What’s the deal with Ohio?
Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2020 · 61 posts · 56 votes
What’s the deal with Ohio?
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Remington LymanBusiness Member
Real Estate Agent · Columbus, OH · Member since 2017 · 6k+ posts · 7k+ votesOriginally posted by @Joe S.:
I see so many people promoting Ohio I almost wonder if it’s being oversold. I kind of wondered about that myself because they have a higher number of realtors promoting their services than it seems any other state.
164 Replies
- New to Real Estate · Dalton, NH · Member since 2020 · 116 posts · 64 votes5y
I know that for us in northern New Hampshire, Ohio is big on our radar. We have had a massive influx of tech companies over the last few years. Add covid and people fleeing the cities for more rural areas and our market is nuclear. The market didn't have much for inventory before those two events. Add onto that the limited talent to work on property, with some contractors backed up by up to two years and investors start looking for where else they can do business.
- Rental Property Investor · Brooke Park Drive · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes5y
Originally posted by @Sitaram Koppaka:
Very interesting discussion. I am an investor in Columbus for last few years and I own quite a few multi family units. The market is extremely hot here. I am trying hard to invest but properties are very high priced. I think market is just arbitrarily inflated. I saw 6 properties last week and planned to make offer on 2 for sure. They were gone the next morning. So, be careful on what you buy. I read a lot of real estate stuff, so I wouldn't go into why all this happening but do due diligence before invest.
Typically I have stayed away from Cleveland and Toledo but I am actively looking at Dayton and Cincinnati.
@Brianne Leichliter I will take your offer to get connected to know more about Cin, I can share my inputs about CMH. This is interesting and valuable discussion about OH for sure.
- Real Estate Agent · Burlington, KY · Member since 2018 · 207 posts · 232 votes5y
@Reece Iovine Same here for me. I rented a 2 bed/1 bath unit in Northern Kentucky starting the beginning of December and had no issues at all. Didn't lose a days of rent and had TON of inquiries on the property. People are hungry for quality and affordable places to live.
- Investor · Marin County California · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes5y
@Christopher Smith I have a long history in Ohio going back to 1983. Happy to proven wrong but I would need to see some numbers to believe there has been some "red hot" growth any where in the Toledo to Dayton/Cincinnati corridor over the past 20 years.
- Member since 2020 · 7 posts · 2 votes5y
@Brianne Leichliter
I'm interested in investing in Ohio. I wouldn't mind hear more about Ohio and getting your feed back.
- Specialist · Toronto, Ontario · Member since 2012 · 2k+ posts · 891 votes5y
@Mike Mocek
I went to Toledo years ago.. I didn't really plan a trip just passed through to grab a quick bite and gas.. I did happen to drive through a few neighborhoods and unfortunately it happen to be a run down D-Class area..
I dont want to be quick to judge as I am sure there are much better areas..
Are large companies moving into town to set up shop to create jobs?
- Real Estate Agent · Sacramento, CA · Member since 2014 · 8 posts · 7 votes5y
I have five years of recent multifamily experience in the East Side of Cleveland (Cleveland Heights and Shaker Heights). Cleveland is really a tapestry of smaller sub-municipalities: Beachwood, Shaker Heights, Cleveland Heights, Ohio City, Lakewood, etc. Each municipality has its own property tax rate (and income tax!) and they net high. This is one of the drivers for lower asset prices. Most buildings are between 100 and 60 years old, maintenance is always ongoing, and owners usually pay for heat with a central system. Overall population growth in Cleveland has been flat. Besides city and federal employment, hospitals are the largest employers (Cleveland Clinic is largest and growing!). In class B, rents have stayed relatively flat, maybe keeping pace with inflation. Asset prices have been increasing. Many of the municipalities have been committed to reinvestment, and those investments have been paying off.
If you are thinking of moving there, quality of life is great. Happy searching!
