After hanging around these forums for about half a year now, I've noticed that the word "Guru" gets tossed around quite a bit, and (understandably) not in a good way. It's a label that tends to be used interchangeably with words like "scam", "ripoff", "liar", "no credibility", and a lot of other negative connotations. I have to admit, when I hear the word "Guru" - the first thoughts that come to mind generally aren't positive either. This got me to thinking, what exactly makes someone a "Guru"? At what point does someone deserve to be lumped into this category? - When they make a particular claim? - Is it an attitude, action or behavior? - When they try to sell an informational product of any kind? - When they claim to have a repeatable "system" of any kind? - When they offer proof that they have been wildly successful? - When they say that real estate investing is "easy"? - Some other criteria? I'm guessing there are a lot of different ideas out there. I'd be curious to hear what you all think, and why.

If you attend my free seminar and sign up for the $25k gold level program I can give you this answer.

I don't think it's black-and-white, but in my opinion, here are two big things that would lead me to call someone a guru: 1. They make the bulk of their income in education, not investing in real estate. 2. They use their paid education (seminars, courses, etc) to upsell additional (generally higher priced) paid education. These two things -- to me -- are the hallmark of a real estate "guru"...

They have a group of acolytes that they refer to as "students", LOL :). Sort of a master/grasshoppa relationship that I find insulting. A classic hallmark is that they shill for each other on-line in a never-ending barrage of affiliate marketing e-mails, that I am constantly trying to unsubscribe from. So they don't really compete with each other, but rather work in a format of trying to extract every possible cent from the collective email lists of everyone in this sordid little fraternity.

Belinda: I don't one think one should compare success rates of REI courses/programs with that of degree or trade certificate programs. Even if an academic or trade program has a 100% graduation rate, that doesn't say anything about career or financial success. Look to the unemployment rate and underemployment rate for young adults graduating in the last five years. Trade schools and medical certificate schools have the highest student loan default rates (somewhere in the 30% range). That indicates a lot of people with financial or employment challenges after graduating. Passing the state bar exam doesn't translate to success or income in law. I would be interested in how many REI students make their money back and in what time frame. There's a lot of guru hype that goes something like $10K is cheap if your first deal nets you $50K. Sounds rational. But what are the stats? How long does it take? How much more do you have to spend after the $10K course fee? A franchise with an educational component serves the franchise. It requires the franchisee to follow instructions and perpetuate the same product and the same message. The education/training component is more for the benefit of the franchise than franchisee. Getting paid a continuous fee to train people to work for you is the brilliance of successful franchises.

I’ll jump in on this since I just recently started offering a program for new or inexperienced wholesalers. Gurus are a big reason why I created the program; for someone like me, their claims are offensive. They drastically oversimplify the process to make anyone and everyone feel like it’s a simple, no money needed, get rich quick business. I recently saw a poster here on BP defend a well-known guru saying that his unrealistic claims were simply “marketing”. I could sell a lot more memberships by making false promises, or in his words marketing, but then I’d be just another lying guru. I openly admit that almost everything I know can be found on the internet, a lot of it right here. There is no “secret” to wholesaling. If someone wants to pay a very reasonable fee they can speed up the process of learning and get unlimited advice from someone with a lot of experience and success. I also tell people that have no money to put their wallet away and not to sign-up.

Belinda Lopez - I think if the Gurus were required to report their success rates, they'd probably be out of business . . .

@Ben Leybovich Great picture. I hope that is just for taking pictures, and you two stopped shortly afterwards and put helmets on. Road rash takes time to heal. ;-)

What makes someone a real estate "Guru"?

Ben Leybovich

Rental Property Investor · Phoenix/Lima, Arizona/OH · Member since 2012 · 4k+ posts · 4k+ votes

13y

Braden C. Of course. RE is not new. People pay for convenience of easy access! Which is why what we offer should be priced accordingly - not $5,000 - $60,000 :)

What makes someone a real estate "Guru"?

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