Should I file for bankruptcy?

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Should I file for bankruptcy?

Account Closed
Statesboro, GA · Member since 2015 · 99 posts · 24 votes
A couple disclaimers before I start:
  • If you look through my profile and previous posts, you'll see that I am young (just turned 22), and also may believe I don't have the right mindset or maturity yet to start REI. This is understandable, but also note that this isn't really a REI question, but more of a financial strategy question from those more experienced than me.
  • I know that all this should be taken as simply advice and I can't base this decision solely on the opinions/guidance of people from the internet. Trust me, regardless of the responses, I will still make the best decision I believe for myself. I'm just trying to get some light in my relatively dark tunnel, for lack of a better expression. I know plenty of people have experience in this subject or at least enough to offer some words of advice to a young entrepreneur.

Now, like I said, I'm only 22. I have NO student loan debt. I had a good job for about a year. In this time, I went and financed things like crazy. Long story short, I was laid off. I'm currently over $20k in debt. All my debts are unsecured. I have loans and credit cards, that is all. I moved back in with my parents and my next focus is going back to college. I plan to get a degree in Construction Management. I feel like this would be very beneficial being that I eventually want to buy homes to fix and also possibly spec build homes at some point.

With that being said, I've read a lot into filing. My parent's have had a few friends file. One filed and 3 years later, bought a new home and a new truck. One has amazing credit and he filed 5 years ago. I've also heard it's not as bad as most people think. A bunch of people believe if you file, you just can't do anything for 10 years, but that isn't the case. I've read a bunch of positives as well as negatives. Obviously every situation is different. But given what you know with my situation, what do you believe is best? If it were up to me right now, with no guidance... I would say to file and take it as a lesson learned. I think dealing with the consequences of having no credit or access to any for a few years while I go back to school and focus on my education would mature me. But I'd like to hear your advice!

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Jim Shepard
Investor · Edwardsville, IL · Member since 2015 · 432 posts · 481 votes
10y
I think everyone has given a lot of good, solid advice. I will throw one more angle at you. Even after 7 years when the bankruptcy has disappeared off of your credit report, you will be asked on every application that you fill out, "have you ever filed bankruptcy"? It will follow you the rest of your life. At 22 years old you can work a 40 hour job and go to school at the same time. You can pay that 20k off a lot faster than you think while living with your parents. Here's two scenarios while you are in front of a banker asking for a loan a few years from now: 1. Yes, I filed bankruptcy when I was 22. I bought a lot of stuff I didn't need. 2. Yes, my credit was terrible when I was younger. I bought a lot of useless stuff and financed it. I didn't file bankruptcy because I knew I owed the money and pay all of my debts. I have learned by my mistake and won't repeat it. Who do you think will get the loan?
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  • Jon S.Pro Member
    Investor · Tampa, FL · Member since 2015 · 530 posts · 92 votes
    10y

    You've received a ton of advice, and it was very smart of you to post here. I think you are young and in unfamiliar territory and it is scary to be there. The easy decision for now is to take a bankruptcy, but in the world of business, in the world of corporate hiring, in the world of finance, anyone who has had a bankruptcy is ineligible for a number of positions that require evidence of fiduciary responsibility. For example you could not become a stock broker, you could not be a financial planner, etc. If you are going to be in the real estate investment business, it might effect the way banks look at you when you want a $250,000 loan on a property that can make you $100,000. So you miss the deal, or you have to borrow from a hard money lender at 3 points and 14% interest and all kinds of fees. Now that is on one deal, you will probably lose over $20,000. Repeat that and multiply the losses over a career in real estate investing. Your credit history is your friend in this line of work, as you want to be able to access the lowest interest rates from the best lenders.

    What if in the future you REALLY NEED to declare bankruptcy, say 10 years after college when you are a successful real estate developer, when one of your ONE MILLION DOLLAR deals goes unavoidably sour. Are you then going to be a business owner with 2 bankruptcies? 

    As others have said, you could polish up your resume, use the unemployment office assistance with job search, use your former university job search office, use the internet for job search, ask your parents for work doing some renovation on their home, ask if their friends have any jobs available. You could go to college and work summers to pay off debts. You could be much more creative in solving this financial problem. 

