Local Governments Restricting STRs
Emanuel BlandoBusiness Member
Real Estate Coach · Member since 2019 · 14 posts · 5 votesLocal Governments Restricting STRs
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Real Estate Broker · Minneapolis, MN · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 6k+ votes
3yQuote from @Tim Bee:
Quote from @James Hamling:
@Emanuel Blando Just looking at this whole thing with no bias in any direction, it's a really smart mechanism they are using to make this enforcement.
They have obviously learned from other areas trying to enforce such that issuing fines alone does little, but creating regulation that empowers the city to send a "delist" notice to the handful of platforms STR Operators use, well it "cut's em off at the pass" doesn't it. Smart, it's really smart, credit where it's due.
And it reads to me that they said "Ok, people want to operate like a hotel, well then they can exist like a hotel" and hotels have to comply with zoning regulations of being in a commercial zoning, which often is a completely different world of taxation. I am willing to bet that's a component to this.
For how it all goes down, the regulations linked seem to outline it rather clearly, I don't see a reason for confusion, unless your thinking the city government will go through all the trouble of making such regulations to just sit back and not enforce it. It just is what it is, unless you have the $ to burn via filling suite and trying to get an injunction, just accept it and move on.
Let capitalism regain control and communism get out of the way. The most terrifying words in the English Language are: I'm from the government, and I'm here to help.
Look, I am "The Guy" for limited government, and I think your way over-exaggerating this. Zoning regulations are an absolute must, to let people build what-ever, where-ever, is a recipe for a disaster of a city. What this city regulation is doing is exactly what they are supposed to do, throttle commerce to sustainable levels and placement. A market flooded with STR's is not good, and that's exactly what brought this issue to come.
Also, setting a standard on how such business's are run, is the difference between the U.S. landscape and that of, let's say Nigeria. It's not communism to direct a cities development and commerce in an intelligent manner. Your just sore because it's has impact on yourself. How do you feel about food inspectors? Should they get out of those inspections? Used car dealers, should they be allowed to open shop anywhere regardless of zoning?
Look, I hate to tell you but they are right, residential zoning is designed and meant for residential use, NOT hospitality. There is a design to cities for a reason, not just random "communist" motives.
This is an example of city doing it's actual job. The density of STR's is getting out of hand, so they have to do something. That is a common theme all over the place. They didn't have an issue with it, until people made it an issue. MFH has to live in the same scope of adhering to zoning does it not? Every other business has to follow such, so why should STR get special exclusionary rights?
They are not removing capitalism, they are setting the boundaries, which is their job. Every business has such boundaries for operation. The issue seems to be more-so of not wanting to be forced to operate as a a hospitality business.
39 Replies
- 3yAndrew SteffensBusiness MemberTampa, FL · Member since 2022 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
I see this happening in a lot of jurisdictions all over the country. Florida has a law protecting from this to an extent:
Vacation Rentals of Florida53 Reviews - Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes3y
Only warning: no politics. You can discuss policies all you like but denigrating or demonizing "the other side" will either get your post removed or the thread shut down.
Skyline Properties - Handyman · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2018 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes3y
You know, STR and crypto have something in common, or at least their more fervent supporters do. There's this incredibly naive belief that, when profits and long-standing systems of control are threatened, big business and government will play fair and "do the right thing," allowing their power to dissolve and their profits to disappear, when history teaches us that is absolutely false. POWER IS NEVER INNOCENT.
Tech entrepreneurs are always looking to effectively disrupt an industry. A whole generation of them has been raised with "disruption" as one of their chief buzzwords. But with disruption, there is always backlash, and there are always entrenched interests, and all sorts of rich and powerful folks who have something to lose if the status quo changes. These people will not sit on their hands and lose what they have. They will work, fight, and if necessary, scratch and gouge and bite to keep what they have. With AirBnb especially, getting public opinion on the side of the hotels in the name of "sanitary regulation" and "the public good" was child's play for the lobbyist veterans of the hospitality industry. Not when the alternative, STRs, could be easily shilled to the public as unregulated private profit-taking by a widely hated class of convenient villains, already wealthy landlords looking to maximize their parasitic profits. And who was going to fight back and push an alternative narrative in the halls of power? AirBnb? Individual STR owners and operators banding together? Maybe half the public officials in this country take their wives and kids on junkets comped by the hospitality industry. Who was going to fight that kind of investment in manipulating power?Get used to it, people. This is how it's going to be.
