about something, like hearing their neighbors having loud sex LOLOL! Some voicemails didn't even get returned :-)
Rental Property Investor · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2016 · 109 posts · 59 votes
10y
I have a full time job as well and self manage 3 SFR's. I live in Florida and all of my units are in North Carolina so this adds a degree of difficulty at times. Luckily I have a really trustworthy handyman and all of my tenants pay me through Venmo or the Cash app so I don't have to be present for much.
The biggest factor for me is screening. I can have piece of mind being out of state when I know that I have properly screened the families living in my units.
Investor · Orlando, FL · Member since 2016 · 40 posts · 8 votes
10y
Hi Rob,
I self manage 3 doors. 1 Duplex and 1 condo. I'm also considering investing out of state and NC is on my list. Any tips you can provide me with on being a landlord while living in Florida? Do you recommend any cities?
Investor · Coral Springs, FL · Member since 2012 · 54 posts · 26 votes
10y
The issue of self management of retaining the services of a professional is one of time and cost. Regardless of how many units you manage, the issue is how you are measuring the cost. While professional managers have an easily identifiable cost, the cost of self management is often hidden. How many of ya'll that self manage take into account the cost of your time? Is is in fact cheaper to outsource many of those tasks as opposed to taking into account the value/cost of your own time?
Another factor is that while everything is going well, it may be perceived to be cheaper to self manage. What is the cost to address any issues that arise? Don't forget to include the cost of the learning curve to get up to speed on how to deal with that specific issue.
If you think the cost of a professional is expensive, try the cost of an amature.
Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2015 · 100 posts · 59 votes
10y
I have a fairly demanding full time job in tech and travel for work as well. So I self manage 4 and that's all I have capacity for. Pretty happy with the 4 I have and have decided to pause (unless something interesting happens to appear).
The issue of self management of retaining the services of a professional is one of time and cost. Regardless of how many units you manage, the issue is how you are measuring the cost. While professional managers have an easily identifiable cost, the cost of self management is often hidden. How many of ya'll that self manage take into account the cost of your time? Is is in fact cheaper to outsource many of those tasks as opposed to taking into account the value/cost of your own time?
Another factor is that while everything is going well, it may be perceived to be cheaper to self manage. What is the cost to address any issues that arise? Don't forget to include the cost of the learning curve to get up to speed on how to deal with that specific issue.
If you think the cost of a professional is expensive, try the cost of an amature.
I think the difference is having control over the decisions when you self-manage. My experience with hiring a PM was that when they're making decisions based on using my money, they're a lot freer with it than I would be. That's expensive. So, when you figure what your time is worth, and it eliminates the easy decisions based on someone spending my money freely vs. my hourly rate - I think you still come out ahead when you self-manage.
My favorite example is my daughter's tenant called her PM to say the breaker keeps flipping. Now, you or I would first ask the tenant what they have plugged in at the same time and tell them not to do that anymore, if it's ridiculous.
But, her PM first sent out her guy to look at the box (and charged my daughter to do so), then they called in an electrician to look at the box, and put in a new box that could handle the tenant plugging a ridiculous amount of things on that breaker - the same breaker that never tripped while my daughter lived in that house for several years. They called it all an "emergency" repair, which meant, they didn't have to consult my daughter before they spent a ton of money out of her reserve account.
Now, was my daughter's time more valuable in having this PM take care of the problem for her? When one call to my daughter would have taken maybe 15 minutes and an explanation of how they can't plug in 50 things in the kitchen at the same time? Or the $1,000 the PM charged her to put in a new electrical box?
Now, if you could find a PM who would treat every decision as if it was truly their own money at stake - well, then, sure. But, good luck with that.
Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2016 · 19 posts · 4 votes
10y
I agree with Tamara. My goal in real estate investing was to retire, so I bought my properties with the intention of having someone else manage them. Sure, I may lose out on 8% on rent, but that is worth the piece of mind.
HVAC Tech · Fort Wayne, IN · Member since 2015 · 423 posts · 223 votes
10y
I self manage 11 units, working a full time job. My goal is to buy as many as fast as I can, until I can make it a full time job. Like was mentioned above, the better you screen the easier it is. I absolutely love managingredients my properties.
I agree with Tamara. My goal in real estate investing was to retire, so I bought my properties with the intention of having someone else manage them. Sure, I may lose out on 8% on rent, but that is worth the piece of mind.
8% plus all of the ridiculously expensive and often unnecessary repairs. Don't forget to add all of that on top of the 8%.
I know there are good, honest, smart PMs out there who won't rob you blind. They're just very rare.
Portland, ME · Member since 2012 · 616 posts · 550 votes
10y
32 units, with husband's help sometimes. I also help some folks find tenants for their properties. I don't have a regular full time job, but work on other investment properties when I can find them. The income from rentals has replaced the need for a regular job, but landlording is just a job with sporadic hours. I often do turnovers myself because I can't find good people to work on short notice. As was posted above, I believe the most money is saved by troubleshooting problems rather than immediately calling in expensive professionals.
Next week I'm buying a 4 unit and will have a management company take it over from the start. They are people who I know are honest, but we'll see if they manage it well. If I end up having to manage it, it's in an easy location for me to do so. If they do a great job, they will get more units from me to manage.
It was a lot harder when I had 10 units and little kids to care for, but now that the kids are mostly self-sufficient it's easier even with more units. Just like how many kids you have, I don't think there is a certain number that's right. You'll know when you've reached your limit!