Land investing for cash flow.
Specialist · Santa Cruz, CA (Santa Cruz) · Member since 2017 · 31 posts · 10 votes
Land investing for cash flow.
Most Popular Reply
Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votesMy dad started in the land business in 1966 right there in Loch Lomand Ben Lomand.. the office was at the Trout farm in. ( not sure if its still there or not.
so i grew up in the land business.. there are many ways of course for commerical use of land as you talked about above.
but one of the best ways is simply finding that smokin deal you pay cash for then sell it for more on terms and collect the payments..
so i grew up in the land business.. there are many ways of course for commerical use of land as you talked about above.
but one of the best ways is simply finding that smokin deal you pay cash for then sell it for more on terms and collect the payments..
36 Replies
- Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Matt R.:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @David Wilk:
@Jay Hinrichs Amazing, thanks for sharing. What years was this?
I started logging in 92 ended in 2000.. bought tree farm in 2000 for long term project and hold.. turned out to be a big winner. Tree farm was just 2 miles north of Willamina OR. our long term land plays now are prime properties on the border of the UGB in Washington county. And I had one in Rohnert Park CA that I just closed on in Jan.. I bought that bare land in 95 for 27k and sold in Jan for 1.9million to a developer.. its across the street from the Graton Casino.. it was unbuildable when I bought it that's why it was so cheap but Path of progress caught up to us.. I suspect if I had bought apple or google then we would have made the same money.
Jay those are great land deal stories. You crushed it. Apple in 1995 was in the dumps and no Steve Jobs back yet. 1996 he came back to save apple. A few stocks splits later and add 25 years that $27k is 32 mil today.
This eventually became the worlds most valuable company with Jobs back at that helm. Who knew, as they were down for the count in 95. You absolutely killed it anyways and sounds like the adventure was priceless. These are great stories.OH you just ruined my day.. for a short time I was in the Office building in Los Altos were Next computer was and would see jobs brown Benz in the handicap space LOL
They were toast in 95, you did the right thing based on info at the time. The stock was getting killed and even was under $1 for a time in 96. Jobs pulled a rabbit out of a hat. I was debating on sharing it but I think you are in a position to laugh it off.
- Member since 2020 · 1 post · 0 votes6y
Jay, you should make a course on deals involving timber. I've never seen one and even the big land flip gurus barely even touch on it. The closest I've seen is a guy that sells some ebooks on Amazon. The investing community would do well to have some detail on how to find and partner with loggers/ timber companies, how to scout timber, etc. In many cases, builders look at timber as a hassle and expense rather than an asset. I'd love to get together some investors, loggers, etc and create some sort of mastermind/ virtual conference on this, but not really sure how to identify all the right parties.
- Wholesaler · Sunnyvale, CA · Member since 2016 · 106 posts · 58 votes6y
@Michael Guydish I'm not going to lie, I didn't read every word of everyone's post because there was a great response, and I've got plenty of work to do haha. I have been flipping land for the past 3 years. Here is my advice from someone actively in the land business. Do not start out trying to figure out the timber game, it is a niche within the land business, and one with experienced investors. You need to start with the fundamentals and that's finding off market land deals at 20c on the dollar, doing due diligence, and selling those properties. Once you get that down you can move into more niched areas.
I would suggest you start by readings as much information as you can on the REtipster forums. Seth Williams is an authority in the space who has produced the best content on the niche that I'm aware of. And a lot of it is free. He has a course if you want it all spoon fed to you. But you should really read 10-20 articles on there and see if you feel like it's for you.
If you do decide that land is for you then I think the best way to generate cash flow is by selling land on owner financed notes like @Jay Hinrichs mentioned. Most folks follow a strategy where they try to get their cost basis in the property out on the down payment, then collect monthly cash flow (I.e. buy for 2k, sell for 8k with 2k down and $100-200/month), rinse repeat.
Personally, I only do cash flips, the velocity of money is much better if you just buy for 2k, sell for 4k, and keep doing that (that being said I play in the 5-15k acquisition, 10-30k sales price margins).
Land is a viable niche for cash flow, but I'd encourage you to do your research on a site like REtipster.com and see if you think it's for you. I send 3-4k direct mail letters per month, it is more like wholesaling than it is like buy and hold real estate.
Alternatively you could always try to network in the land forums and find someone to purchase a timber property from (we usually aim to sell at 70-80% of market value to keep that velocity of money up) and perhaps the timber numbers work for that. I'm not sure.
Hope that helps!
