First deal advice - buying SFD and building ADU

First deal advice - buying SFD and building ADU

Contractor · Huntington Beach, CA · Member since 2019 · 32 posts · 29 votes

Hi BP fam.  I'm a 32 year old licensed GC in southern Cali.  I'm looking to invest in my first property and would like to hear your guys' thoughts.  In my mind this is a no brainer but what the hell do I know.  I have made several offers but none have been accepted yet.  Regardless, my eventually first deal will look something like this:

Purchase price - $750,000.00
Down Payment - 5% or 3.5% whichever makes more sense (will take advantage of owner occupied loan)
After closing, insurance, taxes, etc. if I go with the 5% down the loan agent and I figured I will be out of pocket $37,500 down payment, $10,000 closing, and need to show $17,000 in reserves. Total needed is $64,000.00 but $17,000.00 is reserves. They are estimating the rate at 2.875% and the payment at $4,201.00 (forget how much of that is PMI but I think around 300)

Now here comes the fun stuff...

I'm looking for properties that have a detached garage at the rear and plan to add 400 SF to the garage and convert the garage, making it a 750-800 SF ADU. The ADU will have 2 bedrooms and 2 bathrooms, a living, kitchen, laundry closet and have it's own entrance. Now normally this would cost a home owner in southern CA around 150-200k depending on the contractor. Being that I'm a contractor I plan on adding this 750-800 SF ADU for about $75,000-80,000 after plans, engineering, permits and construction (it will be turn key). I've spoken to a few lenders who offer construction loans on these types of projects and they are telling me I should be able to get a construction loan based on future appraisal (70% loan to value). Even if the give me a low future appraisal, 100k?, if they can finance me 70k to get the majority of the project done I can personally finance the rest. The monthly payment on the loan is anywhere between 600-1,200 depending on my credit and DTI at the time and how much I borrow. The rate can vary from 4.99%-12%. The ADU should be ready to rent 7 months into me getting the keys. I will be living in the front house for the first year and plan on renting it out after. I should mention that If the main house needs remodeling I will also do that at cost. So there is a possibility to increase value on the main house as well but not really factoring that in as it will be icing on the cake.

This is where it gets tricky for me since I'm new to this.  My plan is to eventually rent out the front house - according to different rent estimating websites I should be able to get 2,800-3,200 rent for the main house (remember the mortgage is 4,201.00).  Then I should be able to rent the brand new 2 bed 2 bath backhouse for 2,200-2,400, maybe more.  We have done similar builds for homeowners over the past year and they confirmed what they charge for rents so I'm going off their numbers plus similar rents in the area.

Once I can refi I plan on doing that and I think the property which now has a second house on it should appraise for much more than I spent.  Normally this wouldn't be the case if I paid full retail price $150,000-$200,000k but since I'm building it for myself at around 75,000-80,000, shouldn't I be able to refi now that I added at least 140,000 worth of value to the property (this number was given to be from an owner we built a similar ADU for, he got an appraisal for 140k after we finished and that was in a bad area).  Am I wrong here on how this all works?  I'm hoping after the refi my monthly payment would drop to 3,200?  Is this naive to think?  If it does drop to 3,200 and I receive 3,000 in rent for the main house, 2,200 for the backhouse, then this property would cash flow $2,000 per month.  In this scenario would I be able to pull out enough cash to do this all over again?  I plan on doing another owner occupied loan and doing everything exactly the same but with more experience.  My credit union said I can do a owner occupied 3-4 times before they pull the rug and make me do investment loans.  I figure by the 4th one I will have 20% to put down moving forward.

I know this is just a unique opportunity for me since I'm a builder and this won't work out for everyone.  Another thing I should add is this - The numbers seem to good to be true so when I tell my family or people who I think would invest with me they don't believe me or want me to prove myself first.  I'm okay with that but I want to mention that the reason this will work for me is that the state of CA just started allowing ADU's (first in 2018 but then they opened the flood gates in the bill they just passed in 2020).  There are basically no restrictions for ADU's under 800 SF.  Most builders in my area are barely catching on but once they do I believe they will try to do exactly what I'm trying to do.  Oh also, I should add that this works because Los Angeles and Orange county are overpopulated and there isn't enough affordable housing.  People pay 800-1,200 just to rent a room in some areas!  I actually will look at renting by the room down the line.

