Cringeworthy self promotion on BP
Most Popular Reply
Investor · Dallas, TX · Member since 2009 · 718 posts · 913 votes
6y@Jeff C., Yep, there are definitely some cringeworthy threads going on. I think BP does an overall good job of keeping the marketing in marketplace, but you can tell a lot of these posters are pushing it right to the line. There's one in particular right now who, if you accept his boasting, is approaching Buffett-like heights of investing yet still somehow manages to find time to write all of his self-promoting posts while adding almost zero value in terms of content. It's like only he has the secret sauce and supernatural insight and the only logical conclusion is to see if you can offer him money and hopefully he will let you invest with him. Pass.
126 Replies
- Rental Property Investor · Concord, GA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes6y
I really look squinty eyed at posts that make statements like, "I went from $460,000 in debt to 863 doors in just 5 months!"
That's just numbers I made up but I think some of these posts are fabricated too. I've purchased a number of properties and just can't comprehend how someone could even identify that many potential properties and write offers on them in that period of time, let alone do a fraction of that many closings. So I just assume it's bullcrap. It may all be true but sorry, I can't believe it.
- 6yJeff C.Real Estate Broker · Bakersfield, CA · Member since 2018 · 269 posts · 597 votesOP
Originally posted by @John Teachout:
I really look squinty eyed at posts that make statements like, "I went from $460,000 in debt to 863 doors in just 5 months!"
That's just numbers I made up but I think some of these posts are fabricated too. I've purchased a number of properties and just can't comprehend how someone could even identify that many potential properties and write offers on them in that period of time, let alone do a fraction of that many closings. So I just assume it's bullcrap. It may all be true but sorry, I can't believe it.
The 2 step BP shortcut to owning 500 units:
1: Become a 1% investor in a 500 unit syndication deal
2: Put "acquired more than 500 units!", or something to that effect in your profile
Easy as pie.
- Rental Property Investor · Concord, GA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes6y
Yeah, there's that. At least that has a tinge of truth in it. ie, 1/500th amount of truth. But some of the posts I've seen I think are even much thinner. If I have 2 shares of Walmart stock I don't tell people I own the store...lol. (and I don't have 2 shares anyway.)
- 6yShiloh LundahlPro MemberRental Property Investor · Gilbert, AZ · Member since 2016 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
@Jeff C. To be honest, I do this all the time. I am a big self-promotor. But if I don’t promote myself, who else will?
Many people on this thread have mentioned a decline of the quality of the posts on BiggerPockets. I don’t think that the quality has necessarily gone down. If I want to know more about something then I will search for it in the search bar and I can learn about the topic from people that are posting about it now or from people who posted about it years ago.
In my option BiggerPockets has really been great to me. It has definitely been one of the best resources for learning and networking in real estate that I have found. Over the years, as I became more familiar with this site, I found that it was also a great place to increase interest in the lease option niche that we focus on. And as I post more about what we do and our niche, we have had many people reach out to us to lend to us on our deals so that they can get on our WhatsApp group and learn more about how we invest.
But I hear you, it can be off-putting when someone is blatantly advertising themselves. So when I post, I try to be more discrete in how I self promote like how I did it in the previous paragraph that I wrote above.
- Multifamily Syndicator · Houston, TX · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes6y
So glad someone started this forum topic.
I read every single comment and I did see one person who is a chronic self-promoter and cringeworthy, for sure. Fascinating to see they didn't do it on this post, how refreshing?!!!
For example, someone asks a question and the self-promoter says something: "well, I think you should do this or that because I have bought over XXX doors".I'm like dudeeeee! No one cares and no one leaves this planet with their XXX doors anyways (I see this chest-beating thing with men 97% of the time).
To conclude, I think it is ok to share your story in an organic way if warranted, as human beings are naturally wired to listen, remember and are attracted to storytelling but to plug shamelessly and on a consistent basis just makes it all too cringey and blatantly sleazy!
- Rental Property Investor · Chicago · Member since 2018 · 612 posts · 1k+ votes6y
One simple thing I do to help minimize is I cut down on the folks I followd and only follow folks that provide value. My dashboard is gonna have their comments and I start there instead of following something trendy
(I found this one cause Jay posted on it)
Not the end all solution by any means, but helps minimize.
- Appraiser · Leitchfield, KY · Member since 2018 · 54 posts · 42 votes6y
As a complete newbie I think this site is still top notch. The amount of knowledge I have gained from BP is unbelievable. The issues that are being mentioned here could apply to the internet in general. You have to do your own fact checking, learn how to see past the muck. Take everyone's favorite book Rich Dad Poor Dad for example. Its a great book but at the same time I wouldn't buy into a Robert K course, lol. To me it seems BP still does a good job on keeping the bs to a minimum. In fact I have avoided a few scams because of the information I have learned here. I think real estate attracts so many because they come here looking for a way to make a lot of money, quick and easy. there are people who prey on those looking for a quick easy fix. The ones who I see actually make it are the ones who realize there is a lot of work and learning involved,.