- 6yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Originally posted by @Matthew Bailey:
@Michael Guydish I'm not going to lie, I didn't read every word of everyone's post because there was a great response, and I've got plenty of work to do haha. I have been flipping land for the past 3 years. Here is my advice from someone actively in the land business. Do not start out trying to figure out the timber game, it is a niche within the land business, and one with experienced investors. You need to start with the fundamentals and that's finding off market land deals at 20c on the dollar, doing due diligence, and selling those properties. Once you get that down you can move into more niched areas.
I would suggest you start by readings as much information as you can on the REtipster forums. Seth Williams is an authority in the space who has produced the best content on the niche that I'm aware of. And a lot of it is free. He has a course if you want it all spoon fed to you. But you should really read 10-20 articles on there and see if you feel like it's for you.
If you do decide that land is for you then I think the best way to generate cash flow is by selling land on owner financed notes like @Jay Hinrichs mentioned. Most folks follow a strategy where they try to get their cost basis in the property out on the down payment, then collect monthly cash flow (I.e. buy for 2k, sell for 8k with 2k down and $100-200/month), rinse repeat.
Personally, I only do cash flips, the velocity of money is much better if you just buy for 2k, sell for 4k, and keep doing that (that being said I play in the 5-15k acquisition, 10-30k sales price margins).
Land is a viable niche for cash flow, but I'd encourage you to do your research on a site like REtipster.com and see if you think it's for you. I send 3-4k direct mail letters per month, it is more like wholesaling than it is like buy and hold real estate.
Alternatively you could always try to network in the land forums and find someone to purchase a timber property from (we usually aim to sell at 70-80% of market value to keep that velocity of money up) and perhaps the timber numbers work for that. I'm not sure.
Hope that helps!
Ya my point with timber was more long term buy hold as a hedge and a damn good investment for younger folks.. I don't expect anyone or many on BP to do what we did we had a 10 to 15 million dollar a year business going..
I grew up in the land game you speak of.. My dad bought lots in Northern CA for 50.00 to 500.00 each then sold them for 1k to 5k each some cash a lot on contract and then would sell the contract to an investor so he got cashed out.. our best year we did 800 sales. But we would buy 200 to 300 properties in one day at the tax sale.. but now with tax sales on line it is not nearly as good as it was then. When we could walk into the court house set up our team in the back and dominate.
CA has literally millions of bare lots were this play can work along with AZ NM TX and of course back east FLA we have been doing some last month in FLA and those have worked well..
I like the buy for cash sell for cash.
My Dad used to set up a one day sale in SF hotel.. no property over 990.00 and you had to bring CASH no checks and we had the deeds all prepped and just filled in the names and handed them the deeds usually sell 75 to 100 props in one day.
this even though its like wholesaling the difference though is U actually close and own the asset and resell it.. that's a good way to go.
- Wholesaler · Sunnyvale, CA · Member since 2016 · 106 posts · 58 votes6y
@Jay Hinrichs holy cow that's quite the operation! Yea the tax stuff is a lot easier to access these days. Most land investors do direct mail nowadays. I didn't read too much into the timber conversation on this thread to be honest. There was a lot of info in there. I feel as though it's best to start small then work your way into that niche within the land niche.
- Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @Matthew Bailey:
@Michael Guydish I'm not going to lie, I didn't read every word of everyone's post because there was a great response, and I've got plenty of work to do haha. I have been flipping land for the past 3 years. Here is my advice from someone actively in the land business. Do not start out trying to figure out the timber game, it is a niche within the land business, and one with experienced investors. You need to start with the fundamentals and that's finding off market land deals at 20c on the dollar, doing due diligence, and selling those properties. Once you get that down you can move into more niched areas.
I would suggest you start by readings as much information as you can on the REtipster forums. Seth Williams is an authority in the space who has produced the best content on the niche that I'm aware of. And a lot of it is free. He has a course if you want it all spoon fed to you. But you should really read 10-20 articles on there and see if you feel like it's for you.
If you do decide that land is for you then I think the best way to generate cash flow is by selling land on owner financed notes like @Jay Hinrichs mentioned. Most folks follow a strategy where they try to get their cost basis in the property out on the down payment, then collect monthly cash flow (I.e. buy for 2k, sell for 8k with 2k down and $100-200/month), rinse repeat.
Personally, I only do cash flips, the velocity of money is much better if you just buy for 2k, sell for 4k, and keep doing that (that being said I play in the 5-15k acquisition, 10-30k sales price margins).
Land is a viable niche for cash flow, but I'd encourage you to do your research on a site like REtipster.com and see if you think it's for you. I send 3-4k direct mail letters per month, it is more like wholesaling than it is like buy and hold real estate.
Alternatively you could always try to network in the land forums and find someone to purchase a timber property from (we usually aim to sell at 70-80% of market value to keep that velocity of money up) and perhaps the timber numbers work for that. I'm not sure.