Anyways, sorry for the run on sentences and bad grammar. I'm typing all of this from my cell phone.  I'm really excited about this and if this works I don't see myself working after I turn 36.  I can swoop up 2 of these the first year, 4 the second year and then so on and so forth.  We're strictly talking about cash flow here too.  Once we factor appreciation and depreciation for tax purposes it seems like the deal gets sweeter and sweeter. 








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Realtor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2018 · 952 posts · 1k+ votes
5y

@Jason Gettler, your plan is well thought-out and totally doable.

I'm sure there's a sweet spot of properties that don't have enough margin for a flipper but do have any margin for your business plan.

You definitely need to target fixers so that your ARV can incorporate improvements to the main house. ADUs don't appraise well, so you'll need that extra juice from the house's improvements.

I love your plan. I have your number. I'm call you tomorrow!

Best,

Jon

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  • Contractor · Huntington Beach, CA · Member since 2019 · 32 posts · 29 votes
    5y

    .

  • Realtor · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2018 · 952 posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    @Jason Gettler, your plan is well thought-out and totally doable.

    I'm sure there's a sweet spot of properties that don't have enough margin for a flipper but do have any margin for your business plan.

    You definitely need to target fixers so that your ARV can incorporate improvements to the main house. ADUs don't appraise well, so you'll need that extra juice from the house's improvements.

    I love your plan. I have your number. I'm call you tomorrow!

    Best,

    Jon

  • New to Real Estate · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2020 · 19 posts · 2 votes
    5y

    @Jason Gettler

    @Jason Gettler

    From the discussions I have had with folks, ADUs are certainly a potentially good long game to play as they don't appraise as appropriately right now as there are not enough of them to statistically develop a somewhat consistent value. So I feel you're on track with your statement of folks catching on. I am really curious on more input from the more seasoned users on here, so I'm definitely staying tuned on this thread as I'm very similarly on the same track as you're purchase plan with the exception of myself not being a GC.

    I would definitely recommend you give rick albert a shout. He is the ADU man!

    @Rick Albert

  • Contractor · Huntington Beach, CA · Member since 2019 · 32 posts · 29 votes
    5y

    @Steven Ortiz

    Thanks for the feedback. Will def reach out to Rick and hopefully he can shed some light for us.

    I'm also wondering if my cash will be stuck on the deal due to the "projected lower appraisal". I'm hoping since I can keep construction costs down that will outweigh the lower appraisal and I will still be ahead as far as the refi goes. Would love to see this method work as a BRRRR strategy. It will only work of course if we can refi the money out. If we can't then the strategy of putting 5% down, carrying a 4,200 mortgage payment, a 80k construction loan at 1,200 per month and collected 3,200 main house rent and 2,400 back house rent will likely be a break even cash flow equation until the construction loan pays off. Still not terrible but now the money is locked up and we need to save again for the next property.

  • Investor · Hawaiian Gardens, CA · Member since 2015 · 308 posts · 386 votes
    5y

    Have you considered a garage conversion on a traditional 2 car garage instead? I have a house with a bathroom downstairs (attached to garage), I'm gonna knock down the wall, add a kitchenette and have a JADU there. I'll add another one in the backyard later

  • Real Estate Agent · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2020 · 34 posts · 18 votes
    5y

    @Jason Gettler

    Good plan and very doable especially that you’re a GC.

    On the refi part- you may get close to pulling all your money out but you will only know once you’re refinancing. Depends on the new appraisal and current market.

    I have a lot of investors that are specifically looking for SFR with a 2-car garage. A conversion of the garage without permits runs around 15k and a month of work. The do this strictly for rental income. Obviously an appraisal will no add value on this type of conversion but the cash flow is crazy.!

    I think you’re on the right path. Good luck! Let me know if you need help finding a property.

  • Real Estate Agent · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    Hey Everyone,

    Thanks @Steven Ortiz for the shout out.  @Jason Gettler, the plan overall makes sense. As Steven said, appraisers aren't giving dollar for dollar on the ADUs for now, but over time that can change. You can also look into the FHA 203(k) loans or Home Style Renovation loans. This might get you into the door and you can refi later. That's what we are doing on our ADU property.

    Happy to chat more if you would like.

    Best,

    Rick

  • Real Estate Agent · San Diego, CA · Member since 2014 · 205 posts · 123 votes
    5y

    @Jason Gettler Well thought out plan. My mind is stuck on the same problem. If the ADU won't appraise how will the refi turn out? I'm curious what some experienced investors/lenders thoughts are on this.

