Do any of you know what the status of vacation rentals with the city council currently is in JT and where it's likely to go? From what I've read, 29 palms seems to be very welcoming, but there's a new law being conjured up in JT that could restrict them which I haven't been able to find much info on. It sounds like a pretty restrictive law just passed in Palm Springs. How tough is it to get a license? It seems like a lot of these glamping type dwellings have got to be rogue in that regard.
I have 2 properties in Joshua Tree, one has been listed for several months and the other listing is about to go live this coming week (we have done extensive renovations on each).
Currently, as Joshua Tree is in San Bernardino County, you have to register your STR at the county tax office and pay the 7% TOT quarterly (end of Jan, April, July, and October). You self-report your revenue and pay 7%, which, of course, is normal to pass on to your guests. I walked in to the county office and registered my property same day, and got the actual license (which must be posted in your home) in about a week.
Have not heard anything recent, but there has been word of an ordinance coming out in the city of Joshua Tree. The city council website has some info, but that website does not seem to be updated regularly. Ordinance from the city would be good, as regulation means it is allowed legally and would make it more difficult to ban it (although I don't think that is likely to ever happen).
You are probably aware of the climate -- Palm Springs (city proper), just passed an ordinance limiting the number of rentals you can have per year. Other low desert cities may pass regulations, but have yet to do so. 29 Palms just passed an ordinance allowing it, and part of the push was to join the economy created by STR's as the neighboring cities have already been taking advantage of it.
Joshua Tree is a different kind of city (different from neighboring Yucca Valley, which has more of a suburb feel and 29 Palms, which is a military town). JT is home to artists, musicians, and the people there are very protective of their town and its identity. They are opposed to big business, gated community developments, and the people will fight against any big company trying to open a store in town or doing large-scale real estate developments. Big hotels are never likely to come to JT. This creates a strong short-term rental opportunity, and the city seems to embrace STRs. However, you have to keep the small-town, community-pride feel. If neighbors, or people in town, see you as someone that is not from the area trying to build an STR empire, you will likely get brushback.
As I also do STRs in Orange County, CA -- comparitively, I view JT as relatively low-risk to ever losing the option to rent out my properties short-term. I try to stay involved in the community and talk to my neighbors (I don't live out there but do a lot of work on my house, so people see me often enough to think I'm a "local"). I also try to support local businesses as much as possible.
I watched the whole Anaheim STR ban go down over several months and actually watched several 3-4 hour council meetings in their entirety. The bad STR owners ruin it for everyone. STRs are a unique kind of real estate investment: a hybrid of a hospitality business and a single-family home. You have to run the business like a hotel (customer is always right, don't go cheap on stuff, communicate often with your guests, ensure their vacation is memorable). But you have to also realize you are a single-family home in a neighborhood, and you have responsibilities just like any other homeowner. Noise control, trash control, parking control, looking out for the welfare of your neighbors, being involved in the community, understanding unique local concerns (e.g. light ordinance in JT or the care of environment concerns in JT). It's not enough to just tell your guests, you have to have checks in place to make sure the noise, trash, and parking do not get out of hand.
I follow listings in certain neighborhoods in JT and have noticed that things are selling very quickly now, often cash offers (as they close within a week). Prices have appreciated a lot, and listings sell for around list. It's obvious what's going on, and I just hope the STR owners will not ruin it by treating it strictly as a business and forgetting about the community at large.
I have 2 properties in Joshua Tree, one has been listed for several months and the other listing is about to go live this coming week (we have done extensive renovations on each).
Currently, as Joshua Tree is in San Bernardino County, you have to register your STR at the county tax office and pay the 7% TOT quarterly (end of Jan, April, July, and October). You self-report your revenue and pay 7%, which, of course, is normal to pass on to your guests. I walked in to the county office and registered my property same day, and got the actual license (which must be posted in your home) in about a week.
Have not heard anything recent, but there has been word of an ordinance coming out in the city of Joshua Tree. The city council website has some info, but that website does not seem to be updated regularly. Ordinance from the city would be good, as regulation means it is allowed legally and would make it more difficult to ban it (although I don't think that is likely to ever happen).
You are probably aware of the climate -- Palm Springs (city proper), just passed an ordinance limiting the number of rentals you can have per year. Other low desert cities may pass regulations, but have yet to do so. 29 Palms just passed an ordinance allowing it, and part of the push was to join the economy created by STR's as the neighboring cities have already been taking advantage of it.
Joshua Tree is a different kind of city (different from neighboring Yucca Valley, which has more of a suburb feel and 29 Palms, which is a military town). JT is home to artists, musicians, and the people there are very protective of their town and its identity. They are opposed to big business, gated community developments, and the people will fight against any big company trying to open a store in town or doing large-scale real estate developments. Big hotels are never likely to come to JT. This creates a strong short-term rental opportunity, and the city seems to embrace STRs. However, you have to keep the small-town, community-pride feel. If neighbors, or people in town, see you as someone that is not from the area trying to build an STR empire, you will likely get brushback.
