The plea for females on the podcast...
Member since 2018 · 10 posts · 13 votes
The plea for females on the podcast...
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to play the other side of the coin - why prioritize the content provider's gender rather than the content itself? Shouldn't the content be the primary goal? While I understand wanting diversity and the need for different voices, do we want to hear diversity on the podcasts? or do we want to hear the best available content?
I think diversity is great, and I work with a female real estate agent - but I work with her because she knows what she is doing, and because we have a great working relationship, not because she is female. It may sound insensitive (and if so, I apologize, as that is not my intent), but I don't prioritize equality over quality.
I haven't seen it as a topic on the podast (and it may have already been done), but perhaps a good topic (or topics) would circle around women and/or minorities and having a discussion about what their biggest challenges were in getting established and how they overcame those challenges (regardless of whether the challenge was actually gender or ethnicity)?
29 Replies
- 7yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
don't know why you think its a boys club.. women realtors far out number male realtors..
- Real Estate Broker · Raleigh, NC · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes7y
@Sarah Hood I know when I did the podcast, BP said they were having a hard time getting female guests, and it was a goal of theirs to represent women more. But, it's probably just the ratio of men to women in this field, and that plays out in the number of available podcast guests. I have some friends who started a new podcast devoted to only women in real estate investing called the Real Estate InvestHER show. Check it out!
to play the other side of the coin - why prioritize the content provider's gender rather than the content itself? Shouldn't the content be the primary goal? While I understand wanting diversity and the need for different voices, do we want to hear diversity on the podcasts? or do we want to hear the best available content?
I think diversity is great, and I work with a female real estate agent - but I work with her because she knows what she is doing, and because we have a great working relationship, not because she is female. It may sound insensitive (and if so, I apologize, as that is not my intent), but I don't prioritize equality over quality.
I haven't seen it as a topic on the podast (and it may have already been done), but perhaps a good topic (or topics) would circle around women and/or minorities and having a discussion about what their biggest challenges were in getting established and how they overcame those challenges (regardless of whether the challenge was actually gender or ethnicity)?
- 7yMindy JensenPro MemberBiggerPockets Money Podcast Host · Longmont, CO · Member since 2014 · 7k+ posts · 10k+ votes
Hi @Sarah Hood . I schedule the guests for both podcasts, and finding qualified women for the real estate podcast is especially difficult. Our show interviews experienced real estate investors - we define that as having been part of at least 10 deals as the buyer or seller. (Being part of at least 10 deals as a real estate agent isn't what we're looking for on this show.)
The place to apply to be on the show is www.biggerpockets.com/guest and the overwhelming gender of applications is male. The women who are applying are rare, and in many cases, are vendors who want to promote their product or service rather than share their investing story.
I reach out to women at meetups and in the community as I encounter them to ask their story, but for the most part, it is men applying. We need to produce a show every week, so we're always looking for guests. But the guests need to fit into our parameters so we can continue to produce the show we want to produce, which is interviews with experienced investors.
We have a few women coming on the show in upcoming weeks, including one of the co-hosts of the InvestHER podcast mentioned above.
- Member since 2018 · 10 posts · 13 votes7y
Actually it was Brandon on the podcast that made the plea. I really like the show. I simply wanted to offer the feedback that if women talked to each other the way Brandon and David do they would not be considered funny. The locker room male ribbing seems easy and natural to some, it can be very uncomfortable for women. We don’t usually build rapport by chiding each other about appearance, for instance.
When I searched a forum topic under “women” nothing came up. So clearly there is not an ongoing discussion on that topic.
It is true that there are many RE agents that are women, but not many women investors. When RE investing can be such a great way for moms to scale up and down a business as their “life balance” dictates, why should they be underrepresented? And why are women starting their own podcasts if they are comfortable in an egalitarian, merit based world of Real Estate?
I really don’t want to stand out as the lone harpy of feminism, thus my above stated reluctance to post this morning. But since a question was raised, I felt my feedback might be usefull. And then it was so misunderstood, I felt the need to reply.
There ARE women centric issues I’d like to see discussed further. And yes I’d also like to hear about the obstacles overcome by members of other underrepresented groups. Those stories could be useful to us all.
My wife has been instrumental in 100+ deals, (30+years), runs ALL the banking, accounting & TAX prep for the CPA, designs the rehabs & some were extensive (in a hopeless effort to keep me under budget). She actively mentors several young kids who invest through us &/or buy from us. She also designed & GC'd our home & 1200 sq ft addition. Finished my sons new build because the GC walked & guides all our kids in their various REI endeavors. But she will rarely discus it with anyone outside of immediate family.
@Pat L. get her on the show!
I haven't listened to the podcast in ages, but remember some very, very good female guests. One lady from the Seattle area who was wonderful about articulating her business mission of providing safe, functional housing, and then, I think her name is Paula Pant from Afford Anything. I've always enjoyed those episodes.
I wonder how many female commercial brokers are out there?
I appreciate the effort to find female role modes for other female investors, and also think its worthwhile for female investors to put some effort into lifting each other up with encouragement whenever possible.