- 6yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Originally posted by @John Teachout:
I really look squinty eyed at posts that make statements like, "I went from $460,000 in debt to 863 doors in just 5 months!"
That's just numbers I made up but I think some of these posts are fabricated too. I've purchased a number of properties and just can't comprehend how someone could even identify that many potential properties and write offers on them in that period of time, let alone do a fraction of that many closings. So I just assume it's bullcrap. It may all be true but sorry, I can't believe it.
John, I think what you have with that is an investor puts 25k to 50k into a syndication that has a 400 unit property.. then reports they own 400 units without clarifying that they just own a small peice.. or they put 1000.00 into a crowdfunded deal.. yes they are owners but at what level.
or you get the post like I made a 22% return here is how I did it.. I think the deal diaries is a good place for those that want to talk about deals to put those .. then folks know what it is and if they want to give atta boys or atta girls they can.
Bottom line though syndication is soup de jour right now especially in the MF space.. will be interesting to see how it all settles out over the next decade.. As these types of investments were historically put together and run by very experienced people / companies Not someone who is pretty much a beginner in real estate with no real body of work behind them. Or significant personal capacity
- New Iberia, LA · Member since 2017 · 133 posts · 89 votes6y
The Ouroboros of CRE investing education. It's much the same in just Entrepreneur forums. It's all about becoming a thought leader or focal point in your space. Every podcast and book lately want you to become a podcaster or blogger etc to grow your Network. This bleeds over to any forums because it's about the funnel and numbers and conversions.
I have been coming around here for just over 2 years. What got me here? Morris Invests believe it or not. I saw some videos and listened to a podcast or two and thought this is great! The more I educated myself the further I moved away from the lure of easy money and realized that to do this right you need to know and understand a lot. In fact, I still haven’t done a deal, not even a % of a deal but I am slowly networking and trying to build relationships the right way with the right people. I see a lot of advice to jump right in but that's just not my style and I know that.
I had a conversation with a Broker I have made friends with who has given me some great feedback and we spoke about this recently. I mentioned that there are so many new people who want to know now and not have to educate themselves and this was his reply which I think fits here. “I think the reality one has to face is you are paying for the content to be placed in your lap as someone else sees fit rather than having to go hunt for that value” and that is where we are at.
Guru’s for money know this fact that so many people who have some money want to know NOW how to do this Real Estate thing and it’s just not that simple, but yet hundreds each day sign up for this type of teaching with little or no due diligence because they want it simple and spoon-fed to them. BP just makes that easy to just that, it’s a target-rich environment.
I love BP and what it provides but at times it is hard to look through the forum due to these types of posts.
I did go back and look and if “Hotel Guy” is who I think it is I will say that I have gotten lots of good information from him and it didn’t cost me anything. I know that this individual and his people are trying to put together an education platform that will be able to teach people about investing with a low barrier to entry as they are doing the same thing with Multi-Family. They are also somewhat new at the education part so at this stage it’s still a bit awkward at times, but I think their heart is in the right place, at least right now.
It may be that BP puts up a forum for Educational Programs/Offerings? Maybe they have a pay barrier to be able to post in that space? Maybe make them put up a mission statement about what it is they are trying to do as far as educating others? I do think there has to be a better way though, BP and the Community should be proactive in finding a way to see if there is value in an offering both short term and long term to better advise newer people to what is good, bad and indifferent.
- Rental Property Investor · Concord, GA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes6y
I have found Bigger Pockets as a whole to be a very good resource and I do spend quite a bit of time reading and learning on here. I've been a part of other "non real estate" forums as well and with experience, one learns how to sift through the manure to harvest the worthwhile content. Most of the time when the "braggers" get on here and feel the need to put into nearly every post about how they're a multi-millionaire, I think "good for them" but also think that it's not really necessary information in many contexts. I like hearing about successful investors and most of the people on here are investors or wanna be investors and want to be good at it. There's such a variety of ways to make money in this sector of the economy that it's fascinating. I got into real estate at a fairly mature (sounds better than old) age and really enjoy it. We work at it full time, live on our rental income and hope to create enough passive income so we can retire on it.
- 6yDave FosterBusiness MemberQualified Intermediary for 1031 Exchanges · St. Petersburg, FL · Member since 2013 · 9k+ posts · 9k+ votes
@John Teachout, Texans would say "big hat=no cattle".