    The easy way is bankruptcy, but the way to learn from this is to pay off the debt, work hard in the summers, get a loan from your folks, pay them back every penny, earn their trust. When you graduate from college you won't have this dark cloud of bankruptcy hanging over your financial history. 

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  • Jon S.Pro Member
    Investor · Tampa, FL · Member since 2015 · 530 posts · 92 votes
    10y

    @Paul Choate Very good information, it gives @Account Closed a balanced view. There was no mention of how bankruptcy effects employment. Could you elaborate on the occupations, the employer climate, regarding applicants with a bankruptcy? That would be my major concern, having a negative impact on future income opportunities. Likewise, how does it effect the future access to normal interest rates on home mortgages, car loans, etc. If he borrows on a $300,000 house at 4.5% over 30 years, his payment will be $1520/mo. At 5.5% the same loan payment will be $1703/mo. The difference is (1570-1703)*360= $65,880.00 additional cost on paying off his home mortgage. Yes, he might be able to secure the loan, but it will likely not be at the best rate available, so he will end up paying back much more than the $20,000 he is owes now. There is a long term cost, as this is just one single typical loan that as an adult he will probably need to make. Add to that the many car loans, credit cards, signature loans, etc, the cost will continue to climb. 

    This doesn't even take into account if he loses a job opportunity that would pay him $10K/year more simply because of a bankruptcy on his record. This could happen. 

    Nor does it take into account the trust factor investors will have to have with him, if they want to become investment partners in properties he wants to acquire. If he doesn't have the trust factor, what kind of partners is he going to attract? Probably not the top tier partners he would like to be doing business with. 

    My concern is that one would pay much more than $20,000 in increased lending costs, lost employment opportunities, lost business opportunities, or lost investment opportunities, if they have a bankruptcy at this early stage of their adult life. The next 40 years will be about employment, earnings, business, profits, and borrowing. How much is this $20K issue going to really cost a 22 year old in future opportunity costs? On the other hand, I totally understand you are a bankruptcy attorney, you have seen it all, and you are trying to offset any negative judgemental advice. I agree, this should not be a judgemental issue, this is an issue of a young person trying to make the best decision, so they can go to college and get on with their life. Hopefully, bankruptcy is not the only option. 

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  • Jon S.Pro Member
    Investor · Tampa, FL · Member since 2015 · 530 posts · 92 votes
    10y

    Update: Error Correction, on a $300,000 mortgage loan, the difference in total cost over 30 years between a borrower eligible for 4.5% vs a borrower eligible for 5.5% is $47,880 in higher payments. This is just on the principle and interest payments. This does not include the higher cost of home owners insurance. (I previously posted incorrectly that it was a difference of $65,880).

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  • Paul Choate
    Attorney · Shawnee, OK · Member since 2013 · 350 posts · 230 votes
    10y

    @Jon S.

    Employment

    Sec. 525 of the bankruptcy code prevents public and private employers from discriminating against individuals who filed bankruptcy. There are some exceptions for fiduciary roles (i.e. stockbrokers etc). 

    I should make it very clear. Bankruptcy is a negative as a whole. No one goes into bankruptcy planning to do it because it is fun. There are very few ways to game the system without crossing the line into criminal acts. There are individual bad actors out there. That is not those who took chances or believed the advertisements of creditors or even overextended themselves with bad choices. Hind sight is 20/20. No one plans for a job loss, medical problems or other common set backs.

    But, bankruptcy can be the quickest, fastest and cheapest way of dealing with debt. The point is a fresh start for honest debtors to get them back on their feet and moving forward.

    As to future credit, I have no inside knowledge about lending underwriting standards. I really can't comment on what the future holds. The fact of the matter is the current debt is here and is generally at high interest rates. I know my clients get new debt after filing as they have to contact me about it for various reasons. From what I can tell, if you have a good income and keep your credit clean, your credit score increases rapidly after filing bankruptcy. If you do the same things, your credit stays the same.

