Real Estate Investor · brighton, MI · Member since 2009 · 56 posts · 12 votes
Should we refom health care? Do we leave thing the way they are? Do we pay $800 co-pay per month and then bail out banks? Are we listening to our president or do we disagree just to disagree? Please share how you feel.
"...When there was a fire, all private insurance companies would send their fire crews to see if it was their customer and those that were other companies fire crews would have to get out of the way of the company who was the fire crew for that customer..."
Well, thanks for the history lesson. Actually, in some towns if you hadn't paid a seperate "fire tax" they wouldn't show up at all. In any event, you can continue to hold on to your ideological trappings while the system burns (sorry, couldn't help myself) or, you can join the rest of the civilized world in the 21st century in acknowledging that government involvment is REQUIRED in making health care benefits available to most of us. The notion that you can leave the care of the sick in the hands of for profit health care insurance companies is just, well, nuts. It's a bit like the Medieval notion that the world was flat. You can say it, you can believe it, you can pray that it is so, but the Earth will still NOT be flat.
I confess, I like most services I get from my government. They're not perfect, but who is? I took a shower this morning and made my coffee with water treated by the government and piped to my front door. I didn't worry about drinking it either. I flushed the toilet and they are processing that, as we work. Here in Chicago where I live, if I get sick the city will send an ambulance and EMT's to take me to the hospital (and they have). If the house is on fire, they'll send firefighters. If one of our local freaks tries to break in, the police will come and not inquire as to my home owner's insurance. At the federal level, our soldiers, sailors and Marines are protecting me and, I think, do a pretty good job for a bunch of federal employees. I know most conservatives might think they'd be better off with a .45 and a posse, but I like the military.
So, do nothing, hold on to your values. It won't belong before the system totally implodes. Then the politicians of both parties can all look around and wonder what happened. Naturally, one will blame the other, but there'll be plenty of blame to go around. In the meantime, they'll continue to enjoy tax payer funded government health care. Why America is afraid of tackling this issue is both sad and disconcerting. But, in the near term this will all come home to roost.
Should go in the political forum, but we need to make it clear that this is not about health "care" reform. It is about health care "insurance" reform. It's not about the care, it's about the money.
Should go in the political forum, but we need to make it clear that this is not about health "care" reform. It is about health care "insurance" reform. It's not about the care, it's about the money.
Wow, Tim. I would never believe that I could agree with you on that issue. There is a new documentary (From the maker of "Enron - The smartest man in the room" ) called "Money Driven Medicine" that documents the exact issue.
For a little taste go to ABC Nightline site
http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/
and click on "Health Care Sound and Fury"
I agree its about money. Do you agree that only the rich can afford health insurance today? Do you agree that it adds to unemployment by driving big and small business owners out of the country or out of business?
We waste 1.2 Trillion dollars a year managing preventable diseases (CNN yesterday). From heart disease, to diabetes and through many kinds of cancer. If we only invested in prevention and follow through we could have saved that money. The problem is that prevention is bad for the medical industry. Eating well is bad for the Food, Inc business, and we are too lazy or too "busy" to exercise.
This health care plan is an abomination to what we stand for as a country. Obama should be smacked across the face really really hard for even coming up with such an insidious and ridiculous plan.
I wish people who voted for him and those who support him realize that they have a foot in mouth disease and finally realize just how bad this guy is and will get.
Obama's health care hahahahahahaha what a @#$@#$ joke :roll:
There you go disagree just to disagree. If Bush would have had the same plan and people spoke out against it they have been labled, un-american,communist, traders, oh yeah and against the troops.
Thanks Eddie I have noticed on this issue when facts and numbers are mention, they are in support of reform. When not they say something that has nothing to do with it.
There you go disagree just to disagree. If Bush would have had the same plan and people spoke out against it they have been labled, un-american,communist, traders, oh yeah and against the troops.