- Real Estate Consultant · Cleveland · Member since 2020 · 6k+ posts · 3k+ votes5y
@Nathan Fisher yep those days are over, though I do get them and keep them for myself, however no longer provide that net cap
- Rental Property Investor · Columbus, OH · Member since 2020 · 15 posts · 13 votes5y
@Cameron McNulty. I'm a small time investor. I can tell you what I've bought over the past 8 years. My 1st rental I bought 8 years ago. I paid 64k for a SFH, 3 bed, 1 bath. I recently had it appraised at 155k. This property over 8 yrs had paid-off 1 3/4 times via rent. As you can see I could sell and make 2.5 times what I paid for it. My 2nd rental I paid 117k (3 yrs ago). It is valued at 165k. I charge $1200 a month for both properties. I'm a buy n hold investor. Job opportunity in Columbus is descent. Home prices are high right now. But I just keep looking and keep the money in the bank. Patience is the key. If the numbers makes since I'm more then willing to lay down the cash. Hope that helps.
- Investor · brentwood, CA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 730 votes5y
Originally posted by @Darius Ogloza:
@Christopher Smith I have a long history in Ohio going back to 1983. Happy to proven wrong but I would need to see some numbers to believe there has been some "red hot" growth any where in the Toledo to Dayton/Cincinnati corridor over the past 20 years.
You're certainly free to do the research on your own if you really want numbers on that patch of ground, I really don't need them because I live it every day.
In fact my current PM on the ground says there is so much Red Hot growth, that there really isn't much room left to even build anymore. I get multiple calls and letters every week from begging realtors, flippers and investors to sell all of my properties and have had for years. It actually gets quite annoying at times, but it does at least let me know that demand in that area never really abates from a fever pitch even during the downturns.
Just as background I lived in Springboro starting in 88 and bought my first property based upon a work colleague who recommended the area because it was one of the fastest growing spots in the state, and had been on and off for a few years even at that time. Nothing has really changed during that entire period up until the present date.
One of the better moves I've made was not selling my Springboro stuff when I moved permanently to CA, but rather actually buying more from a distance through my local team on the ground. Maybe it was mostly dumb luck on hitting that relatively small vein of gold in a state where there are certainly large stretch's of somewhat stunted growth, but hey I'll take it.
My OH properties have also been a great portfolio complement to my CA East Bay holdings that I picked up in the 2010 to 2013 time frame. The elevated OH cash flows allow me to tolerate more modest cash flows on my Bay Area properties that have nearly tripled in value over the last ten years.
I even very seriously considered buying in Columbus just a couple of years ago since it's not too far from Springboro and I felt it would get hot too, but my local OH PM didn't cover that area and it's somewhat difficult from a distance to build an entirely new team. Also worked in downtown Columbus in the late 90s until I pulled up stakes and moved to San Jose from the Columbus subarb of Hillard in 2002 so I knew the area reasonably well.
- Property Manager / Licensed Realtor · Toledo/Columbus, OH · Member since 2019 · 244 posts · 262 votes5y
Hey @Hai Loc, Amazon is getting ready to open up their second distribution center in the area within the next month. We also have Jeep, Libey Glass (Next time you go out to eat look at the bottom of the glass for the "Libbey" stamp), and obviously we have Owens Corning and Promedica and Mercy health systems.
I am sorry that was your first impression, if you are ever in the area I will give you a tour (or just want to chat about Toledo) lets hop on a call and discuss the area. - Member since 2020 · 10 posts · 10 votes5y
Cashflow is the main goal right now, and out of state (I'm in CA) investing in Dayton is more affordable and with now with 3 apartment buildings or 15 doors, I'm halfway to my 1st goal (everchanging). I'd wouldn't mind investing in different parts of Ohio.
- Member since 2020 · 437 posts · 675 votes5y
@Cameron McNulty
It’s affordable. Most entry level investors will be able to play in the Ohio market and make a buck. The whole “cash flow” paradigm is easier to reach. As you move into other states the bar gets higher and hence the backlash for more expensive markets.
- 5yOzzy SmithPro MemberSpecialist · Dayton, OH · Member since 2014 · 352 posts · 265 votes
I'll throw my $.02 in on the Dayton market. I'm not originally from OH but have been here for 17 years now and only stay bc of the RE. Like @Andrew Weiner said, it's more about strategy and plan than market. I've had cheap houses in lower class areas and done very well and higher class assets that I got crushed on and visa versa. RE investing is everchanging based on local market conditions and the goals of the individual investor. Myself personally don't invest now in the same neighborhoods and asset class as I did 3 years ago. I'm further along the path now and have more knowledge, bigger goals, and resources than I did before. That doesn't mean my previous investments were bad it just means they are different.
