but that isn't really the topic here. I read through this article and got to the end to see this:
In May, President Barack Obama signed into law a consumer credit card act that also restored the rights of people to carry loaded weapons in national parks.
lol! Now I knew about the Consumer Credit Card Act and I own both guns and credit cards but I fail to see how one has to do with the other. I was just floored. I'd never heard that before. But I thought I would show this as an example of how things get pushed through the system without the American people knowing about it. Hide it in with something really popular and run it through.
Real Estate Investor · Member since 2008 · 340 posts · 34 votes
17y
I have noticed throughout this thread that others are using other countries as examples to prove a point. But be careful. Most of the counties that have been mentioned are social democracies, or democracies using the parliamentary system.
America is truly unique, in that it is a Republic that was born out of the ashes of a revolution against tyranny. True Republics are rare in the history of the world. Because they contain strong executive branches, they lend themselves to evolving into dictatorships.
The founding fathers knew this. They assumed that at some point the people would have to turn against a federalist government if it became too powerful and tyrannical. Hence, why gun ownership is at the core of this country’s founding.
Guns, muskets and cannons gave us our freedom and they protect our freedom against enemies foreign and domestic.
Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
17y
Ok, this is hard for me as a gun owner and legal gun carrier and card carrying NRA member but I support the decision on this legislation. I don't like the idea of state's rights on carrying guns being put into the hands of the federal government. Federal law on transportation of firearms between states - ok. Federal law giving the federal government the power to enforce one state's laws on another state - very bad in principle. I know it is in the Bill of Rights and I know the interpretation is that it's an individual right and I know the Founding Father's intentions with it from reading the Federalist Papers....and I think it's states rights to regulate this within the property borders of the state. There's only 2 states that don't allow this right, Illinois and Wisconsin, and there's a whole lot of US elsewhere to live in....
Let the states work it out with each other in reciprocity.
As to why guns and credit cards go together? Well...like I say about my newly purchased Glock 30. "Don't leave home without it." :mrgreen:
Investor · Mableton, GA · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 465 votes
17y
As an ex-tank commander in the Israeli army who served and fought during the 1973 Yom Kippur war, I carried an Uzi for three years. I must admit that I hate those things and I never understood the American infatuation with guns. Furthermore, I could never understood some American citizens' paranoia of the American government.
..... But then came the Patriot act....
Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
17y
Originally posted by Eddie Ziv:
I must admit that I hate those things and I never understood the American infatuation with guns.
Honestly, it's our root. America wouldn't exist if it weren't for privately owned guns. The Declaration of Independence was just a piece of paper without the guns behind it. Plus we like it when in a time of war we hear that enemy generals say stuff like, "I'd never invade America. There would be a gun behind every blade of grass."
Investor · colorado springs, CO · Member since 2009 · 283 posts · 45 votes
17y
Originally posted by Tim Wieneke:
Plus we like it when in a time of war we hear that enemy generals say stuff like, "I'd never invade America. There would be a gun behind every blade of grass."
Replace the grass w/ sand, you'd have Irak or Afghanistan. And yet they've been invaded.
Real Estate Investor · ten mile, TN · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 374 votes
17y
Originally posted by Sorin T:
Originally posted by Tim Wieneke:
Plus we like it when in a time of war we hear that enemy generals say stuff like, "I'd never invade America. There would be a gun behind every blade of grass."
Replace the grass w/ sand, you'd have Irak or Afghanistan. And yet they've been invaded.
I wonder where he has been the past XXXX number of years. Maybe he just has not graduated yet as we can see how well he spells and remembers current events!
Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
17y
Originally posted by Sorin T:
Originally posted by Tim Wieneke:
Plus we like it when in a time of war we hear that enemy generals say stuff like, "I'd never invade America. There would be a gun behind every blade of grass."
Replace the grass w/ sand, you'd have Irak or Afghanistan. And yet they've been invaded.
I seem to recall our men and women whooping some major ***. Go home now.
