Pace Morby's Subto Mentorship is the BEST!
Real Estate Agent · Henderson, NV · Member since 2014 · 1 post · 8 votes
Pace Morby's Subto Mentorship is the BEST!
Most Popular Reply
Member since 2022 · 5 posts · 8 votes
4yHi @Darrell Gibson I’m considering this mentorship also. How many deals have you closed while doing this program? I’ve seen a lot of rave reviews, but wondering how much everyone is actually doing. It’s one thing to learn and get information, application and results are a what I’m interested in. I appreciate your input!
71 Replies
- Investor · Scottsdale Austin Tuktoyaktuk · Member since 2021 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes3y
Quote from @Chris Seveney:
@Hamlet J.
Probably 1 less than the number of posts made by these people on BP
Find it interesting peoples first post it promoting this.
Someone mentioned he lost his licenses in Arizona. So I am curious why he lost his licenses in Arizona ?
My question is why didn't he make good on these when he started raking in the dough?
Arizona Registrar of Contractors
https://azroc.my.site.com/AZRoc/s/contractor-search?licenseI...
DETAILS FOR
AZ Contracting Group LLC
LICENSE NUMBER ROC 303463
This information is current
as of 2023-08-12 17:00:39
THIS CONTRACTOR IS NOT ABLE TO CONTRACT WITH THIS LICENSE AT THIS TIME. THIS CONTRACTOR MAY BE OPERATING WITH OTHER CURRENT LICENSES.
Name : Pace Jordan Morby
Position : Member
Other Positions : MEMBER
ADDITIONAL COMPLAINT INFORMATION
TYPE
COMPLAINT ID
OUTCOME
CLOSED DATE (IF CLOSED)
Disciplined
2019-04542
Legal – Revoked
2019-12-09
Disciplined
2019-00552
Legal - Revocation
2019-07-08
Disciplined
2019-01410
Legal – Revoked
2019-07-26
Disciplined
2019-01649
Legal - Revocation
2019-09-03
Disciplined
2018-05708
Legal - Revocation
2019-04-25
Disciplined
2018-21
Legal - Revocation
2019-04-25
Disciplined
2018-4172
Legal - Revocation
2019-04-26
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 735 votes3y
Quote from @Rick Kaiser:
Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
I just joined Subto last week. I am taking the course and definitely learning a lot. But I don't come from a real estate background so I guess I would learn loads regardless.
I definitely don't know enough real estate to read through bullsh*t clearly, but I know enough and am starting to get a little suspicious. There are some subto questions about the liability/value for the seller that I can't seem to get answered yet, and I am starting to worry I won't get them answered ever. I certainly don't have the confidence at this point to recommend anyone I know and love to sell their house subto in our current market or to one of his people.
Also, the enormous marketing campaign is sketching me out: the style of the landing pages, the hundreds of emails and links to new offers, the constant emphasis on value, and the cheesy/fake positivity... starting to feel very MLM kinda scammy.
I think the biggest value is the community and the access to contracts, but I have yet to really engage in the community in person or use a contract, so I don't even know how legit those are.
I guess, to get to the point, do you know anyone personally who has successfully purchased a property subto or seller financed one using Pace's contracts and methods? Have you gone to meetups? Are they normal people or is everyone drinking some Pace flavored kool-aid?
And lastly, when Pace introduces a concept in the subto course and reassures us that all our questions and objections will be answered because "we'll go into all that later on in the course," does he actually answer them or does he keep kicking the can down the road till you get to another paywall?
I want to believe this is not a silly waste of time and money but a real opportunity, and I'm looking for reassurance that we aren't all putting too much trust in the "success" stories shared all over social media and the community.
It's all marketing. As soon as people started talking negatively they sent in shills. People with 14 posts.
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 735 votes3y
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @Chris Seveney:
@Hamlet J.
Probably 1 less than the number of posts made by these people on BP
Find it interesting peoples first post it promoting this.
Someone mentioned he lost his licenses in Arizona. So I am curious why he lost his licenses in Arizona ?
My question is why didn't he make good on these when he started raking in the dough?
https://azroc.my.site.com/AZRoc/s/contractor-search?licenseI...
DETAILS FOR
AZ Contracting Group LLC
LICENSE NUMBER ROC 303463
This information is current
as of 2023-08-12 17:00:39
THIS CONTRACTOR IS NOT ABLE TO CONTRACT WITH THIS LICENSE AT THIS TIME. THIS CONTRACTOR MAY BE OPERATING WITH OTHER CURRENT LICENSES.