- 3yCole SchlackPro MemberRealtor · Hawaii, HI · Member since 2015 · 145 posts · 95 votes
Quote from @Emanuel Blando:
On 5/3/2023 the City of Kansas City, MO announced that Short-Term Rentals will be completely banned in ALL residential zoning! I had not taken it seriously until I read a couple of articles outlining their plans. Most of Kansas City's STRs were already operating 'illegally' up to this point and the city doesn't have the resource to enforce their permitting requirements. Just 7% of KC's BNBs were permitted. But now they plan to enlist the help of the platforms like Airbnb in enforcing their law by requiring Airbnb to not list any properties that have a KC address, with heavy fines on hosts for not complying. (links about all this below)
What I want to know: Is there anyone that knows of other cities that have taken similar measures? Has the government been successful in getting the cooperation of Airbnb and other platforms? How does it all go down when a city begins to ban bnbs?
https://www.kcmo.gov/Home/Components/News/News/2033/16
https://www.kcur.org/news/2023-05-04/kansas-city-council-will-vote-on-restricting-airbnbs-in-residential-neighborhoodsI think its interesting to think about the idea that long term(30 Day plus) is an acceptable business operation in nearly 98% of all cities and counties with almost no regulation. but you drop to 29 days and you are a business and need to pay taxes and fees have permits and be regulated. Someone should be fight this seemingly arbitrary 30 day number. Maybe it should be 8 nights maybe 10, maybe 14 . People should be asking why 30 and fight that angle .
- Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes3y
Quote from @Jim K.:
You know, STR and crypto have something in common, or at least their more fervent supporters do. There's this incredibly naive belief that, when profits and long-standing systems of control are threatened, big business and government will play fair and "do the right thing," allowing their power to dissolve and their profits to disappear, when history teaches us that is absolutely false. POWER IS NEVER INNOCENT.
Tech entrepreneurs are always looking to effectively disrupt an industry. A whole generation of them has been raised with "disruption" as one of their chief buzzwords. But with disruption, there is always backlash, and there are always entrenched interests, and all sorts of rich and powerful folks who have something to lose if the status quo changes. These people will not sit on their hands and lose what they have. They will work, fight, and if necessary, scratch and gouge and bite to keep what they have. With AirBnb especially, getting public opinion on the side of the hotels in the name of "sanitary regulation" and "the public good" was child's play for the lobbyist veterans of the hospitality industry. Not when the alternative, STRs, could be easily shilled to the public as unregulated private profit-taking by a widely hated class of convenient villains, already wealthy landlords looking to maximize their parasitic profits. And who was going to fight back and push an alternative narrative in the halls of power? AirBnb? Individual STR owners and operators banding together? Maybe half the public officials in this country take their wives and kids on junkets comped by the hospitality industry. Who was going to fight that kind of investment in manipulating power?Get used to it, people. This is how it's going to be.
I like the way you put it.
People should think about it.
Why in the world that 1 in 3 homes per 1 miles square miles should be a slave of Airbnb CEO. While they invest zero for you.
This whole on-demand is freaking strange if you think about it.
Netflix on-demand is making sense, Uber or Lyft on-demand is still making sense. But Airbnb ? - Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes3y
It wasn't enforced at all for years... And then by the time things go serious there was no way to come into compliance in a timely manner.
i don't recall the exact outcome, but if I remember right there was talk about allowing an ameisty type period for people to go legit and then be grandfathered. Which then went to as long as it was permitted by a future date....then an arbitrary date on December....and then city canceled all pending applications and made it effective immediately.
I am curious though how this plays out for owners/tenants (with owners consent) in being able to register and operate. All the focus has been non resident owners lately...
- Handyman · Pittsburgh, PA · Member since 2018 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes3y
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Jim K.:
You know, STR and crypto have something in common, or at least their more fervent supporters do. There's this incredibly naive belief that, when profits and long-standing systems of control are threatened, big business and government will play fair and "do the right thing," allowing their power to dissolve and their profits to disappear, when history teaches us that is absolutely false. POWER IS NEVER INNOCENT.
Tech entrepreneurs are always looking to effectively disrupt an industry. A whole generation of them has been raised with "disruption" as one of their chief buzzwords. But with disruption, there is always backlash, and there are always entrenched interests, and all sorts of rich and powerful folks who have something to lose if the status quo changes. These people will not sit on their hands and lose what they have. They will work, fight, and if necessary, scratch and gouge and bite to keep what they have. With AirBnb especially, getting public opinion on the side of the hotels in the name of "sanitary regulation" and "the public good" was child's play for the lobbyist veterans of the hospitality industry. Not when the alternative, STRs, could be easily shilled to the public as unregulated private profit-taking by a widely hated class of convenient villains, already wealthy landlords looking to maximize their parasitic profits. And who was going to fight back and push an alternative narrative in the halls of power? AirBnb? Individual STR owners and operators banding together? Maybe half the public officials in this country take their wives and kids on junkets comped by the hospitality industry. Who was going to fight that kind of investment in manipulating power?Get used to it, people. This is how it's going to be.
I like the way you put it.
People should think about it.
Why in the world that 1 in 3 homes per 1 miles square miles should be a slave of Airbnb CEO. While they invest zero for you.
