How are you handling Coronavirus cancellations?
Real Estate Investor · Summerfield, NC · Member since 2016 · 56 posts · 55 votes
How are you handling Coronavirus cancellations?
Most Popular Reply
John UnderwoodPro Member
Investor · Greer, SC · Member since 2014 · 13k+ posts · 17k+ votesI just had my first cancellation due to virus concerns. It was beyond the full price refund time.
I gave them a full refund. I think it was the right thing to do.
I don't live hand to mouth and I can afford to do this.
132 Replies
- Investor · Modesto, CA · Member since 2020 · 32 posts · 19 votes6y
@Steve K. I’ve had 3 cancellations within the last hour all for the month of March, I currently have two Airbnb’s in California near the Bay Area where a lot of the cases of covid are arising. Here in California / Bay Area there are no gatherings of any kind at the line to - I eldest to have more cancellations and will hone them due to the circumstances.
I think not giving a full refund would be unfair to the guest, glues we all want to pay our mortgages on time and have extra funds but this I feel is a matter that isn’t in our control ( or maybe we had plenty of time to see this coming, and our government didn’t prepare effectively) either way it’s here and will likely stay here in the future. As of now I will make sure to lower prices a bit and add multiple night discounts.
- 6yMichael K GallagherBusiness MemberReal Estate Agent · Columbus OH · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
@Collin H. Well said! Something tells me you are a fan of “extreme ownership”! I’m currently dealing with a cruise that was planned and paid for in April, sure I’m going to try and get my money back, but at the end of the day it was my choice to go on the cruise and it’s their choice to refund me or not.
- 6yCollin HaysBusiness MemberProperty Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
Originally posted by @Michael K Gallagher:
@Collin H. Well said! Something tells me you are a fan of “extreme ownership”! I’m currently dealing with a cruise that was planned and paid for in April, sure I’m going to try and get my money back, but at the end of the day it was my choice to go on the cruise and it’s their choice to refund me or not.
Well I don’t know about “extreme”, I just think we have to be careful automatically assuming that guests deserve charity and rich homeowners do not.
My son was supposed to be on a cruise this week, as well. He opted not to go. We don’t fault the cruise line for this and would never even think of asking a refund. Personal responsibility needs to rule the day.
Meanwhile, I have a $15,000 water drainage issue to repair at one of my STRs. This is financially catastrophic for me, but I am not asking charity from anyone. I am the owner and that’s part of the deal.I do think that it is incredibly awful and hypocritical of Homeaway/VRBO to be actively be pushing trip insurance to every renter, for just these such occasions, and they have apparently found some escape hatches in their policies and are NOT reimbursing guests for CV related cancellations. THAT is immoral.
- Investor · Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2016 · 17 posts · 21 votes6y
@Kevin Lefeuvre - I hope that family did enjoy Disneyland before it was closed due to the virus.
First and foremost, I think AirBNB should be the one refunding these bookings as they can best handle the losses. And I’m not advocating for cancellations for no reason.
Yes, there are standard procedures for cancellations but this situation is anything but standard. At the very least, show a little humanity and work with the guests versus pointing to a cancellation policy that was not designed for this scenario.
I would be extremely concerned about my reviews as a host if I showed no compassion under these circumstances.
Great thread and read! The answers vary and you can manage your business as you want but in the end the customer will always be…well, I’l let Sam Walton finish that line, “There is only one boss. The customer. And he can fire everybody in the company from the chairman on down, simply by spending his money somewhere else.” Makes you think about the customer experience. It’s about them not us so think about win-win proposals that can benefit both parties.
- Seattle, WA · Member since 2017 · 16 posts · 7 votes6y
@Collin H.
Silly, our socialist government is literally working the levers to stop evictions, to set relief funds. States with cases are turning on water and other utilities so people can wash their hands to stop the spread of sickness. Then deferring to programs to take payments or have non profits help out. Because compassion and human life is more important than the bottom dollar... I mean once everyone dies where is the demand for the supply. Your priorities need to be checked. Go get informed from real news sources.
Furthermore I cant teach you why you shouldn't care about other people, because that falls under your either a trash goblin or someone who understands hard times means EVERYONE is going to hurt for a little bit.