Name : Pace Jordan Morby
Position : Member
Other Positions : MEMBER
ADDITIONAL COMPLAINT INFORMATION
TYPE
COMPLAINT ID
OUTCOME
CLOSED DATE (IF CLOSED)
Disciplined
2019-04542
Legal – Revoked
2019-12-09
Disciplined
2019-00552
Legal - Revocation
2019-07-08
Disciplined
2019-01410
Legal – Revoked
2019-07-26
Disciplined
2019-01649
Legal - Revocation
2019-09-03
Disciplined
2018-05708
Legal - Revocation
2019-04-25
Disciplined
2018-21
Legal - Revocation
2019-04-25
Disciplined
2018-4172
Legal - Revocation
2019-04-26
Truth. Thanks for posting this info and intel.
- 3yWesley WhiteheadPro MemberRental Property Investor · Depends on where my employer sends me · Member since 2018 · 171 posts · 142 votes
Quote from @Louise Sormillon:
Hi @Darrell Gibson I’m considering this mentorship also. How many deals have you closed while doing this program? I’ve seen a lot of rave reviews, but wondering how much everyone is actually doing. It’s one thing to learn and get information, application and results are a what I’m interested in. I appreciate your input!
Boom there is it. @louise
@Louise Sormillon hits it on the head. If you want to talk about how great the program is then bring hard facts. How long have you been in the program? How much you paid for the program? How many deals have you done since joining the program? How did joining the program allow you to make your deal(s)? What type of cashflow are you making? All of the good reviews I read are similarly about the community but are not backed up by any hard facts (deals/dollars/doors acquired). If someone talks about their experience at a new gym would I be more interested in knowing more about the community at the gym or if said person actually got in better shape. I'm sure that there are some of Pace's SubTo students that can answers the questions I asked. Sadly none of those students seem to post on here.
SubTo students please accept this as a challenge and prove me wrong (and trust me I want to be wrong). However if you reply does no answer any of the question I asked, then you are only promoting a lack of substance to the BP community. - Realtor · Boulder, CO · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 5k+ votes2y
Quote from @Rick Kaiser:
Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
I just joined Subto last week. I am taking the course and definitely learning a lot. But I don't come from a real estate background so I guess I would learn loads regardless.
I definitely don't know enough real estate to read through bullsh*t clearly, but I know enough and am starting to get a little suspicious. There are some subto questions about the liability/value for the seller that I can't seem to get answered yet, and I am starting to worry I won't get them answered ever. I certainly don't have the confidence at this point to recommend anyone I know and love to sell their house subto in our current market or to one of his people.
Also, the enormous marketing campaign is sketching me out: the style of the landing pages, the hundreds of emails and links to new offers, the constant emphasis on value, and the cheesy/fake positivity... starting to feel very MLM kinda scammy.
I think the biggest value is the community and the access to contracts, but I have yet to really engage in the community in person or use a contract, so I don't even know how legit those are.
I guess, to get to the point, do you know anyone personally who has successfully purchased a property subto or seller financed one using Pace's contracts and methods? Have you gone to meetups? Are they normal people or is everyone drinking some Pace flavored kool-aid?
And lastly, when Pace introduces a concept in the subto course and reassures us that all our questions and objections will be answered because "we'll go into all that later on in the course," does he actually answer them or does he keep kicking the can down the road till you get to another paywall?
I want to believe this is not a silly waste of time and money but a real opportunity, and I'm looking for reassurance that we aren't all putting too much trust in the "success" stories shared all over social media and the community.
How has your opinion changed in the last 6 months? Any deals under your belt yet?
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 735 votes2y
Quote from @Wesley Whitehead:
Quote from @Louise Sormillon:
Hi @Darrell Gibson I’m considering this mentorship also. How many deals have you closed while doing this program? I’ve seen a lot of rave reviews, but wondering how much everyone is actually doing. It’s one thing to learn and get information, application and results are a what I’m interested in. I appreciate your input!
Boom there is it. @louise
@Louise Sormillon hits it on the head. If you want to talk about how great the program is then bring hard facts. How long have you been in the program? How much you paid for the program? How many deals have you done since joining the program? How did joining the program allow you to make your deal(s)? What type of cashflow are you making? All of the good reviews I read are similarly about the community but are not backed up by any hard facts (deals/dollars/doors acquired). If someone talks about their experience at a new gym would I be more interested in knowing more about the community at the gym or if said person actually got in better shape. I'm sure that there are some of Pace's SubTo students that can answers the questions I asked. Sadly none of those students seem to post on here.
