California is at it again.
Chicago, IL · Member since 2020 · 184 posts · 182 votes
California is at it again.
Most Popular Reply
Rental Property Investor · Larkspur, CO · Member since 2018 · 198 posts · 179 votes
3yI’m amazed how casual LL’s are about this sort of thing, be it moratoriums, or now this. We’re not supposed to be too political on these forums, but frankly if we don’t get political there will be no Bigger Pockets some day; Government will be the only LL in town as they keep exerting more and more control over the populous via intentional dependency.
Sure that’s extreme in the moment, but the notion of not being allowed to do background checks was pretty well unheard of not long ago. Now you’re hearing of it all over the country. It doesn’t take long. Inflation only makes programs like section 8 more and more common. Do we really want the government as our business partner? Cause that goes so well…
If anything Bigger Pockets should consider spearheading a lobbyist outfit, as much as I hate the very notion of lobbying. But you know the saying; If you can’t beat em, sometimes you have to join em sadly. The longer we just shrug and act like we’re immune to all this nonsense because it’s local or because there are workarounds, the sooner this industry hits a wall and the concept of renting will by default go through a government application.
55 Replies
- 3yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
It's Alameda County, what else can we expect? This will result in a couple of things pretty quickly....a) Landlords will turn their rentals into Condos b) Landlords will leave the state c) Rents will go sky high as LLs try to gather enough Cap Funds to take care of any emergencies.
Watch this spread statewide..... God Bless those morons....!
- 3yBjorn AhlbladPro MemberInvestor · Shelton, WA · Member since 2017 · 6k+ posts · 6k+ votes
How can we ensure the safety of our tenants if we can't background check? Total nonsense. Two years ago the mayor of Oakland Ca threatened LL with a one thousand dollar fine if they conducted BG checks!
- Rental Property Investor · Larkspur, CO · Member since 2018 · 198 posts · 179 votes3y
I’m amazed how casual LL’s are about this sort of thing, be it moratoriums, or now this. We’re not supposed to be too political on these forums, but frankly if we don’t get political there will be no Bigger Pockets some day; Government will be the only LL in town as they keep exerting more and more control over the populous via intentional dependency.
Sure that’s extreme in the moment, but the notion of not being allowed to do background checks was pretty well unheard of not long ago. Now you’re hearing of it all over the country. It doesn’t take long. Inflation only makes programs like section 8 more and more common. Do we really want the government as our business partner? Cause that goes so well…If anything Bigger Pockets should consider spearheading a lobbyist outfit, as much as I hate the very notion of lobbying. But you know the saying; If you can’t beat em, sometimes you have to join em sadly. The longer we just shrug and act like we’re immune to all this nonsense because it’s local or because there are workarounds, the sooner this industry hits a wall and the concept of renting will by default go through a government application.
- 3yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
It's Alameda County, what else can we expect? This will result in a couple of things pretty quickly....a) Landlords will turn their rentals into Condos b) Landlords will leave the state c) Rents will go sky high as LLs try to gather enough Cap Funds to take care of any emergencies.
Watch this spread statewide..... God Bless those morons....!
it looks like its only the unicorporated areas of Alameda county so the cities are exempt I cant see how anyone in Oakland could make this work long term - 3yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
@David S. Said it very well. 100% agree....
- Rental Property Investor · Burlington County, NJ · Member since 2019 · 540 posts · 771 votes3y
This became the law in NJ starting this year. We adjusted, as did, it appears, the other investors in my market. Specifically, our rental portal, Rentler, no longer checks for a criminal record. More specifically, our tenant review criteria continues to reflect high expectations for our prospective tenants. We consistently follow our criteria with a "if in doubt, keep looking" approach.
Unlike the assertions from many here, potential rental property prices did not drop with investors fleeing the market. They appear to remain as strong as other parts of the country.
Can't speak for CA. But for NJ, the doom and gloom projections--on this particular issue--have not yet come to pass. It may, but we'll keep yielding nice returns until they do.
Just my (blue state) two cents.
- 3yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
Quote from @Ron Brady:
This became the law in NJ starting this year. We adjusted, as did, it appears, the other investors in my market. Specifically, our rental portal, Rentler, no longer checks for a criminal record. More specifically, our tenant review criteria continues to reflect high expectations for our prospective tenants. We consistently follow our criteria with a "if in doubt, keep looking" approach.
