Clayton Morris Invest
Hampton, VA · Member since 2016 · 20 posts · 7 votes
Clayton Morris Invest
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Investor · Glendora, CA · Member since 2016 · 41 posts · 72 votes
9yEssentially, Morris Invest wants all-cash purchases on $50,000 houses in C to D neighborhoods. You have no real exit strategy on an investment like this. Take the $50k and use it for a couple of down payments on homes in better areas where you'll actually have the ability to sell the SFR to a family if you want to, not another investor.
I own a home in Franklin, IN, just south of Indy. It's a B+ or so area, with good schools, and a nice smaller town feel. I know I could put this house on the market and recoup my costs right away.
Before I purchased a turnkey home, I talked to about 15 different providers, talked to 10 different property mgmt companies, and analyzed hundreds of turnkey possibilities before making a decision.
My turnkey home is cash flowing about $200/mo for me (which includes 20% for vacancy/capex/repairs and 10% for prop mgmt--from a liquid point of view, I'm really cashflowing closer to $450/mo until I hit some vacancy or repairs).
Yes, you can cash flow with turnkey homes, you just have to know who you're buying from, be confident in the property management, and have ALL the exact numbers in your calculations. And, YOU MUST still have an exit strategy. Clayton's homes are in areas where home ownership is low, and the only other buyers are really other investors.
Don't trust what any turnkey provider says. Do the research yourself. I think you'll find there are far better options that a $50k home in D neighborhoods of Indianapolis.
70 Replies
- Investor · Concord, CA · Member since 2016 · 21 posts · 11 votes9y
rehab is also open for definition apparently. one example of a property that was already rehabbed was on zillow that sold a few weeks earlier for 18k. it was being offered with same pics from zillow but for $37k.
- Investor · Concord, CA · Member since 2016 · 21 posts · 11 votes9y
i guess i assumed that when im told the rehab is already completed that they actually played some part in the rehab.
- 9yAlex CraigBusiness MemberReal Estate Professional · Memphis, TN · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
Some of these experiences are disturbing. Especially @Stephanie Windemuth. While not every client and company are ideal for each other, common business sense is to always be friendly, even if you know from the start that the individual you are talking to is not a good fit for your business. The internet is forever and 1 bad review does so much damage.
- Real Estate Investor · Redmond, WA · Member since 2017 · 18 posts · 7 votes9y
@Brian E. - we talked with Dave K.
I should clarify all of this. Yes, we had/have significant reservations about the program. Clayton appears to be standup guy and the business model is brilliant. I suspect things have become unwieldy in size and I'm not sure how aware of that he is. We continue to read and listen to him as he has great ideas for real estate investing in general, and we have taken many of those ideas and flexed them around to fit our needs and goals.We also looked in depth at the property management company they have. There are many that look the same (identical or almost identical names, etc.) so it took us some time to verify that the business we were looking at was indeed the correct one. Getting in deeper in this area also was a red-flag for us. It was a single person, working out of their home. Information and contact was extremely limited. Again, if this company is managing of units, this didn't sit well with us.
I simply encourage people to do their due diligence here. Ask questions, then look/think. This may be a fit for some and not others. Ask things like...Why do they avoid using bank funding? Some very legitimate reasons (some that I have used myself!)....but...it also removes some of the checks/balances from the equation as well (appraisals, title search, inspections if an owner wants one). What if I want my units rehabbed differently? To a different standard? Who do the rehabbers report to? How are they paid (as in, we send money to cover the rehab, but if subs aren't paid that comes back on me...who is so out of the loop).
These things DO NOT need to be deal breakers, but people need to think thru them.
- 9yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Stephanie Windemuth I simply do not agree with you .. this business model is ANYTHING but brilliant.. its been tried over and over and each and every company has a run make a bunch of dough and leave the poor investor holding the bag and many losing almost all their money.
just not sustainable for a out of area person...
its a joke really
- 9yBrian GarrettPro MemberWestminster, CO · Member since 2016 · 68 posts · 22 votes
Wow - if I was looking to invest with a group and they responded with "you wouldn't understand how it works" I'd keep them on the phone until I understood.