    As for private lenders, I use them extensively. I have never provided a credit report to any of them. Everything I do is based on what I have done and the deal in front of them. 

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  • Brett S.
    Investor · Kalamazoo, MI · Member since 2014 · 60 posts · 25 votes
    10y

    forget those people who say you need to tighten your bootstraps and work your way through it for honor. Bankruptcy is a simple financial data based decision, not emotional one. 

    Both my brother and my dad would have 1) had better lives and 2) more forced saving discipline if the filed for bankruptcy in their lifetimes. It's like the army for misbehaving kids that way. 

    In my view, file yesterday. Particularly if you are going to school. 

    If you want to get really smart read up on what your state won't take (personal residence, etc) buy those things, and then file to end up net positive. 

    Don't feel bad for the bank, they won't feel bad for you. 

    1Reply
  • Chris Martell
    Middletown, CT · Member since 2015 · 25 posts · 10 votes
    10y

    @Account Closed - I'm curious - what would your approach be if bankruptcy were not an option?

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  • Scott Carder
    Investor · Owasso, OK · Member since 2013 · 166 posts · 90 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Paul Choate:

    @Account Closed

    Background: I am a bankruptcy attorney.

    Well, you asked for advice and after reading through all of the responses I think you got what you paid for! 

    I am not going to give you advice to file or not to file. Only you can decide what is best for you. I will however try to correct all of the poor advice given.

    First some simple facts-

    Bankruptcy stays on your credit for 10 years. Your credit will probably be better or the same after filing bankruptcy as it was before filing. Why? The two biggest parts of your credit score are how much debt you have (currently a negative) and your payment history (unknown). Most of my clients are between 630 and 680 a year after filing. Bankruptcy is a negative but it is not given the same weight as the debt you are currently carrying. It is fairly easy to recover from a bankruptcy but it is dependent on what you do going forward. I have a steady flow of clients who have to file bankruptcy to keep their military clearances or gaming licenses because they are less of a risk after filing bankruptcy than before. There are over a million people who file for bankruptcy every year.

    (For all of you getting your undergarments in a twist- please see the morality section below.)

    Debt consolidation!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Debt consolidation is a scam unless you do it yourself or go through a true non-profit like Consumer Credit Counseling Services (CCCS). But guess what? Debt consolidation and debt management plans wreck your credit worse than bankruptcy. Why? Because you are not paying according to the terms of the agreement. Therefore, late payments are being reported and the final note will say something to the effect of "settled for less than full". 

    Debt consolidation works like this: you hear a commercial promising to pay your debts for less than you are paying now over the next 3-5 years. You sign up and start making a monthly payment. 8 months to a year later, you get sued and the consolidation company says, "sorry, we can't help you, we are not lawyers. Oh, and by the way, all of the money you just paid us was applied to our fees. The next 2-5 years was going to go to the creditors." Debt consolidation companies can not control the creditors. They use the normal collection cycle to milk you out of a couple grand and then they are on to the next one. If you want to go this route- read Dave Ramsey and do it your self. (It is possible, hard, but possible if you have the extra income.)

    You can only do three things in your situation:

    1. Do nothing ( the- can't get blood from a turnip- idea; only good if you have no income and no assets and you do not plan to change that in the foreseeable future).

    2. Work with your creditors (everything from settling the debt to paying them in full through wage garnishment or asset seizure). 

    3. Bankruptcy

    How do you decide what is right for you?

    Everyone has a line.  This line is the mathematical point where one penny over it and you can not recover. It does not matter how hard you try or how much you work, you can never pay back what is owed according to the terms of your agreement. Are you there? I can't answer that for you. 

    I have filed bankruptcy for people who owed millions of dollars and for a person who owed $3000. What would the commentators here say? The first was "justified" and the second one wasn't. The second was a 70+ year old man bringing in $850 a month in Social Security and his debt was loan companies charging 119% interest. His payments were more than his total income and he could not work due to his health. 

    The point is there is a line. The amount is not important. The line is. Only you can figure out what that line is. You can work the next 10 years and still end up filing bankruptcy. One of the leading causes of divorce is conflict over finances. Why on earth would someone prioritize the quarterly profits of Capital One over their own marriage? Because of advice as given in this thread. 