Unlike the assertions from many here, potential rental property prices did not drop with investors fleeing the market. They appear to remain as strong as other parts of the country.
Can't speak for CA. But for NJ, the doom and gloom projections--on this particular issue--have not yet come to pass. It may, but we'll keep yielding nice returns until they do.
Just my (blue state) two cents.
But Ron, do you feel comfortable, as a landlord, not being able to do a criminal background check? It would just make me really nervous - as much for the safety of my other tenants as anything. Or do you have other tricks to ascertain the background of people...?
- Austin, TX · Member since 2019 · 5k+ posts · 5k+ votes3y
It "kind of" seems to read to me that many of the homeless in that area must be Ex-Cons.
And that Public and Private housing will not rent to them, despite vouchers or jobs.
And they believe this will get these people indoors (and right next to law abiding citizens who are working hard all day long (not at home).
Your Class B and C areas seem like they will degrade into Class D areas pretty quickly, as will it will probably lower desirability to live there.
Desirability might take a while to surface, but Peter Programmer and his Wife Debbie Department manager (and their two children Emma and Petee Jr, who get great grades, along with their dog Chipper) might start looking at places like Austin to move to so they are not paying Boo Koo Bucks to live in a Crime hole.
Then when the last well paid non-criminal family moves out, what are you left with.
A once thriving area now filled with a a discontented scarey rabble between prison sentences (revolving door--recidivism) instead of high paid middle class workers. And all because a few starry-eyed dreamers stirred the local government officials up and filled their heads with a lot of poorly thought out ideas.
I think they should offer these homeless Ex-Cons Mass Public housing like Nickerson Gardens in LA.
I seems to me like much better solution--somewhere out in the high desert near a military base where they can recidivide to their hearts content.
Just my 2 cents.
- Rental Property Investor · Somewhere over the Rainbow · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes3y
Quote from @Ron Brady:
This became the law in NJ starting this year. We adjusted, as did, it appears, the other investors in my market. Specifically, our rental portal, Rentler, no longer checks for a criminal record. More specifically, our tenant review criteria continues to reflect high expectations for our prospective tenants. We consistently follow our criteria with a "if in doubt, keep looking" approach.
Unlike the assertions from many here, potential rental property prices did not drop with investors fleeing the market. They appear to remain as strong as other parts of the country.
Can't speak for CA. But for NJ, the doom and gloom projections--on this particular issue--have not yet come to pass. It may, but we'll keep yielding nice returns until they do.
Just my (blue state) two cents.
I would wonder as well - do you approve of the change? Think it's fair? Satisfied with it?
What's next? No credit checks? No income checks?
This is exactly how it happens - the government slowly strips away one thing at a time (these days because someone's feelings are hurt) and you are "ok" with it. Then you wake up in Hunter Biden's basement covered in feces with a tattoo of Joe Biden's face on your ***, asking yourself "how'd I get here?"
- Rental Property Investor · Burlington County, NJ · Member since 2019 · 540 posts · 771 votes3y
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
Quote from @Ron Brady:
This became the law in NJ starting this year. We adjusted, as did, it appears, the other investors in my market. Specifically, our rental portal, Rentler, no longer checks for a criminal record. More specifically, our tenant review criteria continues to reflect high expectations for our prospective tenants. We consistently follow our criteria with a "if in doubt, keep looking" approach.
Unlike the assertions from many here, potential rental property prices did not drop with investors fleeing the market. They appear to remain as strong as other parts of the country.
Can't speak for CA. But for NJ, the doom and gloom projections--on this particular issue--have not yet come to pass. It may, but we'll keep yielding nice returns until they do.
Just my (blue state) two cents.
But Ron, do you feel comfortable, as a landlord, not being able to do a criminal background check? It would just make me really nervous - as much for the safety of my other tenants as anything. Or do you have other tricks to ascertain the background of people...?