SubTo students please accept this as a challenge and prove me wrong (and trust me I want to be wrong). However if you reply does no answer any of the question I asked, then you are only promoting a lack of substance to the BP community.They can't because they are for the most part shills. Some are influencers living in their parents basement with their "command center" of pawn shop bought computers and monitors of which a few are on Porn Hub 24/7 while they shill for Pace and crypto bois. The blowup doll sits in the corner dejected.
- Investor · Scottsdale Austin Tuktoyaktuk · Member since 2021 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes2yYour Question: "How has your opinion changed in the last 6 months? Any deals under your belt yet?"
Quote from @Steve K.:
Quote from @Rick Kaiser:
Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
I just joined Subto last week. I am taking the course and definitely learning a lot. But I don't come from a real estate background so I guess I would learn loads regardless.
I definitely don't know enough real estate to read through bullsh*t clearly, but I know enough and am starting to get a little suspicious. There are some subto questions about the liability/value for the seller that I can't seem to get answered yet, and I am starting to worry I won't get them answered ever. I certainly don't have the confidence at this point to recommend anyone I know and love to sell their house subto in our current market or to one of his people.
Also, the enormous marketing campaign is sketching me out: the style of the landing pages, the hundreds of emails and links to new offers, the constant emphasis on value, and the cheesy/fake positivity... starting to feel very MLM kinda scammy.
I think the biggest value is the community and the access to contracts, but I have yet to really engage in the community in person or use a contract, so I don't even know how legit those are.
I guess, to get to the point, do you know anyone personally who has successfully purchased a property subto or seller financed one using Pace's contracts and methods? Have you gone to meetups? Are they normal people or is everyone drinking some Pace flavored kool-aid?
And lastly, when Pace introduces a concept in the subto course and reassures us that all our questions and objections will be answered because "we'll go into all that later on in the course," does he actually answer them or does he keep kicking the can down the road till you get to another paywall?
I want to believe this is not a silly waste of time and money but a real opportunity, and I'm looking for reassurance that we aren't all putting too much trust in the "success" stories shared all over social media and the community.
How has your opinion changed in the last 6 months? Any deals under your belt yet?
@Steve K.: Voted BEST Question of the day! - Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 735 votes2y
Quote from @Account Closed:
Your Question: "How has your opinion changed in the last 6 months? Any deals under your belt yet?"Quote from @Steve K.:
Quote from @Rick Kaiser:
Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
I just joined Subto last week. I am taking the course and definitely learning a lot. But I don't come from a real estate background so I guess I would learn loads regardless.
I definitely don't know enough real estate to read through bullsh*t clearly, but I know enough and am starting to get a little suspicious. There are some subto questions about the liability/value for the seller that I can't seem to get answered yet, and I am starting to worry I won't get them answered ever. I certainly don't have the confidence at this point to recommend anyone I know and love to sell their house subto in our current market or to one of his people.
Also, the enormous marketing campaign is sketching me out: the style of the landing pages, the hundreds of emails and links to new offers, the constant emphasis on value, and the cheesy/fake positivity... starting to feel very MLM kinda scammy.
I think the biggest value is the community and the access to contracts, but I have yet to really engage in the community in person or use a contract, so I don't even know how legit those are.
I guess, to get to the point, do you know anyone personally who has successfully purchased a property subto or seller financed one using Pace's contracts and methods? Have you gone to meetups? Are they normal people or is everyone drinking some Pace flavored kool-aid?
And lastly, when Pace introduces a concept in the subto course and reassures us that all our questions and objections will be answered because "we'll go into all that later on in the course," does he actually answer them or does he keep kicking the can down the road till you get to another paywall?
I want to believe this is not a silly waste of time and money but a real opportunity, and I'm looking for reassurance that we aren't all putting too much trust in the "success" stories shared all over social media and the community.
How has your opinion changed in the last 6 months? Any deals under your belt yet?
@Steve K.: Voted BEST Question of the day!Yep. Then crickets.
- Investor · VA · Member since 2015 · 21k+ posts · 19k+ votes2y
@Nate Marshall
They are still trying to figure out how to forge their proof of funds documents.
