Starting to feel Disappointed
Member since 2022 · 69 posts · 20 votes
Starting to feel Disappointed
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Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
4yQuote from @Kenny Kuramoto:
I've been reading for a few months now on biggerpockets and feel like the beginner posts are starting to be not informative. Lots of people replying with consider my location here or my location is best I can help you. I feel like people are just selling themselves not giving actual advice.. am I wrong for this?
I think the forums have changed. There's definitely an increase in short-term rental conversations. I'm being driven crazy by "mid-term rentals" which are really just month-to-month rentals. And there are a lot of sharks on here promoting their business to new investors.
As @Joe Villeneuve said, the internet is full of information. Not all of it is good, so you need to be careful who you are listening to. Do they have a lot of posts with at least as many votes? Are they giving away advice for free, or are they trying to sell you something? Is there information verifiable from another reliable source?
There are many "old timers" on here like Joe that will give you more advice than your brain can handle and they'll never try to sell you anything.
The DIY Landlord Book4.7247 Reviews
44 Replies
- 4yJoe VilleneuvePro MemberPlymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votes
You're wrong. I haven't seen any of your posts, but I see including this one, it's only 5. That's 5,...and you made the conclusion you just stated? Maybe you need to realize that the answers to only 5 questions isn't going to give you much to work with...especially if the questions are vague to begin with.
This isn't meant as a criticism of you. This is meant as a series of questions to you, as in:
1 - What are you looking for,
2 - How fast are you anticipating being an expert,
3 - Are you willing to accumulate info, and build knowledge,
4 - Will you recognize "it" when you get there? - Investor · Pasadena, CA · Member since 2017 · 613 posts · 523 votes4y
I don't necessarily see a difference now as compared to a while ago, but then again, I may not be reading the same posts you are. But, I do see a good amount of helpful. informative responses, along with the self-promotion. Generally though, I'd say many people offer their genuine advice/experience/knowledge, more than just promoting. Some of them you just have to sift through looking for the nuggets.
- 4yJonathan BombaciBusiness MemberReal Estate Agent · Lowell, MA · Member since 2019 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
Not sure what you’re reading but the general advice I always give is to invest where you live or where you know and stick to your personal investment criteria. There are a Million ways to make money in real estate no one can tell you what way is right for you. It’s up to you to figure that out and seek information to help you along your journey.
- Member since 2020 · 671 posts · 937 votes4y
I kind of think that we've just left a period where finding deals was like shooting fish in a barrel, so giving actionable advice was easy. "Find a deal that cash flows and buy it..."
Now, for me, deals have dried up quite a bit. My actual advice for someone like me (a casual, patient investor that likes his deals to be fish in a barrel as opposed to doing the difficult work of uncovering deals) would be to buy mutual funds, be patient, and wait.
It wouldn't surprise me if it took years for easy deals to be had again, so I'll just be trying to buy low in the stock market until then...
Sorry if that's not what you're hoping to hear! haha. I've been trying to learn to surf, but sometimes it's best for me to hang on the beach and watch the pros instead of making the lifeguards nervous.
- Member since 2022 · 69 posts · 20 votes4y
Quote from @Joe Villeneuve:
You're wrong. I haven't seen any of your posts, but I see including this one, it's only 5. That's 5,...and you made the conclusion you just stated? Maybe you need to realize that the answers to only 5 questions isn't going to give you much to work with...especially if the questions are vague to begin with.
This isn't meant as a criticism of you. This is meant as a series of questions to you, as in:
1 - What are you looking for,
2 - How fast are you anticipating being an expert,
3 - Are you willing to accumulate info, and build knowledge,
4 - Will you recognize "it" when you get there?I'm sorry I'm not trying to offend anyone. Yes I have 5 posts because I've been reading mostly. I don't contribute because I have nothing to contribute YET. The videos have been helping me so much. I know what I want. I want to cash flow with my heloc. And repeat. It's just when people talk about markets I find the people say look at my market and it's cash flowing coc >15%. I tried to reach out tot one but it was not the case. Maybe I'm just being too quick to judge and that's a fault to me. Sorry again!
- Member since 2022 · 69 posts · 20 votes4yYeah. It just to me a newbie in the game sees a different eye. Just a food for thought.