    Now my opinion (the morality section).

    Quick note if you are a religious person- bankruptcy originates in the Bible. Forgiveness is a part of every religious belief I am aware of. No one is perfect. 

    An underlying assumption of most of the posts is one of a "moral" obligation on the part of the individual contemplating filing bankruptcy. This makes me see red. 

     Every single lender on a national level has committed criminal acts against consumers. (Remember too big to fail and its aftermath anyone?)

    Every. Single. National. Lender. Many smaller lenders do as well.

    Guess what happens to the bank? Pay a fine. (Not to the people who were hurt of course; but to the federal regulatory agency.) Move on. 

    (In my best announcers voice)

    In this corner we have Big Bank X spending billions of dollars on research and marketing with hundreds of years of institutional memory in the smartest minds from the best schools, all laws and regulations are influenced and approved by their lobbyists, all regulators either worked for them or will some day

    and in the other corner 

    a 22 year old. 

    The world is different than it was 200 years ago. The banks are big boys and they know what they are doing. It is business to them. They created it! They are making money all the way until they push you off a cliff. There is a culture trying to keep you on the edge for as long as possible. Who do you think benefits from this attitude? (Hint: its not you.)

    It is a business for them and it is time you treated yourself as a business. Make your own business decision. That may mean doing everything you can to avoid bankruptcy or recognizing that you have crossed that line. 

    Good Luck!

    You left out option #4. Get your butt to work and easily pay off 20k in a year.

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  • Scott Carder
    Investor · Owasso, OK · Member since 2013 · 166 posts · 90 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Brett S.:

    forget those people who say you need to tighten your bootstraps and work your way through it for honor. Bankruptcy is a simple financial data based decision, not emotional one. 

    Both my brother and my dad would have 1) had better lives and 2) more forced saving discipline if the filed for bankruptcy in their lifetimes. It's like the army for misbehaving kids that way. 

    In my view, file yesterday. Particularly if you are going to school. 

    If you want to get really smart read up on what your state won't take (personal residence, etc) buy those things, and then file to end up net positive. 

    Don't feel bad for the bank, they won't feel bad for you. 

     You should print out a copy of this and share it with every banker/lender/partner you ever plan to work with. I bet they make a simple decision at that point.

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  • Account Closed
    OP
    Statesboro, GA · Member since 2015 · 99 posts · 24 votes
    10y

    @Chris Martell, just attempt to pay it off through a debt consolidation company. But it wouldn't be in a timely fashion at all. I don't have a job and only 14 weeks on unemployment. That's why I considered filing from the beginning. Instead of paying for 5 months and eventually filing anyways, just saving the 5 months of attempted payments.

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  • Account Closed
    OP
    Statesboro, GA · Member since 2015 · 99 posts · 24 votes
    10y

    @Scott Carder, it's actually towards $27,000. I had a situation with a motorcycle that was stolen. The bank's insurance was supposed to file it as a total loss, ended up finding it and giving it back. So that's an additional $6k. And that's $27k without any interest added. So it would take more like 1.5 - 2 years because my current lease doesn't end for 4 more months. To cancel is 3 months rent as a fee. So add $900 x 3 on top of the $27k, plus interest. And I also have no vehicle. I bought a new 2014 truck when I had a job, realized it was dumb to pay $800 a month with insurance (I'm only 22 so my insurance was ungodly), so I took it back. Now I drive my dad's beater truck with over 300,000 miles. So I'm also in need of a vehicle. A reliable one could be around $4,000. So $27k, plus interest on that, plus $2,700 for rent fees, plus around $4,000 for a reliable vehicle. All with no income and only 14 weeks of unemployment at $330 a week and HOPEFULLY being able to find a decent job.

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  • Brett S.
    Investor · Kalamazoo, MI · Member since 2014 · 60 posts · 25 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Scott Carder:
    Originally posted by @Brett S.:

    forget those people who say you need to tighten your bootstraps and work your way through it for honor. Bankruptcy is a simple financial data based decision, not emotional one. 

