How are you handling Coronavirus cancellations?

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How are you handling Coronavirus cancellations?

Real Estate Investor · Summerfield, NC · Member since 2016 · 56 posts · 55 votes

We have a Strict cancellation policy but guests are asking for full refunds due to events that are cancelled in the area. We are not in a region of the US that Airbnb recognizes in the extenuating circumstance guidelines. I'm inclined to adhere to our cancellation policy but I'm having trouble putting into words the rational. Thoughts?? Am I being unreasonable?

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John UnderwoodPro Member

Investor · Greer, SC · Member since 2014 · 13k+ posts · 17k+ votes

I just had my first cancellation due to virus concerns. It was beyond the full price refund time.

I gave them a full refund. I think it was the right thing to do.

I don't live hand to mouth and I can afford to do this.

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Dee Thomas
Flipper/Rehabber · Dover, DE · Member since 2020 · 3 posts · 2 votes
6y
@Collin H. That may be your policy but what happenens when a guest travels to Your Airbnb THAT HAS THE VIRUS AND INFECTS YOUR PLACE SOMETHING CALLED KARMA! So do as you wish but use have some compassion and since a State of emergency has been declared YOU can file a claim to recoup your LOST INCOME! ( Is it worth it seriously?)
2 Reply
Michael Greenberg
Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2016 · 533 posts · 433 votes
6y
- Terms of Airbnb's updated policy below. A unilateral stance and completely unfair to not include hosts in the process and just refund guests 100%. Heck, they didn't even offer "no fee" bookings for new guests. I'm down about $10K already. Nice of them to not affect our SH stats - WHO CARES?! I would like to understand what an attorney might think about this, whether or not we would choose to reimburse. My preference would have been that Airbnb allow guests to cancel without penalty, but allow them to rebook at a later date, at the same rates. Would have been a less painful stance.
- The guest will receive a full refund (including any fees)
- Hosts won’t incur any cancellation fees
- Hosts can accept new reservations for those dates
- Superhost status will not be affected
2 Reply
Brian Ploszay
Investor · Chicago, IL · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
6y
Great Post. It is a judgement call and I would tend to allow refunds because of these unique circumstances. Yes, you are taking a loss.
Let's go forward for a moment: Airbnb rentals are an asset class that is highly affected by this virus.

You are going to have lots of vacancy for foreseeable future.

Hopefully this downturn is temporary, but you may have to carry losses on these investments for several months.
1 Reply
Todd Goedeke
Contractor · Sheboygan, WI · Member since 2016 · 921 posts · 266 votes
6y

@David L., good luck trying to rationalize your point in the face of a declared National Emergency. Attorneys, like sharks, will be glad to represent travelers,vacationers in a class action suit against hosts that did not refund reservations.

@Ken Latchers, you may win the battle but surely lose the war if you do not refund. KARMA has a way of finding people who in a National Emergency decide their interests take priority over travelers.Your policy is every competitors dream and leaves the STVR industry with a stain when this is over. So yes, it is other people 's business how you conduct yourself if it leaves a black eye on the Airbnb platform.
2 Reply
Mary M.
Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
6y
As a person who stays in STRs I would never stay in a place if I knew the owners/managers did not refund 100% during this global Emergency....

we are all in this together, give the refunds, be a better person.
2 Reply
Mary M.
Rental Property Investor · Portland OR · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 3k+ votes
6y
Originally posted by @Collin Hays:
Originally posted by @Jordan Hawthorn:
@Collin H.
Silly, our socialist government is literally working the levers to stop evictions, to set relief funds. States with cases are turning on water and other utilities so people can wash their hands to stop the spread of sickness. Then deferring to programs to take payments or have non profits help out. Because compassion and human life is more important than the bottom dollar... I mean once everyone dies where is the demand for the supply. Your priorities need to be checked. Go get informed from real news sources.
Furthermore I cant teach you why you shouldn't care about other people, because that falls under your either a trash goblin or someone who understands hard times means EVERYONE is going to hurt for a little bit.

So my homeowner clients deserve no compassion? Most of are relying on these STRs for their incomes. So I am supposed to tell them "sorry, you've got no income this month as we are allowing everyone refunds". What makes the guest more deserving of the financial break? Because they are presumably poorer than the homeowner?

Your owners should have insurance that covers this kind of thing, they also should have 6 months of reserves just in case- and finally, the govt is figuring out ways to help - so it isnt “just” renters - we are all in this together.
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Collin HaysBusiness Member
Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
6y

There again, we are back to picking sides based on “who” presumably can afford a loss, reserves that “you owners” should have, and insurance owners should have.

“Who” can most easily absorb a financial hit is purely subjective and isn’t relevant.

Home owners certainly “should” have reserves for financial catastrophes like ones that I have endured.

Homeowners CAN buy business interruption insurance and in fact most have this in their policy. “Fear of travel” is most certainly NOT a covered peril.

