Alternative K-12 Education - What's Out There?

Alternative K-12 Education - What's Out There?

Julie MarquezPro Member
Investor · Skagit County, WA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 807 votes

We've all been thinking about the value of college education as tuition rises, wondering if the time spent and outcome is worth it. There are trades schools, a plethora of online courses, and as most investors know, the school of hard knocks, internships and jobs, and hands on experience. Depending on your chosen career path, there are dozens of new opportunities to learn these days.

What about K-12 education alternatives? Why can't a 14 year old get their feet wet in real estate and work in the field? Do you think back on your high school career and wonder if all that history homework and tests were really worth it and valuable to your success today? I'm not arguing against the core skills or reading, writing, and math, but the extra 1000 hours a year sitting in a classroom listening to a teacher lecture, and even more hours at home doing homework during childhood. Just to take a test and forget the next day.

I contribute most of my success as a real estate investor to my dad and family, and the experience spent outside of the classroom. Realizing this, I have been looking for alternative schools for my 4 and 6 year old children. This brought us to Acton Academy, a real world solution to the apathy that plagues todays traditional education. The priority of the learners is to build a healthy civilization, set their own goals, and find their passions. The focus is Socratic discussions, respectful disagreements, personal responsibility, servant leadership, and character building. They call it learner driven, and it's amazing how capable children are when we give them the trust they deserve. Seth Godin, Gary V, and our family are all huge fans.

1. Those with children that are looking for alternatives to tradition K-12 education, what are you doing? I know there is homeschooling, charter schools, microschools, and other opportunities depending on the state.

2. Those who are successful real estate investors, when you look back on your primary education, what do you contribute to you success and what would you change? What would an ideal primary education look like?

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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
3y

I agree. In a lot of cases and for many people, formal education is highly over-rated and I daresay even wasted. It's good that many areas have the alternative for families to choose Charter Schools.

Way past time to bring back Woodshop, Home Economics, and Motor Shop.

Add to these other options like you mention..... 

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  • Bruce WoodruffPro Member
    Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
    3y

    I agree. In a lot of cases and for many people, formal education is highly over-rated and I daresay even wasted. It's good that many areas have the alternative for families to choose Charter Schools.

    Way past time to bring back Woodshop, Home Economics, and Motor Shop.

    Add to these other options like you mention..... 

  • Julie MarquezPro Member
    OP
    Investor · Skagit County, WA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 807 votes
    3y

    @Bruce Woodruff Arizona is a great state for alternative education! I love the tech schools, we have an amazing technical high school program for construction where students can spend a half day in an advanced wood shop (and more) class.

  • Bruce WoodruffPro Member
    Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
    3y
    Quote from @Julie Marquez:

    @Bruce Woodruff Arizona is a great state for alternative education! I love the tech schools, we have an amazing technical high school program for construction where students can spend a half day in an advanced wood shop (and more) class.


    Yes it is...although the new 'Governor' (?) Katie Hobbs is trying to limit Charter Schools and other alternatives. AZ has had the nation's largest and most expansive school choice program. She is attempting to repeal it.....brilliant.

  • Bobbie LehnhofPro Member
    Investor · Gilbert AZ · Member since 2019 · 18 posts · 7 votes
    3y

    @Julie Marquez I love this topic and think about it all the time. I have four kids 12,10,7,4 and I’m always questioning if normal school is right for kids these days. My conclusion is I can’t hide them from the world but I can teach them by making them help me with properties doing rehab or teach them to find properties and evaluate them. I wish I had more experience to share!

  • Julie MarquezPro Member
    OP
    Investor · Skagit County, WA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 807 votes
    3y

    @Bobbie Lehnhof That's awesome, they are going to learn so much from the experiences with you. That's true, the world is out there. You're in Arizona (with many options), what are you guys doing for school now?

  • Cliff BennerBusiness Member
    Accountant · Denver, CO · Member since 2020 · 392 posts · 183 votes
    3y

    I remember when I was in high school there was our normal schools, then a place called the Career Center, where it had Mechanics class, EMT Training, preschool education classes, and then a class, I regret not taking, where they every school year the class built a small home on a trailer frame from start to finish, then it went to a family in need(from what I heard 10 years ago); they had licensed Electricians and plumbers do the specialty stuff but the rest was done by high schoolers. Now I want to do this class everyday! My school had Jewelry, metal working, pottery, wood shop, econ, and cooking as electives. All more useful then the required classes. 

