Airbnb Breach of Contract Class Action Petition

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Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
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Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
6y

I can't stand people that play the victim and think they should be compensated any time something bad happens. People lose jobs. Someone steps on a mine and loses a leg. A spouse commits suicide. A virus makes it dangerous for people to travel or share homes and you lose money.

Suck it up, Buttercup. Figure out how to prepare for a downturn and you'll thrive while others fall apart.

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  • Jason Collins
    Rental Property Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2018 · 46 posts · 76 votes
    6y

    The reason the host ‘buttercups’ are upset is not because they took a calculated risk and lost money, but because AirBNB unilaterally intervened and changed the contract structure without consulting owners first.

    I agree that lawsuits will not solve the problem.

    However, I think that a much better policy would have been to allow individual hosts and guests to work out the situation on their own terms.

    For example, I would have offered my guests a 100% credit for a future date of their choice OR a 50% rebate.

    Going forward, I believe the best way to resolve this would be for AirBNB to allow hosts to offer their own travelers insurance.

    For example, for $75 extra dollars a booking, I will allow guests to cancel with full refund in the event of a documented medical condition or a natural disaster, state of emergency, etc.

    4Reply
  • Ken Boone
    Investor · Greenville, SC · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    I think the other thing a lawsuit will do for the bunch win or lose will get them kicked off airbnb.. so there goes one of their main platforms for doing business.  Shooting themselves in the foot.

    1Reply
  • Kyle Parks
    Rental Property Investor · Lakewood, OH · Member since 2016 · 119 posts · 156 votes
    6y

    Looks like 18,000 people signed up to own a business because they dont understand what it entails.

    Hopefully they will all quit and I can raise my rates.

    1Reply
  • Account Closed
    Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    There will be winners and losers from this incredible world event. And I would wager that I can point to 18,000+ people who won’t be in the “winners” category 5 years from now.

    0Reply
  • John UnderwoodPro Member
    Investor · Greer, SC · Member since 2014 · 13k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Mike V.:
    Originally posted by @Nathan Gesner:

    I can't stand people that play the victim and think they should be compensated any time something bad happens. People lose jobs. Someone steps on a mine and loses a leg. A spouse commits suicide. A virus makes it dangerous for people to travel or share homes and you lose money.

    Suck it up, Buttercup. Figure out how to prepare for a downturn and you'll thrive while others fall apart.

    You're a moderator?  Posting in the short term vacation rental forum?  Telling the Short term rental owners to "suck it up buttercup?"

    Guess anyone can be a moderator nowadays. 

    You do realize this is how 99% of the people here literally make their livings?

    You do realize that rental contracts are legally binding contracts?

    .... And if you decided to sue each guest (assuming you have a signed rental agreement) you would win?

    You do realize theres this mysterious thing called....  Travel insurance?

    Why are "buttercups" expected to grunt 100% of the losses, superseding legally binding rental agreements, while travels get to walk away with zero financial impact?  Would 50% be THAT unfair?  Is it THAT unreasonable to even imply that guests share some of the financial burdens?  

    You do realize this is no more the hosts fault than the travelers?

    You do realize i'm still required to pay my mortgage, property taxes, insurance, electricity, HOA, and 20 other things?

    But nice to know we're "buttercups"

     He is talking to you buttercup.

    Most of us DO NOT have all our eggs in the STR basket contrary to your belief. Those that do are in for a tough few months.

    0Reply
  • Mary M.
    Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    So here is my comment/question: STR folks make bank, right?? Isnt this why they are so pissed?

    so, afai understand real estate, the higher the returns, the higher the risk (or vice versa)  STR folks should of been cognizant that all that money comes with a downside. That is why the returns are so big - so you have something to sock away for the inevitable downturn 
    If you have been negatively affected there are many relief options available  

    I really hope everyone makes it thru this disaster. :( 

    0Reply
  • Collin HaysBusiness Member
    Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Nathan Gesner:

    I can't stand people that play the victim and think they should be compensated any time something bad happens. People lose jobs. Someone steps on a mine and loses a leg. A spouse commits suicide. A virus makes it dangerous for people to travel or share homes and you lose money.

    Suck it up, Buttercup. Figure out how to prepare for a downturn and you'll thrive while others fall apart.

    I don't think they are wanting to be compensated for something bad happening.  They are wanting to be compensated because AirBnB placed them in the position of insurer for likely $ tens of millions, and without the benefit of a single penny of premium.  That is a big, big deal.  If it wasn't illegal, it was at best highly unethical.  If refunds were considered to be so important with the COVID crisis, then why was AirBnB simultaneously denying claims made for cancelled reservations from trip cancellation insurance that THEY sold and profited from?   "Hmm...the insurance that you bought from us doesn't cover pandemics, but we can certainly refund the homeowner's money."  

    Homeowners have plenty enough on their plate as it is without having to worry with nonsense from AirBnB.  
     

