NOUVEAU RICHE-Interesting Review

NOUVEAU RICHE-Interesting Review

Member since 2008 · 2k+ posts · 0 votes

I found this on another site and was given permission by the author to post it here. I am neutral, have no experience with Nouveau, but found the review extremely interesting.

NOUVEAU RICHE - New Bootcamp/guru - Dolf

There's a new kid on the block in the world of RE Guru's known as Nouveau Riche. This group sells exclusively products from Dolf de Roos (one of Robert Kiyosaki's "Mentors"). They are springing up a lot in Utah and Arizona, as well as several other countries (Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and England primarily). If you haven't heard about them yet, I imagine that you will in the future. I wanted to share my experience with them with anyone that might be contemplating joining their organization.

Disclaimers
I AM IN NO WAY AFFILIATED, SELLING, PROMOTING, OR REPRESENTING NOUVEAU RICHE! (Read on and you'll Believe me!) My experiences were in March of 2003. The company was started in November 2002. Perhaps the company is more mature and efficient now. That said, some of my information might be out of date. Additionally, I'm going to boil this down so that you can read it in one sitting. I could write a lot more. Let me know if you want me to expand on any particular point. I appologize for the length of this post, but hope that it provides someone with information they're looking for.

My Experience
I've enjoyed going to some of the 3 Hour "Free RE" seminars that pop up at hotels where they get you there and wet your appetite and try to sell their seminars (after you go to 3 or 4 you start to laugh at how much alike they all are). It opens my eyes to what other guru's & groups are all about. I meet people and learn a thing or two. With Nouveau Riche I was initially impressed. I was an unemployed RE Investor in the making. I though it could be a good thing to get involved with so I could continue learning about RE, network, teach others about RE, and make some money in the process while I was trying to invest. I went to multiple meetings (3 I think), went to lunch with about 14 of them, went to one of their houses and met with 3 of them, and spent many hours on the phone and after meetings chatting with various members of the organization. Additionally, I knew a couple of them from other connections. I bought the lowest package deal (and returned it), and I seriously considered joining the group, but did not. Here are my reasons.

Overview
There are 3 packages that you can pay for and join in with. The first is about $3500, the second is around $6,000, and the third is $7,000 (these are the prices if you buy them all together. I believe they're more expensive if you buy them separately. These are estimates, but the total cost is $16,000 for all three). Any time you buy any one of these, your "Friend" who sold it to you keeps 70% of the COST of the product (which is negotiable, but they won't tell you that) Note: I've heard that they've rearranged their pricing so the lowest one is cheaper, but they're all still about $16K. If you join and sell NR, your "sponsor" makes a profit on your purchase and your next two. Their motto is "Buy one, Sell two".

-Package #1. $3500. Includes: REMS (Real Estate Management Software)
If you've never used anything else, you'll think it's great. If you've used ANYTHING else, you'll hate it. I found it cumbersome, non-conforming, and counterintuitive (not to mention very expensive compared to other things out there).

REPS (Real Estate Purchase Software
(see REMS). I had about the same feeling. You can get spreadsheets from realtors that do the same thing. Heck, I made my own. It's not rocket science; it's a few equations (only mine does more!). If you know how to do a dozen or so equations in Excel you can do it yourself (BTW, I didn't know anything about excel when I started to make mine).

CD's
You get 12 audio CD's of Dolf giving one of his seminars. After I listened to the CD's I didn't think it was worth paying to go to hear him speak (more on that later).

Books
They tossed in a few de Roos's books that you can get at any bookstore as fillers. $30 worth or so.

Seminar
Included was a 2 day seminar (You have to pay all expenses,travel, air, etc) that was 6 months away. (but only a 3 day return policy)

Package #2. $6,000. Includes:
3 Day Seminar
(see above)

Package #3. $7000. Includes:
5 Day Seminar
(See Above).

With all of the products you receive a weekly newsletter from Dolf (kind of what you would read from Carleton Sheets). There are also world wide teleconferences where everyone could participate, and local groups. The worldwide teleconferences were interesting. Everyone was from Utah, Phoenix, or Australia. (Keep in mind, this was when the company was still fairly small and new). One of two things would happen. We'd end up talking about specific neighborhoods in phoenix (that's great if you're in phoenix, but what if you're in New York,..or Mexico) or the moderator would say "You need to ask your lawyer/accountant that question" because the info was way too generic. Most questions were given about one minute of consideration. I can only imagine how they'll be once they've got people on their from 10 countries and all over the USA. As for the local groups, I already told you who was running them. I asked when they met, for how long, where at, what they discussed, etc. Everything was answered like "we haven't exactly decided..". bottom line, there hadn't been any local RE educational meetings, only recruiting meetings (which they'd had a ton of).

Seminars
In two days they claimed that they would teach you all about real estate so you could run out and do it. Additionally they were going to teach you how to do it many different ways and many different techniques. The most useful thing he teaches is "look at 100 properties". If you do that with ANYTHING you'll learn the market (cars, boats, houses, multi's etc). They must cater to the lowest common denominator (i.e., stupidest person in the audience) and speak in generalities because after all they have everyone from high school dropouts who put the $16K on a credit card to doctors and MBA's. Fluffy stories that tell you to make your money when you buy, buy properties and then change them (rent them, divide them, etc), look at 100 properties, etc. Additionally they talk about how to take advantage of global RE fluctuations and buy properties in China, Argentina, and Mexico. If you can't afford to leave your job, travel to china, hire others to do it for you, you don't know how to invest in your back yard, and you don't know Chinese, then Chinese Real Estate is not for you...At least not yet. There are great opportunities outside of the USA, but you've got more things to learn and over come as you get into international real estate.

High Pressure Sales
During that time, I was negotiating two real estate deals that would have taken up most of the capital I had in closing costs, appraisals, inspections, deferred maintenance, etc. Across the board I was encouraged by the Nouveau Riche reps to spend ALL of my savings on the seminars and products (that I would not gone to for about 7 months) rather than use it to secure 2 profitable real estate projects. Interesting attitude from a company that encourages you to buy real estate. One of those was a 24 unit apartment building which I now own.

Selling To Others
They encouraged me to make a list of 200 people who I could contact and invite them to explore the product. I did this. After I had looked across the list of names of 200 friends and family, there were only 3 of them that I felt like I could sell this to without feeling like a weasel, draining their pocketbooks, encouraging them to take on debt, deceiving them, and hoping that they wouldn't resent me for talking them into something that is $16,000 when most of the same information is available for cheap or free. Bottom line, I didn't believe it was worth that. Additionally I knew that $11,000 of that $16K would be going into my pocket. I know that other people have margins to make, but other products are not that expensive, nor do they have those margins.