    Both my brother and my dad would have 1) had better lives and 2) more forced saving discipline if the filed for bankruptcy in their lifetimes. It's like the army for misbehaving kids that way. 

    In my view, file yesterday. Particularly if you are going to school. 

    If you want to get really smart read up on what your state won't take (personal residence, etc) buy those things, and then file to end up net positive. 

    Don't feel bad for the bank, they won't feel bad for you. 

     You should print out a copy of this and share it with every banker/lender/partner you ever plan to work with. I bet they make a simple decision at that point.

     They do this every time I apply. What do you think the credit check is for?

    0Reply
  • JD MartinBusiness Member
    Moderator
    Rock Star Extraordinaire · Northeast, TN · Member since 2015 · 10k+ posts · 16k+ votes
    10y

    I disagree with @Paul Choate's post. I have no love for banks, credit cards or financial institutions. They're just businesses like anything else. I don't think anyone technically owes them anything - interest is part of the risk the lender takes that the borrower defaults, and charges accordingly. And bankruptcy - a fresh start - is an accepted way of dealing with situations that get so far out of control that they would be ridiculously onerous on those forced to do the payback. 

    My problem with easily absolved financial situations that are wiped through bankruptcy is that it raises the cost of doing business for those who feel they have an ethical, if not an absolute legal, responsibility to pay back what they've borrowed - especially when the borrowing was done for goodies like new trucks, motorcycles and poker night. There may not be a financial difference between the guy who owes $27k on new cars and nice clothes, and the guy who owes $27k because his wife was stricken with cancer, but there sure as hell is an ethical difference in my opinion. I don't necessarily mind paying a little more in interest to take up the slack for people who had real problems, but I'm not interested in paying on the back end for someone to run around in a 2014 truck that they could only afford when working.

    In this case, you're talking about someone being able to probably make everyone whole in 1-1.5 years, that has no wife or kids to take care of, and is really only considering it from the point of having to delay school for another semester in order to meet the obligations. It may be legal to file in this case, but I don't think it's ethical, and failing to take responsibility for one's actions is more detrimental long-term for the poster than the short-term benefit of wiping out the debts and leaving the wreckage in his wake. What does he learn? That when things don't go as plan, you don't just buckle down and ride out the storm, you abandon ship, every man for himself. 

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  • David Dachtera
    Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    10y

    I'm glad @Paul Choate made his post. He presented a fairly balanced viewpoint considering he's a bankruptcy professional. There *IS* much to consider, and the Bk move is not to be taken lightly. Social pressure one way or the other, however, has no place in the decision making process.

    One point I hope I can make is that needing to file is no more a "failure" than being laid off from the job which has been paying those bills is either your fault or within your control. Bk is an option when there are no other options left.

    @Chris Martell, If Bk were not an option I guess his only other choice would be to skip town and start over under an assumed identity.

    @Scott Carder, "Get your butt to work and easily pay off 20k in a year." That's hard to do when the only jobs available are poverty wage jobs paying less than $15K gross - less than $10K take-home - and you still have to pay your own living expenses.

    Being a computer-chair financial planner is easy.

    Dealing with large debts and no income ... not so much.

    0Reply
  • Scott Carder
    Investor · Owasso, OK · Member since 2013 · 166 posts · 90 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @David Dachtera:

    I'm glad @Paul Choate made his post. He presented a fairly balanced viewpoint considering he's a bankruptcy professional. There *IS* much to consider, and the Bk move is not to be taken lightly. Social pressure one way or the other, however, has no place in the decision making process.

    One point I hope I can make is that needing to file is no more a "failure" than being laid off from the job which has been paying those bills is either your fault or within your control. Bk is an option when there are no other options left.

    @Chris Martell, If Bk were not an option I guess his only other choice would be to skip town and start over under an assumed identity.

    @Scott Carder, "Get your butt to work and easily pay off 20k in a year." That's hard to do when the only jobs available are poverty wage jobs paying less than $15K gross - less than $10K take-home - and you still have to pay your own living expenses.

    Being a computer-chair financial planner is easy.