7e investments53 Reviews - Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 735 votes2y
Quote from @Chris Seveney:
@Nate Marshall
They are still trying to figure out how to forge their proof of funds documents.
I thought it was "right click, save as" on the Chase website.
- Investor · Hillsboro, OR · Member since 2016 · 304 posts · 153 votes2yChris: What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?
Quote from @Chris Seveney:
So are you saying people pay $7,000 to join a community?Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
Curious how much is joing a community?
Since joining, how many deals have you done?
Do they tell you upfront how much money you need?
Do they explain what happens if a borrower files BK after a sub2 deal?
Do they explain happens if the person you sell to files BK is a POC filed on both loans?
Do they have a counter of how many people are in the community and how many total deals they have done?
Does the sponsor of the group share addresses of properties they did sub2 and how many deals they are doing? - Investor · Scottsdale Austin Tuktoyaktuk · Member since 2021 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes2y
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Chris: What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?Quote from @Chris Seveney:
So are you saying people pay $7,000 to join a community?Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
Curious how much is joing a community?
Since joining, how many deals have you done?
Do they tell you upfront how much money you need?
Do they explain what happens if a borrower files BK after a sub2 deal?
Do they explain happens if the person you sell to files BK is a POC filed on both loans?
Do they have a counter of how many people are in the community and how many total deals they have done?
Does the sponsor of the group share addresses of properties they did sub2 and how many deals they are doing?Your Question: "What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?"
There isn't a clear cut answer to that.
If the Subject To was done legally, properly, safely, then your attorney will get the court to release the property from the bankruptcy and you are then under obligation to pay off the loan, pretty much immediately. The loan is secured by the property and I doubt the lender will release the loan unless you pay it off. They will likely call the Due on Sale.
If it was done according to the "Subto community" standards, all bets are off as to what will happen. There are too many variables. But, for sure, It will be an expensive, legal entanglement, with no clear path to a solution.I've seen these lawsuits go on for a year to a year and a half and you must be making the payments even if you are uncertain of the outcome. I suggest you get properly trained and in my opinion, from what I've read and seen, the "community" is not the choice I would make.
- Investor · Hillsboro, OR · Member since 2016 · 304 posts · 153 votes2y
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Chris: What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?Quote from @Chris Seveney:
So are you saying people pay $7,000 to join a community?Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
Curious how much is joing a community?
Since joining, how many deals have you done?
Do they tell you upfront how much money you need?
Do they explain what happens if a borrower files BK after a sub2 deal?
Do they explain happens if the person you sell to files BK is a POC filed on both loans?
Do they have a counter of how many people are in the community and how many total deals they have done?
Does the sponsor of the group share addresses of properties they did sub2 and how many deals they are doing?Your Question: "What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?"
There isn't a clear cut answer to that.
If the Subject To was done legally, properly, safely, then your attorney will get the court to release the property from the bankruptcy and you are then under obligation to pay off the loan, pretty much immediately. The loan is secured by the property and I doubt the lender will release the loan unless you pay it off. They will likely call the Due on Sale.
If it was done according to the "Subto community" standards, all bets are off as to what will happen. There are too many variables. But, for sure, It will be an expensive, legal entanglement, with no clear path to a solution.I've seen these lawsuits go on for a year to a year and a half and you must be making the payments even if you are uncertain of the outcome. I suggest you get properly trained and in my opinion, from what I've read and seen, the "community" is not the choice I would make.
It seems to me that people who are in a good place financially would laugh at a sub2 offer. This means that people who accept a sub2 offer are not in a good financial place. If you are not in a good financial place , you are more likely to declare bankruptcy.
Anybody arguing my logic yet?
So, if your sub2 seller declares bankruptcy ... and you did things correctly, you have a very short period of time to refinance.
If your sub2 is not done correctly, it will be tied up in court you will have to hire a lawyer. And there is no guarantee that you will get anything? No guarantees to time line?
What is the appeal of this business model? These are not the financial profiles of people you want to do business with. All they have to do is hire a BK attorney and you are toast.???
Is this really about the buyers? A lot of people feel shut out of buying in this housing market. Is this course aimed at them? Is this all about selling people hope? Is this even about investing?
Why have the sellers not been able to sell in a market with very low inventory? It seems like folks are hunting for unicorns. And when you find one, you have to worry about them declaring BK, which seems like has a high percentage of happening.