Experience
Most of the people in NR had very little RE experience. Those who did, had it before they became involved. They would say that they were going to host the meetings and teach you about RE. Most of the ones that DID have RE had it because they'd made a killing selling NR to others and they bought RE conventionally with that money, often times paying cash for the properties. Most have no idea how to buy properties creatively.

Pyramid
It is NOT a Pyramid scheme by definition. It is Legal. That said, it looks and feels a lot like one. I've heard them tell people "you'll make so much money selling this that you can buy all the RE you want". There's something seriously wrong with this picture. I won't go into the definition of a pyramid scheme, but it does feel like it. Legally, there has to be an inexpensive way to get into any MLM (which they claim they're not, but they are. Just a shallow one). It's usually between $45 and $100. For NR it's $75. When I finally decided that I'd be interested in joining to see how it goes, they wouldn't let me join for $75. I told them they had to by law. They retaliated by saying that they'd let me, but that there would be NO support for me at all until I paid at least the $3500 to "show my commitment". I responded by saying "What motivation do you have to help and support me if you've already been paid" to which they had no good response other than "I wasn't committed". The bottom line is that they're more interested in recruiting (and forcing their recruits to buy product) than actually selling their product.

Learning Curve
Now that you've paid your $16K, you STILL have to figure out how to buy RE. You're not trading money for knowledge. Ron LeGrand will have seminars that are several days long where he teaches short sales, and ONLY short sales. I know many people, who have paid a lot for their education, but they walk out, and they pocket $20K on their first deal. He gives them the forms, the strategies, the equations, the words to use, etc. He trains you very specifically how to do a very narrowly-focused, very profitable transaction. NR does no such thing. NR students will still be found on TCI, libraries, and bookstores trying to figure it out.

Opportunity Costs
By now you know that I don't think their product is worth what they ask. What is the opportunity cost (what you could have done) with the $16,000. Look at it this way. If you were to open a separate checking account, how long would it take you to stash away an extra $16K. Most people (with say a $32K/year income) would be doing really well if they could stash away an extra $5K a year after all expenses, taxes, contributions, retirement, etc. That's 3 years of discretionary income. Or they could quit their job, move in with mom and dad, and do nothing but read library books, RE websites, and talk with people and begin to learn the business.

Sharing
One of the biggest turn-offs was the attitude towards sharing information with other investors. They treat RE techniques like they're responsible for protecting the ancient secrets (such as buy low, sell high, rehab, buy distressed properties, lease options, etc) that are theirs to protect and hand down only to chosen individuals. (Chosen = "paid thousands of dollars). If you ask them a question, they're response is something like "You ought to come to one of our meetings to find out more about our organization." Interestingly enough, they can be found at other meetings asking questions and trying to learn from others. One-way vacuum. It's very hypocritical in my opinion.

Insiders
They claim to provide strategic partnerships. I've personally spoken with two of their "partners". Both receive referrals and commissions of some sort from the NR members/organization when they work with them. Both are extremely knowledgeable about RE. Neither one is impressed with NR. One helps them find properties. They have a waiting list of several hundred buyers (NR students) for their name to get to the top of a list so that they can spring onto an opportunity (often a SFR in an area most investors run from at about 85% LTV). (I also know one of the guys that provides them with properties. ANYONE can go to him and get the same deal any time, and without waiting on a list! In any case, they only have half a dozen properties per month come up. That list is only getting longer.

Other Opinions
I'll put it this way. 100% of the investors that I know, respect, and trust their opinions don't like NR. They'll roll their eyes or laugh hysterically at best or get angry and disgusted at worst. The only people who I've heard say good things about them were those who were involved and those who were new to RE.

In their Defense
I do have a handful of good things that I can say about them. In recent months I've talked to a few people who are NR students say some good things about NR. This could be to save their ego or it could be because they genuinely feel that way. I thought the people involved were fun to be with and associate with. Additionally I think that there are people who NEED to pay $16K to get a fire under their pants and get going in RE. If they start buying one SFR per year at 95% LTV and do so for the rest of their life, but wouldn't have without NR, then I suppose that it was money well spent. For if they hadn't made the financial commitment, nothing would have happened. Additionally, from a business standpoint, I guess I've got to have a bit of respect for someone who can talk people into paying $16K (putting $11K in their pocket) for 10 days of seminars, 12 CD's, a couple of books, and some mediocre software.

Conclusion
Recently our local RE group received a letter from an individual who was about to join NR when she found our group. She indicated that ours was much more informative when it came to learning about real estate (as opposed to recruiting).

As for the boot camps, I am very opposed to bad RE "boot camps, or the ones that you pay $3000 for and half of the time is spent explaining to you why you need to spend $10,000 for the next one. Many are simply motivational hype, but no training. That said, there are some great ones out there that will help you stagger through your first deal, do better on your second, and have it down pat by your third (more or less anyways). I do not feel that this is one of them. Your time and money are extremely valuable. Spend them both wisely. $16K is a new car, a down payment on a house, 4 nice, exotic vacations, consumer debt elimination. Most people think long and hard about spending that kind of money on any one of those things listed. Do the same with the RE packages that you are considering.

Added: January 12th 2004
Reviewer: hibby76
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Hits: 16711

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Most Popular Reply

Wholesaler · Dallas, TX · Member since 2009 · 48 posts · 21 votes
16y

NRU is great if you have $16k to invest in education after or before you purchase 10 property deals. The same can be said for every other educational product, ie Russ Whitney, RichDad Education or RDU. I am not knocking any of these offerings. You can make money, as an affiliate. But you damage your reputation in most cases doing so. This site is priceless for the valuable real world education you can get. I developed a simple solution in the beginning. Attend any free training, until you no longer can afford to spend time at a free workshop, web conference, etc. Because if you are doing deals, eventually your time will be worth more than the workshops and NRU can provide. Fear of the unknown, failure, and making mistakes it used to motivate large purchases.

I stopped buying courses, and started buying property.

There is private money available, realtors are a great start. Sign up for the free newsletters, and watch the course costs drop with each email.

The reason RichDad stops marketing to you if you buy. Is because you may see the same free tips, in the paid material, and start wondering why you paid if they eventually give it away.

