Connections in Montana

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Connections in Montana

Shaun Moore
Investor · Helena, MT · Member since 2015 · 37 posts · 12 votes

Wondering if anyone else from Montana is active on here! Who are you? Where are you from? I noticed this forum had no posts so I wanted to start one.

I'm looking for some connections and always like "local" people, or someone who knows Montana.

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Alissa Engel
Great Falls, MT · Member since 2017 · 97 posts · 172 votes
7y

Some history and perspective from a 3rd generation Montanan, and someone who has been investing here for 18 years:

There are a few markets (Bozeman, the Flathead Valley, and Missoula) that are volatile. I bought a condo in Bozeman in 2007 for 164K .  It seemed like a steal, because I'd spent the previous five years in So Cal with the military.  I did not do my homework, and compared to LA prices, that condo seemed affordable.  If this isn't obvious...I am warning people coming into the Montana markets from more expensive states or states with better job markets.  Montana is it's own beast.  By 2008, that condo value tanked to 115K.   I graduated from my Masters program at MSU in 2009, and had to leave Bozeman due to the dismal job market.  I could get a job, but positions in Bozeman were paying half of what the exact same job was paying in Great Falls. Why?  Bozeman is awesome and many people are willing to work for min wage WITH a graduate degree just to stay there.  Bozeman overbuilt so badly, that rents also decreased sharply and rapidly.  I was able to rent that condo for $1300 when I bought and $800 when I left two years later.  I broke even ONLY because I put down 20%.

I broke even for 8 years (when I was making more than the 1% rule in more stable markets)!  Fast forward to the present....in the past 2-3 years, the value of this condo shot up to 235K!  It has well-surpassed the pre-recession value.  I currently rent that condo for $1450.  The wages in Bozeman are NOT equivalent to the cost of housing and living.  There's a reason us natives call it Bozangeles.

I am 1031 exchanging this condo for two properties (a tri-plex and a duplex) in Great Falls in the spring. People who don't understand Montana and the history think I'm crazy.  They think Bozeman will continue to appreciate. In my opinion, the markets in these areas are not sustainable, and they will take the biggest "hits" when the market corrects.  Only invest here if you can afford to ride out a market correction for the next 10 years.  Seriously.

I am an advocate for more stable Montana markets.  They aren't as "trendy" but they are where the money is at.  It will be very difficult to make the 1% rule in Bozeman, Missoula, or the Flathead Valley, but it is obtainable in other Montana markets.  During the last recession, values in Great Falls "dipped" a little.  My rents decreased by $50 a month.  Also, the values and rents recovered much more quickly.  

Remember, a good rule of thumb is: "The best predictor of future behaviors is past behavior".  

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  • Patrick McGowen
    Investor · Belgrade, MT · Member since 2013 · 135 posts · 32 votes
    10y

    Hey Shaun,

    There are a few Montana folks on here, seems like a year ago I could count the BP membership (active at least) for the entire state on my fingers, but more active members every day.  There is a group of us in Bozeman that get together twice a month to discuss real estate and sometimes play cashflow game.  If you are ever in Bozeman on a Thursday evening, search meetup dot com for Bozeman cashflow club.  If you are in Bozeman at any other time, I am always up for a cup o jo and a visit with a fellow real estate investor.  

    Cheers.  

    0Reply
  • Shaun Moore
    OP
    Investor · Helena, MT · Member since 2015 · 37 posts · 12 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Patrick McGowen:

    Hey Shaun,

    There are a few Montana folks on here, seems like a year ago I could count the BP membership (active at least) for the entire state on my fingers, but more active members every day.  There is a group of us in Bozeman that get together twice a month to discuss real estate and sometimes play cashflow game.  If you are ever in Bozeman on a Thursday evening, search meetup dot com for Bozeman cashflow club.  If you are in Bozeman at any other time, I am always up for a cup o jo and a visit with a fellow real estate investor.  

    Cheers.  

    Thanks Patrick! That's great to hear. Bozeman isn't that for MT standards. I would love to meet up sometime. Thanks for connecting on here!

    1Reply
  • Joshua D.
    Investor · Columbus, MT · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    @Shaun Moore 

    I am on this site trolling almost everyday... Great reading before bed and in the morning. 

    I am in between Billings and Bozeman and love to connect with others as well. I would love to know more about the Helena market as well. 