The tried and true method is hard work and unpopular. Think Dave Ramsey, Rice and Beans, Budget, a second job ... not fun or sexy. Just work with a goal. But, it has a much higher success rate. Less debt, more cash and a better credit score have a very high success rate.
- 2yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Chris: What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?Quote from @Chris Seveney:
So are you saying people pay $7,000 to join a community?Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
Curious how much is joing a community?
Since joining, how many deals have you done?
Do they tell you upfront how much money you need?
Do they explain what happens if a borrower files BK after a sub2 deal?
Do they explain happens if the person you sell to files BK is a POC filed on both loans?
Do they have a counter of how many people are in the community and how many total deals they have done?
Does the sponsor of the group share addresses of properties they did sub2 and how many deals they are doing?Your Question: "What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?"
There isn't a clear cut answer to that.
If the Subject To was done legally, properly, safely, then your attorney will get the court to release the property from the bankruptcy and you are then under obligation to pay off the loan, pretty much immediately. The loan is secured by the property and I doubt the lender will release the loan unless you pay it off. They will likely call the Due on Sale.
If it was done according to the "Subto community" standards, all bets are off as to what will happen. There are too many variables. But, for sure, It will be an expensive, legal entanglement, with no clear path to a solution.I've seen these lawsuits go on for a year to a year and a half and you must be making the payments even if you are uncertain of the outcome. I suggest you get properly trained and in my opinion, from what I've read and seen, the "community" is not the choice I would make.
It seems to me that people who are in a good place financially would laugh at a sub2 offer. This means that people who accept a sub2 offer are not in a good financial place. If you are not in a good financial place , you are more likely to declare bankruptcy.
Anybody arguing my logic yet?
So, if your sub2 seller declares bankruptcy ... and you did things correctly, you have a very short period of time to refinance.
If your sub2 is not done correctly, it will be tied up in court you will have to hire a lawyer. And there is no guarantee that you will get anything? No guarantees to time line?
What is the appeal of this business model? These are not the financial profiles of people you want to do business with. All they have to do is hire a BK attorney and you are toast.???
Is this really about the buyers? A lot of people feel shut out of buying in this housing market. Is this course aimed at them? Is this all about selling people hope? Is this even about investing?
Why have the sellers not been able to sell in a market with very low inventory? It seems like folks are hunting for unicorns. And when you find one, you have to worry about them declaring BK, which seems like has a high percentage of happening.
The tried and true method is hard work and unpopular. Think Dave Ramsey, Rice and Beans, Budget, a second job ... not fun or sexy. Just work with a goal. But, it has a much higher success rate. Less debt, more cash and a better credit score have a very high success rate.
when I did my sub to in earnest was pre 2007 when it was legal to rescue someone from foreclosure and then rent back to them.. it is no longer legal in OR or WA to do that.. So yes you had people in a high degree of stress and did not want to move the kids or themselves and since we only contacted them about 5 to 7 days from the foreclosure sale they were highly motivated. So for us sub to was a purchase lease back. We did give them an option to purchase and a few did that.
Most though made it 6 months to maybe 3 years then moved on..
someone in decent financial shape would be ill advised and crazy to do a sub too UNLESS they were warpping it with an interest rate far higher than the one they had and just wanted to make money on the delta like a long term note investment My Dad did that back in the high interest rates of the early 80s he would buy at say 5% then sell on terms and the wrap would be at 13 to 18% which was market interest in those days so those worked well also.. But people are people and they dont consult their lawyer or many times anyone else and get sweet talked into it..
But yes its generally a distress situation for sure. - Investor · Hillsboro, OR · Member since 2016 · 304 posts · 153 votes2y
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Chris: What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?Quote from @Chris Seveney:
So are you saying people pay $7,000 to join a community?Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
Curious how much is joing a community?
Since joining, how many deals have you done?
Do they tell you upfront how much money you need?
Do they explain what happens if a borrower files BK after a sub2 deal?
Do they explain happens if the person you sell to files BK is a POC filed on both loans?
Do they have a counter of how many people are in the community and how many total deals they have done?
Does the sponsor of the group share addresses of properties they did sub2 and how many deals they are doing?Your Question: "What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?"
There isn't a clear cut answer to that.
If the Subject To was done legally, properly, safely, then your attorney will get the court to release the property from the bankruptcy and you are then under obligation to pay off the loan, pretty much immediately. The loan is secured by the property and I doubt the lender will release the loan unless you pay it off. They will likely call the Due on Sale.