Quote from @Brad S.:
I don't necessarily see a difference now as compared to a while ago, but then again, I may not be reading the same posts you are. But, I do see a good amount of helpful. informative responses, along with the self-promotion. Generally though, I'd say many people offer their genuine advice/experience/knowledge, more than just promoting. Some of them you just have to sift through looking for the nuggets.
- Member since 2022 · 69 posts · 20 votes4y
Quote from @Chris John:
I kind of think that we've just left a period where finding deals was like shooting fish in a barrel, so giving actionable advice was easy. "Find a deal that cash flows and buy it..."
Now, for me, deals have dried up quite a bit. My actual advice for someone like me (a casual, patient investor that likes his deals to be fish in a barrel as opposed to doing the difficult work of uncovering deals) would be to buy mutual funds, be patient, and wait.
It wouldn't surprise me if it took years for easy deals to be had again, so I'll just be trying to buy low in the stock market until then...
Sorry if that's not what you're hoping to hear! haha. I've been trying to learn to surf, but sometimes it's best for me to hang on the beach and watch the pros instead of making the lifeguards nervous.
Haha I'm from San diego and love to surf. I totally get that last reference! But this is good info thanks. I already realized that it's harder to find deals now a days. I know it's not all gone just harder which I'm still looking to find my first. Thanks for your post hope it helps other people starting out!
- Member since 2022 · 69 posts · 20 votes4y
Quote from @Jonathan Bombaci:
Not sure what you’re reading but the general advice I always give is to invest where you live or where you know and stick to your personal investment criteria. There are a Million ways to make money in real estate no one can tell you what way is right for you. It’s up to you to figure that out and seek information to help you along your journey.
Like I said in the beginning, it's not every post but I read starting out everyday and 60% of the posts are the same with the same answers of look at my area.
- Investor · Pasadena, CA · Member since 2017 · 613 posts · 523 votes4y
Quote from @Kenny Kuramoto:
Yeah. It just to me a newbie in the game sees a different eye. Just a food for thought.Quote from @Brad S.:
I don't necessarily see a difference now as compared to a while ago, but then again, I may not be reading the same posts you are. But, I do see a good amount of helpful. informative responses, along with the self-promotion. Generally though, I'd say many people offer their genuine advice/experience/knowledge, more than just promoting. Some of them you just have to sift through looking for the nuggets.
*****************************
Yes, I get that. I've been doing it so long, I may just be on autopilot when I go through some of the posts. I do kinda ignore some, since there are so many hours in the day and they can become a black hole and a distraction from other things I need to do.
But, in any case, there are still a lot of knowledgeable people, willing to help on here. And it is a good thing that you realize there may be others offering more self-promotion, since that may help you to discern between that and meaningful knowledge for you.
Anyway, I am happy to offer any of my vast "useless" knowledge. I am just a little ways North of you (LA county) and also invest out of state (for 25 years) and do deals locally, as well. Feel free to reach out, if you like.
Seems like you are in a good position to start, since you have so much equity. Congratulations on that!
- Real Estate Broker · Redwood City, CA · Member since 2014 · 679 posts · 888 votes4y
Quote from @Kenny Kuramoto:
I've been reading for a few months now on biggerpockets and feel like the beginner posts are starting to be not informative. Lots of people replying with consider my location here or my location is best I can help you. I feel like people are just selling themselves not giving actual advice.. am I wrong for this?
You are right. A lot of self promoters trying to rip off new investors.
- 4yDan H.Pro MemberInvestor · Poway, CA · Member since 2015 · 7k+ posts · 8k+ votes
Quote from @Kenny Kuramoto:
Quote from @Chris John:
I kind of think that we've just left a period where finding deals was like shooting fish in a barrel, so giving actionable advice was easy. "Find a deal that cash flows and buy it..."
Now, for me, deals have dried up quite a bit. My actual advice for someone like me (a casual, patient investor that likes his deals to be fish in a barrel as opposed to doing the difficult work of uncovering deals) would be to buy mutual funds, be patient, and wait.
It wouldn't surprise me if it took years for easy deals to be had again, so I'll just be trying to buy low in the stock market until then...
Sorry if that's not what you're hoping to hear! haha. I've been trying to learn to surf, but sometimes it's best for me to hang on the beach and watch the pros instead of making the lifeguards nervous.
Haha I'm from San diego and love to surf. I totally get that last reference! But this is good info thanks. I already realized that it's harder to find deals now a days. I know it's not all gone just harder which I'm still looking to find my first. Thanks for your post hope it helps other people starting out!
