Gave my notice - Leaving security for happiness

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Gave my notice - Leaving security for happiness

Brian Ellis
Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes

A lot of people might disagree with my decision, or question it. But I am leaving a family business that I have been a part of for the last 6.5 years. I finally gave a months notice last week. This has been debated in my head for a very long time. 

Am I financially free? Definitely not. Has Real estate given me the opportunity to pursue what I love? Yes. 

Over the past 3 years I have invested part time in Real Estate (a full time side hustle basically). I will own 3 rentals next month, and will be selling my first house to have a good chunk of reserves for when I leave this job. I have also started my own construction business, and have been doing side jobs over the past year. People tend to like my work, so I have jobs lined up all next month going into December. I also have a subcontractor position working part time for a reputable contractor in the area. 

I have a lot of security at my current job. A steady paycheck making 75k a year, Health insurance, company vehicle, and a company cell phone. But I am also tied to a leash, and working a job I don't like. I am constantly waiting to lock up the shop so I can get home to work on Real Estate. I am currently working 11 hour days, driving 50 minutes to and from work every day. Over the past 6.5 years I have seen my mental health deteriorate and my eyes have become tired. Im 32 years old, but I feel 55 here.

When im working on real estate I feel alive, and intelligent. I get to be creative and call the shots. I get to watch my vision come to fruition. For me, that is well worth the pay cut and leaving. I will have 60 more hours a week to pursue and find success in what I enjoy. I can spend more time with my family, and watch my son grow.

Will it be a tough year, two years, three years? I believe there will be a lot of challenging and pressing times. But I know that it will be worth it in the end. Real estate has really given me the opportunity to make this decision. Im not financially free by any means, but the progress Ive made so far will give me more opportunity. If I never invested in real estate as a side hustle, I would never be able to take this risk.

I am grateful for Biggerpockets, and the community here. Especially all the help ive received over the years. Especially @Steve Vaughan & @JD Martin. Heres to many more years of challenges, and happiness! Exciting but scary times, and I am hopeful it will turn out to be the best decision I ever made. 

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Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
5y

Welcome to the world of the self employed  .. right now the construction trades to me is a never out of a job situation given the shortage of good reliable contractors and sub trades..  

Being self employed brings on a whole new set of risks emotions worries and when it goes good feeling of success. 

My self I have been self employed my entire life basically.. starting with Fuller Brush at 14  real estate sales at 18 so I know nothing else.. And when things are not going good in our industry I many times think back to being raised in Cupertino and watching Tech explode that I should have gone that route.. Gone into sales for one of the big tech companies.. But cant look back.  

Real Estate cycles in many markets so just make sure you have multiple income streams.. 

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  • Robert Stark
    Investor · Holderness, NH · Member since 2016 · 19 posts · 30 votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis I’ve read many of your well thought out posts on BP, so I’m sure your business plan is solid and you’ll be successful. A hard days work always feels good, but never as good as when you’re working for yourself! Congratulations!

    3Reply
  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Brian Ellis:

    A lot of people might disagree with my decision, or question it. But I am leaving a family business that I have been a part of for the last 6.5 years. I finally gave a months notice last week. This has been debated in my head for a very long time. 

    Am I financially free? Definitely not. Has Real estate given me the opportunity to pursue what I love? Yes. 

    Over the past 3 years I have invested part time in Real Estate (a full time side hustle basically). I will own 3 rentals next month, and will be selling my first house to have a good chunk of reserves for when I leave this job. I have also started my own construction business, and have been doing side jobs over the past year. People tend to like my work, so I have jobs lined up all next month going into December. I also have a subcontractor position working part time for a reputable contractor in the area. 

    I have a lot of security at my current job. A steady paycheck making 75k a year, Health insurance, company vehicle, and a company cell phone. But I am also tied to a leash, and working a job I don't like. I am constantly waiting to lock up the shop so I can get home to work on Real Estate. I am currently working 11 hour days, driving 50 minutes to and from work every day. Over the past 6.5 years I have seen my mental health deteriorate and my eyes have become tired. Im 32 years old, but I feel 55 here.

    When im working on real estate I feel alive, and intelligent. I get to be creative and call the shots. I get to watch my vision come to fruition. For me, that is well worth the pay cut and leaving. I will have 60 more hours a week to pursue and find success in what I enjoy. I can spend more time with my family, and watch my son grow.