Well said @Sarah Hood - the jocular interactions work fine for some of the men but it’s less comfortable sounding when there are female guests. Just want to make sure you get the support comments as well.
Keep looking for female guests, and other underrepresented groups, that qualify - we are out there!
It’s a Great podcast - keep going!
Marla
I went to an investors conference earlier this year that was about 700 people, and I'll estimate that about 30-40 of those people were women. I've been to smaller investor gatherings where out of 30 people, I've been the only female there who is not a "wife". It is a little uncomfortable, but you know, I choose to hang out in places where the people are wonderful, and so I had no worries about being welcomed, these folks I hang with are generally awesome people.
What was interesting to me was that at the conference, two of their three main speakers were women -- Randi Zuckerberg (that is, Mark Zuckerberg's sister, who is also the creator of Facebook Live and creator of a kids show called Dot, Dot Complicated and a new initiative called Sue's Test Kitchen, that are all about kids and technology). One of the other speakers was Jill Furman, a Broadway producer (who apparently made the introduction to Randi Zuckerberg for the conference organizers).As far as I can tell, his 700 mostly male audience was very appreciative and loved both presenters. As a female, I was inspired, and thankful.
Also at this conference, it was very interesting how other women approached me with warmth and kindness. Having these new women friends helped me feel "less weird" about being there in the first place. And these women were so impressive, I am so thankful to have met them.
So anyway, just sharing some experiences.
I will also share that one of my current business heroes is Katrina Lake, CEO of Stitch Fix. She's a very successful young female entrepreneur and she has articulated some of the struggles of starting out and taking her company public in an investing world that is full of guys.
- Real Estate Broker · Canton, GA · Member since 2010 · 15k+ posts · 11k+ votes7y
There are lot's of female commercial brokers out there. CREW is an organization within commercial real estate.
I view a person as a person and a professional. People in general can have limiting self beliefs in their own minds of how things are or what can be achieved.
In commercial it Is more analytics and numbers. I have had some friends on the residential side tell me they enjoy that part more as they can relate emotionally to helping families buy their home etc. So it really comes down to personal preference and what you enjoy.
A big base of investors here are just getting started so lot's of content centers around that versus more advanced topics that seasoned investors would tend to enjoy more of.
It is odd that I never considered that females had barriers to entering real estate investing. I know that there is generally a " good old boys club" to everything business related and there are fewer women interested but never paused to consider money had a gender.
I don't see beyond the money which is why I did not appreciate there were barriers for women.
I feel this is nonsense and political correctness run amuck to push for something that just isn't there . It's The same reason every advertisement has to have a person of every known ethnicity background and hair color on earth so no ones feelings are hurt . Affirmative action for real estate podcasts now ? Have we become that thin skinned as a culture already ? The reality is statistically it ( REI) is likely more of a male demographic just like hunting or hockey or football or skeet shooting etc..
I don't think this topic is about political correctness I think women investors are simply interested in hearing from other women.
I do however agree about political correctness in general though. Flogging a dead horse in my opinion. Advertisers are becoming pathetic in their attempt to show equality in advertising. It's being taken to the extreme and by doing so is in effect mocking ethnicity etc.
- Member since 2018 · 10 posts · 13 votes7y
Originally posted by @Pat L.:
My wife has been instrumental in 100+ deals, (30+years), runs ALL the banking, accounting & TAX prep for the CPA, designs the rehabs & some were extensive (in a hopeless effort to keep me under budget). She actively mentors several young kids who invest through us &/or buy from us. She also designed & GC'd our home & 1200 sq ft addition. Finished my sons new build because the GC walked & guides all our kids in their various REI endeavors. But she will rarely discus it with anyone outside of immediate family.
Thanks for sharing this Pat L! She sounds like an extraordinary woman. I wonder why she doesn’t like to talk about her endeavors? I am very curious about all the secret married businesswomen out there, the “wives” at the conferences who are keeping the books and acting as GC.
@Sarah Hood she honestly feels its bad luck to talk about successes. However, I honestly believe that a lot of guys out there are REI millionaires simply because their wives &/or SO kept a tight rein on the expenses. From our own acquaintances the women (in business) are notorious for maintaining tight achievable budgets.
- Rental Property Investor · Salem, OR · Member since 2017 · 696 posts · 660 votes7y
@Sarah Hood I would say that Pat's wife is an extraordinary person. That she is a woman should not matter, and I think that most of the replies are saying the same thing. None of us care what sex and/or gender the person is, man, woman, non-binary, whatever, it is open to anyone who wants to work hard. That is one of the great things about real estate, some of us have high school degrees, and some are PHDs, some were born here, and many were not.
Would it be great to have some other stories on the podcast (women, people of different family structure, country of origin, etc) SURE, I think we all agree. I believe that some people take issue with is that there is some kind of barrier or "committee" that is stopping people. It is like stand up comedy...the mic is there, just put your name on the list and stand up!
Last point. Brandon and David etc. and the way they interact is fine, it is real, and it is human. @Mindy Jensen gives those guys crap as well and she should! (Mindy is my personal hero BTW...and she raps...I heard it on Mad Fientist podcast with Mindy, and her husband from their blog...which is fantastic)
I never fail to be surprised that people who see mostly the way that people are different can feel like they are more "woke" than people who see everyone as just a person. (that was a general comment not aimed at Sarah or anyone else.)