What are you looking to do? I would suggest to combine a house hack of detached duplex with a BRRRR. Buy the detached duplex with a high LTV loan such as an FHA (up to 96.5% LTV). Move into the more thrashed unit and rehab it in place. Once done rent it at top of market rent (it has a new, nice rehab) and move into the other unit. If you have increased the value enough to justify a refi, refi it before renting the 2nd unit out so you can get owner occupied terms.
If you decide to stay in the unit rather than move to next unit (repeat), you can rent rooms in you unit to further reduce your expenses (improve your cash flow).
I would save OOS RE investing for after you have some experience. I question if after you have some local experience if you would find a desire for OOS RE investing.
Good luck
- Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2021 · 28 posts · 11 votes4y
Give it some more time. I would say that experience and having something to offer are 'relative'. It's relative in that, there is always someone that will know less than you and always people that know more. Embrace both. Teach those around you and learn from the people in networks like these. Good luck.
- Member since 2022 · 64 posts · 35 votes4y
Quote from @Kenny Kuramoto:
Quote from @Joe Villeneuve:
You're wrong. I haven't seen any of your posts, but I see including this one, it's only 5. That's 5,...and you made the conclusion you just stated? Maybe you need to realize that the answers to only 5 questions isn't going to give you much to work with...especially if the questions are vague to begin with.
This isn't meant as a criticism of you. This is meant as a series of questions to you, as in:
1 - What are you looking for,
2 - How fast are you anticipating being an expert,
3 - Are you willing to accumulate info, and build knowledge,
4 - Will you recognize "it" when you get there?I'm sorry I'm not trying to offend anyone. Yes I have 5 posts because I've been reading mostly. I don't contribute because I have nothing to contribute YET. The videos have been helping me so much. I know what I want. I want to cash flow with my heloc. And repeat. It's just when people talk about markets I find the people say look at my market and it's cash flowing coc >15%. I tried to reach out tot one but it was not the case. Maybe I'm just being too quick to judge and that's a fault to me. Sorry again!
I'm assuming that you are in San Diego. I don't live there but my little knowledge of San Diego is it's super expensive. I love San Diego it's my favorite city in the US. But my guess is it might be difficult to cash flow on LTR's cause it's so expensive there. Might be a better area to do AirBNB as I know San Diego gets a ton of tourists. I haven't done any research on the San Diego market but if I was you, I would go on AirDNA and for free you can see what a property would cash flow if it was a STR. This just gives you an idea so don't use it as gospel but would give you an idea. I know Robuilt on YouTube has some super informative videos about how to analyze STR properties. They might be a bit old (like a year or so) so might have to dig a bit to find them. You might even be able to do a House Hack that you live in and put the other half on AirBNB. If I was in San Diego, I think that is what I would do if I needed a place to live and wanted cash flow. Buy a house hack once a year and in no time you will have a very nice portfolio.
Also, I know Lennar one of the largest home builders in the US just said San Diego is a strong market right now. Didn't sound like they thought San Diego was a city to worry about yet in this market.
- 4yJoe VilleneuvePro MemberPlymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votesPM me here. From what I've red from you on this discussion, it appears as though you have fallen into to a very, very common trap with regards to learning. You have been gathering a lot of info on a lot of topics, and the more you accumulate, the more confusing it gets. That's because info isn't the same as knowledge. The internet is full of info, which is good, but knowledge, for the most part, is lacking. Actually it's there, but many love the internet because it gives them quick answers to questions they have, but those answers are usually the "readers Digest" versions...and as a result, incomplete. They may cover a lot as far as the specific question goes, but there's no connection to anything outside of the question. Info can be used to fill in the blanks, but you need knowledge first in order to generate those blanks that need to be filled. Knowledge puts it all together. Info is great for trivia games, but knowledge is required for everything else...especially REI.
Quote from @Kenny Kuramoto:
Quote from @Joe Villeneuve:
You're wrong. I haven't seen any of your posts, but I see including this one, it's only 5. That's 5,...and you made the conclusion you just stated? Maybe you need to realize that the answers to only 5 questions isn't going to give you much to work with...especially if the questions are vague to begin with.