There is an easy way to qualify the value of any course: is it sold on eBay? Free markets determine the real world price to value ratio in many cases, maybe not all. Of course asking here is a great way also.

Please spend your money and time investing in deals before you buy the education materials.

Libraries, newsletters, and forums are free.

See this reply in the discussion

186 Replies

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  • Real Estate Investor · Mesa, AZ · Member since 2008 · 33 posts · 0 votes
    18y

    You're welcome.

    At first reading Reed's reviews were annoying at times, but then it occurred to me that he is the way he is probably because of frustration over the "bad name" that scammers, MLMers, and rip-off type gurus cause to the industry. If people start to think that everyone in the RE biz are just a bunch of sleazy, greedy con-artists, then what does that do for the legitimate businesses?

    Even Robinson talks about that in his book. How landlords are depicted in the public's eye, and how to deal with that.

    Even in my own profession, where there's no regulation...the legitimate businesses have to constantly fight a reputation of irresponsible, non-professional types. It can get really, really frustrating for those who are doing their best to be truthful, responsible and professional in their work.

  • Homeowner · Citrus Heights, CA · Member since 2008 · 3 posts · 0 votes
    18y

    Hey everybody!
    I have not had time this weekend to get replys back (kids and nephews graduating, life outside of this stuff!).

    I would like to thank you for your replys, reviews and comments, and I would like to ask for forgiveness on the emotional response I posted when first seeing this discussion. It was wrong of me.

    I'll be back with some info soon. Thanks Joshua!

    Ron

  • Joshua D.Pro Member
    BiggerPockets Founder · HI · Member since 2008 · 16k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    18y

    Ron -
    I hope you're here not only to promote/defend NRU, but also to participate here on the site and share what you know with the rest of the community.

    I'll be looking forward to seeing you on other threads than just this one.

    Best,
    Josh

  • Real Estate Consultant · Reno, NV · Member since 2008 · 3 posts · 1 vote
    18y

    I too attended a briefing. I found the day to be extremely informative. I do value education, I just couldn't get past the hard sell. To their credit, they did mention at the beginning of the presentation that they were selling a program and I did sit through the entire presentation to see how much it cost. I was torn with the cost, and my past experiences. My background in real estate over the past 20 years included the purchase of over 35 single family and residential multifamily residences. I purchased Carlton Sheets program many years ago and have read a bunch of books on real estate investing. I actually utilized a plan outlined by Robert Allen in his book "Creating Wealth". I basically followed his plan an ended up purchasing 33 properties in 5 years. The one thing I find in all of the books and training I have attended is that it is "valuable information" and remember, "knowledge is NOT power", the "application of knowledge is POWER". There is a big difference. It doesn't matter how much you know, or how much you have paid for an education if you are unwilling to take the action necessary to make things happen.

    Anyway, I met Ron Sanderson who has posted several times in defense of NRU. With NRU they allow you to have a tuition partner. Ron offered his tuition partner slot to me in order for me to attend a college at no cost other than my own air fare and we shared the cost of a hotel room. Ron is a man of integrity and willingly gives of himself to help others. He is involved in many money making opportunities and he has started a real estate mastermind group in Sacramento for all of its members to benefit through networking and sharing their own experiences.

    Well Ron and I attended a week long college put on by NRU in October of last year. I have to say the classes were very good. Focused and there was no upselling in the classes. You took a pre-test and a post-test. Because of my own past real estate experience I choose to take some upper level courses. I took a two day class on short sales which was absolutely phenomenal. It was given by a guy named Tony Lister and his friend. A very good class. It was thorough, complete and even had us participating in exercising where we had to do some negotiating. The idea being that by practicing it with each other, it would be easier when you actually did it for the first time. I took a bunch of other classes as well, but the one that put the icing on the cake was the class on commercial real estate investing. The class was put on by John Dassauer. He is an amazing guy who has the ability to explain things like cap rates, noi, dcr's and he has what he calls a 60 second analysis.

    John's class opened my eyes to the true possibilities in real estate. I think commercial real estate investors are kind of like Navy Submariners. Submariners motto is "loose lips sink ships". There is so much potential in commercial real estate and the players are keeping a tight lid on it. I know that there are more and more gurus out there that are starting to teach on commercial real estate, but not as many as are teaching the residential side.

    So I had an amazing educational experience. There was so much information that it seemed a little overwhelming. I decided I wanted to do the short-sales and the commercial real estate and started taking action to make that happen. What I realized and I was informed in the commercial real estate class that you spend the same amount of time on the residential deals as you do on the commercial deals, only the numbers are a little larger. That includes the payoff. So in January I decided to focus strickly on commercial property investments, more specifically apartments. I took a week and wrote out a detailed business plan based on the knowledge I gained from the NRU classes and my past experiences. In February I got a signed contract on a 40 unit apartment complex. I began my due diligence, had the property professionally inspected as I was taught, and the inspection results allowed me to re-enter a soft negotiation with the seller. While conducting my due diligence I simultaneously contacted 5 local banks as recommended by my instructor John Dassauer. He said that the local banks weren't really affected by the savings and loan crisis that we are experiencing. My goal on this deal was to get cash back at closing. I was able to renegotiate a better deal after the inspection, I just received financing approval 10 days ago and we are looking to close on July 7th. Here are the amazing details:

    Apraised: $1,200,000
    Contract Price: $1,135000
    New loan for $955,000 at 6.25% amortized for 25 years and adjusts every 3 years at prime plus 1.25.

    Down Payment: $180,000
    Buyer Credits: $270,000 (that means I get cash back at closing)

    There is $245,000 in equity, I am getting around $90,000 cash back at closing, and the property will cash flow about $2,500/mo.

    Had I not attended the NRU class on commercial real estate would I have been able to do this? Is the $16,000+ NRU education worth it? There is value in the knowledge you receive from NRU, but the POWER only comes to those that apply the knowledge. Could you get it cheaper elsewhere? NRU is an instense 1 week of immersion training in various topics in real estate.

    Here is my take on NRU:

    You have several types of people involved in NRU
    -You have the MLM type people that sell the opportunity,
    -You have the novice real estate investor who is taught by NRU that if you sell some of the educational benefits you can have money to buy real estate, and then,
    -You have the real estate investor who is seeking knowledge but at the same time is not afraid to apply that knowledge and take action.