Very fair question, Bruce. Would we prefer criminal background checks? Definitely. But our bar is so high that if someone meets it--steady employment, sufficient income, solid credit, good references from current employer and prior landlord, is responsive and professional in our interactions, makes scheduled showings--then they make our pool. And we give prospectives a deadline for application submissions after open houses so that we, ideally, pick the best of a group of applicants. If you make it through that and have a record, then we are OK renting to that person, given that's the new law. And if you have a record and can do all of that, I kinda think you've earned your chance.
- Rental Property Investor · Burlington County, NJ · Member since 2019 · 540 posts · 771 votes3y
Quote from @Jeremy Horton:
Quote from @Ron Brady:
This became the law in NJ starting this year. We adjusted, as did, it appears, the other investors in my market. Specifically, our rental portal, Rentler, no longer checks for a criminal record. More specifically, our tenant review criteria continues to reflect high expectations for our prospective tenants. We consistently follow our criteria with a "if in doubt, keep looking" approach.
Unlike the assertions from many here, potential rental property prices did not drop with investors fleeing the market. They appear to remain as strong as other parts of the country.
Can't speak for CA. But for NJ, the doom and gloom projections--on this particular issue--have not yet come to pass. It may, but we'll keep yielding nice returns until they do.
Just my (blue state) two cents.
I would wonder as well - do you approve of the change? Think it's fair? Satisfied with it?
What's next? No credit checks? No income checks?
This is exactly how it happens - the government slowly strips away one thing at a time (these days because someone's feelings are hurt) and you are "ok" with it. Then you wake up in Hunter Biden's basement covered in feces with a tattoo of Joe Biden's face on your ***, asking yourself "how'd I get here?"
Fair question, Jeremy. Would I prefer the criminal screen? Yes. But I'll say this. I think that the idea of restoring rights to those who've served their time is the right idea (with some exceptions and conditions)
And as I responded to Bruce above, if an applicant can make it past our screens, we're comfortable with them.
The whole tattoo stuff.... bruh!
- 3yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
Quote from @Ron Brady:
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
Quote from @Ron Brady:
This became the law in NJ starting this year. We adjusted, as did, it appears, the other investors in my market. Specifically, our rental portal, Rentler, no longer checks for a criminal record. More specifically, our tenant review criteria continues to reflect high expectations for our prospective tenants. We consistently follow our criteria with a "if in doubt, keep looking" approach.
Unlike the assertions from many here, potential rental property prices did not drop with investors fleeing the market. They appear to remain as strong as other parts of the country.
Can't speak for CA. But for NJ, the doom and gloom projections--on this particular issue--have not yet come to pass. It may, but we'll keep yielding nice returns until they do.
Just my (blue state) two cents.
But Ron, do you feel comfortable, as a landlord, not being able to do a criminal background check? It would just make me really nervous - as much for the safety of my other tenants as anything. Or do you have other tricks to ascertain the background of people...?
Very fair question, Bruce. Would we prefer criminal background checks? Definitely. But our bar is so high that if someone meets it--steady employment, sufficient income, solid credit, good references from current employer and prior landlord, is responsive and professional in our interactions, makes scheduled showings--then they make our pool. And we give prospectives a deadline for application submissions after open houses so that we, ideally, pick the best of a group of applicants. If you make it through that and have a record, then we are OK renting to that person, given that's the new law. And if you have a record and can do all of that, I kinda think you've earned your chance.
Knowing you, I figured you had the type of clients you wouldn't worry about....and like you say, if a person has really turned a page, then good for them. I would just (like you) feel better if I could really know the truth and make my own decision. That's how it should work (in that perfect world :-)
- Rental Property Investor · Somewhere over the Rainbow · Member since 2021 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes3y
Quote from @Ron Brady:
Quote from @Jeremy Horton:
Quote from @Ron Brady:
This became the law in NJ starting this year. We adjusted, as did, it appears, the other investors in my market. Specifically, our rental portal, Rentler, no longer checks for a criminal record. More specifically, our tenant review criteria continues to reflect high expectations for our prospective tenants. We consistently follow our criteria with a "if in doubt, keep looking" approach.
Unlike the assertions from many here, potential rental property prices did not drop with investors fleeing the market. They appear to remain as strong as other parts of the country.
Can't speak for CA. But for NJ, the doom and gloom projections--on this particular issue--have not yet come to pass. It may, but we'll keep yielding nice returns until they do.
Just my (blue state) two cents.