- 6yCollin HaysBusiness MemberProperty Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
Originally posted by @Jordan Hawthorn:
@Collin H.
Silly, our socialist government is literally working the levers to stop evictions, to set relief funds. States with cases are turning on water and other utilities so people can wash their hands to stop the spread of sickness. Then deferring to programs to take payments or have non profits help out. Because compassion and human life is more important than the bottom dollar... I mean once everyone dies where is the demand for the supply. Your priorities need to be checked. Go get informed from real news sources.
Furthermore I cant teach you why you shouldn't care about other people, because that falls under your either a trash goblin or someone who understands hard times means EVERYONE is going to hurt for a little bit.
So my homeowner clients deserve no compassion? Most of are relying on these STRs for their incomes. So I am supposed to tell them "sorry, you've got no income this month as we are allowing everyone refunds". What makes the guest more deserving of the financial break? Because they are presumably poorer than the homeowner?
- Seattle, WA · Member since 2017 · 16 posts · 7 votes6y
@Collin H.
Receiving money for a service that was not provided, with the ability to possibly book a last minute tenant seems a lot like taking advantage of a situation. Let me guess we should also pay for the vaccine when it arrives because it cost money to develop and we cant just do things for the wellbeing of fellow mankind. You'll be ok because you have saving and cash reserves though! Never mind the elderly and children and the expecting mothers who might loose their children. Oh but you're homeowner doesnt have the reserves to weather even 1 cancelation? Hahaha listen to yourself. I love how fast people forget that hard times come and 12 years ago we went through something that this can potentially morph into. I'm 26 and I specifically set my finances to live of unemployment because I dont want to short sale for a lose or have a repossession on my cr. Good luck with business, I'm sure people will e busting down your door for you to take their money with no services rendered.
- Hatfield, PA · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 629 votes6y
The only thing I can say about these coronavirus cancellation threads are, each person will do what they want.
but I don't get those who try to tell others what they should do cancellation, as frankly it's absolutely none of their business.
we have a cancellation policy. During this crisis time, we manage our business adjusting prices and policies as we see fit. If we wish to give a partial or full cancellation to 2 past guests or those we never have met that is our business.
we are not obligated to people who book because they are afraid or they changed your mind or something was canceled. Don't care what hotels are doing. Don't care what airlines are doing. They are big, we are not.
so stop the moralizing about that we are greedy or harsh or other stupid things when it's our business and not yours and we do as we think we need to do.
it's completely and totally none of your business
- 6yCollin HaysBusiness MemberProperty Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
Originally posted by @Jordan Hawthorn:
@Collin H.
Receiving money for a service that was not provided, with the ability to possibly book a last minute tenant seems a lot like taking advantage of a situation. Let me guess we should also pay for the vaccine when it arrives because it cost money to develop and we cant just do things for the wellbeing of fellow mankind. You'll be ok because you have saving and cash reserves though! Never mind the elderly and children and the expecting mothers who might loose their children. Oh but you're homeowner doesnt have the reserves to weather even 1 cancelation? Hahaha listen to yourself. I love how fast people forget that hard times come and 12 years ago we went through something that this can potentially morph into. I'm 26 and I specifically set my finances to live of unemployment because I dont want to short sale for a lose or have a repossession on my cr. Good luck with business, I'm sure people will e busting down your door for you to take their money with no services rendered.
One cancellation? Try a month's worth. A homeowner booked off their home for a period of time in return for payment. Both parties agreed to the terms. The guest had the opportunity to buy trip insurance. The guest doesn't want to travel out of fear (and justifiably so!) So now the homeowner is the bad guy. Rich, greedy SOB. Everyone knows a homeowner has the means to skip payments for a month or two.
If you want free cancellation within two weeks, don't book a vacation rental. There are all sorts of things that can happen that screw up our plans - sickness, death, job loss, natural disasters, you name it. If you are fearful of such, buy trip insurance. If you want to self-insure, don't buy trip insurance. But don't ask the homeowner to step in and be your insurance. If you need a fully refundable at any time stay, book at the Holiday Inn. They can re-sell that room in 5 minutes.