    It is easy to put down a program. Often times what I will see is that someone will see someone like Carlton Sheets, and maybe even buy the program. They will begin to go through the program and get stuck on something they don't think is right or don't understand and then they say "It won't work because..." It is easy to make excuses so you don't have to take action. During the past few months working this deal I had to continually remind myself that "some people don't know what they don't know". What I mean by that is I would talk to someone that thought they were experts and would say, "you can't do that". I realized that I have to translate that into, "maybe he doesn't know how to do it." Its easy to find excuses for why you can't do something. The next time you are working a deal I would challenge you, that when faced with a potential problem that you "seek solutions".

    I am no longer interested in investing in residential real estate. I have also attended some other commercial courses or heard presentations from folks like Davd Lindalh and Scott Scheels and I like both of their approaches to investing in commercial real estate. A good book on investing in apartments is: How to buy and sell apartment buildings by Eugene E. Vollucci. I found this to be a great reference while I was negotiation my last deal. The NRU classes were excellent, but the notebooks they give you in the class are more like outlines. If you took great notes, you would have a great resource. If you didn't take good note, then you have a decent outline.

    So technically, I am not officially an NRU person, I can't sell the opportunity, and I can only attend the college as a tuition partner.
    Bottom line is that their education is very good, and unfortunately some of their people only try to sell the opportunity and lack credibility because they don't pursue the real estate aspect.

    Just my two cents worth...

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    18y

    Jim,
    Thank you for your input and congrats on your residential investments as well as your decision to move into commercial. I agree 100% that commercial investing takes about the same time and effort, just bigger numbers and bigger profits, but I will add bigger potential losses as well.
    I also highly respect Johnny D. He is a good teacher and is passionate about RE investing. Scott Scheel is also very good, and since I have learned from both, I do find that Scott is a bit more advanced/technical in his property analysis as well as other items including strategies.

    That said, I still remain with the others on my dislike for NR marketing techniques, upselling, etc. The reps they bring on have little or no investing experience at all. How do you feel about someone standing up in front of a small crowd telling the audiance that they need NRU education in order to learn how to invest in RE whne that speaker does not even own an investment property?

    Note to James C. - In all fairness, I do know that there is no upsell at the NR college. That is the most expensive product/package they sell. Not sure if they upsell the "investor concierge" as I do not have personal knowledge of that so I can not comment. If they do, shame on them but it wouldn't surprise me.

    Jim, as far as your newly acquired contract on the 40 unit, I am not getting your numbers. You say that it appraises for 1.2 million and the contract price is 1.135 milllion. That is only $65k equity and even if you add the extra $90k back at close you are left with $155k, not $245k. What gives?
    Also, assuming you calculated the NOI correctly, your cash flow per door is only $62 per month. Most of us shoot for a minimum of $100 per door. I also believe the loan is suspect. Why would you want an arm in a lending market that is going South? The rates are bound to climb. You are overleveraged in this and if anything goes wrong, you will be in trouble.

    What is your DSCR, what is the cap rate, what is the TROI?
    Assuming you bought at a 1.5% rent to purchase price, your gross annual income would be 204,000 with an estimated 102,000 in NOI. That gives you a DSCR of approx. 1.35 (good enough for the bank, not good by Johnny D's standards) and what about when the rate increases cutting into your cash flow and hurting your dscr?
    Point being, I am not seeing the "great deal" you are exclaiming that only happended because of your NRU education. I do believe there is value in the education you received, and even more so in the fact that you are taking action, but I recommend you evaluate this deal a bit closer or post evidence of numbers to the contrary.

    If you have Scott Scheel's evaluator software, plug in the numbers to that and I am sure you will get a better picture of this deal. Look forward to your response.

    P.S. To myself, James, and Jim - This must be the long azz post forum! :lol:

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    18y

    Let me explain James,

    It is called an MBA for Jim P.
    (MASSIVE BANK ACCOUNT)

    He is quite the business man.

  • Real Estate Investor · Seattle, WA · Member since 2008 · 34 posts · 6 votes
    18y

    NRU is definitely a multi-level marketing scheme, and has everything that goes along with such things. I have some friends that bought into it and over a year later they are still tasting the koolaid in their mouth. Personally, I think its extremely overpriced. My friends seem to be learning a few things and networking with other people through their NRU involvement, but generally speaking I'm rather shocked at how slowly they are learning. When I have conversations with them, they don't come off like the real estate geniuses they ought be after spending cumulatively something like a month on the NRU campus being trained, not to mention all the intbetween stuff they have done on a monthly basis, the videos they brought home to study, etc..

    They paid $15,000 for the two of them(you can bring a partner for free so they split the cost). $15,000??? are you serious? It better be a lot of great content. Thing is, its not that impressive what I have heard coming out of their mouths.

    That being said, neither of them really possess the inate drive to study on their own and learn this stuff, so in a way they need something like NRU or some other mentorship program to hold their hand and get through the mental parts. they have extensive experience in construction, etc, but when it comes to business and numbers, they are a disaster waiting to happen without some guidance. I think NRU has also been very motivational to kick them into gear and get them going instead of sitting around all day dreaming about it.

    However, I personally think NRU preys on the people that don't have any knowledge about how to get into real estate with no money down..normal working class people that probably should keep their day job. I went to their weekend seminar once and the sell job was so blatantly multi-level marketing that I wanted to vomit. There is absolutely no way in hell I would give them my money. Add to that, a little research turned up the fact that the top guy at NRU has a criminal record....insurance fraud. Specifically, he took his girlfriend's car and tried to dump it in the desert to collect on the insurance. These are not veterns in real estate, they are veterns of the MLM game with just enough knowledge about real estate to be dangerous. Watch out.

  • Investor · Fort Lauderdale, FL · Member since 2008 · 51 posts · 2 votes
    18y

    My experience with NRU just occured over the past few days. I recently attended the monthly local REIA meeting here in South Florida, and noticed a truck at the meeting that had a number to call about RE investment trainee position. Thinking it might be a local investor looking to offer an internship, I gave the number a call.

    A couple weeks later, a guy called and after some chit chat invited me to come to an "interview" session set up at a local hotel, and boasting about how I could be making what I currently make annually every month. :roll:

    That was pretty much my cue to run, but I went to the "interview" anyway. The guy I spoke to was one of several "greeters" in the lobby. He handed me a copy of Success magazine, which he boasted they had dedicated the entire issue to his company (not mentioning that the magazine was published by his company, LOL). I was then supposed to go to another meeting room to register and wait for the meeting to start.

    There were at least 20-30 other people there for this meeting, even though on the phone my guy had told me it would only be 4 or 5 people at this "interview". One look at the materials in the magazine, and the text about selling a program and getting commissions was enough for me. I hightailed it out the side door, got in my car and sped away.

