rental restrictions, 30 day minimum. How would this be enforced?

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rental restrictions, 30 day minimum. How would this be enforced?

Alexander King
New Haven, CT · Member since 2020 · 62 posts · 18 votes

Looking at a vacation rental that has a rental restriction of 30 days minimum.  Who would enforce it and how would they tell if someone wanted to do a weekly or nightly rental?  

Deal details: $800k pp, 1.5 back end high seasons jan to April 15-25k, low seasons 8-10k

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Lauren Kormylo
Rental Property Investor · Phoenix, AZ and Rehoboth Beach DE · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
2y

Cities or HOAs have an employee or pay an outside person to look on Airbnb and Vrbo and see if they can rent your place for a shorter time.  Easy to do. They also sometimes have a phone number for neighbors to turn violators in too.  Once you're reported to Airbnb as breaking local restrictions, Airbnb will delist you. 

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  • Lauren Kormylo
    Rental Property Investor · Phoenix, AZ and Rehoboth Beach DE · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    2y

    Cities or HOAs have an employee or pay an outside person to look on Airbnb and Vrbo and see if they can rent your place for a shorter time.  Easy to do. They also sometimes have a phone number for neighbors to turn violators in too.  Once you're reported to Airbnb as breaking local restrictions, Airbnb will delist you. 

    5Reply
  • Jesse Turner
    Insurance Agent · Gainesville, GA · Member since 2023 · 99 posts · 89 votes
    2y

    Neighbors could also report you to the city. You’d want to check with Furnished Finders to see what you could get for the property on a “medium-term” basis rather than short-term.

    3Reply
  • John UnderwoodPro Member
    Investor · Greer, SC · Member since 2014 · 13k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    2y

    Ciry or County can enforce this and report you just from checking your listing.

    2Reply
  • Monique P.
    Member since 2023 · 88 posts · 62 votes
    2y

    Some cities require the STR permit number in the title or very top of the OTA listing so city permit technicians can scan and keep track otherwise the owner will be contacted and fined for forgetting or shut down if operating illegally.

    Some cities have a 24/7 STR hotline dedicated to receiving any complaints (from neighbors, HOA) for a code compliance officer to act on

    Some cities issue expensive fines for those operating without the STR permit. $3,000 for the first violation and $5,000 for every violation after.

    Some may not catch onto the first dozen of rental times with a STR flying under the radar but depending on how sensitive the market is to STRs, will determine how quickly that operator will be cited and shut down.

    And there's the unpaid taxes for operating illegally... i'd give this property a thumbs down.

    0Reply
  • Michael BaumPro Member
    Olympia, WA · Member since 2016 · 8k+ posts · 7k+ votes
    2y

    Hey @Alexander King, everyone said it best.

    All I can say is don't be that guy. Don't be the one who breaks the rules and makes life hard for everyone in the STR game.

    3Reply
  • Andrew SteffensBusiness Member
    Tampa, FL · Member since 2022 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
    2y

    Some places enforce it more than others, but you should not buy with the intent of breaking the rules.  It will catch up to you eventually.  Code enforcement officers are usually the ones who catch on to you.  Once they have proof of the violation you may get a warning, and then a daily fine.  It gets expensive and there is nothing you can do in most cases.

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  • Bill B.
    Investor · Las Vegas, NV · Member since 2013 · 8k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    2y
    0Reply
  • Alexander King
    OP
    New Haven, CT · Member since 2020 · 62 posts · 18 votes
    2y
    Quote from @Jesse Turner:

    Neighbors could also report you to the city. You’d want to check with Furnished Finders to see what you could get for the property on a “medium-term” basis rather than short-term.


     Furnished Finders... great piece of information here!  Thanks Jesse

    0Reply
  • John Clark
    Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    2y

    Some places require the platform to report days rented to the city, and I have heard of forbidding platforms from renting if X days exceeded, on penalty of losing permission to do business in the city.

    You also have to report your activity to the city, and may God have mercy on your soul if your report doesn’t match the rental platform’s report.

    0Reply
  • Tim J.
    Investor · Vermont and New York · Member since 2023 · 308 posts · 309 votes
    2y

    IMO It is a complete violation of the takings clause of the 5th amendment... but you're going to be in for a world of hurt if you buy into a market with existing restrictions.  

    0Reply
  • John Clark
    Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    2y
    Quote from @Tim J.:

    IMO It is a complete violation of the takings clause of the 5th amendment... but you're going to be in for a world of hurt if you buy into a market with existing restrictions.  

    Rubbish. Short term rentals impose costs on the local community (parking, noise, increased demands on infrastructure), so regulation is completely justified. Your right to swing your fist ends before it connects with your neighbor’s nose.
    0Reply
  • John Clark
    Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    2y
    Quote from @Tim J.:

    IMO It is a complete violation of the takings clause of the 5th amendment... but you're going to be in for a world of hurt if you buy into a market with existing restrictions.  