Investor · colorado springs, CO · Member since 2009 · 283 posts · 45 votes
17y
Originally posted by Tim Wieneke:
Originally posted by Sorin T:
Originally posted by Tim Wieneke:
Plus we like it when in a time of war we hear that enemy generals say stuff like, "I'd never invade America. There would be a gun behind every blade of grass."
Replace the grass w/ sand, you'd have Irak or Afghanistan. And yet they've been invaded.
I seem to recall our men and women whooping some major ***. Go home now.
Relax Tim, I don't dispute that. My only point was that abundance of weapons in their countries did not keep them out of war, or being invaded. Which part of this you disagree with?
Investor · colorado springs, CO · Member since 2009 · 283 posts · 45 votes
17y
Originally posted by jawsette:
When was Iran invaded?
Since you picked on my spelling (please do share your wisdom and correct me for all our enlightenment ) can I pick on your reading/comprehending skills and challenge you to show me where did I mention Iran?
It's true, I might not have the same credibility as one claiming US is under global attack, but still ...
Investor · colorado springs, CO · Member since 2009 · 283 posts · 45 votes
17y
Originally posted by Tim Wieneke:
:roll: :roll: :roll:
What facts? And don't tell me what you believe or hope or feel. Tell me facts.
Just what I said above. That having plenty of weapons did not keep them out of war, and didn't prevent them being invaded. Unlike most countries in Europe for example, where the exact opposite is true.
Do I have your blessing to go home now, Tim? Why so jumpy tonight when I didn't attack any of your heroes?
Real Estate Investor · ten mile, TN · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 374 votes
17y
It was just an opportunity for you to correctly say which country you were speaking of when you mentioned "Irak". I could have been Iran or Iraq. Since the K on the keyboard is so much closer to the N than the Q it makes one think you were trying to say Iran.
And lets not forget that the principles in the statement of Tim's are the people's having the guns. This is not true of either situation you mentioned as it is only the STATE sanctioned peoples that are allowed to have guns. The regular people are not!
Thus the difference in the "generals" viewpoints of Tim's statement.
Investor · colorado springs, CO · Member since 2009 · 283 posts · 45 votes
17y
Originally posted by jawsette:
It was just an opportunity for you to correctly say which country you were speaking of when you mentioned "Irak". I could have been Iran or Iraq. Since the K on the keyboard is so much closer to the N than the Q it makes one think you were trying to say Iran.
And lets not forget that the principles in the statement of Tim's are the people's having the guns. This is not true of either situation you mentioned as it is only the STATE sanctioned peoples that are allowed to have guns. The regular people are not!
Thus the difference in the "generals" viewpoints of Tim's statement.
Your facts still do not pan out to be facts.
Nope, Irak, sorry. Next time don't jump to conclusions and insults. Some people spell it like that, it reads the same.
As far as regular people not allowed to have guns, I'd like to challenge that also. After the US supplied them weapons in the 80's (plus what Russians left behind) Afghanistan has probably more guns per capita than silverware. Somehow I doubt it's all registered to state sanctioned people. And yet they can't seem to stay out of wars. These are the facts that you decided to pan in or out, sorry.
But anyhow, nice twisting there, congrats. What's next after "state sanctioned peoples allowed to have guns"? Valid serial numbers on AK's?
Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
17y
Originally posted by Sorin T:
Some people spell it like that,
:roll:
Sorin,
There are over 200 Million firearms in private ownership in America by approximately 39-50% of the population. There are 300 Million people in the US. Every other person has a gun and those that have, have enough to arm 100 million other people. Where are your facts?
Beyond that, the quote was from General Yamomoto who was speaking of an occupying invasion by Japan into the US. That was NOT done by the us into Iraq or Afghanistan. Iraqis and Afghans fought alongside US forces and don't you freaking dare try to apply the words and philosophies of the Axis Powers to the US Military. You DO NOT disrespect our Military that way.