If it was done according to the "Subto community" standards, all bets are off as to what will happen. There are too many variables. But, for sure, It will be an expensive, legal entanglement, with no clear path to a solution.I've seen these lawsuits go on for a year to a year and a half and you must be making the payments even if you are uncertain of the outcome. I suggest you get properly trained and in my opinion, from what I've read and seen, the "community" is not the choice I would make.
Mike: I don't have a problem with you doing this. Everybody should get a chance to fight another day. But, you have education, experience, cash reserves .... My concern is that I keep reading about new investors with no experience going this route. Do they have the cash to pay the utilites, the $10k spruce up cost etc etc. I know, that you know, that "No Money Down" doesn't mean "No Money Needed".
Mike: Please give us a post, with examples, of how much you spend in cash. If you go sub to you need to be able to make those mortgage payments. How many months reserves for mortgage payments do you reccomend? Do you need cash to help the seller move? Do they need cash to get in to an apartment? $10k for repairs / spruce up? What does this all add up to? $20k ? $30k ??
In my book, if you tell somebody that you are going to make their mortgage payments you need to follow thru 100%. This does not mean to hit up your "network" in the investor community, blah blah. IMHO, you need to have this in your back pocket.
- 2yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Chris: What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?Quote from @Chris Seveney:
So are you saying people pay $7,000 to join a community?Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
Curious how much is joing a community?
Since joining, how many deals have you done?
Do they tell you upfront how much money you need?
Do they explain what happens if a borrower files BK after a sub2 deal?
Do they explain happens if the person you sell to files BK is a POC filed on both loans?
Do they have a counter of how many people are in the community and how many total deals they have done?
Does the sponsor of the group share addresses of properties they did sub2 and how many deals they are doing?Your Question: "What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?"
There isn't a clear cut answer to that.
If the Subject To was done legally, properly, safely, then your attorney will get the court to release the property from the bankruptcy and you are then under obligation to pay off the loan, pretty much immediately. The loan is secured by the property and I doubt the lender will release the loan unless you pay it off. They will likely call the Due on Sale.
If it was done according to the "Subto community" standards, all bets are off as to what will happen. There are too many variables. But, for sure, It will be an expensive, legal entanglement, with no clear path to a solution.I've seen these lawsuits go on for a year to a year and a half and you must be making the payments even if you are uncertain of the outcome. I suggest you get properly trained and in my opinion, from what I've read and seen, the "community" is not the choice I would make.
Mike: I don't have a problem with you doing this. Everybody should get a chance to fight another day. But, you have education, experience, cash reserves .... My concern is that I keep reading about new investors with no experience going this route. Do they have the cash to pay the utilites, the $10k spruce up cost etc etc. I know, that you know, that "No Money Down" doesn't mean "No Money Needed".
Mike: Please give us a post, with examples, of how much you spend in cash. If you go sub to you need to be able to make those mortgage payments. How many months reserves for mortgage payments do you reccomend? Do you need cash to help the seller move? Do they need cash to get in to an apartment? $10k for repairs / spruce up? What does this all add up to? $20k ? $30k ??
In my book, if you tell somebody that you are going to make their mortgage payments you need to follow thru 100%. This does not mean to hit up your "network" in the investor community, blah blah. IMHO, you need to have this in your back pocket.
Christie, Mike and Ken sell how to sub to they will teach it to you for 15k.. its there business teaching sub to that they feel is the correct method. - Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 735 votes2y
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Chris: What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?Quote from @Chris Seveney:
So are you saying people pay $7,000 to join a community?Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
Curious how much is joing a community?
Since joining, how many deals have you done?
Do they tell you upfront how much money you need?
Do they explain what happens if a borrower files BK after a sub2 deal?
Do they explain happens if the person you sell to files BK is a POC filed on both loans?
Do they have a counter of how many people are in the community and how many total deals they have done?
Does the sponsor of the group share addresses of properties they did sub2 and how many deals they are doing?Your Question: "What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?"
There isn't a clear cut answer to that.
If the Subject To was done legally, properly, safely, then your attorney will get the court to release the property from the bankruptcy and you are then under obligation to pay off the loan, pretty much immediately. The loan is secured by the property and I doubt the lender will release the loan unless you pay it off. They will likely call the Due on Sale.