Clayton Morris' podcasts is what got me looking into this path of investment. I just don't have time during the day that I can call and chat with someone about this kind of stuff, so I was going to wait until I had some time off. Kinda glad I waited now. I still think his podcasts have value - but maybe not the company in general. - Real Estate Agent · Damascus, OR · Member since 2016 · 19 posts · 1 vote9y
Originally posted by @Christian Ritter:
Hi @Robert Shelton - Just to add my two cents here. I actually have two SFH and three duplexes that I acquired through Morris Invest. They are in Indianapolis. They are professionally managed by Oceanpointe Investments. I can say I am happy with my ROI, the quality of their rehab work, and the team. I have viewed everything in person. Thus far, they have delivered on what was promised.
Anyway, I hope this helps. Thanks,
Christian
Christian. Saw your post. Im heading over there in a few weeks. Any other stuff you can let me know. Is oceanpoint there management company
- Real Estate Agent · Damascus, OR · Member since 2016 · 19 posts · 1 vote9y
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
@Stephanie Windemuth your correct there is NO company in the US that can rehab 100 homes per month.. that would mean they have 4 to 5 months of inventory. .IE just purchased beginning rehab middle rehab and closing.. so that would be 300 to 400 homes in inventory..
I just spent 2 days in Indy looking at my projects ( I have 22 going) and there simply is not 400 to 500 homes that could be purchased unless they are the absolute dogs of dogs..
Man O man thread after thread of the same stuff ... LOL... I mean who owns all this inventory ????
math simply does not add up.
Now to be fair I know a couple of companies one if fund others I don't that do 20 to 40 a month... so that number can be done.. but those companies have 10 to 15 million in cash out controlling the inventory and have appropriate staffing... go to Memphis and ask for an appointment with Memphis Invest or Reedy.. walk into their offices those are for real companies..
Jay. Hello. Tony Matic here Portland realtor and investor. What turnkey companies do you recommend in Indy. I have 5 in Pittsburgh and happy there just wanted to expand into another state and indy is right up my alley as far as price points. Any thoughts?
- 9yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Tony Matic happy to talk off line.. I am in PDX this week ping me.
- Real Estate Agent · Damascus, OR · Member since 2016 · 19 posts · 1 vote9y
Yes I will look you up. thanks..tony
- Mooresville, NC · Member since 2017 · 15 posts · 7 votes9yJay Hinrichs Thanks for all of your input on these threads. Definitely having second thoughts on keeping my call with them. I would be interested in hearing your thoughts regarding turnkey opportunities in the mid west. I'm looking at an apartment deal in OK with some partners but want something on my own. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.
- 9yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Chris H. its important to note that I am only commenting on what I know is industry norms and standards and the feedback by others who have personally viewed the properties plus my 10 plus year experience investing and lending in Indy.. You can draw your own conclusions.. however the imperial first hand feedback by California investor who have visited and passed is the most accurate and I think should hold the most weight.
- Investor · Redondo Beach, CA · Member since 2017 · 134 posts · 46 votes9y
@Brian Bertsch thanks for the info. I'm flying to indie to meet their team. Would you recommend them?
- Investor · Redondo Beach, CA · Member since 2017 · 134 posts · 46 votes9y
@Jay Hinrichs I will be flying out there this coming to meet with their team and take a tour. I'll let you know what I think. I do have to agree with a previous poster when they said communication has been questionable. I keep thinking it's a sign that this may not be a good idea, but I think we will know more when I actually meet the team and let my gut go to work.
- 9yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
@Vera Herlihy well have a safe trip... Just use logic.. and you should also have a unaffiliated real estate broker show U some listings as well in a better price point for indy which is 75 to 100k.. and then do some comparison.. I know its hard for west coast investor to understand the difference it makes in price points.. but you should be able to see it for yourself.
- Investor · Redondo Beach, CA · Member since 2017 · 134 posts · 46 votes9y
Thanks @Jay Hinrichs I'm actually hoping to also meet with another Turnkey provider.
- Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 20 posts · 35 votes8y
I purchased a home with Morris Invest over 3 months ago. Rehab was delayed, which is fine as I understand that can happen. Then now that it is done, they are working on getting it rented. That part still hasn't happened.
