Bought House - Undisclosed Plumbing Issues = High Water Bill

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Bought House - Undisclosed Plumbing Issues = High Water Bill

Dennis Kronenwetter
Charlotte, NC · Member since 2019 · 10 posts · 4 votes

Hello BP Community,

I closed on my first rental property about a month ago. The house was sold by a flipping company. Everything was great and exciting at the beginning - and then....

After buying the washer and dryer for the home I tested the washer out by running a cycle. When the water started to drain I quickly realized the down pipe was clogged about 3 feet down causing water to shoot back out like the Bellagio water show in Vegas. I tried fixing myself but quickly realized it was clogged with dried up dirt/mud. I called a plumber to come out to see about repairing since I had a tenant and I did not have the time that week with work to do myself. 

Plumber came out to say the entire plumbing system was done incorrectly and there is also constant water running through the meter (even though nothing was turned on in the house). He was unable to find the home shutoff valve to determine if it was the mainline under yard or under the house leaking. This was about a week ago and I have now received Charlotte, NC Water bill showing ~39,000 gallons of water for a awesome value of $550. Plumber said it would be roughly $4300 to replace plumbing under the house and $1300 to repair mainline (if that is leaking).


BP, has anyone run into this situation before? Can I hold the flippers/sellers accountable? I have Charlotte Water investigating to hopefully forgive the high bill. I am betting this seller knew of the water issues and checked "no representation" on the disclosure forms. 

Thanks for any advice!

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Ryan Clark
Member since 2019 · 22 posts · 15 votes
6y

@Matt P. At the very least, the inspector should have noticed the meter running with nothing on. That is a basic part of inspection. That is how you determine if there is an unknown leak somewhere.

6Reply
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  • Mary M.
    Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    Did you not get inspections?? I would find out who the GC was and contact them for warranty work

    4Reply
  • Dennis Kronenwetter
    OP
    Charlotte, NC · Member since 2019 · 10 posts · 4 votes
    6y

    Yes I had an inspection prior and there  was plumbing work for seller to redo under craw space, and then we had re-inspection. I do not believe it is common for inspectors to check laundry drain pipe, especially when no washer is available to test. It will be a mental check for me going forward. 

    I believe it should be a check for inspectors to listen for running water at meter. But may not be something commonly checked either. This will be added to my personal checklist going forward. 

    0Reply
  • Alex G.
    Eastern Mass & Central Maine · Member since 2009 · 252 posts · 135 votes
    6y

    A sewer camera inspection would have probably discovered the problem. 

    1Reply
  • Matt P.
    Investor · Columbus, OH · Member since 2015 · 625 posts · 601 votes
    6y

    @Dennis Kronenwetter I'd call the water company and see how long they have been getting super high usage at that place. If it goes back months then the seller obviously knew about the issue. Idk what your options are for getting them to pay for the fix but it's definitely worth a little research to see when the leak started. If they rehabbed it then they had the water turned on while work was happening.

    2Reply
  • Ryan Clark
    Member since 2019 · 22 posts · 15 votes
    6y

    @Matt P. At the very least, the inspector should have noticed the meter running with nothing on. That is a basic part of inspection. That is how you determine if there is an unknown leak somewhere.

    6Reply
  • Matt P.
    Investor · Columbus, OH · Member since 2015 · 625 posts · 601 votes
    6y

    @Ryan Clark Real talk. Super basic stuff right there. Honestly I can't believe it was missed.

    0Reply
  • Dennis Kronenwetter
    OP
    Charlotte, NC · Member since 2019 · 10 posts · 4 votes
    6y

    So should I hold inspector accountable? They claim to have a *limited repair reimbursement guarantee* for anything they checked off as satisfactory on this inspection report. 

    0Reply
  • Jared Wonders
    Charlotte, NC · Member since 2017 · 71 posts · 32 votes
    6y

    @Dennis Kronenwetter

    Hey Dennis,

    I’m very sorry you ran into these issues. If you have a tenant in place is there a reason you are receiving the water bill? I would also get a few bids on the pricing for the plumbing if you were wanting to get that work done as well and as others have mentioned making sure that there isn’t a warranty covering the issues that you addressed.

    I would also contact the water company and see if they are responsible for assisting with the main water line fix. You could also check with your homeowners insurance as last resort if you think a claim needs to be filed, although this will increase your premiums so this should be last resort.

    Hope this helps!

    Jared Wonders

    0Reply
  • Caleb Heimsoth
    Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    6y

    @Dennis Kronenwetter. You can try to hold different people accountable but in reality you’re probably not going to have much luck with that besides spending more money and not actually fixing the problem

    5Reply
  • Jill F.
    Investor · Akron, OH · Member since 2016 · 2k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    6y
    Make sure to get quotes from more than one plumbing company especially if you have not worked with them before.
    1Reply
  • Ben Haab
    Member since 2017 · 36 posts · 24 votes
    6y

    You should go after the inspector.  Total $ you will get is the cost of the inspection, but it's more principle and they usually cave pretty quick. Bad reviews online get the job done.  Then talk with your realtor to get in touch with the seller.  But fix it right away

    1) start with the utility. Get as much info as possible, but most likely they will say leak is on your property = your problem.

    2) if there is no leak inside the residence I'd start with the main line.  Have you looked for wet areas in the yard?

    3) Excavate the main water line yourself. Digging dirt and locating a water line isn't too hard, but it's the most costly part of the fix.  Once you know where the leak is have a handyman replace the line.

    1Reply
  • Russell BrazilBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes
    6y

    You mention this was discovered only after you purchased a washer and dryer, and ran it. How then was someone supposed to know a problem existed when prior to you buying said washer and dryer, the condition to discover the defect was not yet in place?