This isn't meant as a criticism of you. This is meant as a series of questions to you, as in:
1 - What are you looking for,
2 - How fast are you anticipating being an expert,
3 - Are you willing to accumulate info, and build knowledge,
4 - Will you recognize "it" when you get there?I'm sorry I'm not trying to offend anyone. Yes I have 5 posts because I've been reading mostly. I don't contribute because I have nothing to contribute YET. The videos have been helping me so much. I know what I want. I want to cash flow with my heloc. And repeat. It's just when people talk about markets I find the people say look at my market and it's cash flowing coc >15%. I tried to reach out tot one but it was not the case. Maybe I'm just being too quick to judge and that's a fault to me. Sorry again!
- Real Estate Broker · Beloit, WI · Member since 2015 · 234 posts · 60 votes4y
Quote from @Kenny Kuramoto:
I've been reading for a few months now on biggerpockets and feel like the beginner posts are starting to be not informative. Lots of people replying with consider my location here or my location is best I can help you. I feel like people are just selling themselves not giving actual advice.. am I wrong for this?
My approach to working with newbie investors is to help, guide, mentor through doing deals. It happens that I live in an area that offers an abundance of fantastic investment opportunities - consistent 1% to 1.3% rent to purchase price, 15% to 20% cash on cash return. I believe in giving to get. I believe in doing good while doing well. You win, I win if you end up doing deals in/with/through me. You get a great investment, you learn a lot going through the process. I share all of my knowledge, experience, and expertise through the process. I earn my income by doing deals. I encourage my fellow BiggerPockets members to call me any time to chat.
- Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes4y
Quote from @Kenny Kuramoto:
I've been reading for a few months now on biggerpockets and feel like the beginner posts are starting to be not informative. Lots of people replying with consider my location here or my location is best I can help you. I feel like people are just selling themselves not giving actual advice.. am I wrong for this?
I think the forums have changed. There's definitely an increase in short-term rental conversations. I'm being driven crazy by "mid-term rentals" which are really just month-to-month rentals. And there are a lot of sharks on here promoting their business to new investors.
As @Joe Villeneuve said, the internet is full of information. Not all of it is good, so you need to be careful who you are listening to. Do they have a lot of posts with at least as many votes? Are they giving away advice for free, or are they trying to sell you something? Is there information verifiable from another reliable source?
There are many "old timers" on here like Joe that will give you more advice than your brain can handle and they'll never try to sell you anything.
The DIY Landlord Book4.7247 Reviews - Real Estate Broker · Medford, NJ · Member since 2018 · 236 posts · 177 votes4y
@Kenny Kuramoto there are a lot of very intricate topics on here that can help once you get rolling but to someone who is new may not be as helpful. Keep reading, stay patient, and wait for the right deal, it will come if you’re persistent. Real estate is a long game, always remember that. Personally I wouldn’t pay or buy services from any of the “gurus” out there. There is so much free info everywhere on the internet these days.
- Investor · Greenville, SC · Member since 2016 · 5k+ posts · 13k+ votes4y
You are exactly right. And here's the harsh truth. The quality of your questions will determine the quality of your feedback. If you ask what market to invest in, 95% of your answers are going to be from business selling properties in their markets. Instead, search the forums (and google) for posts on the subject and then come back with specific questions based on your research and resulting target markets. The market is competitive...other members are not going to line up to share their secrets on their honey holes either. Go to work. Research the forums, listen to podcasts and see where the interviewees are investing, attend REIA meetings, network on the forums, google search market data, etc. You have to enjoy the hunt; otherwise, it's not worth it. Good luck...REI is just like any new endeavor...lots of trial and error.
- 4yBruce WoodruffPro MemberContractor/Investor/Consultant · San Diego / Phoenix · Member since 2021 · 12k+ posts · 15k+ votes
@Kenny Kuramoto This is a free forum filled with very knowledgeable people trying to help each other. If you had been here longer or actually cared to participate more instead of surf, you would have noticed that most of the people giving the best advice never ask questions themselves. Meaning they are here to help others learn what they already know.
My free advice - either stick around and figure this forum out or go find another that suits you better.
- Investor · Cleveland, OH · Member since 2017 · 319 posts · 330 votes4yThe first rule of finding deals is, you never know what's gonna turn up. The second rule is, you need to be ready to run with what you do find. Otherwise, you may never find anything. Once you do find something, BP can be very helpful with the specifics - even if it's not what you came here to learn about.