    This might be an old but....  I always wanted to start a hand-basket company up there, so it could be called "Helena hand-basket Co"

    2Reply
  • Shaun Moore
    OP
    Investor · Helena, MT · Member since 2015 · 37 posts · 12 votes
    10y

    @Joshua Daniels, after an incredibly busy summer, we're starting to see a little bit of a slowdown in Helena. Multi-family investment property has been crazy (prices and transactions) but with the addition of a new 240 unit complex coming in, that could change.

    If anyone ever gets this way, I would buy you a cup of coffee and visit for a while!

    0Reply
  • Joshua D.
    Investor · Columbus, MT · Member since 2013 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    10y

    @Shaun Moore  sounds great! Next time I'm up there I will connect.

    0Reply
  • Sharon Virgin
    Great Falls, MT · Member since 2015 · 3 posts · 2 votes
    10y

    Hi there I am active in Great Falls Real Estate market and have been for the past 19 years.  Great Falls market is very stable and appears to be continuing on the same path.  Let me know if you have any questions on the Great Falls and surrounding areas!

    0Reply
  • Peter Dascoulias IIPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Great Falls, MT · Member since 2014 · 45 posts · 26 votes
    10y

    There is a group of us that try to meet on a monthly basis up here in Great Falls.  We usually just sit around and have a few beers and talk about deals from the past or our intentions for the future.  Our Landlord Association's up here have a tendency to be pretty structured, so we try to have a little more fun outside of the Landlord meetings.

    As Patrick said; there are more and more locals popping up everyday on the Forums!

    0Reply
  • Jim P.
    Boise, ID · Member since 2013 · 45 posts · 18 votes
    10y

    Nice!  Haven't heard it yet!  But definitely like it.

    To all:  I'm up there often, but usually running around crazy-like.  If I'm around Bozeman/Helenahand-basket/Great Falls, etc... I'll reach out then...

    Jimmy

    0Reply
  • Shelli CallanBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker · Kalispell, MT · Member since 2013 · 67 posts · 20 votes
    10y

    I am in the Glacier National Park corner of the state over here in Kalispell!  Love Bigger Pockets!  From Great Falls, to Helena, to Bozeman and Kalispell if we were in another part of the country we would all be in different sates! 

    [email protected]406-212-9081
    Shelli Callan with ADT Realty Campfire Realty Group
    WebsiteView Page
    1Reply
  • Peter Dascoulias IIPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Great Falls, MT · Member since 2014 · 45 posts · 26 votes
    10y

    You're right Shelli!  I'm originally from New England and it amazes me how big Montana is compared to our states.

    0Reply
  • Brad B.
    Investor · Bakersfield, CA · Member since 2013 · 146 posts · 93 votes
    10y

    I have family in Ronan / Polson area so I'm up there several times a year. Anyone working in that area?

    0Reply
  • Shelli CallanBusiness Member
    Real Estate Broker · Kalispell, MT · Member since 2013 · 67 posts · 20 votes
    10y

    I am just up the road from Polson. Polson is in my MLS so I watch what is going on there. Would love to do a deal there!

    [email protected]406-212-9081
    Shelli Callan with ADT Realty Campfire Realty Group
    WebsiteView Page
    0Reply
  • Alan Brown
    Rental Property Investor · NY MA CT VT MT, MO · Member since 2015 · 200 posts · 116 votes
    10y

    Wow!  this is fantastic!  I am definitely IN if you need help with the Helena handbasket co!  Genius!

    Excited to hear about the meetup in Bozeman.. didn't know there was one.  

    I love the Flathead Valley and make it a point to float the lower Flathead river every year... would love to find some deals over there, so Shelli it sounds like you're the person to see!  

    Good to hear from you all and I look forward to meeting you sometime.

    0Reply
  • Shaun Moore
    OP
    Investor · Helena, MT · Member since 2015 · 37 posts · 12 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Shelli Callan:

    I am just up the road from Polson. Polson is in my MLS so I watch what is going on there. Would love to do a deal there!

    Hi Shelli,

    I have an aunt in Polson who is also an appraiser. I would love to know more about the market. I understand rentals are in pretty high demand.

    0Reply
  • George N.
    Investor · Great Falls, MT · Member since 2014 · 163 posts · 132 votes
    10y

    Also up here in MT. Living in Great Falls but invested in Bozeman/Livingston.

    @Patrick McGowenshoot me a txt to remind me next time you guys get together in Bozeman. I'm down there once a week for anywhere from a day to the better part of the week so there's a good chance I'll be around.

