Luke CarlPro Member
Rental Property Investor · Tennessee Florida · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 5k+ votes
5y
@paul Sandhu is the best in the nation. It’s a shame this question doesn’t get asked more often.
Podcast Guest on Show From Surviving on $30/Day to 30+ Properties Thanks to Blue-Collar Skills
5 Reply
John UnderwoodPro Member
Investor · Greer, SC · Member since 2014 · 13k+ posts · 17k+ votes
5y
The person I'm the mirror.
Why - because no one has more incentive than you to outperform the PM that is trying to fill 100 other properties too.
Plus, easy to self manage from your phone and save the 30% PM fee.
8 Reply
Gerald Pitts
Lender · Asheville NC · Member since 2016 · 470 posts · 317 votes
5y
I have a PM for one long term rental, but self manage 3 short term. Software makes it a breeze.
3 Reply
Paul Sandhu
Investor · The worst town to live in, KS · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @John Underwood:
The person I'm the mirror.
Why - because no one has more incentive than you to outperform the PM that is trying to fill 100 other properties too.
Plus, easy to self manage from your phone and save the 30% PM fee.

You beat me to my original answer. So here is my new answer"
The person wearing your underwear.
3 Reply
Chris K.
OP
Investor · FL · Member since 2020 · 179 posts · 55 votes
5y
@Luke Carl awesome thank you!
0 Reply
Chris K.
OP
Investor · FL · Member since 2020 · 179 posts · 55 votes
5y
@John Underwood
Agreed with self management. BUT to scale to multiple STR properties plus living in another state I feel a solid PM could be worth the $? Currently seeing Vacasa, Evolve, which are between 10-18% gross revenue.
1 Reply
Luke CarlPro Member
Rental Property Investor · Tennessee Florida · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 5k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Chris K.:
@John Underwood
Agreed with self management. BUT to scale to multiple STR properties plus living in another state I feel a solid PM could be worth the $? Currently seeing Vacasa, Evolve, which are between 10-18% gross revenue.

Yes and 60% occupancy :/
Podcast Guest on Show From Surviving on $30/Day to 30+ Properties Thanks to Blue-Collar Skills
3 Reply
Leora Merrell
Rental Property Investor · Member since 2019 · 276 posts · 235 votes
5y
@Chris K.
I self manage six from a distance. Get your ducks in a row and good teams in place and you’ll be fine.
2 Reply
Paul Sandhu
Investor · The worst town to live in, KS · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Leora Merrell:
@Chris K.
I self manage six from a distance. Get your ducks in a row and good teams in place and you’ll be fine.

0 Reply
Paul Sandhu
Investor · The worst town to live in, KS · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
5y
Here's my ducks in a row.
6 Reply
Meto D.
Rental Property Investor · Naples, FL · Member since 2020 · 3 posts · 0 votes
5y
@Gerald Pitts what software do you use for short term rentals. Thanks
0 Reply
Matthew LoPiccolo
Flipper/Rehabber · Canton, GA · Member since 2021 · 32 posts · 27 votes
5y
@Chris K.
Key Real Estate Advisors in Fort Myers.
Dan has been in the area for over 20 years. Has a great team that helps you pick a property that meets your criteria, a rehab team to fix any known issues and a designer to help make the place appealing to ST Renters.
Here is a link to their website
http://www.keyrealestateadvisors.com
1 Reply
Matthew LoPiccolo
Flipper/Rehabber · Canton, GA · Member since 2021 · 32 posts · 27 votes
5y
@Chris K.
Key Real Estate Advisors in Fort Myers.
Dan has been in the area for over 20 years. Has a great team that helps you pick a property that meets your criteria, a rehab team to fix any known issues and a designer to help make the place appealing to ST Renters.
Here is a link to their website
http://www.keyrealestateadvisors.com
2 Reply
Gerald Pitts
Lender · Asheville NC · Member since 2016 · 470 posts · 317 votes
5y
Originally posted by @Meto D.:
@Gerald Pitts what software do you use for short term rentals. Thanks

Your Porter for PMS, Price Labs for pricing tool, Hostfully for guidebooks. Airbnb, VRBO for listings.
1 Reply
Zachary Beach
Specialist · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2018 · 291 posts · 231 votes
5y
@Chris K. The best short term rental management company is the one that makes you more money than you would have made without them after all the costs including paying them is considered and your time value of money. Everyone’s profit potential on the same house is different and so is everyone’s time value of money. You want a property manager with substantially higher profit potential than you and or to have a high time value to your money or for your goal for it to be a passive investment not a always on call job.
Unfortunately most STR management companies suck. I guess fortunately for me so I can fill that need.
0 Reply
Jonathan Soto
Lender · Newark, NJ · Member since 2016 · 695 posts · 252 votes
5y
self manage as much as you can as no one will ensure everything is up to you standards beside you. once you know the standards you can hire it out to match.
0 Reply
Collin HaysBusiness Member
Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
5y
The best property management company is one that is renting your property for 300 days per year and not stealing from you.