This whole on-demand is freaking strange if you think about it.
Netflix on-demand is making sense, Uber or Lyft on-demand is still making sense. But Airbnb ?Don't get me wrong, Carlos. I think this whole thing is completely screwed up. Nobody who lived as long as I did in Athens, Greece has bad things to say about Airbnb. A good chunk of the families who live in the city have kept the lights on and paid the bills thanks to Airbnb in the last few debt-crisis years. The bulk of the money goes to the people, not as in the case of the city's many hotels, where most of it goes into the pockets of foreign investors while the Greeks working in the hotels make minimum wage.
The golden rule in America is very simple: he who has the gold, makes the rules. I'm just saying that hoping that Airbnb was going to somehow neatly circumvent this rule, and that the big money in the hospitality industry would stand by and just watch their profits and power evaporate...that's just wishful thinking. - Member since 2019 · 7k+ posts · 4k+ votes3y
Quote from @Jim K.:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Jim K.:
You know, STR and crypto have something in common, or at least their more fervent supporters do. There's this incredibly naive belief that, when profits and long-standing systems of control are threatened, big business and government will play fair and "do the right thing," allowing their power to dissolve and their profits to disappear, when history teaches us that is absolutely false. POWER IS NEVER INNOCENT.
Tech entrepreneurs are always looking to effectively disrupt an industry. A whole generation of them has been raised with "disruption" as one of their chief buzzwords. But with disruption, there is always backlash, and there are always entrenched interests, and all sorts of rich and powerful folks who have something to lose if the status quo changes. These people will not sit on their hands and lose what they have. They will work, fight, and if necessary, scratch and gouge and bite to keep what they have. With AirBnb especially, getting public opinion on the side of the hotels in the name of "sanitary regulation" and "the public good" was child's play for the lobbyist veterans of the hospitality industry. Not when the alternative, STRs, could be easily shilled to the public as unregulated private profit-taking by a widely hated class of convenient villains, already wealthy landlords looking to maximize their parasitic profits. And who was going to fight back and push an alternative narrative in the halls of power? AirBnb? Individual STR owners and operators banding together? Maybe half the public officials in this country take their wives and kids on junkets comped by the hospitality industry. Who was going to fight that kind of investment in manipulating power?Get used to it, people. This is how it's going to be.
I like the way you put it.
People should think about it.
Why in the world that 1 in 3 homes per 1 miles square miles should be a slave of Airbnb CEO. While they invest zero for you.
This whole on-demand is freaking strange if you think about it.
Netflix on-demand is making sense, Uber or Lyft on-demand is still making sense. But Airbnb ?Don't get me wrong, Carlos. I think this whole thing is completely screwed up. Nobody who lived as long as I did in Athens, Greece has bad things to say about Airbnb. A good chunk of the families who live in the city have kept the lights on and paid the bills thanks to Airbnb in the last few debt-crisis years. The bulk of the money goes to the people, not as in the case of the city's many hotels, where most of it goes into the pockets of foreign investors while the Greeks working in the hotels make minimum wage.
The golden rule in America is very simple: he who has the gold, makes the rules. I'm just saying that hoping that Airbnb was going to somehow neatly circumvent this rule, and that the big money in the hospitality industry would stand by and just watch their profits and power evaporate...that's just wishful thinking.Not just the hotel, the hesitancy is coming from local people as they're destroying the local real estate market. If Airbnb hosts in their own OO then it's fine. But many of (illegal) Airbnb is actually coming from out of state investors that's purchasing bulk of real estate market and then rent it out as STR, it makes affordability problem for local people that want to buy. In Hawaii the solution was to have some of these condo to accept STR OR OO SF when Owner lives there. These are good win win solution.
- Cambridge, MA · Member since 2015 · 651 posts · 736 votes3y
Quote from @Jim K.:
Quote from @Carlos Ptriawan:
Quote from @Jim K.:
You know, STR and crypto have something in common, or at least their more fervent supporters do. There's this incredibly naive belief that, when profits and long-standing systems of control are threatened, big business and government will play fair and "do the right thing," allowing their power to dissolve and their profits to disappear, when history teaches us that is absolutely false. POWER IS NEVER INNOCENT.
Tech entrepreneurs are always looking to effectively disrupt an industry. A whole generation of them has been raised with "disruption" as one of their chief buzzwords. But with disruption, there is always backlash, and there are always entrenched interests, and all sorts of rich and powerful folks who have something to lose if the status quo changes. These people will not sit on their hands and lose what they have. They will work, fight, and if necessary, scratch and gouge and bite to keep what they have. With AirBnb especially, getting public opinion on the side of the hotels in the name of "sanitary regulation" and "the public good" was child's play for the lobbyist veterans of the hospitality industry. Not when the alternative, STRs, could be easily shilled to the public as unregulated private profit-taking by a widely hated class of convenient villains, already wealthy landlords looking to maximize their parasitic profits. And who was going to fight back and push an alternative narrative in the halls of power? AirBnb? Individual STR owners and operators banding together? Maybe half the public officials in this country take their wives and kids on junkets comped by the hospitality industry. Who was going to fight that kind of investment in manipulating power?Get used to it, people. This is how it's going to be.