    I didn't stay long enough to get to the $16000 pitch, but then again I didn't need to. The whole setup smelled fishy as hell, and it certainly wasn't what I was looking to get involved in.

  • Real Estate Consultant · Reno, NV · Member since 2008 · 3 posts · 1 vote
    18y

    Qoute:

    What would the COST of the week long college have been? Ron brought you as a "tuition partner" and there was NO UPSELLING what so ever?
    Very out of character for NRU and I have NEVER heard of any NRU related anything that didn't include a HARD SELL for MORE education and courses.
    I could be wrong and there could just be a lot of people that are turned off by that? I have never attended any NRU gig and probably would not. My personal choice.

    Ron did not charge me a dime. Your lack of understanding is based on your limited and close minded views from others that share your opinions. As you state, you have never attended any NRU gig. I stated earlier that I attended a free briefing and was also turned off by their hard sell approach. I also stated that I attended a week long training with NRU and in the classroom there was no upselling. Each class began with test and ended with a test. All classes were recorded and instructors were not allowed to advertise their own programs or do any upselling. Outside the classrooms their were tables set up where they had other "opportunities" available such as the RME. They also had multiple social programs for networking. I have to agree with several people who have responded and that the people they knew that attended didn't seem to have accomplished much from their education. I have experienced that from many of the people I have encountered with NRU as well. I think many would like to make a lot of money in real estate but it is fear that keeps them from taking action. Honestly a week long intensive education on a subject a person has no knowledge of can be extremely confusing and overwhelming. I attended but had much experience under my belt.

    Qoute:

    I have to disagree with you when you say that commercial is actually residential in a nut shell. Actually it is different. Residential mortgages are FICO driven, commercial are primarily Asset Based with a minimum DCR of 1.2 to get a loan. With residential multifamily is 4 units and under, commercial multifamily is over 4 units. With commercial properties you have economies of scale that make it a much better investment.

    Qoute:

    You mention NRU classed again here. So, were you now paying for the classes and if so, how much total have you invested in the NRU education?
    Your testimonial seems a little like your leaving out some details, like how you have gotten all this wonderful NRU education by way of Ron's generous "tuition partnership" or not?? I am confused by this.

    I stated that I attended a week long training as Ron's tuition partner. He did not charge me anything. As I stated earlier, I split the cost of hotel room for the week and I paid for the rental car. He said he hated to see it go to waste. Is this confusing to you?

    Qoute:

    Nice comment. It is typical of someone that doesn't understand a concept to label it as something... "Loan Fraud" You say it is old school and then you want me to "go into more detail". It sounds like you want me to tell you how it is done because you obviously don't know yourself.

    Qoute:

    Let me be clear about the timeline... It was one week. I explained a couple of the classes that I took during that week of training. Is that difficult to understand? Ron did pay in excess of 16 grand for the education and he did not pressure me or upsell me.

    You misunderstand me if you think the value is in the opportunity of selling the opportunity. You don't get it. Here it is in simple form:

    1. NRU sells an education in real estate investing
    2. NRU gives you an opportunity to sell this opportunity (they say that if you sell this opportunity than you will have "money" to invest in real estate)
    3. They provide local networking groups supposedly to help with the real estate investing. (I don't know about these, but it seems like they are often getting together to talk about how to sell the opportunity).

    My comments:

    -I found the actual classes to be very informative with very experienced and knowledgeable instructors. There was absolutely no upselling in the classes.
    -I don't like the hard sell from most of the people I have come in contact with who are associated with NRU. Ron is the exception and not the norm for NRU.
    -The one day intensive that I attended they had knowledgeable instructor and they had several people give testimonials. I was turned off by the approach and did not join. (I later became friends with Ron who mentioned the "opportunity". I told him I had attended an intensive but did not join. He offered his tuition partner slot if I would split the cost of his hotel room for the week.)
    -The information/education is good, but that in itself will not make you money.
    -Most people that buy into this that don't have any real estate experience are probably overwhelmed by all of the information. Most of them believe as they have been told by NRU that they need to sell a few programs to get the money to invest.
    -I have spoken to very few that have done a lot of real estate transactions in NRU.
    -I will agree that they prey on peoples fear and tell them that they could easily loss the amount they would pay for their education through NRU if they had a bad deal because of their lack of knowledge.
    -People take action and make money, information doesn't. Knowledge is not power... Knowledge applied correctly is power...

    Qoute:

    I understand your jab at me about "PROMOTING NRU as expected!" This is obviously to get me to respond and it worked. Mostly because of your ignorance and lack of understanding of the program.

    Again let me simplify this for you... Ron paid the money to attend 2 years worth of colleges. I believe they have 6 or 8 colleges a year. You are responsible for your own travel and lodging expenses at the colleges. Ron allowed me to go to 1 week as a tuition partner. I did not take any other classes. If you were really interested in figuring out the cost that would be about $1,000 a week if there were 8 colleges a year. When you think about that and compare it to what other real estate guru's are charging it looks like a bargain. You could probably tell me what guru's are charging for a 3 or 4 day "boot camp". It seems to me like I see them running around $5,000, but then again they often let you bring a spouse for free or often give discount of $1,000 if you purchase by a certain date.

    I would be interested in knowing if you have attended any courses from other real estate gurus. Your posts often put down these programs and you say you haven't attended these, but only have heard information about these programs. You are very critical of something that you really have no knowledge about, but you are comfortable putting others down in order to get them to respond. Your lack of understanding does not help your point.

    Qoute:

    Let me clarify for those that didn't get this...
    The property appraised for 1.2 million.
    The contract price was for 1.135 million.
    The bank wanted 15% down based on the appraisal of 1.2 million.
    The down payment comes to $180,000.
    Purchase price of 1.135 million minus down payment equals loan amount of $955,000.
    Equity equals appraisal of 1.2 million minus how much is owed (loan amount) $955,000 which comes to $245,000. That is what gives...

    The contract shows that I am putting down $180,000, but I have credits of $270,000... Credits come back to me at closing. What does that mean? It means the seller is really only getting about $865,000 out of the deal even though the contract price is 1.135 million.