Hey fellow women investors! I agree with the perception that there are not enough women represented. I think we should encourage more participation on the boards and on podcasts.... Perhaps BP could create a series of "women in investing" and perhaps lower the criteria to try to encourage more women to participate. For example, I have been a part of 7? (i think I need to count) deals... but while the number may be low the value is high. (multiple millions)... I am not suggesting having me on the podcast, merely suggesting that there may be other criteria that may be valid.
Also, I think everyone benefits when everyone feels encouraged to be a part of the boards for example. I actually was surprised at the male "tone" of the boards and decided that I would just start interjecting a more "female" perspective to hopefully encourage others.....
This is a good and important discussion to be having.
Originally posted by @Mindy Jensen:
Hi @Sarah Hood . I schedule the guests for both podcasts, and finding qualified women for the real estate podcast is especially difficult. Our show interviews experienced real estate investors - we define that as having been part of at least 10 deals as the buyer or seller. (Being part of at least 10 deals as a real estate agent isn't what we're looking for on this show.)
The place to apply to be on the show is www.biggerpockets.com/guest and the overwhelming gender of applications is male. The women who are applying are rare, and in many cases, are vendors who want to promote their product or service rather than share their investing story.
I reach out to women at meetups and in the community as I encounter them to ask their story, but for the most part, it is men applying. We need to produce a show every week, so we're always looking for guests. But the guests need to fit into our parameters so we can continue to produce the show we want to produce, which is interviews with experienced investors.
We have a few women coming on the show in upcoming weeks, including one of the co-hosts of the InvestHER podcast mentioned above.
I'm just curious about how you define "deals." For example, my husband and I buy groups of properties, we bought two side-by-side 4-units at the same time from the same owner with separate residential loans. Is that 1 deal, 2 deals, or 8 deals? Similarly we bought 4 duplexes, a quad, and a SFR with one commercial loan from one owner, 13 units, 6 properties, 1 loan-- how many deals? Our last purchase was a 7-unit, a duplex, and tri-plex bought at the same time from two owners with two commercial loans? 12 units, 3 properties, 2 loans. Have we done 3 deals, 11 deals or 33 deals? If that is counted as 3 deals, I'll probably (given my goals) never have enough experience to do a podcast. If my experience is calculated as 11 deals, then I'd be eligible for a podcast with only 30 months of experience as a landlord and if you count deals by numbers of units I would have been eligible with a mere 8 months of landlording experience. Perhaps you need to use some additional criteria?
- Rental Property Investor · Salem, OR · Member since 2017 · 696 posts · 660 votes7y
@Jill F. I think you have done 11 deals, BUT 33 units, either way it brings a LOT of street cred (awesome work) I can not imagine the BP team would not look at anyone that submits an app and is able to see that clearly someone has relevant experience and is a motivation to the community even if they do not hit every one of the criteria that might be listed.
- Investor · Calgary, Alberta · Member since 2016 · 168 posts · 123 votes7y
Since I started listening to the podcasts, it's been my goal to eventually have enough experience and have done enough deals to be considered for a guest on the podcast. I'm only on deal #4 right now, but I have a feeling things are going to start happening much more quickly in 2019. I have also wondered why it seems there are so few women, but I hadn't realized there weren't many applying. Good information is good information whether it comes from a male or female, but hearing from another woman who's successful is nice as well. They can have a different perspective as they've probably had to deal with contractors and other people in business who, as I've experienced, raise an eyebrow when I say I can lay tile or install a floor, or tell me I should "talk to my husband about it first".
Great question about number of deals! I am curious too, as i have a similar experience -sold one SFH, 2 commercial bldgs, bought 5 duplexes (all contiguous ) bought, renovated (keeping period charm!) and sold a SFH built out an equestrian facility - how many deals??
- Investor · Atlanta, GA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes7y
I personally don't care what gender someone is. I'm more interested in the content of the book than the cover.
Yes, there may be differences between women and men in business, but I think it all evens out. Maybe a seller will let his/her guard down more easily with a woman and subsequently might be easier to be open and honest and create a win-win situation than a man might have with that same seller.
But then I might be talked down to the next subcontractor I try to get quotes from.
In my opinion, those are small things that don't really need special separation from the guys. But then I'm the type of woman that loves to hang out with guys and joke and tease.
And I, for one, would never want to be on a podcast, even though I fit their qualifications. I do things differently, often fly by the seat of my pants. Am willing to change directions, if opportunity jumps my way. I hate paperwork and am always late with getting organized I don't keep a big number of cash reserves and will rather take a chance and buy another property. I take chances, that I wouldn't recommend to anyone. I don't have a system. Have always created my own, new niches.I don't follow the call of 'more, more, more!" Overall I'm doing great, could retire with my rental income, but would just get bored.
- Ann Arbor, MI · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 997 votes7y
No one should be rewarded for simply existing. To believe otherwise is a dangerous road to entitlement; reward without action.
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