I would wonder as well - do you approve of the change? Think it's fair? Satisfied with it?
What's next? No credit checks? No income checks?
This is exactly how it happens - the government slowly strips away one thing at a time (these days because someone's feelings are hurt) and you are "ok" with it. Then you wake up in Hunter Biden's basement covered in feces with a tattoo of Joe Biden's face on your ***, asking yourself "how'd I get here?"
Fair question, Jeremy. Would I prefer the criminal screen? Yes. But I'll say this. I think that the idea of restoring rights to those who've served their time is the right idea (with some exceptions and conditions)
And as I responded to Bruce above, if an applicant can make it past our screens, we're comfortable with them.
The whole tattoo stuff.... bruh!
Missed the "right" that says we're not allowed to have a criminal background check on us...
Should we extend the same practice to employment? Schools? Daycare?
- 3yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
Quote from @Jeremy Horton:
You watch......if we don't turn this crazy train around, that's exactly what'll be happening in 5 years....
- Rental Property Investor · Burlington County, NJ · Member since 2019 · 540 posts · 771 votes3yI misspoke. I did not mean it as a right. I meant it as if one’s done their time, it’s over, with, as I said some limitations. But I surmise we differ on that. The joy of real estate is I can invest in NJ and secure good yields and you can take a different approach and secure good yields for you. Best wishes Jeremy.
Quote from @Jeremy Horton:
Quote from @Ron Brady:
Quote from @Jeremy Horton:
Quote from @Ron Brady:
This became the law in NJ starting this year. We adjusted, as did, it appears, the other investors in my market. Specifically, our rental portal, Rentler, no longer checks for a criminal record. More specifically, our tenant review criteria continues to reflect high expectations for our prospective tenants. We consistently follow our criteria with a "if in doubt, keep looking" approach.
Unlike the assertions from many here, potential rental property prices did not drop with investors fleeing the market. They appear to remain as strong as other parts of the country.
Can't speak for CA. But for NJ, the doom and gloom projections--on this particular issue--have not yet come to pass. It may, but we'll keep yielding nice returns until they do.
Just my (blue state) two cents.
I would wonder as well - do you approve of the change? Think it's fair? Satisfied with it?
What's next? No credit checks? No income checks?
This is exactly how it happens - the government slowly strips away one thing at a time (these days because someone's feelings are hurt) and you are "ok" with it. Then you wake up in Hunter Biden's basement covered in feces with a tattoo of Joe Biden's face on your ***, asking yourself "how'd I get here?"
Fair question, Jeremy. Would I prefer the criminal screen? Yes. But I'll say this. I think that the idea of restoring rights to those who've served their time is the right idea (with some exceptions and conditions)
And as I responded to Bruce above, if an applicant can make it past our screens, we're comfortable with them.
The whole tattoo stuff.... bruh!
Missed the "right" that says we're not allowed to have a criminal background check on us...
Should we extend the same practice to employment? Schools? Daycare?
- Rental Property Investor · Burlington County, NJ · Member since 2019 · 540 posts · 771 votes3yI misspoke. I did not mean it as a right. I meant it as if one’s done their time, it’s over, with, as I said some limitations. But I surmise we differ on that. The joy of real estate is I can invest in NJ and secure good yields and you can take a different approach and secure good yields for you. Best wishes Jeremy.
Quote from @Jeremy Horton:
Quote from @Ron Brady:
Quote from @Jeremy Horton:
Quote from @Ron Brady:
This became the law in NJ starting this year. We adjusted, as did, it appears, the other investors in my market. Specifically, our rental portal, Rentler, no longer checks for a criminal record. More specifically, our tenant review criteria continues to reflect high expectations for our prospective tenants. We consistently follow our criteria with a "if in doubt, keep looking" approach.
Unlike the assertions from many here, potential rental property prices did not drop with investors fleeing the market. They appear to remain as strong as other parts of the country.
Can't speak for CA. But for NJ, the doom and gloom projections--on this particular issue--have not yet come to pass. It may, but we'll keep yielding nice returns until they do.
Just my (blue state) two cents.
I would wonder as well - do you approve of the change? Think it's fair? Satisfied with it?
What's next? No credit checks? No income checks?