    Qoute:

    I understand you are not seeing the great deal. You didn't understand the basic equity situation. So that you understand, I have gone over all of the ratios and I don't see a need to put that all down in this forum. You misunderstood me when you say "exclaiming that only happend because of your NRU education". That is not what I am saying at all. I said there is value in education, but in fact that knowledge is not power. It is knowledge applied correctly is power... There are many people that spend thousands of dollars on education but are afraid to take action. They will find an excuse to not take action. It appears that many people on this post use the fear monger tactics and attack some educational institutue. Look, I am not a spokesman for NRU or any other guru. I have had an opportunity to receive some education from them and I will say that the information was valuable. You say you like Johnny D. Well I spent 2 days with him at NRU. You used the 50% expense ratio to quickly determine the NOI as Johnny D teaches and you make some quick assumptions and then tell me its a bad deal. Understand that this deal took over 4 months to work out. There was a thorough due diligence period and a professional property inspection done as Johnny D preaches. That did allow me to enter into another soft negotiation and get more back from the seller. Look I don't need to prove anything to anyone. I am glad that I took action and did not allow the fear mongers to scare me off. There are good deals all over for the taking but most people won't take action because they are afraid. It sounds like many people on this post are of the same mindset.

    Qoute:

    I don't have Scott Scheels evaluator software, I do have one from Dave Lindahl and I also ran it through two other evaluator programs. Guess what? I have a pretty good picture of this deal and I would gladly do many more. I will say that many people are afraid to negotiate. Many people are afraid to ask for certain things because they believe the seller will never give it to them. Well guess what. Don't make the decision for the seller. Give the seller an opportunity to make that decision. In my negotiation, I tried to guide my broker in the process. I also tried to educate the seller. We had 8 counters before we came to a final agreement.

    Qoute:

    The Naval Academy is a four year college. I didn't purchase my first home until I graduated. I spent 12.5 years in the Marine Corps and that is when I purchased the properties. I did not manage them myself. I had local property managers doing the work for me.

    Qoute:

    Hey my man! You obviously didn't do your research about 7-Eleven my man... 7-Eleven isn't like a McDonalds or Burger King my man... It doesn't take as much serious capital as you may think my man... You can't even get an SBA loan on a 7-Eleven franchise my man... Because you don't own anything my man... Also it doesn't take serious business skills my man... They have all of their systems in place. You are not re-inventing the wheel, and they provide a field consultant weekly my man... The problem is that they want you to be in your stores all the time, and to me that is like buying a job. I wasn't in my stores much and they didn't like me because of that...

    Qoute:

    Because I can. I'm in great shape for my age. Additionally, its a lot of fun. I got to chase down bad guys. I also appreciate the value of serving. It is a noble profession and I had a lot of fun. It was a challenge to get in at my age and I was able to accomplish that task. What have you done with your life?

    Comments:

    Its seems like there are several people on this board that like to attack or jump on someone who is having some success. That is typical of people that are not successful. Anyway, I'm sure someone will not understand what I have said with this post either, and I don't feel the need to respond any further regarding this post or NRU. I don't normally spend much time on the forums. Good luck with your bashings. If anyone is serious about networking and investing in commercial real estate you can contact me directly.

    Jim

  • Real Estate Investor · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2008 · 51 posts · 0 votes
    18y
    Originally posted by "**********":

    Thanks :wink:

    You just shot yourself in the foot here, Jim.

  • Real Estate Investor · San Francisco, CA · Member since 2008 · 51 posts · 0 votes
    18y
    Originally posted by "**********":
    Jim4sparks, or me James?

    In my opinion the way this is spelled out is sketchy, loan wise.

    Oops I meant Jim4sparks!

  • Real Estate Consultant · Member since 2008 · 792 posts · 30 votes
    18y

    This thread is hilarious. I am soooo happy i found it.

    Jim,

    Really?

    That was your goal?

    To get cash back at closing?

    After 20 years of investing, cash back at closing on a commercial deal is your goal?

    I suggest that you might want to aim a little higher with your goal setting, even if the education is free.

    For what it's worth, I've never even heard of the NR crap until today.

    I find it very amusing.

    I am going to start a new thread called "Misguided Real Estate Investing Goals".

    Here are a couple of thoughts:

    "I want to leverage 150%"
    "I want to do a lease option with a tenant that has no chance to ever buy"

    or maybe,

    "I want to get into commercial deals because, 'loose lips sink ships'."

    I don't think i'm going to get any more real work done today....i can't stop laughing about how "loose lips sink ships"....

    Jim,

    last thought, people aren't bashing you, they are mocking you. There is a difference.

    People are taking offense, because the garbage you are regurgitating has a damaging effect on people trying to learn the business.

    Please, for the sake of humanity and all things legitimate, never, ever, ever, say that cash back at closing is a goal.

    peace.

  • Title Representative · LAS VEGAS, NV · Member since 2008 · 1 post · 0 votes
    18y

    Hello everyone. I actually signed up for the NRU program, received my loan thru Chase, but decided not to go thru the class. I did find out that it is NOT an actual University nor is it accredited as one. That alone caused me to further research, as it is totally misleading. My buddy that tried to get me in decided to fess up and told me about how the only money he has been able to make is by convincing people to take the course and cough up 19,500. He apologized and felt horrible about trying to get me in but I understood why he acted like such a "Soldier" for NRU. He explained how most people that went thru it are currently stuck with bad deal, an average of 3 a piece, and that the only way to pay the mortgages and hang in there is by recruiting people. He is a good man but was sold bad properties and suckered in to bad deals. With a third child on the way, mortgages, credit cards he racked up for his NRU investments, he just had no other way to pay the bills. As he said it "how can I tell others the truth when my only options are sink or swim.”? Anyway, he is still wrong for misleading others.

    Fortunately, I met a guy named Steve in Home Depot, he is an experienced rehabber and after telling him my story he recommended a 9 day course that has no advertisement, no website (yet they say), and no hype. I just tool the rehab (reo investing) course in Chicago last week. It's called the National Housing Rehab Program. It was the best thing I could have done. They taught the 7 people that attended everything in detail. They are new but really good. Call me naive but they seemed so down to earth, honest, and said things as they are. Some guys finished the course thanking them for opening their eyes and realizing the business was not for them. They share so many horror stories about rehabbing that really showed you real life experiences and all of the cons of the business, not just the Pro's. We were walked thru properties in 8 different stages, from searching for deal, inspecting, making offers (negotiating), closing to actually seeing and assisting in the demolition of a property. We saw how to fix it, where to buy materials, permits, security, listing, getting "Section 8" tenants (in some neighborhood) etc etc etc it was a ton of stuff. I would never be able to describe everything. It was just well worth it a definitely something I am doing. My first REO offer has been accepted at 52,000 for a 2 unit brick building in Chicago, all recent closings, 4 months or less, for similar homes are 260k. Of course I have to fix it but I am already approved for the loan. The contractor is charging 70k for a full gut rehab all included and the lender will be reviewing and inspecting the property at every payout. I love it.