    Rubbish. Short term rentals impose costs on the local community (parking, noise, increased demands on infrastructure), so regulation is completely justified. Your right to swing your fist ends before it connects with your neighbor’s nose.
    0Reply
  • Tim J.
    Investor · Vermont and New York · Member since 2023 · 308 posts · 309 votes
    2y
    Quote from @John Clark:
    Quote from @Tim J.:

    IMO It is a complete violation of the takings clause of the 5th amendment... but you're going to be in for a world of hurt if you buy into a market with existing restrictions.  

    Rubbish. Short term rentals impose costs on the local community (parking, noise, increased demands on infrastructure), so regulation is completely justified. Your right to swing your fist ends before it connects with your neighbor’s nose.

    LOL.  You felt so strongly about this you responded twice.  First of all, the nuisance stuff you mention like parking and noise usually already have town codes to handle that.  So instead of taking property rights away, the municipality should just enforce the town codes.  Second, I don't see how one can unilaterally say that short term rentals are a negative.  In fact, in many places they are a boon tot he local economy.  

    So, right back at you:  "RUBBISH"

    Regulation is absolutely anti-American.  We fought a war against tyranny for similar over-reach.

    Not sure what the F you are talking about with respect to swinging fists. 
    0Reply
  • Jeremy Jareckyj
    Real Estate Agent · Salt Lake City, UT · Member since 2020 · 490 posts · 205 votes
    2y
    Quote from @Alexander King:

    Looking at a vacation rental that has a rental restriction of 30 days minimum.  Who would enforce it and how would they tell if someone wanted to do a weekly or nightly rental?  

    Deal details: $800k pp, 1.5 back end high seasons jan to April 15-25k, low seasons 8-10k


     Yeah most cities will use their code enforcement department to give you notices to be in compliant.

    0Reply
  • John Clark
    Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    2y
    Quote from @Tim J.:
    Quote from @John Clark:
    Quote from @Tim J.:

    IMO It is a complete violation of the takings clause of the 5th amendment... but you're going to be in for a world of hurt if you buy into a market with existing restrictions.  

    Rubbish. Short term rentals impose costs on the local community (parking, noise, increased demands on infrastructure), so regulation is completely justified. Your right to swing your fist ends before it connects with your neighbor’s nose.

    LOL.  You felt so strongly about this you responded twice.  First of all, the nuisance stuff you mention like parking and noise usually already have town codes to handle that.  So instead of taking property rights away, the municipality should just enforce the town codes.  Second, I don't see how one can unilaterally say that short term rentals are a negative.  In fact, in many places they are a boon tot he local economy.  

    So, right back at you:  "RUBBISH"

    Regulation is absolutely anti-American.  We fought a war against tyranny for similar over-reach.

    Not sure what the F you are talking about with respect to swinging fists. 

    Yes, I tapped the post button twice. My bust.


    parking and noise, etc are externalities imposed on the people but not properly paid for. People buy homes in residential areas, not business districts, so when someone starts running a business in a residential area, the externalities are beyond what people can be expected to put up with, and the government can regulate. 


    case in point - parking. Parking capacity is usually determined by expected use capacity. When I start running a business with lots of additional cars coming in, I crowd out the residents, imposing a cost on them, even if all of my guests are lawfully and properly parking their cars. 


    case in point- noise. Tourists behave differently from residents. They’re noisier. We expect a certain level of noise. But when it’s exceeded constantly, it becomes an externality that’s a cost on the residents.


    nor can one blithely say to just enforce local parking and noise laws. If the visitor’s car is properly parked, the cops have nothing to ticket. It’s the residents who were crowded out and forced to improperly park because you are running a business in a residential area who would get the ticket. 


    as for noise complaints, the cops coming after the noise has started is after the damage is done. Just ask any parent trying to get a baby to sleep. And I’ll tell you something else too: Eventually the cops stop coming. Putting up with the neighbors having a loud party once a year is one thing. Putting up with strangers partying loudly every weekend is a difference of degree so great as to be a difference in kind. The conditions giving rise to that state of affairs ( short term rentals) can be regulated/banned properly under any philosophical construct of law (even Ayn Rand would approve).


    so I suspect you’ll find there’s no property right to impose externalities on your neighbors by running a business in a residential neighborhood. 


    fists and noses? Classic example of imposing externalities on others. 


    so the reasonableness of regulation depends on the context.


    so yes, your absolutist position is rubbish. 

    0Reply
  • Nathan GesnerBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
    2y

    Cheaters don't win, and winners don't cheat.

    "What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul?" Matthew 16:26

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