Any property management company charging less than 25 percent is stealing from you.  Simple as that. Most of this is done through charging exorbitant "booking fees" and cleaning fees. It is quite common for management companies to charge $100 or much, much more for a booking fee. Or $250 cleaning fee for a 700 square foot cabin. They aren't sharing that with you. And they have to hold down your rents to make all of those extra fees palatable to the guest.

I am always amazed that folks go for the "cheaper" management company by default. These companies are minding and managing your asset.  It's your financial parachute. If I am shopping for parachute, "cheapest" might not be my first choice.
As for self-managing, I always recommend it, but only if you want a part time job. We had a homeowner - a trial attorney - who joined us last year after doing the Vacasa deal. He was "only" paying 17 percent, and his cabin did slightly above $20,000 the previous year. He really whined about paying us 25%, so I gave him the first 6 months free so he could "try before you buy." Well, his cabin is on pace to do around $45,000 this year. He's a happy camper.
Self managing is a lot easier if you are living within 30 miles of your place and can keep track of things. The idea of self managing from 1000 miles away with someone from Bangladesh taking calls, and everything else being handled by computer...well, it would be great if it was that easy.  I'd be doing it myself.
[email protected]806-672-7102
SMOKY MOUNTAIN FALLS INC.51 Review
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1 Reply
Mark S.
Real Estate Investor · Saint Paul, MN · Member since 2017 · 543 posts · 475 votes
5y
@Collin H. I am self managing two properties- one is 950 miles away and the other 964. On average they take perhaps 3 hours a week to manage, including providing the kind of service that has gotten us 99% 5 star reviews (1 was 4 star but the guest said it was the best vacation rental stay she has ever had 🤔). That does not include an annual site visit to check things, which is more or less a little vacation for my wife and me. Annual gross around $150k. The 30% I would be paying a property manager comes to $45,000. So I figure I am making $288/hour self managing.
0 Reply
Collin HaysBusiness Member
Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Mark S.:
@Collin H. I am self managing two properties- one is 950 miles away and the other 964. On average they take perhaps 3 hours a week to manage, including providing the kind of service that has gotten us 99% 5 star reviews (1 was 4 star but the guest said it was the best vacation rental stay she has ever had 🤔). That does not include an annual site visit to check things, which is more or less a little vacation for my wife and me. Annual gross around $150k. The 30% I would be paying a property manager comes to $45,000. So I figure I am making $288/hour self managing.

I love it!!
[email protected]806-672-7102
SMOKY MOUNTAIN FALLS INC.51 Review
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1 Reply
Chris K.
OP
Investor · FL · Member since 2020 · 179 posts · 55 votes
5y
@Jonathan Soto
If you do self manage (I am not afraid of the work for bookings , communication with renters etc) how do you have confidence with cleaning and maintenance service?
How are you scheduling these services around your bookings?
0 Reply
Chris K.
OP
Investor · FL · Member since 2020 · 179 posts · 55 votes
5y
@Collin H.
Makes sense. Vacasa seems to have a lot of market share in the area I am looking for my next one, near beach in Florida. Not sure if that means they do a good job or not. I was just a renter with Vacasa through Airbnb and was happy with the service they provided me.
0 Reply
Collin HaysBusiness Member
Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Chris K.:
@Jonathan Soto
If you do self manage (I am not afraid of the work for bookings , communication with renters etc) how do you have confidence with cleaning and maintenance service?
How are you scheduling these services around your bookings?

This is the part that can be a headache. Heck I’ve got people on staff for these things, and there are still days when the manager is helping people get their TVs to work or chasing a snake out of the basement. “John in Bangladesh” is of no help on these situations.

[email protected]806-672-7102
SMOKY MOUNTAIN FALLS INC.51 Review
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1 Reply
Collin HaysBusiness Member
Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Chris K.:
@Collin H.
Makes sense. Vacasa seems to have a lot of market share in the area I am looking for my next one, near beach in Florida. Not sure if that means they do a good job or not. I was just a renter with Vacasa through Airbnb and was happy with the service they provided me.

They’re stealing from owners. After the smoke and mirrors, they are easily above a 30% management fee.
[email protected]806-672-7102
SMOKY MOUNTAIN FALLS INC.51 Review
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1 Reply
Michael Plante
Deland, FL · Member since 2017 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @John Underwood:
The person I'm the mirror.
Why - because no one has more incentive than you to outperform the PM that is trying to fill 100 other properties too.
Plus, easy to self manage from your phone and save the 30% PM fee.

How do you handle the housekeeping for a long distance STR?
0 Reply
John UnderwoodPro Member
Investor · Greer, SC · Member since 2014 · 13k+ posts · 17k+ votes
5y
Originally posted by @Michael Plante:
Originally posted by @John Underwood:
The person I'm the mirror.
Why - because no one has more incentive than you to outperform the PM that is trying to fill 100 other properties too.
Plus, easy to self manage from your phone and save the 30% PM fee.

How do you handle the housekeeping for a long distance STR?

Just share the schedule with the cleaners.
0 Reply

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