I would echo some of the points made by others on this thread and others. The #1, #2, and #3 problem with this organization is that the communication is probably the worst I have ever come across from what is supposed to be a "turnkey" real estate company (and I have worked with 2 others in other markets to purchase investment property). It literally takes 6-10 emails and/or at least 4 calls to get anything done with this group. Even when you email Clayton a question, half the time he doesn't respond and requires a repeat email. I understand he may be busy, but this company, at least in my experience, treats you like they are doing you a favor by giving you a deal on a property...so if they don't get back to you, just deal with it because once you buy from them as an out-of-state investor, you sort of need them to follow through on this promise of the high returns. Also, in my limited conversations with them, there have been a couple of times where they offer you a deal, and then they say "we usually offer this deal to our VIP clients." I'm not sure what that means, but I assume that would mean the people that buy 10 fixer-upper houses from them at a time or something. Sure makes me, the guy who bought one, feel like I'm not important in their book of business at all. Also, if they have VIP clients and non-VIP clients, do the save the best deals (better neighborhoods, better returns, etc.) for the VIP's and leave everything else to the rest? Just makes me wonder.
I sincerely hope I have a chance to update this review in the next couple months with more positive feedback, but at this point, the experience has been so poor and the communication has been so unbelievably poor that I would rather opt for a lower return in a different market with a different 'turnkey' real estate provider than work with these guys again.
To end on a positive note, they do have a lot of good information on their youtube videos that is worth a look as a lot of this info can be applied to real estate investing in general.
- 8yJames B.Pro MemberInvestor · Monterey Area, CA · Member since 2011 · 150 posts · 81 votes
I just listened to two podcasts (Kiyosaki and Get Rich Education) that featured Clayton Morris. He must be advertising.
Anybody have any updates for this thread? Seems like lack of communication is the theme here (that would drive me crazy as I tend to over communicate with my TK folks in Memphis:))
In today’s age of cell, email, video there’s no reason not to have all the info you request and require...
- Specialist · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes8y
Originally posted by @Tom J.:
I purchased a home with Morris Invest over 3 months ago. Rehab was delayed, which is fine as I understand that can happen. Then now that it is done, they are working on getting it rented. That part still hasn't happened.
I would echo some of the points made by others on this thread and others. The #1, #2, and #3 problem with this organization is that the communication is probably the worst I have ever come across from what is supposed to be a "turnkey" real estate company (and I have worked with 2 others in other markets to purchase investment property). It literally takes 6-10 emails and/or at least 4 calls to get anything done with this group. Even when you email Clayton a question, half the time he doesn't respond and requires a repeat email. I understand he may be busy, but this company, at least in my experience, treats you like they are doing you a favor by giving you a deal on a property...so if they don't get back to you, just deal with it because once you buy from them as an out-of-state investor, you sort of need them to follow through on this promise of the high returns. Also, in my limited conversations with them, there have been a couple of times where they offer you a deal, and then they say "we usually offer this deal to our VIP clients." I'm not sure what that means, but I assume that would mean the people that buy 10 fixer-upper houses from them at a time or something. Sure makes me, the guy who bought one, feel like I'm not important in their book of business at all. Also, if they have VIP clients and non-VIP clients, do the save the best deals (better neighborhoods, better returns, etc.) for the VIP's and leave everything else to the rest? Just makes me wonder.
I sincerely hope I have a chance to update this review in the next couple months with more positive feedback, but at this point, the experience has been so poor and the communication has been so unbelievably poor that I would rather opt for a lower return in a different market with a different 'turnkey' real estate provider than work with these guys again.
To end on a positive note, they do have a lot of good information on their youtube videos that is worth a look as a lot of this info can be applied to real estate investing in general.
Tom, any update for us?
- Specialist · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes8y
Originally posted by @Account Closed:
Originally posted by @Tom J.:
I purchased a home with Morris Invest over 3 months ago. Rehab was delayed, which is fine as I understand that can happen. Then now that it is done, they are working on getting it rented. That part still hasn't happened.
