New to Real Estate · Virginia Beach, VA (Virginia Beach) · Member since 2020 · 29 posts · 19 votes
I'm in the Navy and my wife and I are nearing the end of my contract here in Pensacola. I have the option to stay here for another 4 years or move to Oahu for 4 years. I'm looking for investing advice but also for some life advice.
Below is the breakdown of income in both areas as well as a rough housing cost breakdown. Long story short we will still be able to save a good amount living in Oahu but we won't be able to buy a house. Whereas here in Pensacola we will be able to save a good amount AND buy at least one house, maybe two (this would be our first house and we want to have multiple rentals across the country by the time I get out). We're both relatively young (both 22) and we're trying to decide what the best course of action is. Both places we would be able to save about $800-1000/month after all expenses besides regular spending money. We're trying to decide whether the lost time/ money investing in real estate is worth it considering we'll be getting paid to live in Oahu and will still be able to pocket some money. We're young and relatively free of responsibility so if we're ever going to do it this is the time.
Only debt is 13,500 on my wife's car.
Our total NW right now including the car loan is about $1,550 (We saved all of our tax return which brought us above 0!)
Thank you guys for the help and advice!!
Honolulu:
Total monthly income: 5463.71
Average price of apartments we've been looking at: 2000
Real Estate Agent · Fort Walton Beach, FL · Member since 2018 · 143 posts · 114 votes
6y
Aloha Justin! My wife and I got stationed on Oahu in April of 2019 so I could provide some insight into the mind of a RE investor who is in the military and stationed on Oahu. My goal when we arrived was also to buy. I offered on types of properties and in certain areas of the island before I was educated and knew the island. My first bit of advice would be to get here and use your TLA (temporary living allowance) while getting a feel for the island before making offers. 30 minutes of driving on this island will take you through 5 completely different towns with different feels, traffic, home evaluations, etc. Just because the island looks small on a map doesn't mean that every town here is the same, not even close. Know the island and where you and your wife are comfortable before you offer and get stuck somewhere. After unsuccessfully offering on properties the first go around, we've been renting for about 10 months now, and I am deep into the home search once again. I offered on a property last week and we're in the thick of negotiations. Complete house hacks may not always be possible, but heavy mortgage supplementation is definitely possible and worth shooting for, as tons of homes here have mother-in-law units (or Ohana units) on the property for great rental income. So, although you may not be able to cover all $3K of your mortgage, maybe your 1 bed/1 bath is bringing in $1200 and bringing your mortgage down to $1800K, super helpful! In addition, don't let the hefty prices intimidate you as we have a great advantage with 0% down, or close to 0% down, VA loans. Great opportunity for "free" appreciation!
All in all, do what's right for you and your wife, but choosing Oahu has put me out of my comfort zone in the best way and made me experience adventures, friendships, and culture I never would have on the mainland. Has it delayed my investing career? Unfortunately yes, but I know in 10 years when I have 15 properties I'm going to be talking about and thankful for my time here. It's also help me become more educated and savvy in OOS investing. Hope that helps - feel free to reach out if you have any questions I'd be happy to help!
Rental Property Investor · Concord, GA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 3k+ votes
6y
While Hawaii would be a fun place to spend some time. It is likely you could put it further down the line. I'd stay in Pensacola and build your property portfolio. It's going to be easier to make a spread there between your BAH and actual costs than in Hawaii most likely as everything is expensive in HI. If you haven't established FL residency yet, you could do that to avoid income taxes on the state level. That can make a big difference to your finances. The FL panhandle as a whole has lower real estate prices than much of the rest of FL and you should be able to buy a live in flip or turn it into a buy/hold to rent out after you PCS.
While Hawaii would be a fun place to spend some time. It is likely you could put it further down the line. I'd stay in Pensacola and build your property portfolio. It's going to be easier to make a spread there between your BAH and actual costs than in Hawaii most likely as everything is expensive in HI. If you haven't established FL residency yet, you could do that to avoid income taxes on the state level. That can make a big difference to your finances. The FL panhandle as a whole has lower real estate prices than much of the rest of FL and you should be able to buy a live in flip or turn it into a buy/hold to rent out after you PCS.
The reason we said we would rather do it now than later is because we don't have any children and have relatively few responsibilities so we feel like it would be the best time if we want to go to Hawaii.