This is exactly how it happens - the government slowly strips away one thing at a time (these days because someone's feelings are hurt) and you are "ok" with it. Then you wake up in Hunter Biden's basement covered in feces with a tattoo of Joe Biden's face on your ***, asking yourself "how'd I get here?"
Fair question, Jeremy. Would I prefer the criminal screen? Yes. But I'll say this. I think that the idea of restoring rights to those who've served their time is the right idea (with some exceptions and conditions)
And as I responded to Bruce above, if an applicant can make it past our screens, we're comfortable with them.
The whole tattoo stuff.... bruh!
Missed the "right" that says we're not allowed to have a criminal background check on us...
Should we extend the same practice to employment? Schools? Daycare?
- Rental Property Investor · Member since 2020 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes3y
Whenever I read things like this, I really wish I had money just to prove a point. It is a great thing in principal and these people aren't investors most likely so it doesn't affect them. That said I'd love to have enough money to buy a few houses next to the 4 people who voted yes to make halfway houses for pedo's, rapists, murders, robbers, addicts, and maybe a few gang bangers to even out the mix and see how comfortable and tolerant they really are. I understand how some could say that people who are out of prison have done their time, but I stick with actions have consequences and there are too many good tenants to take a chance.
- Real Estate Broker · Medford, NJ · Member since 2018 · 236 posts · 177 votes3y
@Ron Brady From what I understand of NJ law on this, you cannot run a criminal check prior to acceptance. You can run a criminal check after, with consent. I like your approach as it’s the same as mine of setting high criteria and if in doubt keep moving. Would love to chat someday, I’m in Burlington county as well.
- Member since 2015 · 53 posts · 88 votes3yThe main issue is that with people, unlike mutual funds, past performance IS a predictor of future performance.
Having a bad credit score doesn't mean that person isn't going to pay their rent, but it makes it more likely that they're not going to pay.
Having an eviction doesn't mean I'm going to have to evict the person in the future, it just means it's more likely.
The same is true with a criminal conviction. If someone has shown that they're willing to assault, murder, steal, etc., in the past, then I'd rather myself nor my other tenants to be subjected to that person in case they do it again. - 3yJohn MorganPro MemberRental Property Investor · Grand Prairie, TX · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
CA is a joke. I lived there for 23 years and nonsense like this is why I moved to Texas which knows how to run the state effectively. And very landlord friendly! This will cause rental prices to increase there that much more since investors are leaving CA to invest their $ elsewhere. Who would want to invest in a place like that!? Good luck finding future RE investors there.
- Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes3y
California politics is controlled by the extreme left while the general population may have nothing to do with it but the one that makes California rich is the engineers, not the politician, but engineers --like Elon Musk said-- hates politics. So we're in a perfect hostage situation here.
I am not surprised if they're going to do anything crazier LOL as it's okay to do an open crime in a few cities now LOL
Not a surprise if San Francisco would become the new Detroit in 15 years where "it used to be great here" LOL - 3yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votesErrr, my friend , you need to get out more. It is already being referred to as such..... :-)
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Not a surprise if San Francisco would become the new Detroit in 15 years where "it used to be great here" LOL
- 3yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votesI actually made it for 40 years! But of course there were the 'old days' when Cali actually was a Red State.....
Quote from @John Morgan:
CA is a joke. I lived there for 23 years and nonsense like this is why I moved to Texas which knows how to run the state effectively. And very landlord friendly! This will cause rental prices to increase there that much more since investors are leaving CA to invest their $ elsewhere. Who would want to invest in a place like that!? Good luck finding future RE investors there.
- Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes3y
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
Errr, my friend , you need to get out more. It is already being referred to as such..... :-)Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Not a surprise if San Francisco would become the new Detroit in 15 years where "it used to be great here" LOL
ask my CEO to move the company hahaha I can't stand it anymore
you know what they all do this brainwashing at the company level tooI wish there is a time machine to travel back to 1983
- Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes3y
Quote from @Palmer Thomas:
The main issue is that with people, unlike mutual funds, past performance IS a predictor of future performance.the problem is not that, the problem is a at much higher level , for these people, there's this thing called "extreme equality" where criminals, bank robbers, church goers , CEO and a grandma , should have equal status to everything.
Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.