How do I help a friend that is struggling with his life?

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How do I help a friend that is struggling with his life?

Ethan S.
Hurricane, UT · Member since 2015 · 48 posts · 7 votes

I have a child hood buddy who is struggling with his life. He is 24 living with parents and is working as a pizza delivery job. He got his masters in Psychology 5 months ago but is having issues finding a job. His parents are being hard on him to get a job and taking the little energy he has. It's like a downward spiral. He's coming to me seeking support. Recently he started having back issues from constantly sitting in his car. Just the other day he went to get a MRI done and it cost him $1000 which isn't helping his situation. He resorts to pot to solve his issues which is takes away his back pain. I'm not sure how to go about this situation. The household he lives in is disorganized and in disarray. When I mention anything related to personal finances he completely shuts down. 

He originally wanted to rent a place from me to escape his issues but I don't want to entangle a friendship with business. 

What are your thoughts with this situation? 

Is it a hopeless cause for me to help my friend?

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Caleb Heimsoth
Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
7y
@Ethan Schneider. Don’t rent to this person under any circumstances
20Reply
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  • Caleb Heimsoth
    Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    7y
    @Ethan Schneider. Don’t rent to this person under any circumstances
    20Reply
  • Chris Szepessy
    Catskill, NY · Member since 2018 · 636 posts · 668 votes
    7y

    I probably wouldn't rent to him either. Moving out isn't going to fix his life. Yeah, his parents wouldn't be there to "nag" him, but he's their son and they probably want him to succeed in life. I would just try to calmly mention to him occasionally about finances and not over burden him. If he doesn't want to discuss it, let it go for a little while and then casually bring it back up again. How do you invest in RE? If you flip houses, could you "hire" him part time to help with small tasks? Or if you buy and hold, can he come along when you do some maintenance? Maybe him "working" in RE will help convince him that it may be worthwhile for him to look into it or just motivate him to want to do better...or if nothing else, it'll keep his mind off his not so good living arrangements and whatnot.

    7Reply
  • Max T.
    Investor · Philadelphia, PA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    Don't rent to him and don't try and "help" him unless he seeks your advice. Sounds like he isn't there yet.

    3Reply
  • Marisa R.
    Developer · Atlanta and Detroit · Member since 2018 · 601 posts · 821 votes
    7y

    sadly you cant help him if he is not prepared to help himself

    That saying .......you take a horse to water but you cant make it drink

    Sometimes people have to hit rick bottom before they are prepared to take responsibility and make serious changes

    9Reply
  • Jonathan R McLaughlin
    Rental Property Investor · Boston, Massachusetts (MA) · Member since 2016 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y
    Not a doctor but boy this sounds like he is struggling with depression. It is a sneaky illness but it is one that can be treated. Sounds from your post as if he is self medicating now. If you want to help him, maybe get him to a depression screening either at a doctor or free service.
    9Reply
  • Jason D.
    Rental Property Investor · St. Petersburg, FL · Member since 2017 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    7y
    @Ethan Schneider you cant help him, he needs to help himself. 1) Stop smoking pot, nearly all "real" jobs drug test. 2) Get a job that he can be proud of (jobs are everywhere). 3) move out of moms house. The parents are the reason he's depressed. They probably forced education on him when he should have been figuring out what HE wanted to do. Caring about what other people think about you more than caring what you think about yourself leads you nowhere. He needs to figure that out before he can go anywhere.
    5Reply
  • Dominique Pradel-Lewis
    Investor · Pittsburgh PA · Member since 2018 · 102 posts · 76 votes
    7y

    @Ethan S. It must be tough for your friend to have worked hard in school to get his masters and not be able to find a job.  He is not alone: this happens to a multitude of new grads.  You are a great friend to him to care so much for him.  I don't have the answers about renting to him or not.  I could tell you not to get involve but I did just that when my friend was in need of a consigner for personal loan at 23.  Everyone told me not to do it but I trusted my gut knowing the kind of person she was and did it.  Three years later it was all paid off.  You have to trust your gut on this.  I agree with @Jonathan R McLaughlin that he is most likely depressed and need to address that issue. But if you decide to help him, you better have a long talk about the conditions such as: renting for a fixed amount of time, job searching, seeking help for depression, exit strategy and how this may hurt your friendship.  While his parents are well meaning they are certainly aggravating the situation.  Regardless of your decision you need a talk with him (non confrontational) to discuss your concerns about his approach.

    Good luck

    2Reply
  • Thomas S.
    Member since 2016 · 13k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    7y

    Psychology grad, living at home, pizza delivery. He is in a very common situation with young people today. Overeducated in a discipline without jobs, lacking motivation to improve their life and unwilling to seek viable employment. 

    I would advise him to seek medical help for depression. The rest of the world is not the source of his problems. Blaming others is counter productive. He is the source and the cure. If he does not get the necessary medical help steer well clear as he will ultimately put you down with him.