  • Real Estate Agent · Los Angeles, CA · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    5y

    The only way I see it on the surface is buying a run down, undersized home and do the reno to the main house and build out the ADU. Make sure to buy in an area where there are ADU comps. Don't be the first one. You are going to have to do major homework on every property ahead of time. Think like a flipper without the margins.

  • Folsom, CA · Member since 2018 · 134 posts · 100 votes
    5y

    @Jason Gettler way to get creative with the ADU! My fiend just got done doing exactly this and it's worked out great for him. (We live in northern CA) I think it's a great strategy, just remember that the "cash flow" your talking about isn't entirely accurate because you haven't accounted for expenses, vacancies, and capital expenditures. Your cap x and vacancies will probably be low but I would still put some money aside for those. Get on the calculators here on BP and punch your numbers in and it will have a spot for expenses etc. This will give you a more accurate look at cash flow. Either way, even with putting money aside for expenses it still looks like a good deal. Good luck!

  • Contractor · Huntington Beach, CA · Member since 2019 · 32 posts · 29 votes
    5y

    @Rick Albert @David Frandsen  @Jeremy Blevins

    Thanks for checking in guys. I will keep you updated on my journey. Rick, I think you are right and another BP member just advised me the same. Might lean towards finding a duplex instead and add two ADU's on the property. It seems more likely to appraise as a 4-plex rather than a SFD w/ adu being appraised as a duplex. In fact, I don't really know how the appraiser will know that I even built ADU's since there are other 4-plex's in the area it will look like another 4-plex. It will likely cash flow much better since I'm adding two units and then I can refi out my money and repeat the process.

    The numbers will look something like this:

    Purchase price 975,000

    5% down plus closing and reserves(owner occupied) - 63,750

    $6,000 rent to pay (one tenant pays 2,500 (2bd/1bth) and I live in the other 2/1 for 3,500 a month)

    I take a loan for 100k t convert the garage and add square footage (approx 580 SF, 2 bed/1 bth) and I build a 1 bd /1 bth new construction unit detached.

    I rent out the 2bed/1 bath unit for $2,500 and I rent out the 1/1 for $2,000

    Once it's built I refi the property and hope to pull my money out.  I see a similar property (maybe slightly better) sell for 1.4 million about 2.5 miles away (closest one I found that is similar). 

    After the year I rent out the spot I was living in for $2,500 and I have a total of $9,500 coming in.  Total investment would be the $65,000 (5% down and closing/insurance.  The rent I pay each month I don't really consider out of pocket because we would rent somewhere else anyways.  Yes, this would be more but still not going to count it in the equation.  Since the construction is not really out of pocket I don't know what else I need to calculate in. 

    Thank you Jeremy for the BP calculator advice.  I ran the numbers on this new property and if I don't use a property manager and keep 0 vacancies (not hard to do in this area as it is over populated), then the property will generate $2,790 a month!

    I must be missing something.

  • New York, NY · Member since 2016 · 53 posts · 33 votes
    5y

    @Jason Gettler

    If I was you I would partner with a deal maker and do 50-50 for the first few deals. He find the deal you run it.

    Get enough cash to have 10-20% down and find local lenders who will lend 80-90%( tip to find one - go on the local Facebook group and search “ hard money lender”- you will pull lots of posts mentioning different peoples/ companies you can reach out to.

    Finally reach out to 20 wholesalers using the same method.

    You have an advantage working with Wholesalers because your renovation cost will always be lower than anyone else who compete on the same house!

    You are in a much better position than I was a year ago. Good luck!

  • Real Estate Consultant · Glendora, CA · Member since 2019 · 314 posts · 95 votes
    5y

    Once I can refi I plan on doing that and I think the property which now has a second house on it should appraise for much more than I spent. Normally this wouldn't be the case if I paid full retail price $150,000-$200,000k but since I'm building it for myself at around 75,000-80,000, shouldn't I be able to refi now that I added at least 140,000 worth of value to the property (this number was given to be from an owner we built a similar ADU for, he got an appraisal for 140k after we finished and that was in a bad area)

    @Jason Gettler similar to what others said, the appraised value may not come in as high as you hope. I'm sure things will change in the foreseeable future. 

    I'm submitting my 1200 sf ADU plans to the city next week. Fingers crossed... Once plans are approved and I start breaking ground, I will begin providing updates to the BP community on the build out.

    Good luck Jason!

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