The UAW wants to wreck the economy

Rental Property Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes

Is the auto industry big enough to create ripples in RE markets? If so, why? The UAW just escalated the "stand up" strike to 38 new locations. This includes everyone already striking. This affects thousand of UAW members and numerous part suppliers. I don't see the negotiations ending anytime soon.

Transitioning from ICE to EV requires sacrifice. I think disruption in the auto industry combined with other economic red flags could create big impacts on our economy.

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Bill B.

Investor · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 10k+ votes

I hope they get their wish and put those 3 companies out of business. That will sure teach the billionaires a lesson. You know, since none of them work for those companies or drive their products. There has not been a worse sector for investors, they should yank their money before it gets word.

May they follow in the steps of the union at yellow freight. When you call the company you work for evil or greedy while complaining that the best job you could get doesn’t pay enough. Remember it’s also evil and greedy to make more than teachers and only fat cats have defined pensions and all inclusive medical care. The last 2 UAW presidents being in prison and the government being required to monitor the union certain speaks to the quality of leadership. At least they’re being reasonable. A 50% pay increase while working 25% less hours in an industry that requires government subsidies to stay afloat and has competitors that already have lower costs I’m sure the last few employees will become very rich

May they get every thing they are asking for. Detroit was the richest city in the world before right? This is probably the path back to that

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Aaron BreckenridgePro Member
Technology · Dallas, TX · Member since 2022 · 496 posts · 314 votes
3y
Moved to "Off Topic" forum.
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Jaron WallingPro Member
OP
Rental Property Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
3y
Quote from @Aaron Breckenridge:

Moved to "Off Topic" forum.

Aaron, thank you. It's a hot topic in the mid west since a lot of the American auto companies build here.
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Aaron BreckenridgePro Member
Technology · Dallas, TX · Member since 2022 · 496 posts · 314 votes
3y
Rather than quoting the UAW for your topic title, it may help discourse to re-state that as a question specific to the impacts on the market.
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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
3y
IMHO, the UAW caves on their ridiculous demands after the workers go hungry for a while....
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Chris Martin
Investor · Willow Spring, NC · Member since 2009 · 5k+ posts · 3k+ votes
3y
Quote from @Jaron Walling:

Is the auto industry big enough to create ripples in RE markets? If so, why? The UAW just escalated the "stand up" strike to 38 new locations. This includes everyone already striking. This affects thousand of UAW members and numerous part suppliers. I don't see the negotiations ending anytime soon.

Transitioning from ICE to EV requires sacrifice. I think disruption in the auto industry combined with other economic red flags could create big impacts on our economy.
?

I think you have his quote wrong, from the UAW president interview several days ago (emphasis mine)

"UAW president Shawn Fain said “we’re not going to wreck the economy. The truth is we are going to wreck the billionaire economy.”

A week prior, Fain said in an interview:

“In the last four years, the price of cars went up 30%. [Automakers’] CEO pay went up 40%. No one said a word. No one had any complaints about that but God forbid the workers ask for their fair share,” he said. “It’s not [that] we’ll wreck the economy. We’ll wreck their economy, the economy that only works for the billionaire class and not the working class.”

The auto industry is certainly big enough to cause ripples in some economies. Nationally, I don't see a big impact on real estate short term, even with a longer strike. Remember, the foreclosure process takes a long time (years) so if people don't pay their mortgage next month, maybe by 2025 we'll see consequences. Bigger housing impacts, long term, IMO are things like our overall national demographics as well as obsolescence of some of our industries, like ICE auto.
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Bill B.
Investor · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 10k+ votes
3y
I hope they get their wish and put those 3 companies out of business. That will sure teach the billionaires a lesson. You know, since none of them work for those companies or drive their products. There has not been a worse sector for investors, they should yank their money before it gets word.
May they follow in the steps of the union at yellow freight. When you call the company you work for evil or greedy while complaining that the best job you could get doesn’t pay enough. Remember it’s also evil and greedy to make more than teachers and only fat cats have defined pensions and all inclusive medical care. The last 2 UAW presidents being in prison and the government being required to monitor the union certain speaks to the quality of leadership. At least they’re being reasonable. A 50% pay increase while working 25% less hours in an industry that requires government subsidies to stay afloat and has competitors that already have lower costs I’m sure the last few employees will become very rich
May they get every thing they are asking for. Detroit was the richest city in the world before right? This is probably the path back to that
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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
3y
Quote from @Bill B.:

I hope they get their wish and put those 3 companies out of business. That will sure teach the billionaires a lesson. You know, since none of them work for those companies or drive their products. There has not been a worse sector for investors, they should yank their money before it gets word.
May they follow in the steps of the union at yellow freight. When you call the company you work for evil or greedy while complaining that the best job you could get doesn’t pay enough. Remember it’s also evil and greedy to make more than teachers and only fat cats have defined pensions and all inclusive medical care. The last 2 UAW presidents being in prison and the government being required to monitor the union certain speaks to the quality of leadership. At least they’re being reasonable. A 50% pay increase while working 25% less hours in an industry that requires government subsidies to stay afloat and has competitors that already have lower costs I’m sure the last few employees will become very rich
May they get every thing they are asking for. Detroit was the richest city in the world before right? This is probably the path back to that