    Even with that though, the staff was useless. My counselor told me I wasn't college material because of where I lived(trailer area with drugs around, poor area C- minus on my side of the road at best), even though I had a 3.8 GPA and was accepted to colleges before that conversation, which they knew.

    I don't think school is useful anymore, most teachers seem beat down by the system and entitled students so they don't try anymore, and I learned the same things as my parents 30 years later. I think the Career Center, my town had, would be the best educational option that could happen, K-8 be kind of the same with adjustments to it, but 9-12 be more doing then learning. Most kids anyways want to go work to make money and don't want to be there or advance classes are disregarded by colleges and you have to repeat their version of that class. 

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  • Lender · Comfort, TX · Member since 2017 · 38 posts · 33 votes
    3y

    As a previous public school teacher for 18 years, I can testify that public schools (at least in Texas) are headed in the wrong direction because of the emphasis on the state testing scores, especially in large school districts. I've told my own children multiple times that they must be prepared to homeschool or send their children to private schools. 

    As for college degrees, the degrees should be valued the same as real estate.  What's the Return on Investment? Think about it like this...some kids are going into debt at $100,000 for a 4- or 6-year degree that doesn't even guarantee them a job. I know several art and psychology majors who didn't use those degrees in there field of work or don't make much money to live on. Some of these degrees need to be strictly online, and cut the cost of all the fees associated with going to college (recreation center, parking passes, library pass, etc.) There are junior colleges that you could pay for in cash, and immediately be making money at the age of 20 for $50,000-$100,000 (air traffic controller, radiation therapist, dental hygienist, etc.)  Trade schools need to be emphasized. When I hire a plumber, a mechanic or an electrician, they are rarely under 45 years old, and many are into their 60's. 

    I guess all this to say, yes, education needs a major overhaul, and it's highly unlikely that it will be coming from our government officials.

  • Julie MarquezPro Member
    OP
    Investor · Skagit County, WA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 807 votes
    3y

    @Cliff Benner What a story about your counselor, and I'm glad that person had no ill effects on your success. Maybe even made you want to work harder! I think hands on trade schools are so useful, but not encouraged enough. I think people are realizing those advanced classes and high school curriculum don't equal success in life, and realizing that the system is not working. Kuddos for what you have made of yourself!

  • Julie MarquezPro Member
    OP
    Investor · Skagit County, WA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 807 votes
    3y

    @Kaci Hunter Great to hear from someone with teaching experience. It's sad to see the system not changing, and still focusing on tests and grades, when we all know AI and chatGPT will be able to do it all (I realize it's weakness, but it should be acknowledged for having influence). I think schools should be teaching self management, self governance, critical thinking, leading a community, and servant leadership, along with finding your passion. But I think you're right, the system is NOT going to be doing that for us. Have you heard of Acton Academy? They started in TX (Austin, of course), and I'd consider them innovative, radical, and effective. I wonder (with all your background), what you think of Acton. Schools also don't teach the critical thinking skills to evaluate ROI of higher education. If it makes sense, then go for it, but don't blindly lead every 18 year old into worthless debt.

  • Cliff BennerBusiness Member
    Accountant · Denver, CO · Member since 2020 · 392 posts · 183 votes
    3y
    Quote from @Julie Marquez:

    @Cliff Benner What a story about your counselor, and I'm glad that person had no ill effects on your success. Maybe even made you want to work harder! I think hands on trade schools are so useful, but not encouraged enough. I think people are realizing those advanced classes and high school curriculum don't equal success in life, and realizing that the system is not working. Kuddos for what you have made of yourself!


     My parents were very supportive and knew how school was, so they just told me "just keep your head low and you'll be out soon, those teachers and professors don't get to determine your future". My parents would call me out of school to tour the colleges around us, because the school wouldn't let me go. So they just did what they could to have me avoid the school's permission and did it ourselves. These are MT schools, in case anyone was wondering. My wife and I are trying to figure out something we can do that isn't public school, she had the same issues in ID, so we want to just avoid it and help our future kids be even more successful then us. We would push more for those trade skills then core curriculum, mainly because we think the world is going towards being successful and surviving means you have to have your own business or profitable side hustle. Plus I know Taxes/Bookkeeping so I can teach them that rather then teachers who never studied finance "teaching" finance.

    Thank you for asking this question!

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