Jacksonville FL cash flow market?

Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes

I am a new investor with 2 rental properties in Virginia. I am looking into investing in Jacksonville given its impressive population growth and affordable price point. A local investor refers me to JWB. As I analyze the deals they posted online, they don't appear to cash flow with a mortgage until 5 years later. What are your actual experience in the local market? Also, any recommendation of realtors and property managers would be greatly appreciated!

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Andres Rodriguez

Wholesaler · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2019 · 74 posts · 42 votes

@Elenis Camargo Would be happy to shed some light on the rental market in Jacksonville.

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Gerald Smith
Investor · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2013 · 89 posts · 22 votes
4y
I thought JWB has all of that in-house. Is it that you do not want to utilize them?
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Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
@Gerald Smith They offer turnkey investments. I am not sure their deals will meet my investment criteria. Will wait and see after the second meeting with them later this week. If the numbers don't work, I will have to source my own core four to start building my local team. What types of investments do you focus on in this market?
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Gregg CohenBusiness Member
Rental Property Investor · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2011 · 143 posts · 136 votes
4y
@Cher Li - Nice to meet you. I'm one of the owners of JWB. We offer investments that produce positive cash flow right off the bat and provide better growth due to the Jacksonville market. I think it would be great for you to chat with the team so you can take a deeper dive into the numbers to see how the cash flows work.
However, let me be the first to point out that cash flows in Jacksonville are lower than in many other cash flow markets out there. They are still positive, but not as positive as other low priced, low growth markets.
The reason Jacksonville shines is because it has 24% more home price appreciation per year on average than other comparable cash flow markets out there. If you want to buy and hold for a full market cycle, that's how you win.
Also, there's the vertically-integrated component. JWB clients have experienced 79% more home price appreciation than the average Jacksonville investor since 2013. That's because of our VI approach and the fact that we are committed to only one market.
Hope this helps you in your decision!
904-677-6777
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Rodney Sums
Laveen, AZ · Member since 2016 · 584 posts · 528 votes
4y
Quote from @Cher Li:

I am a new investor with 2 rental properties in Virginia. I am looking into investing in Jacksonville given its impressive population growth and affordable price point. A local investor refers me to JWB. As I analyze the deals they posted online, they don't appear to cash flow with a mortgage until 5 years later. What are your actual experience in the local market? Also, any recommendation of realtors and property managers would be greatly appreciated!

You mentioned criteria a property must meet for you to invest. What can that firm do for you that you can't and haven't already done for yourself?
0 Reply
Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
@Gregg

@Gregg Cohen Thanks! I look forward to the meeting with your team on Friday to find out more.
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Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
@Rodney Sums I haven't had taken on renovations yet. The properties I already bought were all renter-occupied, and hence my property manager just manages repairs for me from time to time. Given the supply chain issues, I would try to stay away from full renovation projects at this point. JWB is attractive in the sense that it offers turnkey and passive investments. Although I am open to a lower cash flow in exchange for the convenience, I am not willing to buy one with negative cash flows and speculate/bet on future equity growth. There are signs that the JAX market is softening as many listed properties start to lower their asking prices.
1 Reply
Andres Rodriguez
Wholesaler · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2019 · 74 posts · 42 votes
4y
@Elenis Camargo Would be happy to shed some light on the rental market in Jacksonville.
2 Reply
Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
@Andres Rodriguez I've reached out to her via BP and her company's website. Hopefully I'll hear from her soon. I'd like to be on your wholesale list.
0 Reply
Andres Rodriguez
Wholesaler · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2019 · 74 posts · 42 votes
4y
Hi @Cher Li
Sure thing. Send me a DM with your email, please.
0 Reply
Elenis Camargo
Property Manager · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2018 · 514 posts · 470 votes
4y
@Andres Rodriguez Thanks for tagging me! @Cher Li I just replied to your message and would love to chat / meet you when you’re down here if you’re up for that. Looking forward to it :)
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Rodney Sums
Laveen, AZ · Member since 2016 · 584 posts · 528 votes
4y
Quote from @Cher Li:

@Rodney Sums I haven't had taken on renovations yet. The properties I already bought were all renter-occupied, and hence my property manager just manages repairs for me from time to time. Given the supply chain issues, I would try to stay away from full renovation projects at this point. JWB is attractive in the sense that it offers turnkey and passive investments. Although I am open to a lower cash flow in exchange for the convenience, I am not willing to buy one with negative cash flows and speculate/bet on future equity growth. There are signs that the JAX market is softening as many listed properties start to lower their asking prices.