That being said, Dayton in particular for me, offers many opportunities. Some of the benefits are affordability for the new investor who wants great cashflow to get out of the rat race, is small enough to not be on the national radar per say, which lessons competition (where I started), and is still big enough to scale (where I am now). I could not have done this in bigger markets because I wouldn't have been able to afford to get started. We do have many areas that are appreciating nicely so as your strategy and financial situation changes we have the ability locally to adapt and still be much more affordable than the big cities.
I hear all the time about our population and job growth being flat - that's true but there's a reason. Traditionally we have been a very blue collar city and as those jobs decrease and that generation of worker dies off we are seeing tremendous growth in the Tech industry which is bringing in more high paying jobs. When looking at the numbers from a distance you think nothing is happening but I believe that it's overall improving. As more and more NEW jobs and younger workers come in I forecast that in the near future you will start to see what many others already know.... ACTUALLY I HOPE MANY OTHERS NEVER SEE IT - MORE FOR ME LOL!
- 5yJennifer PetrilloPro MemberInvestor · Asbury, NJ · Member since 2015 · 226 posts · 205 votes
Getting lots of PMs about where in Ohio I invest--here is the wholesaler I use: Kara_sells_cle at gmail to get on her mailing list
- Real Estate Broker · San Diego, CA · Member since 2016 · 187 posts · 117 votes5y
I was in Columbus with my partner in September of 20. He bought a flip and I went to check it out. There are a lot of opportunities in Ohio. I will partner with him on the next one in Columbus!
- Rental Property Investor · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2020 · 62 posts · 64 votes5y
@Cameron McNulty Stability, Cash Flow, and a fairly good tenant pool are reasons I like investing in the Cincinnati and surrounding sub-markets. I'm mainly focusing on Buy and Hold in B-/C+ areas and demand is there for quality housing. I had 97 inquiries on my last SFR listing at market rent in 1 week. As others previously stated on this thread, ease of access throughout the Tri-state area by car and CVG paired with larger companies like Amazon, P&G, Kroger, etc. make it an attractive area for RE investment.
- Investor · Ann Arbor, MI · Member since 2013 · 178 posts · 225 votes5y
I invest in Toledo, OH, I manage 1,500 apartments in the City, the properties require more aggressive management than what we manage in Michigan but the purchases prices are much lower so there is a trade off.
- Specialist · DETROIT · Member since 2019 · 116 posts · 243 votes5y
Pound for pound Detroit has become a more lucrative rental market than the cities in Ohio provided you get in with the right Turnkey Provider. Less risk here than there’s been in the past 20 years. I’m seeing a lot of smoke and mirrors with the numbers in Ohio these past few years. Their okay but nothing special. More talk then walk if you do a deep dive into the numbers. Cleveland seems to be the only Ohio city with the juice to compete with Detroit. Now don’t get me wrong investment properties in Ohio’s top cities aren’t bad but they simply cannot compete with the cash flow or rent to value ratio in the big D. Now of course as I mentioned bridging up with the right city is equally and vitally as important as who you get into bed with in those cities. I would highly advise a trusted turnkey provider or operation with a healthy amount of references from out-of-state and out-of-country clients firstly and for mostly. Secondly, I would make certain the company has a large and significant boots on the ground team and thirdly you need to make absolutely certain the Turnkey has an outstanding in-house management company with longstanding deep rooted section 8 relationships.