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  • Collin HaysBusiness Member
    Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Ken Boone:

    I think the other thing a lawsuit will do for the bunch win or lose will get them kicked off airbnb.. so there goes one of their main platforms for doing business.  Shooting themselves in the foot.

    This event will spring forth new competitors, thankfully. 

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    0Reply
  • Derek Jones
    Member since 2019 · 7 posts · 1 vote
    6y

    I have a mix of long term and short term properties. All these YouTube channels have bragged about rental arbitrage making 3-4x standard rent roll and now they can’t pay the mortgage or rent? Get over yourselves. I lost 90% of reservations but have rebooked with medium term guests at 50% my normal rate which is still 1.5x standard rent and Airbnb is going to give me back 25% of cancellations under the extenuating circumstances policy due to COVID-19 - deal. I listened to the CEO and he sounded genuine. They made the right call. Hosts that would have forced guests to travel would have caused the virus to spread faster, put their cleaners at risk and caused a deeper damage to to economy and therefore the short term business and would have collapsed guest confidence in the host network. Yes, I made a lot less but filed for relief via the disaster loan program but so did nearly every business in the globe. Hosts, if you would have not voluntarily given guests their booking fee back because their event or work travel was cancelled...shame.

    0Reply
  • Mary M.
    Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    @Collin Hays but you didnt lose anything. Nobody stayed in your rental and not pay. All you lost was a booking. 

    And its not like that booking that got canceled blocked someone else from booking. 

    So really you lost nothing. 

    Also, you absolutely should NOT be allowed to keep a guests money if they are told, by the govt to not travel. 

    2Reply
  • Collin HaysBusiness Member
    Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Mary M.:

    @Collin Hays but you didnt lose anything. Nobody stayed in your rental and not pay. All you lost was a booking. 

    And its not like that booking that got canceled blocked someone else from booking. 

    So really you lost nothing. 

    Also, you absolutely should NOT be allowed to keep a guests money if they are told, by the govt to not travel. 

    It doesn’t really matter why a reservation is cancelled; there are a myriad of good and valid reasons to cancel a plane trip, house rental, or appointment with your shrink.  

    This is about insurance and indemnification.  Homeowners are not insurers.  If you are Airbnb and selling trip insurance, then step up as the insurer and pay claims.  You don’t skirt the very insurance you are selling and place the homeowner in a position of insurer.  

    Airbnb’s contract needs to explicitly explain to hosts something like the following:  “You agree that the trip insurance we are marketing is actually just a profit center for us and we don’t pay claims for valid cancellations, but we instead are going to place you, the Host, in the position of insurer for cancellations as it suits us.”

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  • Mary M.
    Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    @Collin Hays every one of those allow cancelation with no penalty so not sure what your point is ? 

    Honestly, instead of worrying about things you cant change, work to figure out a way to get thru this intact.  Rent your places as furnished long term rentals. Rent to nurses, do something to help yourself. 

    0Reply
  • Collin HaysBusiness Member
    Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Mary M.:

    @Collin Hays every one of those allow cancelation with no penalty so not sure what your point is ? 

    Honestly, instead of worrying about things you cant change, work to figure out a way to get thru this intact.  Rent your places as furnished long term rentals. Rent to nurses, do something to help yourself. 

    Honestly I'm not worried about it because I don't use the AirBnB platform.  This being a discussion forum, it is helpful to know, however, what all of the fuss is about.  As I said, cancellations and refunds aren't the issue per se.  The issue is who is an insurer.

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    0Reply
  • Anand S.
    Plantation, FL · Member since 2009 · 329 posts · 119 votes
    6y

    What's interesting is that today a guest cancelled a booking meant for late April. Instead of a refund, AirBnB gave the guest a CREDIT. Here they are unilaterally forcing us to give full refunds (well now we get back about 12.5%), but when the shoe is on the other foot, they give a CREDIT!?!

    0Reply
  • Michaela G.
    Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    Seems like cutting off your nose to spite your face. Airbnb may not be around for long because of this virus, so, suing them pushes them even more into that direction. 

    You may say: oh, well, I'll go to another platform , but that kind of defeats the purpose

    0Reply
  • Ken Latchers
    Hatfield, PA · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 629 votes
    6y

    Frankly, to me all the onus is on the vacation rental owner. I see so many panicking and doing foolish things and blaming everyone else and complaining about cancellations and not grasping the concept of pandemic.

    Airbnb, booking.com, VRBO, and flip key or simply intermediaries to bring together guests and host. Without them would be almost impossible for the average owner.

    They do it the way they want trying to triangulate what owners and guests want and how to maximize your profit. They constantly tweak the agreements to protect themselves mostly. Is business.

    owners should have properties without getting in over their heads and have a back-up plan and have Christine process and Automation and Furnishings to compete. They should have a nest egg or other streams of reliable income. 

    I have long-term and short-term rentals, a permanent job, and I am working on building my own tour business.

    But for heaven's sakes, why do these chicken littles keep crying that the sky is falling and looking for someone else to blame?

    0Reply
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