Hope that helps!
Is there not a program now that list all the owners via satellite view with contact names, numbers, addresses even facebook links?
- 6yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Originally posted by @Matt R.:
Originally posted by @Matthew Bailey:
@Michael Guydish I'm not going to lie, I didn't read every word of everyone's post because there was a great response, and I've got plenty of work to do haha. I have been flipping land for the past 3 years. Here is my advice from someone actively in the land business. Do not start out trying to figure out the timber game, it is a niche within the land business, and one with experienced investors. You need to start with the fundamentals and that's finding off market land deals at 20c on the dollar, doing due diligence, and selling those properties. Once you get that down you can move into more niched areas.
I would suggest you start by readings as much information as you can on the REtipster forums. Seth Williams is an authority in the space who has produced the best content on the niche that I'm aware of. And a lot of it is free. He has a course if you want it all spoon fed to you. But you should really read 10-20 articles on there and see if you feel like it's for you.
If you do decide that land is for you then I think the best way to generate cash flow is by selling land on owner financed notes like @Jay Hinrichs mentioned. Most folks follow a strategy where they try to get their cost basis in the property out on the down payment, then collect monthly cash flow (I.e. buy for 2k, sell for 8k with 2k down and $100-200/month), rinse repeat.
Personally, I only do cash flips, the velocity of money is much better if you just buy for 2k, sell for 4k, and keep doing that (that being said I play in the 5-15k acquisition, 10-30k sales price margins).
Land is a viable niche for cash flow, but I'd encourage you to do your research on a site like REtipster.com and see if you think it's for you. I send 3-4k direct mail letters per month, it is more like wholesaling than it is like buy and hold real estate.
Alternatively you could always try to network in the land forums and find someone to purchase a timber property from (we usually aim to sell at 70-80% of market value to keep that velocity of money up) and perhaps the timber numbers work for that. I'm not sure.
Hope that helps!
Is there not a program now that list all the owners via satellite view with contact names, numbers, addresses even facebook links?
IN my day it was go get the list from the tax collector.. My dad had in the county we worked every APN number map for the entire county in a big binder.. I new most of the county by just the first two numbers.. then start driving.. Lots of driving.. Pick what you wanted to offer on and off you go.. When did timber our data base was a custom built one were we compared Aerial photogs to plat maps . then we tele marketed . we only sent letters if we could not reach them on the phone.. but keep in mind we were only working a data base of maybe 7 to 10k props. and we took them rotation starting at one part of the state and working through them .. but we hit everyone about every 6 to 9 months.
- Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Matt R.:
Originally posted by @Matthew Bailey:
@Michael Guydish I'm not going to lie, I didn't read every word of everyone's post because there was a great response, and I've got plenty of work to do haha. I have been flipping land for the past 3 years. Here is my advice from someone actively in the land business. Do not start out trying to figure out the timber game, it is a niche within the land business, and one with experienced investors. You need to start with the fundamentals and that's finding off market land deals at 20c on the dollar, doing due diligence, and selling those properties. Once you get that down you can move into more niched areas.
I would suggest you start by readings as much information as you can on the REtipster forums. Seth Williams is an authority in the space who has produced the best content on the niche that I'm aware of. And a lot of it is free. He has a course if you want it all spoon fed to you. But you should really read 10-20 articles on there and see if you feel like it's for you.
If you do decide that land is for you then I think the best way to generate cash flow is by selling land on owner financed notes like @Jay Hinrichs mentioned. Most folks follow a strategy where they try to get their cost basis in the property out on the down payment, then collect monthly cash flow (I.e. buy for 2k, sell for 8k with 2k down and $100-200/month), rinse repeat.
Personally, I only do cash flips, the velocity of money is much better if you just buy for 2k, sell for 4k, and keep doing that (that being said I play in the 5-15k acquisition, 10-30k sales price margins).
Land is a viable niche for cash flow, but I'd encourage you to do your research on a site like REtipster.com and see if you think it's for you. I send 3-4k direct mail letters per month, it is more like wholesaling than it is like buy and hold real estate.
Alternatively you could always try to network in the land forums and find someone to purchase a timber property from (we usually aim to sell at 70-80% of market value to keep that velocity of money up) and perhaps the timber numbers work for that. I'm not sure.
Hope that helps!
Is there not a program now that list all the owners via satellite view with contact names, numbers, addresses even facebook links?