I hear you. If in a similar position I would compare how they are calculating cash flows compared to how you do. This would eliminate concerns of being given overly optimistic or presumptive results.
Without making any accusations toward any entity you're dealing with, its easy for a sales person to make optimistic predictions encouraging you to buy when it's not their money at stake.
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Jag C.Pro Member
Rental Property Investor · Member since 2018 · 74 posts · 22 votes
4y
@Cher Li JWB does a great job in PM as well. Their service level is incredible. I think they sometimes will manage properties outside of their turnkey portfolio? @Gregg Cohen?
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Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
@Jag C.Are you a JWB investor? Their properties do look very nice. It also appears to be quite organized and professional based on my initial interactions. Will find out if it works for me after the demo today.
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Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
Quote from @Rodney Sums:

Quote from @Cher Li:

@Rodney Sums I haven't had taken on renovations yet. The properties I already bought were all renter-occupied, and hence my property manager just manages repairs for me from time to time. Given the supply chain issues, I would try to stay away from full renovation projects at this point. JWB is attractive in the sense that it offers turnkey and passive investments. Although I am open to a lower cash flow in exchange for the convenience, I am not willing to buy one with negative cash flows and speculate/bet on future equity growth. There are signs that the JAX market is softening as many listed properties start to lower their asking prices.

I hear you. If in a similar position I would compare how they are calculating cash flows compared to how you do. This would eliminate concerns of being given overly optimistic or presumptive results.
Without making any accusations toward any entity you're dealing with, its easy for a sales person to make optimistic predictions encouraging you to buy when it's not their money at stake.
Definitely! My concern was that the numbers from their spreadsheet already showed negative cashflow with 7.5% maintenance, 4% vacancy and nothing for CAPEX... I am curious whether it is due to the market condition that it is just hard to cash flow in this market in general. Or other investors still cash flow with off-market deals primarily.
0 Reply
Gerald Smith
Investor · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2013 · 89 posts · 22 votes
4y
@Cher Li Jacksonville can be profitable for investors. The biggest problem is making sure you are investing within your investment box. What is good for some is not good for others. I know some investors who love to invest in low-income areas and wouldn't have it any other way. While others want to invest in only those areas that have great schools. If there is anything I can do to help let me know.
1 Reply
Gregg CohenBusiness Member
Rental Property Investor · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2011 · 143 posts · 136 votes
4y
Hi @Jag C., thanks for the kind words! Yes, we offer turnkey investments for clients who purchase through us and we also perform property management services for clients who already own the assets.
904-677-6777
Gregg Cohen, Not Your Avg Investor Show4.6237 Reviews
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Andrew Olmstead
Kapolei, HI · Member since 2014 · 42 posts · 18 votes
4y
Cher, I closed on my first turnkey with JWB in April. I have been extremely pleased so far as it was easy to buy and I am very very happy with the property (new construction), rents and 3-year lease and positive cash flow. I am a remote passive investor, with a great W-2 job I have no intention of leaving, so I can be more long term oriented, it just depends on what works for you as everyone has different criteria/strategy. JWB is vertically integrated and I like the fact that I am dealing with the same company for all aspects (purchase, financing and property management) and they are super responsive. Their pro-formas are also very conservative as it is important to Gregg and his team to deliver pro-forma or better results he is unwavering in that if you watch his show.
2 Reply
Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
Quote from @Gerald Smith:

@Cher Li Jacksonville can be profitable for investors. The biggest problem is making sure you are investing within your investment box. What is good for some is not good for others. I know some investors who love to invest in low-income areas and wouldn't have it any other way. While others want to invest in only those areas that have great schools. If there is anything I can do to help let me know.