    Dealing with large debts and no income ... not so much.

     Re-read your post, then tell me you actually believe your signature line.

    0Reply
  • David Dachtera
    Rental Property Investor · Rockford, IL · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Scott Carder:
    Originally posted by @David Dachtera:

    I'm glad @Paul Choate made his post. He presented a fairly balanced viewpoint considering he's a bankruptcy professional. There *IS* much to consider, and the Bk move is not to be taken lightly. Social pressure one way or the other, however, has no place in the decision making process.

    One point I hope I can make is that needing to file is no more a "failure" than being laid off from the job which has been paying those bills is either your fault or within your control. Bk is an option when there are no other options left.

    @Chris Martell, If Bk were not an option I guess his only other choice would be to skip town and start over under an assumed identity.

    @Scott Carder, "Get your butt to work and easily pay off 20k in a year." That's hard to do when the only jobs available are poverty wage jobs paying less than $15K gross - less than $10K take-home - and you still have to pay your own living expenses.

    Being a computer-chair financial planner is easy.

    Dealing with large debts and no income ... not so much.

     Re-read your post, then tell me you actually believe your signature line.

    People who get laid off don't choose the event - it is thrust upon them.

    "Your problem" - I actually dislike that expression - may be that you view choosing a legal option provided to you to deal with your financial situation as some form of failure. It is nothing of the sort. It is meant to provide the chance to start over financially by way of a legal process.

    Yes, it is "held against you" in so far as it saps your credit score and gives your credit profile a negative slant.

    That said, what would you consider to be a bigger hit to your credit:

    - A bankruptcy

    - No bankruptcy, but multiple years with lots and lots of late or missed payments while you stumble through trying to pay those accounts you can with half or less your previous income - which runs out after six months and then goes to zero -  and "defer" the rest? (The Bk filing is "procrastinated", not avoided.)

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  • Account Closed
    OP
    Statesboro, GA · Member since 2015 · 99 posts · 24 votes
    10y

    @JD Martin, I understand the ethical side you're talking about. In my defense, I never really grew up having to manage my money. I got the job 2 weeks before turning 21. I was 20 years old making over 4 figures a week. I could get furniture, only $90 a month? Sure. Rent is only one paycheck? Why not, I have 3 more coming. I wasn't thinking long-term. I was thinking I made X amount every month and it would cover finances easily. I wasn't brought up on how to deal with my money. And I actually could afford the truck payments, just saw no need to. I don't understand what's so unforgivable about someone who's barely legal to drink alcohol making a bunch of dumb financial decisions. I'm not saying it wasn't wrong. It was. I was beyond stupid with half the stuff I financed and how quickly I did it all. But giving up 2 years of my life to pay it back just to have horrible credit anyways? And that's just paying back the principle! Add in interest, add in needing a vehicle, add in the fees of me cancelling my lease. We're talking over $35,000 here EASILY. I made some dumb decisions, I've realized that. And just because filing would be the "easy way out" doesn't mean I haven't learned from this. Why does someone have to slave away 2 years of their lives to learn a lesson? Filing would make me have to manage my money for years to come, is that not a lesson learned? I have no love for banks either, most of the money they give you are just numbers on a computer and doesn't even exist. I have no job. I live in a college town. There is a Walmart Distribution Center where I could work in a warehouse. It's the highest paying job in my city for a whopping $13/hr, if that puts it in perspective. Surrounding cities offer better jobs, but I have no reliable vehicle. My situation is pretty complex. I didn't just go finance everything out the *** and not feel like paying it back. I financed a bunch of dumb things, realized, and tried to get out of them only to lose my job.

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  • Account Closed
    OP
    Statesboro, GA · Member since 2015 · 99 posts · 24 votes
    10y

    @David Dachtera, thanks for the help. I have a lot to think about. I should have put my entire situation from the beginning. It's not merely $20k in debt. It's around $27k, plus interest, plus needing a vehicle. It could add up to $35k plus easily. $20k, yes, I understand paying it off. But it's not only that. My main thing is I don't want to slowly pay off and ruin my credit anyways while spending 2 years of my life paying it back. It's either choice A or B for me.