IN my day it was go get the list from the tax collector.. My dad had in the county we worked every APN number map for the entire county in a big binder.. I new most of the county by just the first two numbers.. then start driving.. Lots of driving.. Pick what you wanted to offer on and off you go.. When did timber our data base was a custom built one were we compared Aerial photogs to plat maps . then we tele marketed . we only sent letters if we could not reach them on the phone.. but keep in mind we were only working a data base of maybe 7 to 10k props. and we took them rotation starting at one part of the state and working through them .. but we hit everyone about every 6 to 9 months.
It was like a treasure hunt. I am looking to trim the leg work via this program. So many lots so little time. I think I like the land flip business. It is like a box of chocolates. I just need more lots.
- 6yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Originally posted by @Matt R.:
Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:
Originally posted by @Matt R.:
Originally posted by @Matthew Bailey:
@Michael Guydish I'm not going to lie, I didn't read every word of everyone's post because there was a great response, and I've got plenty of work to do haha. I have been flipping land for the past 3 years. Here is my advice from someone actively in the land business. Do not start out trying to figure out the timber game, it is a niche within the land business, and one with experienced investors. You need to start with the fundamentals and that's finding off market land deals at 20c on the dollar, doing due diligence, and selling those properties. Once you get that down you can move into more niched areas.
I would suggest you start by readings as much information as you can on the REtipster forums. Seth Williams is an authority in the space who has produced the best content on the niche that I'm aware of. And a lot of it is free. He has a course if you want it all spoon fed to you. But you should really read 10-20 articles on there and see if you feel like it's for you.
If you do decide that land is for you then I think the best way to generate cash flow is by selling land on owner financed notes like @Jay Hinrichs mentioned. Most folks follow a strategy where they try to get their cost basis in the property out on the down payment, then collect monthly cash flow (I.e. buy for 2k, sell for 8k with 2k down and $100-200/month), rinse repeat.
Personally, I only do cash flips, the velocity of money is much better if you just buy for 2k, sell for 4k, and keep doing that (that being said I play in the 5-15k acquisition, 10-30k sales price margins).
Land is a viable niche for cash flow, but I'd encourage you to do your research on a site like REtipster.com and see if you think it's for you. I send 3-4k direct mail letters per month, it is more like wholesaling than it is like buy and hold real estate.
Alternatively you could always try to network in the land forums and find someone to purchase a timber property from (we usually aim to sell at 70-80% of market value to keep that velocity of money up) and perhaps the timber numbers work for that. I'm not sure.
Hope that helps!
Is there not a program now that list all the owners via satellite view with contact names, numbers, addresses even facebook links?
IN my day it was go get the list from the tax collector.. My dad had in the county we worked every APN number map for the entire county in a big binder.. I new most of the county by just the first two numbers.. then start driving.. Lots of driving.. Pick what you wanted to offer on and off you go.. When did timber our data base was a custom built one were we compared Aerial photogs to plat maps . then we tele marketed . we only sent letters if we could not reach them on the phone.. but keep in mind we were only working a data base of maybe 7 to 10k props. and we took them rotation starting at one part of the state and working through them .. but we hit everyone about every 6 to 9 months.
It was like a treasure hunt. I am looking to trim the leg work via this program. So many lots so little time. I think I like the land flip business. It is like a box of chocolates. I just need more lots.
Look no further than San BerdU and Riverside counties hundred thousand plus vacant parcels.. if not more
also look up Lehigh acres FLA 200,000 and parts of Coral Gables.. you will be blown away by the google earth of those Massive land projects that were done in the 50s.
- Wholesaler · Sunnyvale, CA · Member since 2016 · 106 posts · 58 votes6y
@Matt R. the information you're looking for can be found using DataTree, AgentPro247, or RealQuestPro. These companies aggregate the county assessor data and you can pull custom lists based on vacant land parameters (0% improvement, vacant land county codes, etc). If you know where you're looking then you can consider NeighborScoop.com
Neighborscoop is a brand new product from the LandAcademy folks. I have been told that you can draw an outline and pull that data. Neighborscoop pairs county data with skip traced data so you should be able to get phone numbers as well. I haven't used it but will probably upgrade from their old product, ParcelFact, which was very good
- Sherman Oaks, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @Matthew Bailey:
@Matt R. the information you're looking for can be found using DataTree, AgentPro247, or RealQuestPro. These companies aggregate the county assessor data and you can pull custom lists based on vacant land parameters (0% improvement, vacant land county codes, etc). If you know where you're looking then you can consider NeighborScoop.com
Neighborscoop is a brand new product from the LandAcademy folks. I have been told that you can draw an outline and pull that data. Neighborscoop pairs county data with skip traced data so you should be able to get phone numbers as well. I haven't used it but will probably upgrade from their old product, ParcelFact, which was very good
Sweet. I will check those out. thanks!
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