    Once he gets medical help he can get his life on track by determining a new carrer path and move forward.

    7Reply
  • Nick C.
    Investor · Tampa, FL · Member since 2011 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    7y

    Absolutely do not rent to him. That's a fast track way to lose that friendship. 

    There are plenty of jobs, although he is going to have to work outside his chosen field. The sooner he realizes that the better. Not much you can do with a Psych degree except become a professor and teach Psych degrees to other people.  

    5Reply
  • Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
    7y

    I suppose he could try seeing a doctor that would likely prescribe him drugs and shuffle him out the door.

    It may sound trite but I think the best solution is a relationship with the Creator. His mind is currently stuck on the internal instead of the eternal. Get him to a church, get him involved in a ministry where he is productively helping others, and his mood is all but guaranteed to change.

    I find nothing snaps me out of a funk faster than time with people looking beyond today and helping others.

    The DIY Landlord Book4.7248 Reviews
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    12Reply
  • Rich S.
    Central, MN · Member since 2015 · 148 posts · 184 votes
    7y

    I think what you do exactly depends on your personal situation. I, personally, would do what I could to help. If I could afford to give him a place to stay for the short term I would... as much of the negativity seems to be coming from the living situation. I'm not saying you rent to him and I'm not saying you shouldn't... but I am saying, often times people need a nag or a nudge to get through times like this. My family has a history of depression and for everyone that says "you have to let them hit rock bottom" before you can help, hasn't lost family to suicide... pretty hard to help when that is the result of rock bottom. If I were in your shoes, I'd invite your friend to shadow you in your business. Have him come to meetings with you, check out properties with you, show him your business. It may stick, it may not, but it will engage him and potentially lead to opportunities or relationships. It will also improve your relationship with him, which may very much help you help him with his demons. I think often times people in REI just focus on business, numbers, results, money, etc... we miss the process part... we miss how much of this is based on relationships... to other investors, contractors, property managers, tenants, etc... If it were my friend, I'd do what I can because getting burned in the short term by a friend who may not hold up his end of the deal will sting a lot less than not trying to help and much worse things happening, in my opinion.

    1Reply
  • Paul DoCampo
    Specialist · ID · Member since 2015 · 121 posts · 53 votes
    7y
    @Ethan Schneider Shame them. Sounds harsh, but I'd rather have friends who tell me the hard truth then conceal things just to make me feel better. It think it's obvious not to rent to him Also, he's not in that bad of a situtation. He has no rent or mortgage and ( I assume no kids). If he's that tired of living with his parents he needs to sack up and find a job that doesn't involve his master's even if it involved cleaning tiolets until he does get a job that he wants
    0Reply
  • Linda S.
    Investor · Richmond, VA · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    @Ethan S.,

    Do NOT rent to him.       I'm sorry, but it sounds like a hopeless idea, be there as a friend, listen and support him emotionally. 

    He sounds depressed, and I feel bad for him... but you're the one who I would feel sorry for, if you rent to him.. because once he moves in, he'll resent you for taking his hard earned money, especially if he knows you're making money off him...  keep friends/business separate.   

    DO NOT RENT TO HIM.

    3Reply
  • James Caruso
    Real Estate Investor · Middle Island, NY · Member since 2016 · 147 posts · 68 votes
    7y

    I wouldn't rent to him like others have said, but do you have any work for him? Perhaps some odd jobs can help get him on his feet.

    2Reply
  • Terry Miller
    Akron, OH · Member since 2015 · 178 posts · 189 votes
    7y

    Find out what he initially wanted to do with his psychology degree. Answers like "try to get into a law school, go to grad school, become a guidance counselor, become a teacher" are fine.

    If he just wanted to study something that wasn't too hard like psych or communications (on the surface level. Everything can be hard if you take it far enough), and just wanted "some job" after college, then that would be a troublesome answer.

    The following is a serious answer: DoorDash and UberEats pay as much or better than that pizza delivery job, I bet. A pad for the back issues would help (I've used one before).

    0Reply
  • Jared York
    Rental Property Investor · Wichita Falls · Member since 2018 · 16 posts · 7 votes
    7y

    Just want to offer my 2 cents. I was a pizza delivery driver for 2yrs so I have a bit of insight into the back problem thing, he is probably using very poor posture while driving, he can fix his issues by fixing his posture. Most people recline their seats too far back, this makes them shift their shoulders forward to reach the steering wheel. Driving like this led me to needing chiropractic adjustments. Also, I averaged $24/hr take-home while delivering, is he not reaching these kinds of numbers? Pizza delivery has a good potential for building up cash quickly. (I know my post doesn't directly answer your question and isn't really related to RE, hope that's ok)

    3Reply
  • Ryan Evans
    Rental Property Investor · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2016 · 653 posts · 769 votes
    7y

    I'd keep your personal life and business life separate. Simple as that. If he needs his own place, go ahead and help him out as a friend in finding another rental. But there's no upside to renting your place to him. 