The 1031 Investor5137 Reviews - Investor · Spring City, PA · Member since 2019 · 56 posts · 41 votes6y
@Jeff Cagle I just tried to share our first podcast and I was taken down immediately. I wasn’t trying to sell anything. Just get some feedback and hopefully connect with more of my tribe but I understand. It’s all good.
- Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @Pankaj Sharma:
@Jeff Cagle I just tried to share our first podcast and I was taken down immediately. I wasn’t trying to sell anything. Just get some feedback and hopefully connect with more of my tribe but I understand. It’s all good.
You can post it in the Marketplace, not in the forums.
District Invest Group546 Reviews - Real Estate Syndicator · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2018 · 903 posts · 1k+ votes6y
Its pretty typical to reflect on the good old days in any forum. Being in IT, I can say this happens on every IT forum for every technology at some point not to mention any Social Media platform. With a greater pool of forum contributors a greater variant of individuals is attracted and the audience/platform changes.
However on the upside, whenever I talk to a new investor, the positive value of Bigger Pockets prevails and I rarely hear anything about negative self-promotion. It would appear it is more those who've seen the transition that notice the discrepancy or the issue. The only thing constant is change.
In any case, there is much more value on sifting through self-promotion on BP then sifting through promotion TV ads while watching re-runs of NCIS. :)
- New Iberia, LA · Member since 2017 · 133 posts · 89 votes6y
Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:
Originally posted by @Pankaj Sharma:
@Jeff Cagle I just tried to share our first podcast and I was taken down immediately. I wasn’t trying to sell anything. Just get some feedback and hopefully connect with more of my tribe but I understand. It’s all good.
You can post it in the Marketplace, not in the forums.
The problem with this is that the Marketplace is not a catch-all. Yall did this to me on a post a while back as well and although it may not be for the general forum I was not trying to sell anything. When you get a lot of a type of post maybe it's time to start looking at creating a new section.
- Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @James Dickens:
Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:
Originally posted by @Pankaj Sharma:
@Jeff Cagle I just tried to share our first podcast and I was taken down immediately. I wasn’t trying to sell anything. Just get some feedback and hopefully connect with more of my tribe but I understand. It’s all good.
You can post it in the Marketplace, not in the forums.
The problem with this is that the Marketplace is not a catch-all. Yall did this to me on a post a while back as well and although it may not be for the general forum I was not trying to sell anything. When you get a lot of a type of post maybe it's time to start looking at creating a new section.
15 years we've had the rule in place. It is a primary rule to these forums, and one of the main reasons why these forums are not over run with spam linking back to thousands of peoples websites, while every other real estate forum online is filled up with those things.
District Invest Group546 Reviews - Investor · Spring City, PA · Member since 2019 · 56 posts · 41 votes6y
@Russell Brazil thanks for the heads up
- New Iberia, LA · Member since 2017 · 133 posts · 89 votes6y
Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:
Originally posted by @James Dickens:
Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:
Originally posted by @Pankaj Sharma:
@Jeff Cagle I just tried to share our first podcast and I was taken down immediately. I wasn’t trying to sell anything. Just get some feedback and hopefully connect with more of my tribe but I understand. It’s all good.
You can post it in the Marketplace, not in the forums.
The problem with this is that the Marketplace is not a catch-all. Yall did this to me on a post a while back as well and although it may not be for the general forum I was not trying to sell anything. When you get a lot of a type of post maybe it's time to start looking at creating a new section.
15 years we've had the rule in place. It is a primary rule to these forums, and one of the main reasons why these forums are not over run with spam linking back to thousands of peoples websites, while every other real estate forum online is filled up with those things.
Not trying to start a separate discussion or argue but how is that any different from your signature or many others? I see several items that would take me other places if I chose to click on them or copy and or paste.
Maybe the topics in Marketplace need to be diversified at least, Review my podcast, looking for a mentor, looking for mentees, etc? Don't just ban hammer posts to Marketplace which is a cluster of crap to begin with on most days. May even make the mod job a bit easier if some of the topics that you have to send there had a place for people to put them in the first place?
Food for thought....
- Olathe, KS · Member since 2018 · 148 posts · 207 votes6y
Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:
Originally posted by @James Dickens:
Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:
Originally posted by @Pankaj Sharma:
@Jeff Cagle I just tried to share our first podcast and I was taken down immediately. I wasn’t trying to sell anything. Just get some feedback and hopefully connect with more of my tribe but I understand. It’s all good.
You can post it in the Marketplace, not in the forums.
The problem with this is that the Marketplace is not a catch-all. Yall did this to me on a post a while back as well and although it may not be for the general forum I was not trying to sell anything. When you get a lot of a type of post maybe it's time to start looking at creating a new section.