    Will it be a tough year, two years, three years? I believe there will be a lot of challenging and pressing times. But I know that it will be worth it in the end. Real estate has really given me the opportunity to make this decision. Im not financially free by any means, but the progress Ive made so far will give me more opportunity. If I never invested in real estate as a side hustle, I would never be able to take this risk.

    I am grateful for Biggerpockets, and the community here. Especially all the help ive received over the years. Especially @Steve Vaughan & @JD Martin. Heres to many more years of challenges, and happiness! Exciting but scary times, and I am hopeful it will turn out to be the best decision I ever made. 

    Hoo! Congratulations Brian! I know this has been on your mind for a long time. I have no doubt you're going to be successful at this next turn in the road!

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  • Taylor Santoro
    Member since 2020 · 9 posts · 4 votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis good luck man

    1Reply
  • John Schober
    Member since 2020 · 4 posts · 2 votes
    5y

    Congrats Brian! It's awesome reading how excited you are about beginning this new chapter of your life. I'm currently working towards similar goals, but I'm just getting started. It's hard to stay motivated some days but posts like this keep me excited and ready to put the extra time and work in. I'd be interested in hearing more about starting a construction company, while learning real estate, WHILE working what sounds like a more than full time job! 

    1Reply
  • Blake Thompson
    Investor · Fresno CA · Member since 2020 · 16 posts · 10 votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis Congratulations! I am in a similar boat and can share the emotional rollercoaster you are probably going through. Dont ever give up.

    1Reply
  • Cliff Parchmon
    New to Real Estate · Tampa, FL · Member since 2015 · 9 posts · 2 votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis

    CONGRATULATIONS!!!! Living life on your terms and doing what makes you happy is priceless.

    1Reply
  • Jim K.
    Handyman · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2018 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis

    Sorry I'm getting to this so late.

    New people take note: this is how you quit your job to do real estate. You plan your exit wisely, you aren't afraid to get your hands dirty, and you make sure your spouse is completely on board. Brian is actually moving towards significantly MORE job security in a growth field as a housing subcontractor.

    Brian, don't know how you're fixed for borrowing money. That's pretty much the only reason I've kept my barely part-time job for so long -- the banks LOVE those long-term W-2 jobs in their lenders.

    Good luck to you, and thanks for so much inspiration over the years.

    3Reply
  • Natalie Schanne
    Real Estate Agent · Princeton, NJ · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis - I highly recommend you and/or your wife also look into become a real estate agent and/or local bank mortgage lender. Especially an agent. If your wife will do it, you can deduct all kinds of extra things from your taxes (passive losses) that you cannot when you’re a full time construction worker or office worker. If you become an agent, you will learn a lot about real estate and probably decide it’s more awesome to make $10,000-20,000 for 20-100 hours of work than working at $15-50/hour while you’re potentially risking your body (cutting your hand on a saw, falling off a roof, etc.). The people in real estate I look up to have learned how to run a team / crew of rehab workers and inspire them to maintain a good level of quality without swinging the hammer themselves.

    If you do decide to continue to swing the hammer, I noticed a specific opportunity in working with banks on fha rehab 203k and homestyle rehab loans. Here the customer puts 3.5-5% down when buying the house and the bank lends them the rehab $$ for roof, painting, etc. I’m saying there’s an opportunity here because I brought no less than 12 contractors to my job site for an hour each to bid my 70,000 rehab (I provided full pictures, floorplans with laser measurements, scope of work) and I got only two bids, one 67k and one 77k. The 77k one I got after begging the other 11 for a bid. The 67k Guy was referred by my mortgage lender for the 203k. He charged 20-40% more than I was used to paying as a rehabber for painting, drywall etc., but I didn’t have a choice I had to use him or I couldn’t buy the house. (It had no running water.) As far as I know, the only hurdle is that the bank will vet you to make sure you’re a licensed contractor without credit or criminal issues.

    Lastly, if you can buy / max out your debt to income ratio based on your w2 income before you leave your job, you definitely want to. All your loans will now be like 8-12% as a flipper instead of 3-5% as a w2 BRRR or owner occupant.

    If it’s a family business, see if they will let you hold onto your healthcare in exchange for some work from you or your wife. Healthcare is extremely expensive.

    Good luck. Remember you should be investing 10-20% of all your revenue into marketing of your business if you want to grow without discounting your services. You definitely don’t want to be the cheapest local bathroom or kitchen remodeler. I used to be able to hire dozens of day workers for $10-15 per hour cash and I recently had no responses to a Craigslist post at $15/hour or $120/day cash. Good luck getting together a crew to help you.