As I also do STRs in Orange County, CA -- comparitively, I view JT as relatively low-risk to ever losing the option to rent out my properties short-term. I try to stay involved in the community and talk to my neighbors (I don't live out there but do a lot of work on my house, so people see me often enough to think I'm a "local"). I also try to support local businesses as much as possible.
I watched the whole Anaheim STR ban go down over several months and actually watched several 3-4 hour council meetings in their entirety. The bad STR owners ruin it for everyone. STRs are a unique kind of real estate investment: a hybrid of a hospitality business and a single-family home. You have to run the business like a hotel (customer is always right, don't go cheap on stuff, communicate often with your guests, ensure their vacation is memorable). But you have to also realize you are a single-family home in a neighborhood, and you have responsibilities just like any other homeowner. Noise control, trash control, parking control, looking out for the welfare of your neighbors, being involved in the community, understanding unique local concerns (e.g. light ordinance in JT or the care of environment concerns in JT). It's not enough to just tell your guests, you have to have checks in place to make sure the noise, trash, and parking do not get out of hand.
I follow listings in certain neighborhoods in JT and have noticed that things are selling very quickly now, often cash offers (as they close within a week). Prices have appreciated a lot, and listings sell for around list. It's obvious what's going on, and I just hope the STR owners will not ruin it by treating it strictly as a business and forgetting about the community at large.
Also, I know from a neighbor of mine that you can't rent out an Airstream trailer on an empty lot. You have to have a dwelling there. Just like anywhere else, you won't have issues unless someone complains. We have someone on our street who seems to have made it his mission to crack down on anyone not following regulation. Good news is that STRs are allowed, so there has been nothing negative coming my way yet. The house that we bought was an operating STR for almost 20 years.
@John Lee Thank you for your insight! I just got back from a weekend in the high desert and I have never seen a market so hot in my life. I'm flabbergasted at what is going on there right now. The home I looked at is
5345 Flamingo Ave Joshua Tree, CA 92252
There were like 5 different buyers who showed up to look at when we did and a few had already made cash offers! It was like an open house. Of all the houses and condos I've looked at in LA, I haven't see a situation like that. It'll be interesting to see what it closes at. We looked everywhere, pioneertown, landers, all over JT. I asked my agent about this place today and thought it would be the perfect project for me since it has water on it and it has land, and literally went pending today. Listed for 300 days too? Unreal. This is the type of situation I'm looking for now.
60767-Sonora...
I stayed up in pipes canyon which is gorgeous and I would own there in a heartbeat. There was a 20 acre lot for what looks like well under market right next to where we were staying, but the story is I guess it's in a flood zone and no one has been able to figure out how to build on it. Plus, there's a ton of hoops to jump through with fish and game and stuff like that. I drove for the entire day all around the high desert on Sunday and saw all of 0 construction sites, so that's starting to add up. I can see why you wanted to rehab, that seems like the only way to go right now with 400 sq ft cabins going for what will probably be over list at 220k. (That place is a work of art btw and you bought it congratulations). Just need water and hopefully septic and some concrete in the ground with a little acreage and space to breath.
The market seems so hot that I might get burned, but if it's cash buyers and new construction costs far outweigh existing homes, could it be a bubble?
Funny, my partner and I just had a conversation about how crazy the JT market is and how it might be a bubble. The pending legislation is also an issue (heard that it will particularly affect the "glamping" type homestead rentals).
Last summer, I told my partner that I wanted to get 3 properties by the end of the year (we ended up with two), and then 6 more in the next year. The rush was because of the likelihood of increased cost of entry, as we saw how prices were appreciating. Well, it's already kind of too late, so we are looking for good deals or looking to buy land at a good price and build.
You can rent out pretty much anywhere in JT, but the look of the house and the surrounding area will dictate the nightly rate. Seems to favor unique, artistically decorated houses or homes with some element of seclusion and attractive natural surroundings.
We designed our strategy around the "worst-case scenario"/multiple exit strategy plan. Of course, first option is short-term rentals via AirBnb and VRBO. Second option is long-term rental (marine base nearby can attract steady renters) -- so we looked at the basics of real estate: good neighborhood, good schools, where locals in JT want to live. Third option is just to sell the house if the first two options don't work out, so again, the basics of real estate dictate the areas with best resale value historically.
Based on that research, we decided to look primarily near the West Entrance of the park, even though houses there are higher than other areas of JT. Neighborhoods like Monument Manor, Joshua Tree Highlands, Friendly Hills area -- basically anything south of Alta Loma and relatively close to Park Blvd.
This does not pertain to JT, but in our area they solved the problem by forcing the owner to obtain a business license and claim it as income.