    0Reply
  • George N.
    Investor · Great Falls, MT · Member since 2014 · 163 posts · 132 votes
    10y

    @Shaun Moore @Alan Brown good to see other active investors in the "neighborhood." Look forward to chatting with both of you. Awesome to see a MT thread spark up and get active!

    0Reply
  • Patrick McGowen
    Investor · Belgrade, MT · Member since 2013 · 135 posts · 32 votes
    10y

    @Brad B. I have some stuff going in Plains, MT which is kind of Polson adjacent?

    @George N. Will do, I have taken to doing a newsletter to keep the group more connected, particularly for those that are only occasional attenders, join the meetup group.  

    @Alan 

    @Alan Brownundefined  Consider joining us next Thursday, we would really value your experience and enthusiasm.  

    Love this thread. REI Montana Mafia is gaining momentum!

    0Reply
  • Alan Brown
    Rental Property Investor · NY MA CT VT MT, MO · Member since 2015 · 200 posts · 116 votes
    10y

    Excellent! I just came back east yesterday, in my back and forth slow transition back to MT, so it might be a little while before I'm back out there. please keep me on a REI newsletter if you would, so that I can meet up when I am in town.

    thanks!

    0Reply
  • Mark Caiazza
    Rental Property Investor · Centerton, AR · Member since 2014 · 54 posts · 28 votes
    10y

    Hi all! I'm another Great Falls regular and would love to see some more faces at the landlord meet-ups (2nd Tuesday) or even start a new one with BP members.

    @Patrick McGowen I think the newsletter is a great idea for keeping us MT folks connected and informed about the local areas. I've been interested in trying out the cash flow game, just never got around to it. I may need to sneak down to Bozeman one of these days. Maybe our Great Falls crew (@Peter Dascoulias II, @George N.) will take a field trip

    @Shaun Moore thanks for starting the thread and getting us all connected!

    0Reply
  • Evans WrightPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2014 · 101 posts · 92 votes
    10y

    @Shaun Moore Hey I am also another investor in Great Falls. Always looking to meet up and share experiences with other BP members or randomly run into them at Home Depot lol @George N..

    0Reply
  • Bryan C.
    Investor · Spokane, WA · Member since 2014 · 733 posts · 155 votes
    10y

    @Evans Wright, what kind of investments in Great Falls do you do?  What is your exit `strategy?  Rentals, flips, wholesale?

    0Reply
  • Evans WrightPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · Charlotte, NC · Member since 2014 · 101 posts · 92 votes
    10y

    @Bryan C. I invest in multifamilies. I have a 4plex and just went under contract for a duplex :) My strategy is to acquire multifamily housing for solid passive income, so I have been house hacking and living in one of the units to get in with low down payments. Once I develop a solid core of passive income I will begin flipping SFH. As far as exit strategy goes worst comes to worst I will sell but since they are multifamies and this towns rental market is strong I am not too worried about it but always good to have a plan B & C. What about you? Feel free to PM me as well.

    0Reply
  • Patrick McGowen
    Investor · Belgrade, MT · Member since 2013 · 135 posts · 32 votes
    10y

    @Mark Caiazza @Alan Brown @George N. and others;

    In regards to the Bozeman area REI newsletter I have been doing, I don't want to put it up on BP or other searchable online area. Then I don't have to worry as much about putting personal info about members, then members are more willing to share their successes and failures with a more intimate group of locals. If you want to be on my mailing list best to join the meetup group. I am willing to try and keep a separate email list of Montana folks that want newsletter but don't want to join the meetup, pm me your email if you want.

    0Reply
  • Bryan C.
    Investor · Spokane, WA · Member since 2014 · 733 posts · 155 votes
    10y

    @Evans Wright, we currently own a 4plex & SFR in Great Falls MT....owned it since 2010. I like the rental market also because it is strong but find it more difficult to find deals. For now I havent added anything in my portfolio from there since we PCS'd away but my wife is from there & we might return at some point.

    0Reply
  • BG Stumberg
    Investor · Helena, MT · Member since 2015 · 6 posts · 3 votes
    10y

    Hi all from Montana.n I am new to bigger pockets and it looks like a great group of people. I have been wanting to connect with some other investors in the area it seems almost impossible to get together. Shaun if I read this right you are from Helena and I would love to have a cup of coffee with you sometime. Patrick you welcomed me in and I would love to get together with you sometime if you're in the Helena area. Maybe we could all start an investor REI group here. I hope this thread of Montana investors continues.

    1Reply
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