    Cost$$$$, When I first called them, they interviewed me for about 20 minutes. Questions about what I expect? What are my goals? And immediately cut my goal for the year from 500,000 to 150k based on my answers they said. They asked I take a cashiers check for $5,000.00 and when I started questioning their integrity and their credibility they really surprised me with their take on it. They said "Bring the check, we will pin it in the wall, once the class is over, if you think it was not worth it, take it back” I was shocked. I took the course, was amazed at how much I learned and enjoyed it, thought of taking the check back but I didn't. It was worth more than that. The only thing I did not like is that they won't pay referral fees.

    That's my 2 cents guys. Look around and if NRU does not offer a full money guarantee, I would not take it.

  • Member since 2008 · 1 post · 0 votes
    18y

    Wow Eddie, NHRP must be the real deal huh?!?! Can you give me some more information on how to reach them. I would like to go ahead and check them out. I mean I heard good things about NRU, but I heard most of their students buy properties in another state without even seeing the properties. Not a wise investment!! Please give me more information on NHRP. I am interested in purchasing a rehab home for $ 250,000 with about $ 70,000 in equity

  • Real Estate Investor · Gainesville, FL · Member since 2008 · 296 posts · 7 votes
    18y

    I had a NR show up to a property I have for sale.

    He walked through the house and his first question was:

    "So, what do you do for a living?"

    Then the conversation focused solely on me and what my interests were and what my plans were. It was actually a little creepy.

    Then he handed me his card and told me to give him a call.

    Oh, and, no questions about the house what-so-ever. As he drove away I saw "Leaders Wanted" written across his Ford F-150.

    Great buddy, thanks for wasting my time with your sleezy sales pitch. I'll go ahead and give you a call. I love the idea of soliciting everyone under at open houses and in the grocery store in an effort to reclaim the thousands I spent on the same scam.

  • Real Estate Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2008 · 1 post · 0 votes
    18y

    I also find the posts very hilarious.

    I got on the forum to see if there was anything on NR, and yes there is.

    Some people have too much time on their hands, so much negative energy and need to be heard.

    To quickly explain. Like every large organization, there are the bad apples. NR works to remove those. Also, there are two parts to NR, Education and Marketing. You can participate on either one, or both. Sounds to me most people here have gotten hit by the marketing people and not so good ones. I participate in both because I love it.

    I am sure everyone here can agree, if you are going to invest in real estate, you better have some form of other income stream when you are first getting started to support it. Hence, the marketing aspect.

    As far as NR only taking and not giving, there are 20,00 people in NR. Seek others out and see what they can offer you. I believe, in general, you will find NR people to be very genuine and very giving people. At least those are the people I hang with. I am disappointed when I see others conducting business in a way that is misleading and misrepresenting the opportunity, but that is in every organization. Those people are removed from NR and their license to sell revoked. If you run across those people, let me know and they will be removed. Plain and simple. I take this seriously.

    Call or e-mail me if you would to discuss this further.

    Sincerely,
    Ed Ferree

  • Real Estate Investor · Brea, CA · Member since 2008 · 4 posts · 0 votes
    18y

    Hey Guys,

    I'm also a student at NR. Personally I love it, but I'm not really posting to be RA RA for the University. Really just to come to it's defense a bit.

    It sounds like a lot of people here were hit by really terrible marketers. Like edferree was saying, there's two sides to NR. The RE and the Marketing. "Students" can participate in both. The commissions in the referral program are huge.. 9750 per person you bring in, so you can imagine that attracts a lot of scumbag marketers and sales reps. Some are shady and they give us a bad name, they're in every company.. probably even yours.

    Then there's the RE side, where I sit. I don't market, heavily - not to say i don't enjoy the occasional $9,500 (1-2 a month typically). I've told friends and family members, and even run a couple of ads, but only because I'm experiencing success at NR. I look for people who seriously want to learn real estate. I've gone from no real estate experience to successfully navigating wholesale deals. I work with sellers, drawn up my own contracts, create my addendums, know how to creatively use terms, assign my contract, and sell my deals with happy buyers. For my investment of 19,500 that's not a bad deal considering i make 5-20k per assignment.

    I'm sorry for the people that have been wronged by NR marketers. they do suck and they do tarnish NR's reputation, but it is a network marketing company after all. true, it's not a pyramid, but yes, it is direct sales. similar, but not the same. no one hides that fact unless they're trying to get you in unethically.

    19,500 isn't a bad deal for two years of schooling. i did my research on boot camps and more specialized niches of real estate, and i felt that this was the best bang for my buck. would i do it again? probably.. i'm not going to say "hell yeah!" because NR does lack in some area's. but what i'm realizing is all the courses out there do too -- regardless of if it's NR or not. the only way you're going to learn is by getting out there and doing it.. asking questions.. networking. and that was taught by NR, too.

    so far their instructors have been ridiculously knowledgeable. and as was mentioned before, none of them are allowed to upsell any products.. it's just 3, 6, or 12 hours of instruction depending on what class you're taking.

    i could go on and on forever, but my opinion in all of this is that for what they offer, the price tag is not that big.

    again, sorry about the hardcore marketers out there. especially the ones that market and don't actually try and invest. for anyone that's seriously looking at learning real estate investing, NR is a pretty dang good introduction to the game. two years worth of instruction, 38 classes, 24 instructors, online video and audio, events, seminars, free classes, investors forums, and a massive community of real investors if you're willing to get out there and network. you can't drag people to success.. ya know? school doesn't mean dick if you're not willing to take some action.

    for whoever it was that said that their friends were stuck in three bad deals? how exactly did that happen? i really am curious.. i don't think that would be the fault of the school, but i suppose it's possible. i personally don't use their "click a mouse, buy a house" investor concierge. the deals are OK, but you can build better ones yourself with a much higher CROI. my opinion.

    anyway, feel free to contact me if you like, i'd be glad to share my experience with NR in greater detail - the good with the bad -- and i won't even invite you to a meeting :) thanks guys. take care.