Great thread. This is an area that my wife and I have been considering jumping in for our first property purchase.
@Lee Davis are you continuing you search for property, or did you decide against this area?
For those that have bought property in JT, do you have any real estate agents you would like to recommend? Feel free to PM me if preferred.
@Mitchel LeHeux I'm closing on a little homesteader cabin next week it looks like, so I'll let you know how it goes. We spent pretty much every weekend out in the hi-desert from the moment I made my original post to when we finally got an offer accepted over a month ago. If this deal fell through, I would have definitely given up on 92252 and searched outside of it where it seems you can still find value, like Twentynine Palms or Landers, or the Yucca Mesa part of Yucca Valley. There are over 40 new airbnb listings in JT just in the time we have been searching, so it's going to be interesting.
yucca valley city council just had a 3 hr session a few nights ago on vacation rentals. they are going to take public comment one more time before enacting the law. basically, you are a mini hotel now (paying occupancy tax, and guest # limit based on bedroom, etc..) you can google what they are proposing, but the overall vibe is that yucca doesn't want Vacation rentals. I think it's just a matter of time before unincorporated san bernardino county can put a law on the books.. but they are just stretched so thin (largest county in the country)
@David Jarvi I just read an article in Hi-Desert Star about the meeting, but it looks like it's just setting rules and regulations? Occupancy taxes, etc seem fine to me. With Yucca and 29 taking stances now, the juggernaut of JT still has to make their move. Twentynine Palms voted in favor with occupancy taxes. I'm expecting Joshua Tree to do the same, just fingers crossed they don't do what Palm Springs did and limit the amount of days you can rent. Are you suggesting that San Bernardino county is going to make prohibitive legislation on vacation rentals? People have been renting out cabins in Big Bear since the beginning of time. I suppose I haven't speculated on that.
correct, rules/regs.
JT is not a city. it's a Census Designated Place. (aka...unincorporated San Bernardino County).
so, governed by the county.
the only area requiring a permit currently is in "the mountain area" .but I heard a rumor from a big time AIRBNB guy that it's being viewed as a pilot for the rest of the county.
@David Jarvi I see, yeah I was just planning on doing what John Lee did who posted earlier in the thread.
"Currently, as Joshua Tree is in San Bernardino County, you have to register your STR at the county tax office and pay the 7% TOT quarterly (end of Jan, April, July, and October). You self-report your revenue and pay 7%, which, of course, is normal to pass on to your guests. I walked in to the county office and registered my property same day, and got the actual license (which must be posted in your home) in about a week."
I didn't realize until now, however, that JT wasn't an actual city, which I feel a little silly about after doing all this research. That and the fact that I'm going to have the keys to a JT property in less than a week. It seems to me to be good news though if we don't have any of these pesky city council meetings to worry about.
No advice here, but I feel the pain on finding a real estate agent in the area. We bought a house in JT last year and it was... interesting. : )
Great thread. This is an area that my wife and I have been considering jumping in for our first property purchase.
@Lee Davis are you continuing you search for property, or did you decide against this area?
For those that have bought property in JT, do you have any real estate agents you would like to recommend? Feel free to PM me if preferred.
Use Paul Karr with Cherie Miller and associates. He recently gave me first dibs on a duplex on commercial street right in downtown JT for $120K. There were 6 cash buyers right behind me. The place is already worth 40K more than I paid for it before any of the custom renovations I'm doing. This was my first real estate venture and he liked me for some reason so he made sure I closed on the deal. One of the most friendly, genuine guys I've ever met. I now have two airbnb's right in the middle of the village for the price of one!
@John Lee Thank you for the tip on the STR 7% tax. I had no idea.
@Lee Davis Did you close on a homestead?
@Josh Bloemendaal How are your Airbnb rentals going?
That's my game plan within the next year or so: plot of land and then add 3-5 Airbnb's right outside Joshua tree.
Zoning dictates “dwelling units” allowed. Some will say 120 sq ft or under you can do whatever (not true) a lot folks seem to be testing county enforcement - seems like if you pay the transient taxes (which is auto collected by airbnb at least) youll be good. But at any point a govt official could show up and demand to see proof of x,y,z based on the advertised pics.
Additions/remods dont seem overly complicated. You submit electronically and county can give rough approval times -3-4 weeks i think for room additions.
Prices have dropped a bit in recent months so a lot more inventory it seems to choose from and prob will continue imo
That's my game plan within the next year or so: plot of land and then add 3-5 Airbnb's right outside Joshua tree.
on slab/on same piece of land?
Ideally one larger lot 20 or so acres with a few different units
Bumping this thread again. I'm out in Joshua tree looking at properties to buy and rehab as airbnb rentals. How has the airbnb rental climate changed since 2017-2019?
I'm mostly looking at properties in J tree, landers, and yucca valley.
I'd be interested to chat with anybody that has done a few out there. DM me.