I am done with this portion of this discussion. The core discussion was going somewhere.
Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
17y
Originally posted by Karen Parker:
And the founding fathers were "distrustful of government as a source of tyranny".
Yeah - the centralized government. That's what's great about this country is that we can live in these "enclaves" of differing thought, policies and legislation. When it comes down to it, each state is almost like it's own country.
I did remember something though when I got my Indiana license to carry (I got a lifetime license - good for life). I did have to get cleared through the FBI for it. Maybe there is some reasoning that since you already need a sort of federal approval, perhaps you should be given federalized rights and privileges?
I did find it interesting that this legislation was only narrowly defeated today.
Investor · colorado springs, CO · Member since 2009 · 283 posts · 45 votes
17y
Tim, again, I was not looking for controversy or to contradict you. Just that as interesting trivia, I don't think that countries with lots of guns per capita keep out of war, or being invaded, on the contrary, and I supplied as example Irak (old name for Iraq) and Afghanistan, as opposed to most of Europe. Again, as trivia, not any sort of political statement. Can you understand and accept that without sending me home or accusing me of not believing half the stuff I say? If that were coming from me directed to you it would be a personal attack probably, right? Can you man up and accept this for what it is - just trivia?
P.S. "don't you freaking dare"... you big Constitution guy, support 1st Amendment, I wonder? And beyond that can you comprehend it was purely a trivia statement with no intent to offend anyone dead or alive? Jeez, lighten up and relax, will you? This is not Waco...
Real Estate Investor · ten mile, TN · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 374 votes
17y
Actually trivia is based in truth, not the phonetic spelling. The country of Iraq has never been known by the name of Irak even since its founding in 1932.
Here is the trivia information for you to correct your facts with. You will notice its old name before the country came into existance was still iraq.
Historically, Iraq was known in Europe by the Greek exonym 'Mesopotamia' (Land between the rivers); after the foundation of the Kingdom of Iraq in 1932, it became known by its ancient endonym 'Iraq'. Iraq has been home to continuous successive civilizations since the 6th millennium BC. The region between the Tigris and Euphrates rivers is identified as the cradle of civilization and the birthplace of writing and the wheel. Throughout its long history, Iraq has been the center of the Akkadian, Assyrian, Babylonian, and Abbasid empires, and part of the Achaemenid, Macedonian, Parthian, Sassanid, Roman, Rashidun, Umayyad, Mongol, Ottoman and British empires.[4][5]
Real Estate Investor · OH · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
17y
In no small part, thanks to the idiot Voinovich and his no vote. I really wish he'd move to California where he could be with the rest of his socialist buddies. We certainly don't want him in Ohio!
Investor · Mableton, GA · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 465 votes
17y
Originally posted by MikeOH:
In no small part, thanks to the idiot Voinovich and his no vote. I really wish he'd move to California where he could be with the rest of his socialist buddies. We certainly don't want him in Ohio!
Mike
Mike, what is that you have against California? I think Orange County as a whole would really take to heart being accused of being socialists. Believe me, if we were bunch of socialists, we wouldn't have the budget crisis in Sacramento, we would have agreed to simply raise taxes. We have one of the lowest property taxes in America thanks to proposition 13. In a matter of fact, if my house was located in Texas and worth as much as it is now, I would have paid three time as much as I do now.
To the issue at heart, IMO, the 2nd amendment is over rated. It should be changed form "The right to bare arms" to "The privilege to bare arms". Just like driver's license.
This is the biggest problem. Once you have a right, no one, regardless of any circumstances can deny you that right, but if it was a privilege then you couldn't posses any firearms if you were a nut case.
Attorney · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2008 · 4k+ posts · 1k+ votes
17y
Originally posted by Eddie Ziv:
To the issue at heart, IMO, the 2nd amendment is over rated. It should be changed form "The right to bare arms" to "The privilege to bare arms". Just like driver's license.
You're allowed to have an opinion because someone used a gun to secure that freedom for you.