I came here in early 2017 wanting to buy residential rentals, but after my first big (tiny) deal fell through, I happened on a chance to buy a controlling interest in a daycare business instead. I'm still doing RE investing (as the business's "real estate guy"), but it sure doesn't resemble the picture I had when I got in..
Thankfully, BP was here to point me in the right direction early on, around where to find financing for small commercial. Once I knew the question, there were people here who could help answer it. - Member since 2022 · 69 posts · 20 votes4y
First off I would like to thank everyone who replied. I hope this helps a lot of new comers who come :) I'm not dissing thr forum or complaining. Just stating what I was reading new everyday on the starting out forum. This thread should help people not get disappointed when trying to read the Starting Out section. I'll reply to everyone when I get a chance. Makes me feel much better and have a better understanding on how to use this forum. Have a great weekend!
- Member since 2021 · 16 posts · 6 votes4y
@Kenny Kuramoto I can't speak for you but ive spent the last 3 years learning stuff about real estate investing and there's still beginner articles that come out that give me an idea or lead me to a better or different thought process
- Member since 2022 · 69 posts · 20 votes4y
Quote from @Matt Scinto:
@Kenny Kuramoto I can't speak for you but ive spent the last 3 years learning stuff about real estate investing and there's still beginner articles that come out that give me an idea or lead me to a better or different thought process
Haha I was just mainly talking about the forum posts. There is a alot of self promoters here then people giving good advice. I'm not complaining about any article or video. Because those helped me :)
- 4yJoe VilleneuvePro MemberPlymouth, MI · Member since 2013 · 13k+ posts · 19k+ votesThe stock market is never the answer. There are always deals in REI, you just have to stop looking for them. Actually, you stated that part perfectly when you mentioned how easy it was to find them. Trouble now isn't that they're hard to find. The trouble now, like any time (even when it was like "shooting fish in a barrel"), was approaching REI like you were investing in the Stock Market. They're NOT the same thing...in any way.
Quote from @Chris John:
I kind of think that we've just left a period where finding deals was like shooting fish in a barrel, so giving actionable advice was easy. "Find a deal that cash flows and buy it..."
Now, for me, deals have dried up quite a bit. My actual advice for someone like me (a casual, patient investor that likes his deals to be fish in a barrel as opposed to doing the difficult work of uncovering deals) would be to buy mutual funds, be patient, and wait.
It wouldn't surprise me if it took years for easy deals to be had again, so I'll just be trying to buy low in the stock market until then...
Sorry if that's not what you're hoping to hear! haha. I've been trying to learn to surf, but sometimes it's best for me to hang on the beach and watch the pros instead of making the lifeguards nervous.
In the SM, you buy low and sell high. Deals just appear before you. In REI, the same thing can happen, but they appear before every REI that is looking for them. Many times, the competition (bidding wars) result in great deals going "south" as the REI's bid against eachother (and themselves).
When that barrel of fish starts to thin itself out, the complaints of "not enough deals out there" are echoing from everywhere. Many answer this buy reducing their criteria for what a "good deal" is (why in the ...) because they are chasing the property instead of the deal. WRONG!!!
The answer then, as it is regardless of how many "fish there are in the barrel", is not to expand your taste buds,...in the REI case, they change their criteria and feed on fish they really don't like...but they're hungry. The answer is to learn how to look for opportunities...not deals. There's no competition, and the deals are better than the ones in that barrel. Just learn how to analyze Markets instead of properties, and learn (and master) more and more strategies, instead of mastering just one. It's that combination that allows the REI to turn those opportunities into the deals nobody else sees...and they are there all the time...no matter how many fish there are in that barrel. - Investor · Ferndale, MI · Member since 2016 · 50 posts · 19 votes4y
My wife and I just started a YouTube channel to share all that we've learned in our Real Estate Journey. The wins and mistakes we've made. We only have about 6 years or so of experience so far, so not super experts by any means. We have been able to quit our jobs and do it full time along with now doing world travel thanks to Real Estate and Personal FInance, though. This link is technically self promotion, but we hope it brings people value.
;t=8sIf you have a question, feel free to ask and I'll do my best to answer. Just to emphasize what others have said....it is hard to give specific advice on your specific market and niche in Real Estate. But do start with small goals. Our first one was just to reduce our expenses as much as possible before starting and then we followed that with a doing a house hack with an FHA. That alone took us about 6, but we learned a lot and it made it easier to choose our next set of goals. They change over time as you learn and grow from experience.
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