15 years we've had the rule in place. It is a primary rule to these forums, and one of the main reasons why these forums are not over run with spam linking back to thousands of peoples websites, while every other real estate forum online is filled up with those things.
There's a certain amount of irony for someone getting moderated for posting a link by a moderator with four links in their signature. :)
- Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @Aaron Taylor:
Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:
Originally posted by @James Dickens:
Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:
Originally posted by @Pankaj Sharma:
@Jeff Cagle I just tried to share our first podcast and I was taken down immediately. I wasn’t trying to sell anything. Just get some feedback and hopefully connect with more of my tribe but I understand. It’s all good.
You can post it in the Marketplace, not in the forums.
The problem with this is that the Marketplace is not a catch-all. Yall did this to me on a post a while back as well and although it may not be for the general forum I was not trying to sell anything. When you get a lot of a type of post maybe it's time to start looking at creating a new section.
15 years we've had the rule in place. It is a primary rule to these forums, and one of the main reasons why these forums are not over run with spam linking back to thousands of peoples websites, while every other real estate forum online is filled up with those things.
There's a certain amount of irony for someone getting moderated for posting a link by a moderator with four links in their signature. :)
Anyone can have links in their signature line. Thats what the signature line is for if you so choose to have one. Signature lines are not search engine indexed, while the content on the forums is.
There is literally thousands of posts per week with members just posting links back to their content and websites. It would simply be one big spam fest if that were allowed, which is why its not.
District Invest Group546 Reviews - Specialist · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @John Chapman:
@Jeff C., Yep, there are definitely some cringeworthy threads going on. I think BP does an overall good job of keeping the marketing in marketplace, but you can tell a lot of these posters are pushing it right to the line. There's one in particular right now who, if you accept his boasting, is approaching Buffett-like heights of investing yet still somehow manages to find time to write all of his self-promoting posts while adding almost zero value in terms of content. It's like only he has the secret sauce and supernatural insight and the only logical conclusion is to see if you can offer him money and hopefully he will let you invest with him. Pass.
Please PM me and let me know who it is. I'd like a laugh and also so I know who to avoid :)
- Specialist · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2014 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @Aaron Taylor:
I was just thinking this same thing today and then I ran across this thread. The posting is starting to get a bit ridiculous at times, but where I really notice the difference is podcasts. Most of the podcasts I've been listening to for the past couple years have started to go downhill, mainly through loads of circular self promotion. Person A has a podcast and Person B comes on it, then A goes on B's, and then they both go on C's and he comes on their's, etc and they all say the same thing and the value just goes downhill quickly. Even the biggerpockets podcasts (which I love most of the time) have fallen victim to this.
Everyone is chasing capital and throwing out their best sales pitch constantly, like it's a frenzy out there now. Probably a bad sign, whenever there is overwhelming exuberance things tend to fall apart.
I do agree with the poster that the quality of posts in general seems to have fallen over the past year for some reason. The constant self promotion stuff isn't making that any better.
This is very well stated. IMO, the most informative, least spammy, and highest value per time spent were the BP forums in 2012 - 2015. About the time 'Bob Bowling' got banned (the guy he upset is a big name and author on BP and friends with the mods and uppers) for providing real value about Cap Rates. What he was staying didn't jive with the general (false) idea on here that higher cap rates are good, as well as promotion of Turnkey or "higher cap" returns. IMO, a great resource like that shouldn't have been banned because someone was offended by his blunt nature.
There is now a lot of promotion, spam, rehashing of the same stuff and capitalizing on newbies who won't take any action anyway. There are still a lot of smart people who if you sift hard enough provide a lot of value. Too bad there is a lot more sifting now than in the past :D
- Contractor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2016 · 267 posts · 144 votes6y
@Lynnette E. I think we can help by reporting them as it is usually pretty obvious and I don’t want BP to turn into a guru/influencer hangout.
It ruins the experience for everyone and I’m sick of seeing people being taken on every other site.
- Contractor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2016 · 267 posts · 144 votes6y
@Jeff Cagle I think Josh Dorkin is set to testify before Congress later this year about it.
- Contractor · Indianapolis, IN · Member since 2016 · 267 posts · 144 votes6y
@David Song really? Not much value? Bro, one BP member to another this is greatest accumulation of real estate investing info possibly and probably in world history.
Imperfect, sure. Nothing is perfect ( except my girlfriend ) but it is not only the best it is great. There’s are over hundreds of thousands of members or more most of whom are well intentioned, the best podcast on the planet, everyday thousands of people are being helped by other members who know more and share their knowledge.
This is the ultimate platform for real estate education and ought to be the model for all educational social platforms. Let’s not downplay it because of the few using it to their advantage.
Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.