    A.) I don't file. I go through a credit consolidation company and somehow manage to pay it off every month on time over the course of years. My credit gets ruined, but I paid off my debts and did it ethically the right way. I also don't have a bankruptcy on my report, so I can be eligible to work some jobs that I'll never even consider applying for in the first place. I can also have the ability to maybe buy a house with a good job, but probably still have to put down a big down payment because my credit is ruined, when in reality I won't be buying a house for years to come anyways.

    or

    B.) File. Immediately start to rebuild my credit. Have no access to credit cards, so even though I feel mature enough now after all this, I will be forced to not use them. Instead of paying off over $35,000 in two years, I can have that $35,000 in my bank account. I'll have a bankruptcy on file, so I can't work with stocks or buy a house for a while. Man, I was really hoping to do both of those at 22...

    Morals aside, I think it's best to file. Like I said, I don't know why people think I have to work 2 years of my life away and give very $ I make to my debts in order for me to learn a lesson. It's not like filing is an easy choice. And it's also not like you have to put yourself through that much in order to grow. I've already realized what I've done and will never do it again. Isn't filing enough of a punishment for that? People act like it's just a get out of jail free card and comes with absolutely no consequences. I have a lot to think about, really.

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  • Scott W.
    Real Estate Investor · chicago, IL · Member since 2012 · 1k+ posts · 231 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Mark Graham II:

    I have to honest with you. You have to get out there and hustle it. I'm less than a month from my 29th birthday, married, and between my wife and I, we have right now just over $290k in debt. We have looked at bankruptcy, but I feel that is a failures method. I was laid off two weeks ago, but I'm looking for work, trying to exhaust every single avenue I can because I don't want to be a coward. I will get into REI, I will succeed, and I WILL be the best in my area. Before any of that starts, I know I need to figure out how to eliminate all the debt I can, and free up any and all funds I can get my hands on. Get out there and hustle! Props on the decision to set school back a year. Doing that should give you enough time to hustle, pay off your debt, and very well could allow you to start school with some savings, and a better understanding of what not to do finically. I wish you luck, and I hope you'll keep us updated

    @mark graham  did you say $290k in debt? as in $290 thousand dollars?!?!?!?!  if so, how on earth do you plan on paying that back????

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  • Mark Graham II
    Williston, ND · Member since 2015 · 63 posts · 17 votes
    10y

    At this point in time, I've worked with my creditors as best as I can, explaining my current situation. And I should mention, 120k of that is in primary residence, and another 110k is wrapped up in my wives student loans. My wife has a fairly good job, so paying the house and student loans isn't a problem. However when I was laid off last year we didn't live within our means, and maxed out two credit cards. Both of which have been awesome at working with us, because they don't want us to file bankruptcy as bad as we don't! So all I can say at this point in my journey, is call people you owe and talk to them. They want the money you borrowed, and would rather work with you to pay it back than to have to file bankruptcy and screw them

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  • Asa Gunderman
    Rental Property Investor · Knoxville, TN · Member since 2015 · 45 posts · 24 votes
    10y
    Originally posted by @Account Closed:

    @David Dachtera,  I'll have a bankruptcy on file, so I can't work with stocks or buy a house for a while. Man, I was really hoping to do both of those at 22...

    If this is how you feel, can I ask why you're posting on a real estate investing forum?  People are coming at you from an investor's point of view. If this is what you want to do, take the advise that the majority of investors have given you.  If not, file bankruptcy and move on.  

    Asa

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  • Account Closed
    OP
    Statesboro, GA · Member since 2015 · 99 posts · 24 votes
    10y

    @Asa Gunderman, I was posting on a real estate forum to ask investors' views because I wanted to know the opinions from people I want to grow into being like in my own investing career. Don't read that portion from my post out of context. I was being sarcastic by saying those types of negatives of filing wouldn't hurt me personally. Could it possibly be a bad thing for other people in my situation but with different goals? Of course. All the replies have helped me immensely. It wasn't meant to sound like I was mocking in any way.

    0Reply
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