Oh give me a break I disagree with this policy because it's a joke not because I want to disagree. If Bush,Clinton or any past president had the same policy I would have said the same thing.
Some people need a reality check to see what's going on in this country. Take the veil off people for crying out loud :roll:
Tim that is ok for one person what about a family of 4? With a house note, car note, insurance, gas, utlities,food. Also if a business pays $200 a month per person times 50 how much can they save?
You want my opinion Lawrence all of us and I mean ALL OF US should speak out against policies like this.
All of us should get together and speak out .
But how many of us would do that? How many would go the extra length and shout out what we think should be done?
There are two separate issues here: 1) health care reform, and 2) the current health care reform bill.
I'm definitely in the camp of "we need health care reform." I'm also in the camp of "the current bill is pretty bad."
As for why I think we need health care reform...health insurance companies shouldn't be making decisions on who lives and who dies (and of course, neither should government bureaucrats) -- only the doctors and the patients themselves should do that.
Unfortunately, that's not the way it works today:
- People like Sarah Palin are complaining that the current bill advocates "death panels." While this is clearly wrong (either she didn't read the bill or is just making things up), our current health care system already has something analogous to death panels -- the group of people at insurance companies who can overrule a doctor's recommendation on how to treat patients by choosing not to pay; they thereby condemn a patient to death by not paying for recommended treatments (presumably to save money for the company);
- About half of all people who are in biggest need (in terms of $$$) from their insurance companies get dropped by the companies due to technicalities. This means that if you run up huge insurance costs for your treatment, there is pretty much a 50% chance you're insurance company will figure out a way to drop you.
I'm all for a system where everyone is provided with at least a minimum standard for care, with people (like me) having the right to choose and pay for private care anytime I want.
This is the way it works for lots of stuff in this country (civil defense, municipal utilities, public transportation, broadcast TV, etc); I don't see people complaining that local police forces providing a standard of security are a socialistic concept...why is health care any different?
YES! We need health care reform. As Obama likes to say, we need change.
Here are the changes I propose:
1. Make it perfectly clear that people do not have a RIGHT to healthcare, food, housing, cell phones, automobiles, big screen tvs, or anything else they're not willing to work to earn.
2,. Immediately reform our tort system. In fact, if we're going to include euthanasia in the health care bill, I recommend starting by euthanizing the low-life scumbag trial lawyers! That's what I call killing two birds with one stone!
3. Get the government COMPLETELY out of healthcare.
4. Get the government out of the insurance regulation business. Allow the free market to operate!
5. Get all the socialists treatment for their mental health problems! A little time in a 'camp' might do them some good!
Tim that is ok for one person what about a family of 4? With a house note, car note, insurance, gas, utlities,food.
If you've got a mortgage and a car loan how is it you can't afford health insurance? If you are carrying a house and vehicle debt that makes health insurance cost prohibitive, maybe you should be re-examining your priorities.
If you work a 40 hour per week job for x amount of $ and the price of health care goes up where do you get the $ from? Do you got and tell the family we aren't eating tonight health care went up. Do you tell your boss I could not afford gas to go to work health care went up again. For most americans its about what you need the most.
Yes, so how about a little tort reform in this bill? One big reason insurance costs keep going up and up is because the doctors have to cover themselves for malpractice suits. I'm with MikeOH. Euthanize the trial lawyers and problem solved!
Well, NOT FROM ME!!! It's YOUR responsibility to pay for YOUR insurance. It's not my responsibility to pay it for you. You made the choice to have a payment on your car and your house. If you don't have money left over for healthcare - that's YOUR choice!
Make it perfectly clear that people do not have a RIGHT to healthcare, food, housing, cell phones, automobiles, big screen tvs, or anything else they're not willing to work to earn.
I agree on all but health care, I think it is inhumane reject someone help for any reason. No job, laid off, lazy, ignorant. What do you tell old people, I cant help you, you didnt work for it.