    2Reply
  • David Moore
    Investor · Crystal, MN · Member since 2013 · 486 posts · 277 votes
    7y

    @Ethan S.

    First, you have my sympathy.  It is good that you are reaching out asking for advice.  I completely agree with @Nathan Gesner.  A relationship with Jesus has been my bedrock, the very foundation of my life since age 17.  Jesus is not religion.  He literally saves people...I've seen it many times, and he saved me.  Offer to go to the Church with him.  

    The other advice I would have is to just listen to him.  Take him out for a coke, and let him talk.  A great friend is one who listens.  He will learn that he can do many things to help his situation, just by bouncing it off a good friend.  Your active listening will help him sort out all the conflicting thoughts he has.  

    2Reply
  • Jeremy Blevins
    Folsom, CA · Member since 2018 · 134 posts · 100 votes
    7y
    @Ethan Schneider I think regular exercise solves a world of problems and is extremely underrated. If you can get him to do that I think that it will create a domino affect for the rest of his life struggles.
    3Reply
  • Karl B.
    Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    7y

    I have a friend who is somewhat similar. He rents his own place but doesn't want to better himself, is complacent, etc. His life plan to financial independence is to win the lottery (seriously). 

    The difference (between my friend and yours) is my friend isn't a college graduate and never did well in school. Though he's had the same job for more than half his life (retail) and works, at the very least, moderately hard.  Though when I advise him he agrees but does nothing to improve himself. He's even turned down management in the past because he doesn't want the responsibility.

    Your friend seems to lack drive and motivation. I was listening to Podcast 294 and the guest, Jesse, talked about being the absolute best at something to where the management can't live without you. To provide insane value, no matter the job; to do whatever it takes. 

    It sounds like his environment isn't good and that's no doubt a big issue. If he was somewhere else he very well could improve but to what degree isn't known until it happens. 

    If you listen to positive podcasts (more general about success)/Youtube videos you can share them with your friend. If he surrounds himself with positivity, hope and self-improvement there's a good chance he'll slowly improve to some degree. 

    We're most often our default setting.

    And I give you props for caring about your friend and his happiness. You're a good friend. 

    3Reply
  • Dennis M.
    Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes
    7y
    @Nathan G. As usual Nathan has excellent advise . I agree 100%
    1Reply
  • Brett Grigsby
    Rental Property Investor · Louisville, KY · Member since 2017 · 4 posts · 1 vote
    7y

    Offer some work on fixing up property or maintenance if he is able to or you have the option to.  Start with something pretty easy that they can't really mess up.  This market is brutal in finding dependable contractors, and if he is able to gain some marketable skills, he can make great money.  

    1Reply
  • Terre B.
    Aurora, CO · Member since 2018 · 180 posts · 166 votes
    7y

    Random thought...Can you get him a guest membership at your gym?  Exercise, and working out serve several purposes.  (says my sedentary 30# overweight self)  The right exercises will help strengthen his back muscles, and correct his posture.  Also, exercise and working out gives a lot of time for reflection and self examination.  

    Be open to questions from him.  Do not tell him what he needs to do but perhaps ask what direction he intended to go with this degree when he started.  Ask him questions to make him think outside his narrowing perspective of pizza delivery and mommies basement.  If he got a degree in psychology, he's not stupid, but some just need a jump start.

    1Reply
  • Joe SplitrockPro Member
    Moderator
    Rental Property Investor · Sioux Falls, SD · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 18k+ votes
    7y

    @Ethan S. his parents are not being hard on him telling him to get a job. His parents would kick him out of the house if they really cared. 

    As a friend you need to be careful to not enable his behavior. In today's economy, there is no excuse for not having a job. Drug use drains his money, drains his motivation and with his head in a fog, he will never get a job. If the back problems stem from driving his car for pizza delivery, he needs to find a different job. 

    It is wonderful that you want to help your friend, but he needs honesty from you. The worst thing you could do is play into his fantasy world where he is a victim.

    The sharing economy offers countless financial opportunities that don't even tie you geographically or require a traditional W2. In addition, there is continuous need for social workers and counselors, both of which would be happy to hire someone with a masters degree. If he can't find a job in his profession, he should use his spare time volunteering in the psychology field, like on a suicide hotline. This will build his resume and help him gain connections.

    As others mentioned, you are smart to NEVER rent to friends or family. Good luck.

    0Reply
  • Adriana Good
    Wilmington, CA · Member since 2017 · 5 posts · 0 votes
    7y

    While you can be a part of a solution, you should not rent to him and mix business with friendship as you mentioned. Perhaps providing him links to blogs or websites that solely focus on personal finance. That would be a starting point.  

    0Reply
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