It's definitely a tough decision. I appreciate your input!! If we do end up staying in Pensacola we've got contact info for a good real estate agent!
Real Estate Agent · Merritt Island, FL · Member since 2017 · 974 posts · 1k+ votes
6y
@Justin Jones - if your idea of investing is buying a house and maybe a 2nd one over the next 4 years, I strongly urge you to move to Oahu. Perhaps you might not be able to afford a home (though you might), however you will enjoy life. I love Hawaii, have made numerous trips there and have friends there as well. You won't have any regrets.
On the other hand, if you want to invest....as in *really* invest, then stay put. Not only is most of FL less expensive than Pensacola, you're in a goldmine (no)thanks to the last hurricane that crushed your area. Many homes need work. If you spend time on BP and team up with your wife, you'll leave Pensacola with perhaps 10 homes. I say 10 because you have a job serving and protecting us; if you didn't have that obligation, I'd say 40. In short, aim high (yeah, yeah....different branch) and stay - or - go live it up with your wife and get aloha!
Developer · Panama City Beach, FL · Member since 2013 · 130 posts · 88 votes
6y
@Justin Jones Most will never have the opportunity to even visit Hawaii and you have an opportunity to live there. I would take it. Sure you could collect some cheap homes in the panhandle, but it's not worth the trade-off in quality of life and experience. Plus you may end up further ahead at your age maxing out a Roth IRA the next 4 years while the stock market gets cheaper and real estate is overpriced. I doubt you will look back 20 years from now wishing you spent 4 more years in the panhandle over Hawaii.
Rental Property Investor · Ambler, PA · Member since 2015 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
6y
@Justin Jones
Great options available to you. I don’t think it matters where you are -you’ll always be able to find deals -do what you want or think is best for you and your family.
The tone of your post makes me believe you’ll be successful either way. Enjoy!
I went to a real estate meet up on oahu and met a girl your age and single. She was able to purchase a condo/townhouse with just her income. I believe close to 400 range. I’m not sure how she did it but you have cola you can use as your monthly payment etc. just have to do your research. Good luck.
Honolulu, HI · Member since 2015 · 29 posts · 14 votes
6y
@Justin Jones As others have said you have some great choices. I'm a realtor and real estate investor on Oahu. Using your BAH and VA loan benefits in Hawaii can be a really sweet deal if you decide to purchase as you can be all in for $2000/mon for a condo. As you have already seen, you can also find rentals at that number. I can connect you to a local mortgage broker who does a bunch of VA loans if you're curious about what you could qualify for. DM me if you have some questions.
I'm in the Navy and my wife and I are nearing the end of my contract here in Pensacola. I have the option to stay here for another 4 years or move to Oahu for 4 years. I'm looking for investing advice but also for some life advice.
Below is the breakdown of income in both areas as well as a rough housing cost breakdown. Long story short we will still be able to save a good amount living in Oahu but we won't be able to buy a house. Whereas here in Pensacola we will be able to save a good amount AND buy at least one house, maybe two (this would be our first house and we want to have multiple rentals across the country by the time I get out). We're both relatively young (both 22) and we're trying to decide what the best course of action is. Both places we would be able to save about $800-1000/month after all expenses besides regular spending money. We're trying to decide whether the lost time/ money investing in real estate is worth it considering we'll be getting paid to live in Oahu and will still be able to pocket some money. We're young and relatively free of responsibility so if we're ever going to do it this is the time.
Only debt is 13,500 on my wife's car.
Our total NW right now including the car loan is about $1,550 (We saved all of our tax return which brought us above 0!)
Thank you guys for the help and advice!!
Honolulu:
Total monthly income: 5463.71
Average price of apartments we've been looking at: 2000
Pensacola:
Total Monthly Income: 4122.71
Average home cost 200,000
We have access to the VA home loan.
I assume you are a pilot. My good friend is also a Navy pilot and was stationed in Oahu a few years ago. I can tell you that it is an AMAZING place and we had a great time visiting him. They absolutely loved living there. You're young and have plenty of time to invest, I would definitely go to Hawaii if I was in your shoes. Not only because it's a beautiful place to live but because moving to a different place gives you more life experiences that you'll appreciate later on. Some things money can't buy.