    Dave

  • Rental Property Investor · Mercer Island, WA · Member since 2008 · 22k+ posts · 14k+ votes
    18y

    So, you say don't market the program, but still make $9,500 to $19,000 a month by selling it to other students. You say you're on the RE side, not the marketing side. How much do you make on real estate? If the point of this program is to make you a good RE investor, you should be making money doing real estate. If you're not, but you are making money selling the program to others, then the point of the program is not to be a RE investor, but to sell it to others.

    Lots of gurus claim they still make lots of money investing, and just sell their program as a service to others. I don't believe them, either.

  • Real Estate Investor · Brea, CA · Member since 2008 · 4 posts · 0 votes
    18y

    just depends on the month.. this month i've assigned three small properties (they each sold for 49k) and each assignment fee made me 5k. so 15k on the real estate. i haven't made a dime on the marketing in the last couple of months. but i did run into a very old friend at a show up in LA and he asked what i'm doing.. i told him (he used to be a systems analyst with me).. and i told him about NR. he's coming down to laguna tomorrow to see me present some of my properties to an NR investor forum, which is a non-marketing event. if he decides this is a route that he wants to take, then i'll make a commission. i won't "sell" him on anything -- if it's not for him, great, if it is, great. either way we'll be going out to lunch and catching up.

    i really question why people see the devil in this process. if the RE education is working, why is it bad of me to market? would you rather the company just run ads on tv and take that money away from students? if you don't like network marketing, don't do it, but don't bash it just because it's something you're not into. it works very well for a lot of people.

    being an NR student can be a business, and not necessarily just for RE. the students choose how they want to manage their own businesses. Me: I study the real estate, and no, i don't market. maybe i should clarify that position. by "not marketing," i mean that i don't spend the majority of my work hours running ads and recruiting. i tell a few people here and there, i've run a couple of ads (i don't anymore, it wasn't for me and it takes too much of my time), but if i generate extra income from that, then good for me.

    if someone asks how i know what i do, i tell them. if they follow my path and join, then i make money there. then i take that money, and apply it to more real estate. it works out pretty nicely when you think about it.

  • Real Estate Investor · Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2008 · 108 posts · 9 votes
    18y

    People throw away money on so many "doodads" each and every day. That includes myself. My philosophy is that if someone spends money on an educational program... money well spent. I've been taken in by deep influence techniques and have the "feeling" of being taken by the guru. However, I've spent tens of thousands of dollars on my education and have made the money back and some. All of my education will also push me to better deals and more and more success in the future.

    What people find bad about the "guru" process of finding and prospecting leads, is that they use people's weaknesses to be influenced against them. See Cialdini's "influence, science and practice. Information marketers are in a huge battle to get your business.

    Research! There are some unbelievable teachers and guru's out there. I continue to go to their seminars.

    Spending money on your education is NEVER a waste unless you choose not to use it.

    BTW - I know nothing about NR.

  • Rental Property Investor · Mercer Island, WA · Member since 2008 · 22k+ posts · 14k+ votes
    18y
    Originally posted by "Duewa":

    just depends on the month.. this month i've assigned three small properties (they each sold for 49k) and each assignment fee made me 5k. so 15k on the real estate. i haven't made a dime on the marketing in the last couple of months.

    I congratulate you on your wholesaling success. It does seem that many NR students choose to focus selling the program rather than investing in real estate. That's the first real evidence I've seen where someone actually applied what they were taught to buying and selling real estate.

  • Real Estate Investor · Brea, CA · Member since 2008 · 4 posts · 0 votes
    18y

    Thanks, and you're right. NR is a marketing company and a lot of people get pulled in strictly to recruit. Some are very good and ethical, and many are not. Those people use shady tactics to get people down to our briefings, and that's when people get a bad taste in their mouth. rightfully so.

    I joined because of the real estate, and will admit, the idea of getting good at sales and making huge commissions can be very alluring. but i realized that's just another job, and not one that i particularly want. so my focus shifted back and i will say that the education is enough to get you going in your career. for me the network of people has actually provided more than any class every could. me and some other students rent space down in laguna and our office, while 100% NR, actually does focus a lot more on the RE than other offices. we're pretty fortunate that way.

    anyway, take care, have a great a day, and do some deals.

    make it a profitable one.

    Dave

  • Real Estate Investor · Lynnwood, WA · Member since 2008 · 66 posts · 9 votes
    18y

    Ok, gotta chime in here. I had only heard of NR in passing from another website. I had heard both good and bad as in all things. I went to a local REI meeting the other day for the first time in a while and behold, a large NR display and the only person at the meeting dressed in a shark suit (full on biz suit where everyone else was in shorts and tees) running the booth. Red flag #1, but I'm a trusting guy. After networking with a dozen or so people and telling them what I do and what I'm looking for (mobiles and small bank references at the moment), I drift over to the group that he is currently holding sway over. I politely listen then put in my hello, here's what I do talk, followed by the inevitable 5 minute explanation of how in the world I can make money selling tin cans. After we drift apart, he follows me away and starts heaping on the praise about how well I was able to explain my business and such. He then goes to explain how I can help sell the NR business to other investors and keep a large portion of their payment for myself. I said, like a MLM? And he says, no, we're not a mlm... and some other stuff. At this point, I lost interest and said thanks and walked.

    He seemed at least moderately knowledgable and claimed to hold 50 or so properties as a full-time investor, but he said he made much more money doing this. Felt just like my first Amway pitch from oh so long ago :)

  • Real Estate Investor · Brea, CA · Member since 2008 · 4 posts · 0 votes
    18y

    haha ... yeah, network marketing is a strange beast. if you're good at sales it's a great business to be in. with NR you get the REI education coupled with sales commissions on the REI education. interesting model.

  • Investor · Cincinnati, OH · Member since 2008 · 118 posts · 22 votes
    18y

    I've read through this information, and I'll have to say I agree with Ron. It seems to have a negative tone. I don't mind that so much. What bothers me is that a lot of the comments are from people that have had no real experience with Nouveau Riche. Most of the negativity comes from uninformed individuals? This doesnt make sense to me.

    I am looking into Nouveau Riche, and am looking for helpful information. I've heard a lot of positive (from people in the company), and I've heard a lot of negative (from people not in the company). This leads me to believe that those that have not joined, and seen what it's really about have a negative outlook, but if they were to join, that thay would see the value. I've heard a lot of stories to confirm this, but I'm still not 100% sure.

    Don't get me wrong. I'm not the gung ho "you are all wrong if you disagree with me" type of person. I really want to hear some legitimate experiences of people that have joined, and stopped. I'm looking for specific reasons why someone decided to stop working with Nouveau Riche.

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