If it was done according to the "Subto community" standards, all bets are off as to what will happen. There are too many variables. But, for sure, It will be an expensive, legal entanglement, with no clear path to a solution.I've seen these lawsuits go on for a year to a year and a half and you must be making the payments even if you are uncertain of the outcome. I suggest you get properly trained and in my opinion, from what I've read and seen, the "community" is not the choice I would make.
Mike: I don't have a problem with you doing this. Everybody should get a chance to fight another day. But, you have education, experience, cash reserves .... My concern is that I keep reading about new investors with no experience going this route. Do they have the cash to pay the utilites, the $10k spruce up cost etc etc. I know, that you know, that "No Money Down" doesn't mean "No Money Needed".
Mike: Please give us a post, with examples, of how much you spend in cash. If you go sub to you need to be able to make those mortgage payments. How many months reserves for mortgage payments do you reccomend? Do you need cash to help the seller move? Do they need cash to get in to an apartment? $10k for repairs / spruce up? What does this all add up to? $20k ? $30k ??
In my book, if you tell somebody that you are going to make their mortgage payments you need to follow thru 100%. This does not mean to hit up your "network" in the investor community, blah blah. IMHO, you need to have this in your back pocket.
Most don't. I also know from first hand knowledge that the Colorado Attorney General has Gator Lending under review and the legislature is looking at Subject To deals.
- 2yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Quote from @Nate Marshall:
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Chris: What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?Quote from @Chris Seveney:
So are you saying people pay $7,000 to join a community?Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
Curious how much is joing a community?
Since joining, how many deals have you done?
Do they tell you upfront how much money you need?
Do they explain what happens if a borrower files BK after a sub2 deal?
Do they explain happens if the person you sell to files BK is a POC filed on both loans?
Do they have a counter of how many people are in the community and how many total deals they have done?
Does the sponsor of the group share addresses of properties they did sub2 and how many deals they are doing?Your Question: "What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?"
There isn't a clear cut answer to that.
If the Subject To was done legally, properly, safely, then your attorney will get the court to release the property from the bankruptcy and you are then under obligation to pay off the loan, pretty much immediately. The loan is secured by the property and I doubt the lender will release the loan unless you pay it off. They will likely call the Due on Sale.
If it was done according to the "Subto community" standards, all bets are off as to what will happen. There are too many variables. But, for sure, It will be an expensive, legal entanglement, with no clear path to a solution.I've seen these lawsuits go on for a year to a year and a half and you must be making the payments even if you are uncertain of the outcome. I suggest you get properly trained and in my opinion, from what I've read and seen, the "community" is not the choice I would make.
Mike: I don't have a problem with you doing this. Everybody should get a chance to fight another day. But, you have education, experience, cash reserves .... My concern is that I keep reading about new investors with no experience going this route. Do they have the cash to pay the utilites, the $10k spruce up cost etc etc. I know, that you know, that "No Money Down" doesn't mean "No Money Needed".
Mike: Please give us a post, with examples, of how much you spend in cash. If you go sub to you need to be able to make those mortgage payments. How many months reserves for mortgage payments do you reccomend? Do you need cash to help the seller move? Do they need cash to get in to an apartment? $10k for repairs / spruce up? What does this all add up to? $20k ? $30k ??
In my book, if you tell somebody that you are going to make their mortgage payments you need to follow thru 100%. This does not mean to hit up your "network" in the investor community, blah blah. IMHO, you need to have this in your back pocket.
Most don't. I also know from first hand knowledge that the Colorado Attorney General has Gator Lending under review and the legislature is looking at Subject To deals.
Legislatures will do nothing about sub to deals they have been in play as long as we have had mortgages and deeds of trust .. What Most AG's and or FTC is after is the promise that if you joing and pay me i can make you X all without any money etc etc.. Just like the Landflip lady thread going around her website says make 30 to 50k per deal.. Montalongo Vertucci Nudge Tarik these folks all had the same deals take my training make 50k a deal.. FTC came down on them and all of them have gone on to other things.. Granted I know Montalongo through all the deals I did for his students and I know Vertucci personally and these guys made MILLIONS before they shut down.