However, guests CAN purchase trip interruption insurance and in fact are promoted to do so by Airbnb and VRBO. These companies have made $ millions in profit off of these policies. However, most of the claims currently being filed by vacationers due to fear of travel due to CV are NOT being paid by these companies.

It is disgusting that Airbnb is arbitrarily taking from owners to refund some of these guests while they are SIMULTANEOUSLY DENYING refunds filed under the insurance that Airbnb sold to the vacationer.

It’s apparently all on the greedy rich homeowner.

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David L.
Nashville, TN · Member since 2016 · 8 posts · 6 votes
6y
@Dee Thomas
Please explain who an Airbnb host would file a “state of emergency claim” with to recoup loss of rental income.
0 Reply
Adam TafelBusiness Member
Real Estate Agent · St. Paul, MN · Member since 2017 · 592 posts · 402 votes
6y
I'm trying my best to be ethical and fair, and yet not take a major loss. A manage a combination of "airbnb arbitrage" apartments, homes for management clients, and my own investments. I'm on the hook for about $7000/mo no matter what, my goal is to break even this month. Hopefully it happens, we shall see.
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Anand S.
Plantation, FL · Member since 2009 · 329 posts · 119 votes
6y
If "we're all in this together" shouldn't the guest bear half of the burden as well? Why is the homeowner expected to bear the entire brunt when they also have commitments that will not be forgiven such as mortgage, utilities, taxes, insurance, etc.? Wish they would accept the argument that we're all in this together and forgive us.
5 Reply
Ken Latchers
Hatfield, PA · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 629 votes
6y

You are borderline a nutcase. A class action suit against hosts because guess you're not happy with the cancellation policy they agreed to?

Attorneys, like sharks, will be glad to represent travelers,vacationers in a class action suit against hosts that did not refund reservations

Karma doesn't exist. And since very few guests ever repeat, I'm not worried about the rest of the noise below.
, KARMA has a way of finding people who in a National Emergency decide their interests take priority over travelers.Your policy is every competitors dream and leaves the STVR industry with a stain when this is over. So yes, it is other people 's business how you conduct yourself if it leaves a black eye on the Airbnb platform.

3 Reply
Ken Latchers
Hatfield, PA · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 629 votes
6y
I need to keep reserves because someone couldn't keep your vacation and I should subsidize them? Again, that's what travel insurance is for. But they decided they didn't need. Busybodies who keep trying to tell other owners what we should be doing should go mind your own businesses and stop interfering with others.

Originally posted by @Mary M.:

3 Reply
David L.
Nashville, TN · Member since 2016 · 8 posts · 6 votes
6y
@Anand S.
Look at the states of the people in here who hold the opposing view and you will quickly get your answer. There is no logic to their argument.
I have compassion that people’s vacations are being disrupted. However it’s not my financial responsibility to hold 100% of the liability because they didn’t take the necessary precautions when they planned their trip.
There is no compassion from the other side. In their minds Homeowner, landlord, business owner = Evil & Guest, Renter, Worker = Poor person getting taken advantage of.
2 Reply
Cliff H.Pro Member
Rental Property Investor · Nashua, NH · Member since 2014 · 599 posts · 477 votes
6y
Vacancies and reserve accounts are a part of every investment in real property. As a host, I am remaining completely transparent with booked guests on what their rights are around cancellations. Similarly, it's incumbent on us to educate guests on both the standard processes we have in place for disinfecting all switches, surfaces, and countertops with every turnover, as well as the reality of what we know on how/where COVID19 spreads and how long it can survive on surfaces, which appears to be somewhere between several hours - 3 days in one study versus up to 9 days in another.

In short, for those of us following standard procedures of having cleaners wipe down all surfaces between weekly turnovers the risk to the average guest (even in a space where an infected individual just left) is still likely quite minimal.

And in an environment where we have to have a thread on where to buy TP because people's worst fear about the end of the world is an inability to wipe their bottoms, a little guest education on risk profiles of staying in our homes never hurt anyone.
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Ken Latchers
Hatfield, PA · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 629 votes
6y
There is a cancellation entitlement mentality among some guests,

where they booked found a lower price and then tried to cancel.

where they booked and didn't really know their schedule or changed their mind and then tried to cancel.

where they booked and decided they didn't need trip insurance

where they booked and were looking to get freebies or threaten the owner in some way such as a bad review expecting comps

where they showed up and stayed a day or two and then tried to cancel for a really minor thing. Usually hoping to get a free stay.

so to the theory that I owe them beyond the cancellation policy or that we share the pain, rings very hollow to me

My town is tourism. Nobody comes here for conferences or shows or business reasons, just to relax for a couple days. They are not under duress, they just don't feel comfortable and think they should get out of their booking.
2 Reply
Dan Schwartz
Real Estate Investor · Tempe, AZ · Member since 2012 · 874 posts · 648 votes
6y

@Cody L. Airbnb is the (a) brand for short term rentals. Homeowners own the property. Hilton is a brand for hotels. Seven out of eight times, someone other than Hilton usually owns the property. If they want to fly the Hilton flag, they follow Hilton's rules, which now include free cancellations for all reservations up to 24 prior to arrival. It's not Hilton eating those losses so much as the property owners and managers, just like we are talking about here. Again, I've been posting in this thread to point out that STR investors who are relying on Airbnb/VRBO/etc for bookings (which is most, but not everyone) has inserted themselves into the hospitality industry, which has major players calling the shots. There is no such analog in the long-term rental industry.