I would echo some of the points made by others on this thread and others. The #1, #2, and #3 problem with this organization is that the communication is probably the worst I have ever come across from what is supposed to be a "turnkey" real estate company (and I have worked with 2 others in other markets to purchase investment property). It literally takes 6-10 emails and/or at least 4 calls to get anything done with this group. Even when you email Clayton a question, half the time he doesn't respond and requires a repeat email. I understand he may be busy, but this company, at least in my experience, treats you like they are doing you a favor by giving you a deal on a property...so if they don't get back to you, just deal with it because once you buy from them as an out-of-state investor, you sort of need them to follow through on this promise of the high returns. Also, in my limited conversations with them, there have been a couple of times where they offer you a deal, and then they say "we usually offer this deal to our VIP clients." I'm not sure what that means, but I assume that would mean the people that buy 10 fixer-upper houses from them at a time or something. Sure makes me, the guy who bought one, feel like I'm not important in their book of business at all. Also, if they have VIP clients and non-VIP clients, do the save the best deals (better neighborhoods, better returns, etc.) for the VIP's and leave everything else to the rest? Just makes me wonder.
I sincerely hope I have a chance to update this review in the next couple months with more positive feedback, but at this point, the experience has been so poor and the communication has been so unbelievably poor that I would rather opt for a lower return in a different market with a different 'turnkey' real estate provider than work with these guys again.
To end on a positive note, they do have a lot of good information on their youtube videos that is worth a look as a lot of this info can be applied to real estate investing in general.
Phil Pustejovsky videos way more info than Morris.
Morris using his wife is pure genius. She adds that cutesy little girl thingy, hard to understand her but who cares. TRANSPARENCY since I'm a serious part timer I dontlisten to Morris anymore.
Give us an example of what you bought.
Agree completely. They buy and rehab a place for $15-20K all-in cost and brag about their financial freedom.. However, they would sell this same place for $40-50K to an investor. So the investor is in $50K with no ability to leverage. How are they supposed to cash flow and acheive financial freedom? The whole thing smelled of intellectul dishonesty my first time hearing about it.
Its nice to be able to acquire the units for 40 cents on the dollar compared to what is then offered to investors. But lets not rub it in the poor investors face who is out 2-3X the money for the same house.
- Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 20 posts · 35 votes8y
Unfortunately no promising update...I contacted the PM company few more times (by phone and email). Someone got back to me and said that they are still working on it and gave pretty much no details. The property is not fully cash flowing yet. Not sure how this is going to turn out long term. There are multiple TK companies out there. If you are considering investing and decide on this one, just realize what you are getting into. Perhaps they are growing too fast to be able to handle the demand or they are just figuring things out as they go. Either way, not a great situation for someone wanting true "turnkey" investing.
- Specialist · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes8y
Originally posted by @Tom J.:
Unfortunately no promising update...I contacted the PM company few more times (by phone and email). Someone got back to me and said that they are still working on it and gave pretty much no details. The property is not fully cash flowing yet. Not sure how this is going to turn out long term. There are multiple TK companies out there. If you are considering investing and decide on this one, just realize what you are getting into. Perhaps they are growing too fast to be able to handle the demand or they are just figuring things out as they go. Either way, not a great situation for someone wanting true "turnkey" investing.
Could you share some more details please. Have you already closed escrow? How much did you purchase the property for? What is the expected ROI after expenses?
If the individual I purchased the property from, who also happens to control the rehab and management, was not answering emails I'd be ticked and try to pull out of the deal.
- Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2017 · 20 posts · 35 votes8y
These are low cost properties...relative speaking. So there isn't escrow and all. U pay the cost and rehab up front and then they rent it out after rehab is complete. Purchased for around $50k. Rent is supposed to be $700 per month. 10% PM fee on gross rent. Tax and insurance is around $600-800 per year. Expected ROI, net of all expenses is supposed to be ~$7000 per year on a $50000 property so ~14-15% is the expected cash return (not accounting for vacancy). That is the attraction because that is the UNLEVERAGED return. Leverage would amplify that return but they don't deal with anyone that needs a loan to purchase so that's something to be aware of if you consider going with them.
- 8yJames B.Pro MemberInvestor · Monterey Area, CA · Member since 2011 · 150 posts · 81 votes
Hi Tom, if you want leverage (financing) some lenders do loan on properties sub $50-$60k.
I prefer financing, as it increases your cash on cash return, and I like to carry mortgages (especially at today’s low rates) because I like loan balances that my wonderful tenants pay down ;)
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