But for legislation for sub too I dont see it.. There is very easy way to regulate that and its on the banks and service-rs.. they simply do a better job of monitoring their debt debt portfolio and every sub to they find and it wont be hard.. they invoke their right under the Event of Default clause in the mortgage or Deed of Trust and accelerate the note.. IE call it all due and payable or we are going to put you into default and foreclose.. Sellers who let someone talk them into a sub to deal start getting those nasty grams and this will all come to a screeching halt.. but I frankly dont see it happening there simply is not enough volume of those type of transactions. Although when they go bad and they do its a huge CLUSTER F$$$$ for the sellers and any seller is an absolute idiot to allow some one to take title to their property and remain on the loan. - Member since 2023 · 40 posts · 30 votes2y
yeah it is the best totally! 1 poster lmao, how much he paid you?
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 735 votes2y
Quote from @Jonathan Cooper:
yeah it is the best totally! 1 poster lmao, how much he paid you?
They come out of the basement kind of like addicts looking for a fent fix.
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 735 votes2y
- Real Estate Consultant · Evergreen, CO · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 735 votes2y
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Quote from @Account Closed:
Quote from @Christie Gahan:
Chris: What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?Quote from @Chris Seveney:
So are you saying people pay $7,000 to join a community?Quote from @Paige Kuhbacher:
14 Posts
19 Posts
Yep.
I've been on BP since October 2020. I am a full time realtor and investor. It has not been a priority of mine to sit in the Bigger Pockets forums and post/comment on everything. I do however provide input and value where I see fit.
I would be happy to help answer questions or clear up any confusion anyone has about the Subto mentorship. I joined in March, but have been involved enough to see the massive potential it provides to investors looking for a supportive community.
Here's my calendly link if you'd like to set up a call: https://calendly.com/pkuhbacher
Curious how much is joing a community?
Since joining, how many deals have you done?
Do they tell you upfront how much money you need?
Do they explain what happens if a borrower files BK after a sub2 deal?
Do they explain happens if the person you sell to files BK is a POC filed on both loans?
Do they have a counter of how many people are in the community and how many total deals they have done?
Does the sponsor of the group share addresses of properties they did sub2 and how many deals they are doing?Your Question: "What does happen if they file bankruptcy ? Does it cloud title?"
There isn't a clear cut answer to that.
If the Subject To was done legally, properly, safely, then your attorney will get the court to release the property from the bankruptcy and you are then under obligation to pay off the loan, pretty much immediately. The loan is secured by the property and I doubt the lender will release the loan unless you pay it off. They will likely call the Due on Sale.
If it was done according to the "Subto community" standards, all bets are off as to what will happen. There are too many variables. But, for sure, It will be an expensive, legal entanglement, with no clear path to a solution.I've seen these lawsuits go on for a year to a year and a half and you must be making the payments even if you are uncertain of the outcome. I suggest you get properly trained and in my opinion, from what I've read and seen, the "community" is not the choice I would make.
Mike: I don't have a problem with you doing this. Everybody should get a chance to fight another day. But, you have education, experience, cash reserves .... My concern is that I keep reading about new investors with no experience going this route. Do they have the cash to pay the utilites, the $10k spruce up cost etc etc. I know, that you know, that "No Money Down" doesn't mean "No Money Needed".
Mike: Please give us a post, with examples, of how much you spend in cash. If you go sub to you need to be able to make those mortgage payments. How many months reserves for mortgage payments do you reccomend? Do you need cash to help the seller move? Do they need cash to get in to an apartment? $10k for repairs / spruce up? What does this all add up to? $20k ? $30k ??
In my book, if you tell somebody that you are going to make their mortgage payments you need to follow thru 100%. This does not mean to hit up your "network" in the investor community, blah blah. IMHO, you need to have this in your back pocket.
Very rough but I'll get my merch department on it like Cookie Monster is on a new batch of Chocol
ate Chip.
- Member since 2018 · 28 posts · 23 votes2y
@steve
@Steve K.I have done 6 wraps, 1 sub to. I joined June 2023. Steve, I can send you HUD statements to prove it. Bigger pockets keeps taking down my post claiming its self promotion. Pace sub to is the REAL DEAL.
- Member since 2018 · 28 posts · 23 votes2y
@Chris Seveney
Im still waiting to schedule a call with you.
- Investor · Scottsdale Austin Tuktoyaktuk · Member since 2021 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes2yWere the Wraps found on the MLS?
Quote from @Luis Ramos:
@steve
@Steve K.I have done 6 wraps, 1 sub to. I joined June 2023. Steve, I can send you HUD statements to prove it. Bigger pockets keeps taking down my post claiming its self promotion. Pace sub to is the REAL DEAL.
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