@Collin Hays the beef with insurance is a valid one. Airbnb/VRBO sell the insurance as agents for the big insurers. The big insurers are getting hammered (as expected). I have people going on three weeks waiting for any acknowledgment of cancellation from one large insurer. As with any insurance, the more claims made, the lower the purchaser is rated. If Airbnb sends all of their customers to insurance to make claims, their loss rate will skyrocket and the insurer will make future insurance sales far less profitable for Airbnb. It's often a wiser decision for the travel company to refund money vs send them to make an insurance claim. Again, I point back to the comment above; this is common practice in the travel industry, and it's Airbnb/VRBO who gets to call the shots on their platform. Hotels switch flags all the time, and I won't be surprised to see people leave certain STR platforms based on these emergency policies.
Again, I hope everyone makes it through this!!
1 Reply
Collin HaysBusiness Member
Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
6y
Wow! I just got in from helping my neighbor Jack off his horse and this has turned into quite a debate!
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Aaron B.
Global · Member since 2019 · 48 posts · 52 votes
6y
I had one reschedule to June, another cancel within time to receive a full refund according to the refund policy set on Airbnb, and the other asking for a full refund after canceling the day before. He has to talk with Airbnb support to get a refund, and Airbnb is currently offering refunds to guests & hosts who have to cancel due to COVID-19. They are also not penalizing anyone's profiles for these extenuating circumstances.

Read Airbnb's policystance on COVID-19 here:
https://www.airbnb.com/help/article/2701/extenuating-circumstances-policy-and-the-coronavirus-covid19

"Existing reservations made on or before March 14, 2020 for stays and Airbnb Experiences with a check-in date of April 14, 2020, or earlier, and with at least one night occurring between March 14, 2020, and April 14, 2020, are covered. Guests who cancel will receive a full refund, and hosts will be able to cancel without charge or impact to their Superhost status. The host’s cancellation policy will apply as usual to reservations made after March 14, 2020, and to existing reservations made on or before March 14, 2020 with check-in dates after April 14, 2020."
So if you are talking about Airbnb short-term rentals, it has already been decided for you.
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Anand S.
Plantation, FL · Member since 2009 · 329 posts · 119 votes
6y
Up to $22K in cancelled reservations and counting... Once ABB opened up the US to the extenuating circumstances, the flood gates opened.
1 Reply
Collin HaysBusiness Member
Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
6y
Originally posted by @Anand S.:
Up to $22K in cancelled reservations and counting... Once ABB opened up the US to the extenuating circumstances, the flood gates opened.

Airbnb is totally hosing the homeowners. Meanwhile they are denying paying claims for the same situation for guests who purchased trip insurance from Airbnb.

Airbnb is going to lose a lot of STRs over this deal. I am glad I’m not on their platform. I had been considering it, but they have owners by the nut sack and are tightening the clamps.

They are being charitable with the homeowner’s money; with theirs not so much.
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Collin HaysBusiness Member
Property Manager · Gatlinburg, TN · Member since 2020 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes
6y
How about this for a new wrinkle? We had a guest today book one of our properties via VRBO, and then cancelled an hour later citing Coronavirus. We refunded since it was not only an hour old reservation. After we did, THE EXACT SAME GUEST booked another cabin we manage that was cheaper.
Of course, the guest had no way of knowing it was the same mgr for both properties.
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Anand S.
Plantation, FL · Member since 2009 · 329 posts · 119 votes
6y
Sounds about right. I'm sure folks are gaming the system now. I had multiple cancellations and as a result, discounted the same dates to motivate others to rebook. Heck, the same person could rebook at a much lower rate.
0 Reply
Michael Greenberg
Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2016 · 533 posts · 433 votes
6y
Originally posted by @Anand S.:
Up to $22K in cancelled reservations and counting... Once ABB opened up the US to the extenuating circumstances, the flood gates opened.

Net $14k in losses and counting. Yes, the floodgates are open and I'm guessing they proactively sent out this communication to guests. I was up to $20k, but have been able to mitigate some of the issue by dropping rates.

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Anand S.
Plantation, FL · Member since 2009 · 329 posts · 119 votes
6y
Now they literally shut the beach down in front of our homes so we're screwed till this is over...
0 Reply
Michael Greenberg
Investor · Denver, CO · Member since 2016 · 533 posts · 433 votes
6y
I searched Homeaway, anyone else find the same thing? In other words, they're allowing the host to decide. I've taken to social media, specifically twitter, stating that Airbnb should be ashamed of themselves for unilateraling making this decision and unfair business practices.
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