You have plenty of time to invest. You could still buy a house in Pensacola even if you're living in Hawaii if you really wanted to.
I suggest you go, save your money like you mentioned, and gain that life experience that the Navy is paying for.
Rental Property Investor · Pensacola, FL · Member since 2019 · 4 posts · 3 votes
6y
Hello! I’ve lived on Oahu and in Pensacola. I’m going to go on the other side here. While everyone is right, Hawaii is a great place to visit, it is much different to live and work there. Again, this is from experience actually living there, not just wondering about it. I’ll give you a few honest reasons why:
1. Cost of living: EVERYTHING is very expensive there. Because very little is produced there, it all has to be imported. This isn’t something that affects vacationers too bad but when you live there you feel it. Flights are very expensive too. If you do go, get a Hawaii drivers license, show it everywhere, and ask for the Kama’aina rate. If they have it, it’s much cheaper than the listed prices.
2. Housing costs: some of the most overpriced housing you’re ever going to see. There are probably gems out there and it’s not a problem as long as the prices keep going up; however, what you’ll pay $200k for here in Pensacola is likely $500-$600k+ there. Not as big an issue if you house hack or even live on base (although you lose your BAH if you do that).
3. Local populace: the locals are some of the kindest, warmest people you’ll ever meet....once you get to know some personally. Not talking about the workers in Waikiki who are polite to everyone (it’s their job). I’m talking about the real locals who wouldn’t ever go down to Waikiki unless they work there. Unfortunately outside investors are raising prices so high they can’t afford to stay in their own homes and many tourists disrespect their sacred areas. This has given many a very bad taste in their mouth against outsiders. It can be overcome for sure, but it’s one of the few places I experienced racism on an almost daily basis. Again, once you break down the initial barriers, they will treat you like family.
4. Island fever: this may be because I went to Hawaii after 3 years in Okinawa, but island fever is a real thing. You know how every advertisement has super small print on the bottom of it? Well most of them say “....except Hawaii and Alaska”. It was very frustrating to not be able get the things you want at times, can’t drive across a couple states for vacation (have to fly everywhere not on your island). A little harder to explain and maybe not everyone experiences it, but those that have lived on an island for an extended time typically understand this, even if they didn’t get it bad.
5. Education system: one of the worst in America. I remember some of my local friends being jokingly happy when they went from 50th to 49th. Then they talked for a couple hours about all the negative affects this has had on them as a population. You don’t have kids so it won’t affect you directly until you do and they are school aged. Homeschooling is always an option. Sports are also limited because since it is an island, there is no interstate travel for big tournaments unless you’re in an individual sports and want to pay to fly. On that note, they LOVE their high school sports there because they get very little college action and no pro action on island.
I still talk to my Hawaiian friends almost daily. I’ve visited numerous times since I left. I will never live there again though. I have some friends who were stationed there, absolutely loved it, retired, and stayed. Some people may disagree but everything above is true and experienced first hand. Just wanted to give you another side of the story.
Real Estate Agent · Pensacola, FL · Member since 2014 · 379 posts · 307 votes
6y
I absolutely love Pensacola and the surrounding area but in your situation I think I would have to go to Oahu for a few years. I don't think that precludes you from investing in Pensacola or anywhere on the mainland. In fact, if you can become an excellent long distance investor while you are there making better money then you will be even better positioned to invest when you return to the continental 48 in a few years. Go have a cool life experience and pursue your investing dreams at the same time would be my advice.
Investor · Tampa, FL · Member since 2017 · 123 posts · 109 votes
6y
I would stay in Florida. If/when the market turns due to the current economic condition, you will be able to pick up investment properties as a local landlord in FL easier.
Everything mentioned above about living here is pretty accurate.
Pensacola for sure hands down. I have never been to Pensacola. Here’s why you don’t choose Hawai’i......
This is coming from a 5th generation local who owns his own house (currently house hacking), is working on adding another rental income stream, and makes a solid income here.
I LOVE the second to none surf here! I go at least once a week, sometimes twice. What I’m saying here is moving will break my heart, as the ocean IS my playground. Despite this, I’m still likely moving to a place that not only doesn’t have year round warm water surf, but no surf at all.
I love the weather, the food, fresh fish, and the hiking trails. I’m absolutely in love with this place, BUT..... I am tired of the cost of living.