    2Reply
  • Aigo Pyles
    Flipper/Rehabber · Memphis, TN · Member since 2020 · 758 posts · 285 votes
    5y

    Best of luck to you!

    1Reply
  • Brian LucierPro Member
    Property Manager · Fitchburg, MA · Member since 2012 · 146 posts · 201 votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis the good news is that you have found the support of BiggerPockets to be your RE Sherpa in your new journey. 19 years ago when we started our trek, we had nothing to go on but a pipe dream. We self-educated along the way and learned as we grew. Got the T-Shirt, bumper sticker, shot glass, and scars along the way. Yup, we had some speed bumps on the road to financial freedom, but we got there.

    Now, 19 years later, we are closing a multi-family flip for a cool $114 in profit later today ($34K in closing, rehab and holding costs). We bought for $197,000 in February and eight months later are selling it for $345,000. This was not an overnight process. But if you stay on the path, everyday putting one foot in front of the other, we will get there faster than you imagined. We had no help, and we did it. You have BiggerPockets as the wind in your sails. See you on the other shore for sure.

    1Reply
  • Brian Ellis
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Joel Florian:

    @Brian Ellis

    Congratulations!   I sold my company (job), learned home inspections, rehabbed a flip, and then jumped back into earning wages.    I own one rental and several cash-flowing notes.   My only hesitation for quitting my W2 and jumping into real estate investing full time is that it seems like banks like W2 income better for lending money.  

    I agree. The w2 income to satisfy the bank was A big concern for me. But I figured if I go off on my own I will ultimately make more money in the long run. There wasn’t much room for me to earn more at my w2.

    0Reply
  • Brian Ellis
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Mark McVey:

    @Brian Ellis good for you. Im just learning about real estate investing and am surrounding myself with folks who i can learn from. Im getting ready to get my first property and your story here inspires me to get started! Good luck.

     Good luck to you, Mark. My biggest piece of advice is to just start. Once you do it’s hard to look back.

    0Reply
  • Brian Ellis
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Jim K.:

    @Brian Ellis

    Sorry I'm getting to this so late.

    New people take note: this is how you quit your job to do real estate. You plan your exit wisely, you aren't afraid to get your hands dirty, and you make sure your spouse is completely on board. Brian is actually moving towards significantly MORE job security in a growth field as a housing subcontractor.

    Brian, don't know how you're fixed for borrowing money. That's pretty much the only reason I've kept my barely part-time job for so long -- the banks LOVE those long-term W-2 jobs in their lenders.

    Good luck to you, and thanks for so much inspiration over the years.

    Yes Jim, that is the worst part of it all. It’s going to tough to satisfy the bank. But I was willing to give up a couple years of investing to do something I enjoy. But I have developed some experience and relationships where I may come across opportunities in the meantime

    Thank you for the kind words 

    0Reply
  • Brian Ellis
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Natalie Schanne:

    @Brian Ellis - I highly recommend you and/or your wife also look into become a real estate agent and/or local bank mortgage lender. Especially an agent. If your wife will do it, you can deduct all kinds of extra things from your taxes (passive losses) that you cannot when you’re a full time construction worker or office worker. If you become an agent, you will learn a lot about real estate and probably decide it’s more awesome to make $10,000-20,000 for 20-100 hours of work than working at $15-50/hour while you’re potentially risking your body (cutting your hand on a saw, falling off a roof, etc.). The people in real estate I look up to have learned how to run a team / crew of rehab workers and inspire them to maintain a good level of quality without swinging the hammer themselves.

    If you do decide to continue to swing the hammer, I noticed a specific opportunity in working with banks on fha rehab 203k and homestyle rehab loans. Here the customer puts 3.5-5% down when buying the house and the bank lends them the rehab $$ for roof, painting, etc. I’m saying there’s an opportunity here because I brought no less than 12 contractors to my job site for an hour each to bid my 70,000 rehab (I provided full pictures, floorplans with laser measurements, scope of work) and I got only two bids, one 67k and one 77k. The 77k one I got after begging the other 11 for a bid. The 67k Guy was referred by my mortgage lender for the 203k. He charged 20-40% more than I was used to paying as a rehabber for painting, drywall etc., but I didn’t have a choice I had to use him or I couldn’t buy the house. (It had no running water.) As far as I know, the only hurdle is that the bank will vet you to make sure you’re a licensed contractor without credit or criminal issues.

