Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2014 · 174 posts · 23 votes
I am soooooo disappointed at BP. A site that I have recommended to many friends and family.
I was so excited watching some of the podcasts for the last few days, and just realized wow, this could just be a whole big load of BS. (not the whole site and its purpose, but in some aspects the money making aspect of BP and some of its members).
I am pretty good at spotting a lie, and that guy was a typical drug induced sales guy lie poop bag. Maybe he has done 2-3 wholesale deals and is now spewing bs about wholesaling to make money in his "coaching" business.
Please just remove his podcast and let this be done.
Escondido, CA · Member since 2016 · 5 posts · 13 votes
10y
Sounds like borderline paranoia to me to be honest. Understand that not everything in life is for you. The things that rub you the wrong way, offend, or upset you... Choose to move on. No need to elaborate the negativity. Even if they are so called scam artists, unless you invested money and lost it to the 'criminals' or know someone who has been royally screwed over by them, not sure if there's a need to trash talk BP etc...? Especially when you are basing this all off of a hunch or personal beliefs.
Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2014 · 174 posts · 23 votes
10y
PURSED LIPS! These guys may have experience in wholesaling and turnkey, etc. But their primary source of income is coaching and non performing turnkey sales in warzones. Tom Krol did not do 100+ deals in 18 months, his tell is his pursed lips before/after a lie. Clayton Morris is a warzone slumlord, turnkey trapartist. Watch some Brain Games and then watch their many videos and google their info... All obvious....
Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2014 · 174 posts · 23 votes
10y
Not everything they say is bad or a lie (some of their methods may perhaps work in real life, maybe not the exact numbers), at least they try to motivate, but when the info you are using to motivate is a lie, it can be extremely unmotivating.
Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2014 · 174 posts · 23 votes
10y
We are in a new age of organized crime, where criminals do something sooooo nearly legal that appears moral on the surface, but when actually analyzed is either a scam or fraud. Its actually so scary now that these criminals can connect over the internet and partner up just like that. Its like the computer matches their brain waves and they can sense themselves over the internet. LoL, sad but honestly I cant come up with a better explaination.
NYC, NY · Member since 2016 · 617 posts · 456 votes
10y
@Martin S. You seem to have a beef with one or two of the podcast guests. Clayton Morris and Tom somebody. Who in the world is Tom Troll? And did you leave your comment at the end of the podcast? It might have gotten to Josh and Brandon just a bit quicker.
Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2014 · 174 posts · 23 votes
10y
No. I don't know them at all. I just started watching the podcasts yesterday, even though I have been on BP for a while. I just like to do my research when I learn something or relearn something. And the research didn't show good things on both of them. Like I said watch some Brain Games and learn the truth.
Escondido, CA · Member since 2016 · 5 posts · 13 votes
10y
Sounds like borderline paranoia to me to be honest. Understand that not everything in life is for you. The things that rub you the wrong way, offend, or upset you... Choose to move on. No need to elaborate the negativity. Even if they are so called scam artists, unless you invested money and lost it to the 'criminals' or know someone who has been royally screwed over by them, not sure if there's a need to trash talk BP etc...? Especially when you are basing this all off of a hunch or personal beliefs.
Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2014 · 174 posts · 23 votes
10y
Yea maybe. I'm just giving a heads up. It was a bit disappointing that it was on a BP podcast. I come here to learn more about real estate, get advice, and maybe get some motivation, so you can imagine it could be surprising that this community could support scammers and fraudsters, especially since I am very used to using free online forums for nearly everything in my life and most forums are places where people with good morals go to actually give good advice. I know that the forums need to make money, but that shouldn't include supporting scammers or fraudsters, it should be by advertising in legitimate businesses, just like every other popular forum does, with no bias.
Huntington Beach, CA · Member since 2016 · 15 posts · 1 vote
10y
This is the perfect place to share scepticism. where else would you? Want to know more... schedule a call with them. I wanted to believe but I don't anymore. Having them as guests on the BP podcast brings makes me worry about BP in general. I know there are good people with good info but scammers are more vocal it seems
Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2014 · 174 posts · 23 votes
10y
All it takes is a few minutes with google. And maybe a couple episodes of Brain Games to get your brain working.
It would have been nice if I wrote you an entire article and spent hours to share all that info with you with links and maybe an investigation, but seriously, that's just spoon feeding and a waste of time for me. I honestly don't have a lot of time and I don't share too much info. But I do not like scammers and fraudsters, and I'd point them out when I can.
Brooklyn, NY · Member since 2014 · 174 posts · 23 votes
10y
Look, honestly I don't really care. There are scams everywhere. I pretty much see everything as a scam. Its just some may be more moral than others. I see retail as a scam, the retailer spent half of what they are selling those goods to you for. Oil, gold, diamonds, wood and other natural resources were stolen from the earth and sold for lots of money. When did god give them the right to own it all? Insurance, taxes, bad lawyers, this and that, I can go on forever. These are just bad scams to rip people off completely. But like I said I really don't care, do your own research, I likely will not spend more time coming back to argue my case as it is not worth my time.