The section 8 cash flow in Detroit up end’s Ohio’s best cities all day long. Not to mention section 8 is clutch in any city in this day and age. Risk factor plummets with vetted section 8 tenants. Again the only city that can even compete with Detroit is Cleveland. Rents are up 19.4% in Detroit over last year rents. The only Ohio city that remotely comes close to that is Cleveland. The other amazing thing about Detroit is it’s highly underrated. The real true growth, numbers, values, size of construction boom are not even being reported. Ask anyone in Detroit and they will confer there is literally at a bare minimum, one rehab in progress on every street of every block in Detroit. Giant Cranes are literally littering the highways in and around Detroit. East, West, North and South. The growth is very real. Obviously this is an Ohio thread and the Detroit haters will quickly surface and begin talking nonsense but there is no denying the highest cash flow and best rent to value ratios are here in Detroit when you link up with the right team. Heck you don’t even need to take my word for it come down to Motor City where big tech and the big 3 have invested billions upon billions in the past few years and check us out for yourself.
- Rental Property Investor · Brooke Park Drive · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes5y
Originally posted by @Isaura Orellana:
Pound for pound Detroit has become a more lucrative rental market than the cities in Ohio provided you get in with the right Turnkey Provider. Less risk here than there’s been in the past 20 years. I’m seeing a lot of smoke and mirrors with the numbers in Ohio these past few years. Their okay but nothing special. More talk then walk if you do a deep dive into the numbers. Cleveland seems to be the only Ohio city with the juice to compete with Detroit. Now don’t get me wrong investment properties in Ohio’s top cities aren’t bad but they simply cannot compete with the cash flow or rent to value ratio in the big D. Now of course as I mentioned bridging up with the right city is equally and vitally as important as who you get into bed with in those cities. I would highly advise a trusted turnkey provider or operation with a healthy amount of references from out-of-state and out-of-country clients firstly and for mostly. Secondly, I would make certain the company has a large and significant boots on the ground team and thirdly you need to make absolutely certain the Turnkey has an outstanding in-house management company with longstanding deep rooted section 8 relationships.
The section 8 cash flow in Detroit up end’s Ohio’s best cities all day long. Not to mention section 8 is clutch in any city in this day and age. Risk factor plummets with vetted section 8 tenants. Again the only city that can even compete with Detroit is Cleveland. Rents are up 19.4% in Detroit over last year rents. The only Ohio city that remotely comes close to that is Cleveland. The other amazing thing about Detroit is it’s highly underrated. The real true growth, numbers, values, size of construction boom are not even being reported. Ask anyone in Detroit and they will confer there is literally at a bare minimum, one rehab in progress on every street of every block in Detroit. Giant Cranes are literally littering the highways in and around Detroit. East, West, North and South. The growth is very real. Obviously this is an Ohio thread and the Detroit haters will quickly surface and begin talking nonsense but there is no denying the highest cash flow and best rent to value ratios are here in Detroit when you link up with the right team. Heck you don’t even need to take my word for it come down to Motor City where big tech and the big 3 have invested billions upon billions in the past few years and check us out for yourself.
Toledo will also benefit if Detroit is successful. Ohio is not at war with Detroit.
- Columbus, OH · Member since 2017 · 48 posts · 43 votes5y
@Isaura Orellana, great info. I would be interested to know more about Detroit. I am looking but did not get positive info. Sent you a request to connect.
- Investor · Metro Detroit, MI · Member since 2020 · 7 posts · 13 votes5y
As a Michigan resident and UofM fan, I’ll overlook the OSU references and just stick to real estate:)
I think people forget how large Ohio is. It’s considered “flyover country” to people on the coasts yet it’s the 7th largest state in the country. It was mentioned earlier but it helps that they have 3 big metro areas with 4 solid mid-market cities. It’s not too different from it neighbors, Michigan and Indiana, when it come to very affordable pricing but I’d say the difference for me looking into Ohio is the overall cost (property tax and insurance) is lower there which improves cash flow.
- Member since 2020 · 1 post · 4 votes5y
I live here and, I would advise ALL investors to stay away. Nothing here but cornfields.
- Rental Property Investor · TX · Member since 2017 · 42 posts · 26 votes5y
@Brianne Leichliter hey Brianne, looking to out of state invest in that area as well. would love to connect!
- Rental Property Investor · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2019 · 59 posts · 77 votes5y
@Robert Howell I actually found my realtor on BP. She was AMAZING and added so much value to me that ultimately helped me make better decisions. Would love to chat about it more with you if you're interested!
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