- 6yCliff H.Pro MemberRental Property Investor · Nashua, NH · Member since 2014 · 599 posts · 477 votes
Just a FYI that if you have guests traveling in from Europe you are now required by some (likely soon all) of the STR platforms to fully refund guest prepayment for stays between 3/14/20 - 4/14/20.
Here’s a snippet from the notification Booking.com sent out to hosts just this week:
“As a result of the policies put in place by the US government about the Coronavirus, guests from the Schengen area in Europe will be prevented from traveling to or staying at your accommodation.
As a consequence we have declared Force Majeure/Forced Circumstances for:
- All reservations made for properties in the United States by travelers from all 26 Schengen countries *), or travelers who have been in the Schengen area in the past 14 days;
- with a check-in date between Saturday, March 14, 2020 and Tuesday, April 14, 2020 (including).
- American citizens, US permanent legal residents, and their families are excluded from the travel ban.
*) Schengen countries: Austria, Belgium, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Liechtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland.
What’s the impact?
With Force Majeure, we expect you to refund any prepayment and waive any cancellation amounts (fees, costs, expenses, and/or other amounts) for all reservations with arrival within the Force Majeure period, if the guest has requested cancellation.
Booking.com will waive the commission in these cases.”
- Contractor · Canton, GA · Member since 2015 · 111 posts · 81 votes6y
Let's say I have a week stay at your accommodations next week.
You refuse to refund.
I come because I have 1100$ to lose along with a contagion.
I'd rather be messing up your place, rather than mine.
Enjoy, the clean up.
As unlikely, this will happen, it's the perception. Then you may have to report it.
I don't do STRS, yet, but the hospitality aspect has a higher expectation, higher liability, and a higher profit. This field will need to analyze what is important and consistent in this platform. REI has its limitations, flaws and extravagant laws, STRS are now seeing what can happen to them. It Wouldn't surprise me that people will need inspections by the health dept. to allow places to be rented. Given a few outbreaks , I'll be happy to stay home.
- Rental Property Investor · Sioux Falls, SD · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 18k+ votes6y
Originally posted by @Collin Hays:
I wouldn't be surprised if there isn't a class action lawsuit that comes out of this with VBRO and AIRBNB. Save copies of all your correspondence.
Of course there will be lawsuits. That's the American way! If something befalls you, find someone else to blame and get your pound of flesh. You didn't buy trip insurance? No worries - the HOMEOWNER is underwriting your risk. Of course, he's taking on all sorts of capital risk that you aren't, but facts be damned.
Nuts.
It looks like the litigation is going to actually be STR owners suing STR companies. New announcement by AirBNB, they are allowing Coronavirus cancellations with 100% refund, regardless of host policy. I would expect others to follow suit.
I love it though, AirBNB is letting hosts cancel reservations without penalty too. You now to keep it fair since guests get 100% refund.
- Investor · Cocoa Beach, FL · Member since 2011 · 3 posts · 5 votes6y
1) When it comes to cancelations - and most other things in life - "I" find the right thing to do is typically the hard thing to do. I simply look at the situation - "how I would want to be treated" and manage it from there.
2) In the 10 years I have owned STR's, I can't remember keeping funds for ANY cancellation. I am probably too trusting - but I am confident the above mantra has helped us - more than hurt us. I lay awake at night wondering about many things - but never second-guessing myself about giving a guest their money back for a cancellation. Then again, I don't (and never did get) a lot of cancellation requests.
3) Note: Our guests stay an average of 3.5 nights - and not typically more than a week. Therefore, if I lose a last-minute booking (and can't re-book) it is not a huge dent. I also don't act like I am going to be a pushover on my cancellation policy when they inquire. There have been a dozen or so times that people have not booked one of my properties because of my cancelation policy.
4.) Covid-19: Due to this new virus I have received at least 6 cancellations (100% refund) in the two condo's I now own/manage on the East coast of Florida. Oddly enough, I have rebooked most of those canceled dates. I know more cancellations are coming - and I am not looking forward to them. However, I am confident I will keep treating people how I would want to be treated.
BEST OF LUCK TO ALL DURING THIS TIME OF UNCERTAINTY.
- 6yKaren ChenaillePro MemberReal Estate Agent · Sevierville, TN · Member since 2017 · 165 posts · 137 votes
@Jay Hinrichs. When a guest cancels they don’t get to review the host.