Thank you so much! Will send you a DM. I look forward to connecting!
0 Reply
Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
Quote from @Andrew Olmstead:

Cher, I closed on my first turnkey with JWB in April. I have been extremely pleased so far as it was easy to buy and I am very very happy with the property (new construction), rents and 3-year lease and positive cash flow. I am a remote passive investor, with a great W-2 job I have no intention of leaving, so I can be more long term oriented, it just depends on what works for you as everyone has different criteria/strategy. JWB is vertically integrated and I like the fact that I am dealing with the same company for all aspects (purchase, financing and property management) and they are super responsive. Their pro-formas are also very conservative as it is important to Gregg and his team to deliver pro-forma or better results he is unwavering in that if you watch his show.

Thank you very much for sharing your experience!
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Alex Talcott
Attorney · Durham, NH · Member since 2019 · 292 posts · 126 votes
4y
Jax has a "missing middle." There are nice homes and apartments, not much in the cash-flowing small-to-midsize multifamily.
0 Reply
Aj Parikh
Rental Property Investor · Centreville, VA · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 799 votes
4y
I am also an investor from Northern Virginia and I have heard a great deal about JWB as well. Please let me know how it goes with them. Would love to connect and chat.
0 Reply
Gregg CohenBusiness Member
Rental Property Investor · Jacksonville, FL · Member since 2011 · 143 posts · 136 votes
4y
@Alex Talcott - Hi Alex! I'm not sure exactly what you mean with missing middle. We focus on single family rental properties here in Jacksonville that provide both positive cash flow and above average growth over a full market cycle. The above average growth comes from the Jacksonville market overall which has earned 24% more home price appreciation on average versus comparable cash flow markets since 1982 (Dallas, Memphis, Cleveland, Kansas City, and Birmingham.) We typically don't offer apartments or multi-family as we feel the best market opportunity for our clients in Jacksonville is single-family.

@Aj Parikh - Nice to meet you as well! I'm one of owners so let me know how my team and I can help.
904-677-6777
Gregg Cohen, Not Your Avg Investor Show4.6237 Reviews
Website View Page
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Aj Parikh
Rental Property Investor · Centreville, VA · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 799 votes
4y
Quote from @Gregg Cohen:

@Alex Talcott - Hi Alex! I'm not sure exactly what you mean with missing middle. We focus on single family rental properties here in Jacksonville that provide both positive cash flow and above average growth over a full market cycle. The above average growth comes from the Jacksonville market overall which has earned 24% more home price appreciation on average versus comparable cash flow markets since 1982 (Dallas, Memphis, Cleveland, Kansas City, and Birmingham.) We typically don't offer apartments or multi-family as we feel the best market opportunity for our clients in Jacksonville is single-family.

@Aj Parikh - Nice to meet you as well! I'm one of owners so let me know how my team and I can help.

Hi @Gregg Cohen I am more concentrated in Cleveland at the moment but will definitely keep you in mind when we decide to buy in FL.
2 Reply
Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
Quote from @Alex Talcott:

Jax has a "missing middle." There are nice homes and apartments, not much in the cash-flowing small-to-midsize multifamily.

There aren't many small multifamily listed on MLS. I was told that many were sold off-market.
0 Reply
Cher Li
OP
Member since 2018 · 15 posts · 8 votes
4y
Quote from @Aj Parikh:

I am also an investor from Northern Virginia and I have heard a great deal about JWB as well. Please let me know how it goes with them. Would love to connect and chat.

Hello AJ, I'd love to connect and hear more about your experience in other markets. I haven't decided whether I should do value-add or turnkey in JAX. The JWB rep did not do a demo with me at our scheduled call. He suggested that I explore the market further and talk with him when I decide what I wan to do. Not very helpful. Although I do like JWB products, I am definitely not going to work with this rep.
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