Your money will go a lot further in Florida and you won’t have your rights regularly trampled on.
Would I feel the same way if I had passive income and didn’t need to work anymore? Maybe a little, but Hawai’i doesn’t have much to offer to the person who seeks financial freedom. It’s got great surf and weather.
Everything mentioned above about living here is pretty accurate.
Pensacola for sure hands down. I have never been to Pensacola. Here’s why you don’t choose Hawai’i......
This is coming from a 5th generation local who owns his own house (currently house hacking), is working on adding another rental income stream, and makes a solid income here.
I LOVE the second to none surf here! I go at least once a week, sometimes twice. What I’m saying here is moving will break my heart, as the ocean IS my playground. Despite this, I’m still likely moving to a place that not only doesn’t have year round warm water surf, but no surf at all.
I love the weather, the food, fresh fish, and the hiking trails. I’m absolutely in love with this place, BUT..... I am tired of the cost of living.
Your money will go a lot further in Florida and you won’t have your rights regularly trampled on.
Would I feel the same way if I had passive income and didn’t need to work anymore? Maybe a little, but Hawai’i doesn’t have much to offer to the person who seeks financial freedom. It’s got great surf and weather.
Ohhh man, slow and steady just doesn't work in Hawaii. Gotta be loaded to start out with or a part time owner of a hotel.
Everything mentioned above about living here is pretty accurate.
Pensacola for sure hands down. I have never been to Pensacola. Here’s why you don’t choose Hawai’i......
This is coming from a 5th generation local who owns his own house (currently house hacking), is working on adding another rental income stream, and makes a solid income here.
I LOVE the second to none surf here! I go at least once a week, sometimes twice. What I’m saying here is moving will break my heart, as the ocean IS my playground. Despite this, I’m still likely moving to a place that not only doesn’t have year round warm water surf, but no surf at all.
I love the weather, the food, fresh fish, and the hiking trails. I’m absolutely in love with this place, BUT..... I am tired of the cost of living.
Your money will go a lot further in Florida and you won’t have your rights regularly trampled on.
Would I feel the same way if I had passive income and didn’t need to work anymore? Maybe a little, but Hawai’i doesn’t have much to offer to the person who seeks financial freedom. It’s got great surf and weather.
Thank you for your input! This is definitely a tough decision. My wife and I personally both LOVE the ocean. I regularly go surfing and spear fishing. My line of thinking was if we end up in oahu we probably won't be able to buy a house but we can save and really enjoy hawaii and the nature and even do our part in giving back to hawaii. And then when we return to the mainland we'll have a larger fund for a down payment and some great life experiences!
Also, the surf in pensacola isn't really good at all... more incentive for hawaii. :)
One quick question. As a quick guess what would you say a weekly grocery cost for two people would be in Oahu? What about utilities? I can't find consistent answers on any blogs or forums.
I do not recall how much it would be for two, that was a long time ago lol.....however my grocery bill for a family of 5 (my kids are all under 8 but they eat like teenagers), is regularly $500-600 a month. 85% or greater of our meals is home cooked. My wife and I both love cooking, and I’d say we eat well. When I say that I mean we buy organic when we can and I get grass fed beef online. Costco plays a big part. We don’t drink anything other than water/tea/coffee (at home), and we don’t drink alcohol.
As far as utilities go, you have a monopoly for water and a monopoly for electricity. Prior to getting PV panels, my electric bill was consistently $180-220 a month (5 years ago). A family of 5 was renting the upstairs unit and it was my wife and my daughter at the time. We DON’T run AC. Don’t have it (one of the requirements when searching for a home was high up on a hill (cooler and our property has GREAT airflow) so that takes care of that. If you live in place that’s hot and need AC, I’ve seen some people paying $400-600 a month with no PV. Up in the heights it’s only unbearable maybe 2-4 weeks a year. Now with the PV panels and solar water heater I pay $26 a month. Water is consistently $150-180 a month and that is for my family of 5 and our single tenant.
You will love the spear fishing and surfing. Guaranteed!
Again, I should state that I am a positive person and not trying to knock Hawai’i. However, math doesn’t lie, and I truly believe that if one is frugal, making a solid income and investing, you can get to FIRE much quicker somewhere else. Once at FIRE..... I’d argue one would enjoy Hawai’i much more coming here for a month or two a year, not having to work, and just surfing and hiking every single day.