    Lastly, if you can buy / max out your debt to income ratio based on your w2 income before you leave your job, you definitely want to. All your loans will now be like 8-12% as a flipper instead of 3-5% as a w2 BRRR or owner occupant.

    If it’s a family business, see if they will let you hold onto your healthcare in exchange for some work from you or your wife. Healthcare is extremely expensive.

    Good luck. Remember you should be investing 10-20% of all your revenue into marketing of your business if you want to grow without discounting your services. You definitely don’t want to be the cheapest local bathroom or kitchen remodeler. I used to be able to hire dozens of day workers for $10-15 per hour cash and I recently had no responses to a Craigslist post at $15/hour or $120/day cash. Good luck getting together a crew to help you.

    Thank you for the well thought out response. My goal is to get my GC license, and have the banks pay me to do the work on my own projects. (Construction loans). 

    Eventually I will find a crew, but as you know, it is very hard to come across good reliable workers. So I’m expecting that will take time. I have beat up my body pretty good over the past few years but I’m confident it will be temporary (5 years max).

    Also, I'm maxing our my DTI. I will be closing on a property soon with 78k In equity just from the purchase.

    0Reply
  • Shelley Moore
    Rental Property Investor · Reston, VA · Member since 2020 · 5 posts · 4 votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis You are an inspiration to me. Thank you for being transparent. You HAVE already reached success because your mindset is set! Congratulations.

    2Reply
  • Justin Elliott
    Investor · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2016 · 145 posts · 108 votes
    5y

    Congrats @Brian Ellis !! I know you will be happy you decided to do this. Your future self will thank you. 

    1Reply
  • Brian Ellis
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Frank Wong:

    Congrats Brian!  You will do great there is no question on that.  Cant teach hustle, hard work, and the desire to succeed which you have. 


    thank you, Frank. I admire your knowledge !

    0Reply
  • Ryan LubyPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · CT · Member since 2016 · 258 posts · 227 votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis Congratulations on the change.

    It appears you've approached this change very intelligently already, I always recommend people read So Good They Can't Ignore You - Cal Newport and more importantly, follow Cal's advice pertaining to big job changes and you're already doing that.

    The biggest negative change I had to get used to being self-employed is getting familiar with the massive chasm between gross income and net income when you're self-employed. If you evaluate this just as carefully as you do real estate you will be fine, but I think it's important to practice underwriting taxes, "benefits", vacation time and run some numbers to determine how much you want to gross, to net enough to still comfortably move towards financial freedom. 

    The biggest upside is after my first full year or so, self-employed I was getting especially stressed about money, then one day I realized that was literally the only thing that was bothering me.. Everything else was amazing. I love working for myself, I love the bit of anxiety associated with relying solely on yourself, the freedom is amazing, and most importantly being able to live my life on my terms is the greatest.

    I wish you the best, hope this helps

    2Reply
  • Brian Ellis
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Ryan Luby:

    @Brian Ellis Congratulations on the change.

    It appears you've approached this change very intelligently already, I always recommend people read So Good They Can't Ignore You - Cal Newport and more importantly, follow Cal's advice pertaining to big job changes and you're already doing that.

    The biggest negative change I had to get used to being self-employed is getting familiar with the massive chasm between gross income and net income when you're self-employed. If you evaluate this just as carefully as you do real estate you will be fine, but I think it's important to practice underwriting taxes, "benefits", vacation time and run some numbers to determine how much you want to gross, to net enough to still comfortably move towards financial freedom. 

    The biggest upside is after my first full year or so, self-employed I was getting especially stressed about money, then one day I realized that was literally the only thing that was bothering me.. Everything else was amazing. I love working for myself, I love the bit of anxiety associated with relying solely on yourself, the freedom is amazing, and most importantly being able to live my life on my terms is the greatest.

    I wish you the best, hope this helps

    Thank you, Ryan. I appreciate the advice. Im excited to see what the next year or two brings me

    0Reply
  • Brian Ellis
    OP
    Rental Property Investor · South shore, MA · Member since 2017 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @John Schober:

    Congrats Brian! It's awesome reading how excited you are about beginning this new chapter of your life. I'm currently working towards similar goals, but I'm just getting started. It's hard to stay motivated some days but posts like this keep me excited and ready to put the extra time and work in. I'd be interested in hearing more about starting a construction company, while learning real estate, WHILE working what sounds like a more than full time job! 

    Discipline is important. It has been at the forefront of all my decisions over the past few years, and it never fails. No matter how tired or annoyed you are, just need to keep pushing forward. There are days I just want to lay down after work and do nothing. But if you add up all those extra hours working towards something beneficial, eventually it pays off. 