- 6yKaren ChenaillePro MemberReal Estate Agent · Sevierville, TN · Member since 2017 · 165 posts · 137 votes
@Andrea Cole I like how your response is worded. Hope you don’t mind if I steal it. :-)
- 6yKaren ChenaillePro MemberReal Estate Agent · Sevierville, TN · Member since 2017 · 165 posts · 137 votes
@Collin H.a guest who cancels cannot leave a review.
Airbnb and VRBO should absolutely step in and protect their guest and the industry during this national emergency. Even the fee hungry airlines are refunding fares and waving change fees.
While unfortunate for owners who will lose money, you should really take a long term perspective on this. Do the right thing, and you will more than likely gain a repeat guest for life. Or keep their money and that guest may never book a short term rental ever again.
- Rental Property Investor · La Quinta, CA · Member since 2018 · 263 posts · 95 votes6y
As of today, Airbnb’s extenuating circumstance policy allows for reservations booked before 3/13 for any period between 3/13-3/31 to receive a full refund do the corona virus outbreak.
https://techcrunch.com/2020/03/13/airbnb-extends-no-charge-cancellation-policy-due-to-coronavirus/
- Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2016 · 565 posts · 391 votes6y
Does anyone know what happens for Airbnb cancellations for US guests happening let's say last week, before the email announcement today, where the guest is in the dates announced today, but was not covered until today (because not from China or Italy), and Airbnb sent out the payout. Are they going to "take it back" ?
What a mess!
- Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2016 · 565 posts · 391 votes6y
Originally posted by @Steven Lowe:
Originally posted by @Kevin Lefeuvre:
I thought Disneyland was closed?
https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/12/media/disneyland-close-coronavirus/index.htmlDisney Land in Anaheim, CA closes tonight, was open until now.
@Jordan Hawthorn
The host are providing the service as contracted. The guest are the ones choosing not to honor the contract by canceling. Cancellation policy’s are clearly defined before a guest makes a reservation. They chose to make the reservation and not to purchase travel insurance. Host have no obligation to offer anything more than what was originally agreed upon.
You’ve set up some communistic straw man argument that a rich fat cat homeowner capitalist has taken advantage of poor people. You just assume the host is somehow better off than the guest. Vacations are a luxury, not some basic human right. You’re quick to jump and say a homeowner should have reserves to weather cancellations outside of what was originally agreed upon, but not acknowledge that the guest has disposable income to take a vacation.
Wether they can afford to or not a host has zero moral or financial obligation to provide refunds because a guest didn’t responsibility plan their trip. Welcome to the real world. I can guarantee the guest doesn’t make this mistake again and the market as a whole is better off.
Originally posted by @Dan Schwartz:
It’s clear which of the commenters are in, or at least understand the hospitality business, and which ones don’t.
I’m not surprised by the preponderance of responses here. They aren’t your clients; they are Airbnb’s clients. That’s why Airbnb is refunding affected travelers, same as nearly everyone else in the tourism/hospitality business is.
Airbnb isn’t refunding them. The homeowners (that count on that income to make their mortgage) are
Airbnb is just a website that shows properties that individuals have for leases. A guest isn’t airbnbs client. If anything the HOSTS are.
This is like if I posted an apartment for rent on Craigslist, had someone out down a deposit, had that tenant change their mind, and somehow Craigslist took it upon themselves to give that person their deposit back using my money.I have no dog in this fight. And am not event arguing that hosts shouldn’t try to work something out with their guests. But I’ve always felt they were a garbage conpany. This confirms it.
Originally posted by @Jordan Hawthorn:
@Collin H.
Silly, our socialist government is literally working the levers to stop evictions, to set relief funds. States with cases are turning on water and other utilities so people can wash their hands to stop the spread of sickness. Then deferring to programs to take payments or have non profits help out. Because compassion and human life is more important than the bottom dollar... I mean once everyone dies where is the demand for the supply. Your priorities need to be checked. Go get informed from real news sources.
Furthermore I cant teach you why you shouldn't care about other people, because that falls under your either a trash goblin or someone who understands hard times means EVERYONE is going to hurt for a little bit.
I’m seeing a lot of people being very generous and compassionate with OTHER people’s money
Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.