Bill, you are hilariously correct! If the UAW had any brains or cahones, they would insist on taking a 50% pay cut. That would have put them in line with reality and what they are really worth, LOL
But no, they are just crooked greedy b#$@ards.. and I mean top to bottom.
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Jaron WallingPro Member
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Rental Property Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
3y
@Bruce Woodruff We have friends that work in the factories and it's interesting what a normal day looks like. It mainly consists of pushing buttons on machines, driving folk lifts 2/8hr work shift, texting/SnapChat all day, napping, taking long lunches, and then repeating. Talked to my Dad about it yesterday. He retired (forced) from GM in 08' during the bailout. Some factories paid employees by the part. You had a daily quota. If you didn't the hit the numbers you didn't get the same pay.
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Michael SmytheBusiness Member
Real Estate Agent · Metro Detroit · Member since 2023 · 4k+ posts · 3k+ votes
3y
It's interesting the UAW hasn't said anything about the record profit sharing checks workers received...
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Jaron WallingPro Member
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Rental Property Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
3y
Quote from @Michael Smythe:

It's interesting the UAW hasn't said anything about the record profit sharing checks workers received...

Exactly. My friend just received a $12k profit sharing check which was $9k after taxes. He subtle brags about them every year. I don't know where all that money goes but it's not REI. People forget the two tier pay system was pushed for and implemented by the UAW. Fast forward to 2023 and they want it eliminated.

I'm confident workers will get better pay (which they deserve) but not everything else. Some of the demands make no sense in todays economy.
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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
3y
Quote from @Jaron Walling:

I'm confident workers will get better pay (which they deserve)
Why do they deserve 'better pay'? Are they currently making below average pay? Is their job putting together vehicles on an assembly line so incredibly difficult? Are they doing a a hazardous job to protect their fellow citizens like firefighters, police or military? Are they serving humanity by finding cures for fatal diseases?
The answers to all of the above is NO. So I have no idea why they would deserve 'better pay'. I must be missing something, please explain.

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Jaron WallingPro Member
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Rental Property Investor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2018 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes
3y
@Bruce Woodruff You mean to tell me $32 per hour + OT + profit sharing checks each isn't enough pay?? I'm leaning towards that's a lot of money.

I worked as a contractor for 2 years at Allison Transmission. It was for the EHS dept. so we worked on the factory floor everyday. The things I saw DID NOT equate to "we deserve a 40% raise". In fact it was quite the opposite. I worked with a union guy who got fired twice. I woke people up from naps on 3rd shift (sleeping bear). It's like it's on ecosystem. Only one person can do one a task. Two people stand around and watch. Being a contractor was a nightmare.
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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
3y
Quote from @Jaron Walling:

@Bruce Woodruff You mean to tell me $32 per hour + OT + profit sharing checks each isn't enough pay?? I'm leaning towards that's a lot of money.

You're misreading my post. I agree that they are being overpaid.
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Ron Brady
Rental Property Investor · Burlington County, NJ · Member since 2019 · 540 posts · 771 votes
3y
I always shake my head when millionaires, and those who aspire to be, come on the forums and lament when others seek to use their economic power to make money. I would not be a union member, but I'll let the UAW and the automakers figure it out.
Just my two cents!
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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
3y
Quote from @Ron Brady:

I always shake my head when millionaires, and those who aspire to be, come on the forums and lament when others seek to use their economic power to make money. I would not be a union member, but I'll let the UAW and the automakers figure it out.
Just my two cents!

I agree let them hash it out. But the millionaires that started, own and invest as stockholders in these companies...deserve to make what ever profit they can make. The worker bees have no skin in the game long term, all they gotta do is show up and do their job. Anything goes sideways, they can just walk away.
Just like any other business, including my employees in the past.....I started the business with my capital input, I took all the risks to keep it going every day 24/7/365, I often took no paycheck and worked 20 hour days for that priviledge. But they got the same paycheck every week, they could count on it. Then when I had a good year and raked in the bucks (lol) they still got the same paycheck, but plus a nice bonus. That seems fair and like it should work...they never complained and were welcome to go seek other employment if they weren't happy.
I just don't understand why people like the UAW expect otherwise.....?
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Ron Brady
Rental Property Investor · Burlington County, NJ · Member since 2019 · 540 posts · 771 votes
3y
@Bruce Woodruff
I respect your take. But both landlord rents and the threat to withhold collective labor are an expression of economic power.
We landlords set and raise rents based on what we think the market can bear. Laborers bargain based on what they think the market can bear.

Same difference to me. I see no reason that one is better, or worse, power to exercise.
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Bruce WoodruffPro Member
Contractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
3y
Quote from @Ron Brady:

@Bruce Woodruff
We landlords set and raise rents based on what we think the market can bear. Laborers bargain based on what they think the market can bear.

Same difference to me. I see no reason that one is better, or worse, power to exercise.
Yep, I agree 100%....! It's all about what the market will bear, and no one should be blamed for trying to get as much as they can. But I don't see the need for any pity toward the poor workers any more than I would for the poor landlords or poor stockholders.
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Ron Brady
Rental Property Investor · Burlington County, NJ · Member since 2019 · 540 posts · 771 votes
3y
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:

Quote from @Ron Brady:

@Bruce Woodruff
We landlords set and raise rents based on what we think the market can bear. Laborers bargain based on what they think the market can bear.

Same difference to me. I see no reason that one is better, or worse, power to exercise.
Yep, I agree 100%....! It's all about what the market will bear, and no one should be blamed for trying to get as much as they can. But I don't see the need for any pity toward the poor workers any more than I would for the poor landlords or poor stockholders.

Fair
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