I like the way you put it.
People should think about it.
Why in the world that 1 in 3 homes per 1 miles square miles should be a slave of Airbnb CEO. While they invest zero for you.
This whole on-demand is freaking strange if you think about it.
Netflix on-demand is making sense, Uber or Lyft on-demand is still making sense. But Airbnb ?Don't get me wrong, Carlos. I think this whole thing is completely screwed up. Nobody who lived as long as I did in Athens, Greece has bad things to say about Airbnb. A good chunk of the families who live in the city have kept the lights on and paid the bills thanks to Airbnb in the last few debt-crisis years. The bulk of the money goes to the people, not as in the case of the city's many hotels, where most of it goes into the pockets of foreign investors while the Greeks working in the hotels make minimum wage.
The golden rule in America is very simple: he who has the gold, makes the rules. I'm just saying that hoping that Airbnb was going to somehow neatly circumvent this rule, and that the big money in the hospitality industry would stand by and just watch their profits and power evaporate...that's just wishful thinking.Ok. Speaking as a US urban homeowner, supplementing our retirement income by running 2 Airbnb units in our 2-family home...
The "hotel industry" includes a ton of low-paid workers.
A lot of the pushback in US cities is actually because our rents have skyrocketed. I suspect that city governments know that Airbnb is only a small reason we are experiencing skyrocketing rents but it is low hanging fruit. Unfortunately, almost every urban homeowner I know is vehemently opposed to building more apartments to meet the demand, which is the major reason we continue to experience exorbitant rent increases.
So until us urban homeowners are willing to embrace 20+ story buildings in our backyard, US urban areas will continue to crack down on investor Airbnbs. It's easier than passing zoning reforms.
BTW, my husband and I welcomed the 19 story apartment building in our backyard which is probably the only reason it was able to get it through our planning board.
- Rental Property Investor · Orange County, CA · Member since 2016 · 740 posts · 529 votes3y
Here is the issue..... the BOOM during covid and over-saturation. Cities when crazy with STR's popping up and neighbors freaked out, hotels freaked out and started complaining to the cities. Cities reacted slower and now imposing restrictions even though the covid boom is over, and a lot of STR's will go under bc they can't afford to make the mortgage payments with the natural slow down that is going to back normal. So...... cities might have to re-adjust in a year or 2 when things are more normal. So, yes A LOT of cities have imposed crazy restrictions that only limit tourism. We will have to watch and see.......
- 3yCollin HaysBusiness MemberProperty Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votesThe biggest requirement that STRs can’t meet is commercial zoning. And I’m with local gubmits on this: I don’t want a hotel next door any more than I want a tanning salon or CBD store.
Quote from @Bruce Woodruff:
Quote from @Nathan Gesner:
Yet when hotels comply with regulations, they are allowed to operate. In these cases, STRs are not allowed to operate. Period. Unless I'm missing something......
- Realtor · Gatlinburg · Member since 2020 · 1k+ posts · 957 votes3y
Quote from @Emanuel Blando:
On 5/3/2023 the City of Kansas City, MO announced that Short-Term Rentals will be completely banned in ALL residential zoning! I had not taken it seriously until I read a couple of articles outlining their plans. Most of Kansas City's STRs were already operating 'illegally' up to this point and the city doesn't have the resource to enforce their permitting requirements. Just 7% of KC's BNBs were permitted. But now they plan to enlist the help of the platforms like Airbnb in enforcing their law by requiring Airbnb to not list any properties that have a KC address, with heavy fines on hosts for not complying. (links about all this below)
What I want to know: Is there anyone that knows of other cities that have taken similar measures? Has the government been successful in getting the cooperation of Airbnb and other platforms? How does it all go down when a city begins to ban bnbs?
https://www.kcmo.gov/Home/Components/News/News/2033/16
https://www.kcur.org/news/2023-05-04/kansas-city-council-will-vote-on-restricting-airbnbs-in-residential-neighborhoodsThis is why you can't own and operate a STR in a restrictive state or area and why they should only be done In vacation destinations without restrictive governments.
The free market flushes most of this stuff out though in the long run. Renting out an Airbnb in Kansas City in a subdivision of other houses isn’t a viable long term STR post Covid. And subdivisions generally have HOAs which can restrict it at a more local level.Here in the smokies people have cabins next to residential everywhere. Many cases, there is space between properties. however, if someone lives here and doesn’t want a rental nearby then they live a bit further out or they live in a subdivision hoa and they have restrictions there.
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