    Id be happy to share my experiences with you if you ever want to shoot me a message! Best of luck.

    0Reply
  • Steve Smith
    Member since 2020 · 217 posts · 167 votes
    5y
    Brian,
    You must be popular.... you've got a bunch of good ideas.
    As for banks, forget about them. Learn to find private financing and seller financing. Banks are a PITA, slow and very time consuming, only to tell you no.

    There's TONS of people out there early a pittance on their money and would love to have a better return. Now, a lot of these guys are retired or been around for awhile and their BIGGEST CONCERN is safety, so you have to convince them of that. And guard their money no matter what.

    Also, there's plenty of sellers that will finance your purchase. So that's an option, and occasionally they will give you better than bank rates.

    As for a bit of cash flow, you can do some wholesale flipping. Find a good investor deal, get it under contract and sell the contract to an investor. I've purchased many of these from my wholesalers, and glad to do it. Now, this is WORK and talks a lot of leg running.

    You can also flip retail.... IF your market is reasonably good and buyers are out there (which is true of most of the US today). Get a property under contract, and find someone that wants it more than you. Works great in a bidding war, if you're the winning bidder. Had exactly that a year ago, and actually left a few dollars on the table and still got more than asking.

    You can co venture with a flipper. Find the deal, put it together, you manage the fix up, give him xxx for his dollars put in (first mortgage, well secured, and a percent of the profits after fix up. BUT, you really need to know what you're doing as you do not want to loose money at this, tick off your investor and have egg on your face. You need to intimately know how to rehab and price it, and you need to know what your profit will be before going in.

    The idea of having your wife work as a realtor is a possibility. But gotta get the training and testing, then end up with a job where she'd work a lot of nights and weekends. Hard work, but the education and opportunities are there.

    Lots of ways......


    2Reply
  • Jaquetta T Ragland
    Real Estate Agent · Winston Salem, NC · Member since 2014 · 486 posts · 303 votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis congrats...so motivating

    1Reply
  • Jay HinrichsBusiness Member
    Real Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
    5y
    Originally posted by @Gary L Wallman:
    Originally posted by @Jay Hinrichs:

    Welcome to the world of the self employed  .. right now the construction trades to me is a never out of a job situation given the shortage of good reliable contractors and sub trades..  

    Being self employed brings on a whole new set of risks emotions worries and when it goes good feeling of success. 

    My self I have been self employed my entire life basically.. starting with Fuller Brush at 14  real estate sales at 18 so I know nothing else.. And when things are not going good in our industry I many times think back to being raised in Cupertino and watching Tech explode that I should have gone that route.. Gone into sales for one of the big tech companies.. But cant look back.  

    Real Estate cycles in many markets so just make sure you have multiple income streams.. 

     Jay,

    Fuller Brush?? Gosh your old. LOL. I remember them so I guess I'm old too darnit. Like you, I started selling Amway at 14 or 15 and got my Insurance license at 18. Spent 8 years in Corporate America in my late 20's and early 30's making the other guy rich without even a thank you.

    Self employed for the other 40 + years, the last 25 in the car business and last 12 in the real estate game as well. Love them both and think the young man who started this thread is right on target.

    It's not a job if you love it. Money follows because you are committed to what you love.

    If your ever out my way in SE Ohio let me know. I'd love to buy you lunch. Seems we may be 2 peas in a pod in our business life.

    One thing I never did was the car business although always thought about it.. had a shirt tail relative who dealt in investment grade vehicles and he did VERY WELL... Very..   And of course he started it decades ago and the real estate he bought way back when made him a fortune. Sold out his last auto lot and show room  to a MBZ dealer who demo'd it and built a huge new shop... 

    Podcast Guest on Show #222
    JLH Capital Partners51 Review
    WebsiteView Page
    1Reply
  • Nate Sanow
    I​nvestor & Agent · Tulsa, OK · Member since 2016 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    @Brian Ellis

    Brave and bold and I love it. It’s my first year self employed and I love it. It’s been a heck of a year with ups and downs. Feasting and starving so to speak. But I wouldn’t change a thing. Good luck to you.

    1Reply
  • Damon Nieves
    Member since 2020 · 5 posts · 4 votes
    5y

    I 100% know how you feel. I am currently "tied to a leash" and want to get away. I have one property under my belt and am working on the second. Scared out of my mind as I am breadwinner and my wife needs the health benefits. So I stay, for now. 

    1Reply
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