    [email protected]301-893-4635Podcast Guest on Show #192
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    2Reply
  • Michael Noto
    Real Estate Agent · Southington, CT · Member since 2008 · 5k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    6y

    Good luck proving they knew about these issues. Nearly impossible. How would they know a washer didn’t run properly when they never had one there to begin with? 

    1Reply
  • Dennis Kronenwetter
    OP
    Charlotte, NC · Member since 2019 · 10 posts · 4 votes
    6y

    @Russell Brazil @Michael Noto I know it will probably be impossible to prove they knew. 

    The washer was how I came across the issue initially-not the source of the leak. You both are correct that they may have never known about the washer drain clogged. The main issue I am trying to resolve is the leak. Two separate issues had arose. The clogged drain pipe lead me to have a plumber come out for that reason. He then told me I had a bigger issue which was the leak Most likely in main line from meter. 

    I would have found the leak eventually once I got the water bill, which I recently got on Friday. The city is investigating the water usage and I guess that would determine somewhat if the seller had at least one bill of high water usage during the months of ownership. When you go to the water meter you can hear the water passing through even with nothing on in the house. 

    0Reply
  • Victor S.
    WorldWide · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:

    You mention this was discovered only after you purchased a washer and dryer, and ran it. How then was someone supposed to know a problem existed when prior to you buying said washer and dryer, the condition to discover the defect was not yet in place?

     A good inspector would connect a hose to that drain and check its functionality. 

    3Reply
  • Russell BrazilBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Agent · Washington, D.C. · Member since 2012 · 17k+ posts · 30k+ votes
    6y

    @Victor S.

    Ive been on hundreds of inspections and not once have I ever seen a home inspector do that.

    [email protected]301-893-4635Podcast Guest on Show #192
    District Invest Group546 Reviews
    WebsiteView Page
    4Reply
  • Victor S.
    WorldWide · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Russell Brazil:

    @Victor S.

    Ive been on hundreds of inspections and not once have I ever seen a home inspector do that.

    well, you've learned something new :) my current inspector did this on a house we were looking at and discovered a clogged drain. 

    1Reply
  • Matthew Kresky
    Rental Property Investor · Laguna Niguel, CA · Member since 2018 · 35 posts · 37 votes
    6y

    @Alex G. Right, is a sewer scope along with a home inspection not common practice?

    0Reply
  • Shawn Coverdell
    Investor · Clatskanie, OR · Member since 2014 · 212 posts · 233 votes
    6y

    I personally never get inspections. I expect the worst and buy at around 50% after repair value. my worst plumbing nightmare cost me 3K. Learn to hire your own people. to crank profits into high gear. Anything can be repaired or worked around. This sounds like a simple issue. I have purchased many homes where as soon as meter is turned on it keeps running indicating a leak. find leak, fix leak. $$$$ POW!!!!   Hell, just replumb the whole house for 3K. Lots of layed off construction workers. especially this time of year. 

    Believe me, you want leaks. leaks are your friend. why else would they sell you a home for half it's value. 

    I tell you a secret...….Cash flow smells similar to cat pee and human feces is a sure path to wealth in this business.

    figure that one out and I will buy next round of shots in Mexico!

    Shawn Coverdell

    Homes in the Hood

    4Reply
  • Brian Ploszay
    Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    6y

    You may have some recourse against the flipper.  It is not easy to get money back from them, but you can send a demand letter, written by an attorney, to the company.  

    Next, a professional inspector would have run a cycle on those machines.  

    Last, get a second opinion from a different plumber.  I find huge variances in prices and opinions within the same trade group.  

    0Reply
  • Brent Paul
    Rental Property Investor · Shakopee, MN · Member since 2015 · 985 posts · 374 votes
    6y

    My inspector tested every appliance: Dishwasher, stove, oven, washer, dryer, furnace, ac.  Every faucet and drain was visually checked to make sure the water went down.  On my house he found the shower water didn't drain. But it was full of hair pretty far down and clogged up.

    I'm not sure if the flipper will be liable that will depend on laws in your state, etc.  Best to consult an attorney.

    Prices for plumbing can vary greatly by company.  Make sure to get a few more quotes before picking one.

    0Reply
  • Steve Vaughan
    Rental Property Investor · East Wenatchee, WA · Member since 2014 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    6y

    Never, ever ever ever ever buy someone's flip.   You want that sweet old couple that's been there 35  years.  Be sure to ask that the carpet rake be included in the sale 😀

    In NC is the seller required to complete a condition disclosure?  They are here and that would be the thing to address for being falsely reported I would think.  

    6Reply
  • Dennis Kronenwetter
    OP
    Charlotte, NC · Member since 2019 · 10 posts · 4 votes
    6y

    @Steve Vaughan they do have a disclosure form to fill out. However, there are three answers for them to use: Yes, No, No Representation. Of course they used No Representation as the answer. 

    1Reply
  • Steve Vaughan
    Rental Property Investor · East Wenatchee, WA · Member since 2014 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    6y
    Originally posted by @Dennis Kronenwetter:

    @Steve Vaughan they do have a disclosure form to fill out. However, there are three answers for them to use: Yes, No, No Representation. Of course they used No Representation as the answer. 

    Figures.  Here it's  yes, no or I don't know.  I've purchased inherited property with all I don't knows.  I promptly reduced the offering price $10k👍 

    0Reply
  • Dennis Kronenwetter
    OP
    Charlotte, NC · Member since 2019 · 10 posts · 4 votes
    6y

    @Steve Vaughan yea I guess I should have done that. Every property and issue we run into is just a way of learning experience. A new check box to mark for the next house I look at. 

    1Reply
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