Also, this whole flu thing that shut the world down....it remains to be seen what impact it will have on Hawaii. Hawai’i has always been a one trick pony with tourism. As of this writing, tourism is down 87%. I surfed town this morning and Waikiki is a ghost town, like out of a zombie movie. Unemployment is rapidly climbing and the only industries I see weathering the storm at this time are construction, healthcare, liquor, grocery and gun stores. Everything is getting hammered. Of course, there is opportunity in everything, just throwing that side of the equation out there.
Good luck in making your decision. It sounds like whatever you pick you will make the most of it. The fact that you and your wife both love the ocean is key. If you weren’t outdoor people it definitely would not be worth it, but I do understand why it’s a hard decision despite the cost of living.
Real Estate Agent · Honolulu, HI · Member since 2019 · 22 posts · 1 vote
6y
@Justin Jones depends on what your main priority is when looking to move. As someone who grew up on the mainland, I’ll admit that you can’t beat the lifestyle out here on Oahu. If you can justify the cost of living, it’s amazing. Hope that helps
I'm in the Navy and my wife and I are nearing the end of my contract here in Pensacola. I have the option to stay here for another 4 years or move to Oahu for 4 years. I'm looking for investing advice but also for some life advice.
Below is the breakdown of income in both areas as well as a rough housing cost breakdown. Long story short we will still be able to save a good amount living in Oahu but we won't be able to buy a house. Whereas here in Pensacola we will be able to save a good amount AND buy at least one house, maybe two (this would be our first house and we want to have multiple rentals across the country by the time I get out). We're both relatively young (both 22) and we're trying to decide what the best course of action is. Both places we would be able to save about $800-1000/month after all expenses besides regular spending money. We're trying to decide whether the lost time/ money investing in real estate is worth it considering we'll be getting paid to live in Oahu and will still be able to pocket some money. We're young and relatively free of responsibility so if we're ever going to do it this is the time.
Only debt is 13,500 on my wife's car.
Our total NW right now including the car loan is about $1,550 (We saved all of our tax return which brought us above 0!)
Thank you guys for the help and advice!!
Honolulu:
Total monthly income: 5463.71
Average price of apartments we've been looking at: 2000
Pensacola:
Total Monthly Income: 4122.71
Average home cost 200,000
We have access to the VA home loan.
I would live in O'ahu. That area seems beautiful, and you only live once. You can get creative with the financing and maybe bring in an investor. You could also explore OOS investing.
New to Real Estate · Virginia Beach, VA (Virginia Beach) · Member since 2020 · 29 posts · 19 votes
6y
Thank you all for your input again!
I recently purchased pro and have set a goal to analyze 100 deals by July. I'm in the middle of school right now so all week I'm studying. My goal is to analyze 3-5 deals/day on saturdays and sundays.
I've been analyzing deals mainly here in pensacola and in oahu.. with a few in columbus ohio too as that's where I'm from.
There seem to be a few really good deals here in Pensacola even if we invested remotely from oahu and didn't house hack here.
However, our plan was to house hack wherever we go. I've been getting a little bummed because it seems like in oahu that's not feasible without a huge down payment. I don't necessarily want to rent but I don't know if we can afford a place in Oahu that is big enough to house hack, even if it needs a lot of work. We really want to take the opportunity to go out to Oahu though if it's offered (which it most likely will be). If we do have to rent in Oahu we're still planning on investing out of state but that's a lot riskier than house hacking. There are some really good deals to be had here in Pensacola from what I've seen even running some pretty conservative numbers.
I'm going to keep analyzing deals but would really like your input. I'm about to start the audiobook on investing with no or low money down as well.
New to Real Estate · Virginia Beach, VA (Virginia Beach) · Member since 2020 · 29 posts · 19 votes
6y
Quick update on this thread. My wife and I ran some quick numbers (we were very conservative) and if we go to Hawaii and IF she can get a job teaching we can save about $2000/month even if we have to pay rent/ a mortgage. If she can’t get a job we’ll be netting -$2600/month.
If we stay in Pensacola we will be able to save about $4000/month. She has a guaranteed job teaching here already if we stay. That’s also accounting for us having to pay a mortgage.