Real Estate Investor · Tacoma, WA · Member since 2013 · 87 posts · 55 votes
10y
Martin S.
You are being ridiculous when you call commodities like wood and oil a scam. No one is forcing you to buy it. Go fell your own trees, rip and plane them into lumber yourself. Go collect used cooking oil and modify your vehicle to run on it. People do it all the time.
There is true wisdom in learning to discern between scam and opportunity. This is why the wise are wealthy. Even a lazy farmer will call a failed harvest a scam. You are only short-changing your own life with your paranoia.
I'm not defending the people you call scammers (never heard of them) but I give no credibility to you.
Wholesaler · Madison , WI · Member since 2016 · 79 posts · 64 votes
10y
I believe the 100 wholesale deals came from him partnering with people who joined his coaching program. the results are real but the details are skewed, IMHO.
Tom is a great guy from what I can tell, he just doesn't give all the details, not to be deceitful but in order to motivate people.
You can wholesale and close a bunch of deals and make money, but all the "just go out and do it BS is the reason people get into the business and then quit, they aren't properly prepared for the realities of running a business, wholesaling can be very profitable, you CAN make a ton of money in a short amount of tkme (6-12 months) but that only comes after about a year of education and a few months of failure.
Columbus, OH · Member since 2015 · 117 posts · 175 votes
10y
This post made me laugh because I didn't believe what was coming out of the guys mouth and actually had to turn the podcast off. No big deal, move on to the next one. Let me also include that I'm a professional wholesaler and have been doing it full time for 6.5 years now. I've completed hundreds of transactions and now average about 4-6 transactions per month. Made $56k my first year, $94k the second and have made over $100k every year since. There was something about Tom Krol that rubbed me the wrong way to and my first impression was that he was full of ****! If these guys are making so much money doing it, why waste your time teaching? If you're doing as many deals as you say, how do you have time to mentor? I'm mailing 12,000 pieces a month, have 2 full time VA's, a full time Sales Manager, my wife helping full time and I'm still putting in 40-60hrs a week. Makes me think of the old saying. Those who can't do, teach...
Wholesaler · Madison , WI · Member since 2016 · 79 posts · 64 votes
10y
Let me get on a podcast I'll keep it real... Wholesaling is hard, I only closed 14 deals in the past 12 months it's my first year, average deal net is about $11,800. I don't have the energy or good looks tom has but I'm honest!
Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
10y
Hi all,
@Martin S. I am glad you have brought up some scary aspects of some topics and unscrupulous posters that post on Bigger Pockets. What I have found in this world, not just on Bigger Pockets, is that people want something for nothing, instanteous gratification. This is a diseased mentality. If it seems too good to be true, it most certainly is a scam!!
I will offend many people or posters on Bigger Pockets with my explanation of why this is so. I don't want another job. That is what flipping, wholesaling, and no down etc... strategies to invest in real estate is all about.
Due to all my posts in the past, people have contacted me with a range of these so called mehthods. Again, I have learned that the only two rules that stand the test of time are:
1. It can't lose money.
2. It must cash flow.
If you flip or wholesale, you are taxed at the highest tax rate and then you have to go out and do it again and again. Also, many people that have contacted me want to use other people's money. However, they don't have any track record of success. I explain to them, that I won't give you my hard earned and saved Real Estate Investment dollars to an inexperienced member on Bigger Pockets.
I will be a principal owner in over 85 front doors by November or December at the latest. In 2011, My wife and my parents went in with me on a little 1bed and 1 bath condo in San Diego. I put in $17,000 and my parents put in $17,000 for a down payment on a $135,000 sale price. That one cash flowed, after all expenses, $330.00 a month. We 1031 exchanged that property for a 10 unit apartment complex 4 years later. We sold that little condo for $205,000.00. Plus we received cash flow for those years we owned the property.
We have continued to defer our taxes and do the same buying 9 more condos from 2011 through 2013. This was not something for nothing, instantaneous gratifying, diseased mentality. We put 25% down and cashed in all IRA's refinanced our personal residences and used properly leveraged debt to acquire these properties.
We are expecting to go from $120,000 in tax deferred cash flow per year to $250,000 in the next 2 years. That translates into about 100-120 front doors. In e next 8-10 years, we have high goals of going from as of this December 6 million in owned Real Estate and 2.5 million net worth to 50 million in owned Real Estate and 16 million in net worth. Approximately, 800-1000 front doors will need to be 1031 exchanged in that period of time.
This will not be easy. Although, if we receive half our goals, that would mean about $400,000-$500.000 in tax deferred cash flow yearly in 8-10 years. Imagine half of that. $200,000-$250,000 of tax deferred cash flow.
Soooooooo, it is difficult to know what is real and not real here on Bigger Pockets. My advice to you is to do Real Estate the right way and make your investment decisions based on those 2 rules I live by now.
1. It can't lose money
2. It must cash flow.
Be very careful out their my Bigger Pockets Friends!!