The BP Politics and Common Purpose Manifesto

The BP Politics and Common Purpose Manifesto

Joshua D.Pro Member
BiggerPockets Founder · HI · Member since 2008 · 16k+ posts · 5k+ votes

2011 has been off to a chaotic start on the BP forums, as there has been a LOT of infighting, bickering, whining, and battling - especially centered around our political forums.

In the 6 years that I've been running the site, I've never seen it as bad as it has been recently.

With that in mind, I've decided that we're officially closing the public political forums for good. Until we can get all posts ported over to the political group, and can officially close the forum for good, any new posts made in the forum will just be transferred.

While I think it is important that we have a place where people can discuss politics (since business and politics go hand in hand), I believe that having the forum has led to rivalries on the site and other issues that have taken away from the most important discussions - the real estate ones.

Beyond politics, I've seen a few other rivalries develop amongst some members because they may not like someone or may disagree with their ideas. This has led to a lot of backhanded and blatant attacks on one another.

This post it my plea to get over it. We're all here for generally the same reasons - to learn something, to make some money, to meet new people.

If you don't like someone, ignore them. Don't respond to their posts. Don't give in to temptation and get into battles. If someone crosses the line, report their post, but don't engage them.

We're all adults here with common purpose.

It kills me that some people have allowed their disdain for one member or another to drive them away from participating here and from making money as a result.

I hope everyone reading this can stop and think about this for a minute. I hope everyone reading this realizes that life is too short to let your dislike for one or several people to cause them to behave in a manner that they wouldn't normally or cause them to stop participating on a community that can be very good for their business.

I hope we can try to move forward in 2011 and better ourselves and our businesses, instead of behaving like a bunch of high-school kids.

Thanks for listening.

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Most Popular Reply

Investor · Westminster, CO · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
15y

Wow, what did I miss?

I always thought the political forums were more "tongue in cheek" then actually feelings for one another. But if there were personal attacks, then it needed to be removed. If people cannot separate a person from their political beliefs, then they should not engage in dialogue. And if anyone leaves BP because of political beliefs, then they are members of BP for the wrong reasons.

It is a shame the adults behave in such a way that forces Joshua to close a forum.

I first got on the internet in 1984, using a monochrome screen. One thing that I have noticed, whether it is forum posting, blogs, emails, instant messages, etc... is that many times, a reader will put an entirely different emotion on the written word than the writer intended. Let me give an example:

Look at this sentence:

"I did not say he stole the money." How can this be interpreted?

"I" did not say he stole the money. (It was said by someone else)

I "DID NOT" say he stole the money. (vehement denial)

I did not "SAY" he stole the money. (I implied it but did not say it)

I did not say "HE" stole the money. (someone else did)

I did not say he "STOLE" the money. (he just borrowed it)

I did not say he stole "THE MONEY" (I said he stole the car)

All of a sudden, you have six different ways to read a very simple sentence. Multiply that by many sentences and all of a sudden, mis-communication takes a life of it's own. Assumptions are made, mostly incorrect assumptions, feelings get hurt, and personal attacks, defensiveness and retaliation takes place.

It is better for Joshua to close the political forum and let's get back to investing in Real Estate Information.

See this reply in the discussion

25 Replies

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  • Property Manager · Dublin, OH · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 291 votes
    15y

    I agree Joshua, on few posts I thought to myself : "What´s happening here?".

    -Uwe

  • Altus, OK · Member since 2008 · 2k+ posts · 690 votes
    15y

    That's the nature of political forums Josh they end up becoming a cesspool of flames and constant bickering and fighting.

    They're never a good idea because of the indifferences between different parties on different subjects. Right vs Left never is pretty when they clash.

  • Landlord · Seattle, WA · Member since 2010 · 3k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y

    Amen. I take it though that the politics group will still be open?

  • Joshua D.Pro Member
    OP
    BiggerPockets Founder · HI · Member since 2008 · 16k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    15y

    Yes Charles, the group will be open (and will be a place where without moderation, except if someone really goes overboard, where they will simply lose all forum privileges). We're not playing baby sitter anymore.

  • Specialist · MA · Member since 2009 · 858 posts · 306 votes
    15y

    Hi Josh!

    Just to make you feel a BIT better, I've never seen the fighting, although, I personally don't visit the political forum at all. I've never been politically charged or motivated, as I grew up with a parent that was feuled by it and it was very caustic.

    Anyways, I'm still a huge fan of BP and BP's primary objective to bring investors together and mutually assist and educate each other. I'm here every day or every other day and always take a good tidbit away...(LOL and hopefully add a good tidbit here and there)

    Sorry the political forums have been so "charged" - I haven't noticed.
    :D

  • Joshua D.Pro Member
    OP
    BiggerPockets Founder · HI · Member since 2008 · 16k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    15y

    Maryann -
    I'm glad to hear that you haven't seen the fighting, but it has been pretty out of control of late. That said, it is going to stop.

    I'm glad that you're such a fan of the site -- I work my backside off to make sure this is the top real estate investing site online and I'm not going to let a few people sabotage that for everyone else.

    See you around.

  • Specialist · Riverside, CA · Member since 2008 · 382 posts · 72 votes
    15y

    You gotta admit, it's pretty impressive that this is your biggest problem. This site is extremely purpose driving compared to other major real restate forums.

  • Joshua D.Pro Member
    OP
    BiggerPockets Founder · HI · Member since 2008 · 16k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    15y

    Quick head's up: We've emptied out the political forum and will be closing it completely shortly . . .

    (Josh - reporting from lovely Ritchfield, Utah)

    Yeah - I felt inspired by Rich Weese

  • Investor · Round Rock, TX · Member since 2010 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    15y

    The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles.

    Freeman and slave, patrician and plebeian, lord and serf, guild-master and journeyman, in a word, oppressor and oppressed, stood in constant opposition to one another, carried on an uninterrupted, now hidden, now open fight, a fight that each time ended, either in a revolutionary reconstitution of society at large, or in the common ruin of the contending classes.

  • J ScottPro Member
    Moderator
    Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2008 · 18k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Bryan Hancock:
    The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles.

    Freeman and slave, patrician and plebeian, lord and serf, guild-master and journeyman, in a word, oppressor and oppressed, stood in constant opposition to one another, carried on an uninterrupted, now hidden, now open fight, a fight that each time ended, either in a revolutionary reconstitution of society at large, or in the common ruin of the contending classes.

    Come on, Bryan...warn us with a spoiler alert next time!

    You know some of us haven't finished Chapter 1 yet...

  • Investor · Round Rock, TX · Member since 2010 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by J Scott:

    Come on, Bryan...warn us with a spoiler alert next time!

    You know some of us haven't finished Chapter 1 yet...

    :mrgreen:

  • J ScottPro Member
    Moderator
    Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2008 · 18k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    15y

    I think the most interesting part about removing the public politics forum will be to see who (if anyone) stops or significantly cuts back on their posting now that it's gone...should give us an idea of who's really interested in the main purpose of this site -- Real Estate...

    Hopefully it will turn out to be everyone...

  • Investor · Round Rock, TX · Member since 2010 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    15y

    I really hope so too J. Nice observation!

  • Joshua D.Pro Member
    OP
    BiggerPockets Founder · HI · Member since 2008 · 16k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    15y

    I have a feeling that we're going to lose some people, but if someone leaves the site or stops participating because of our political forum, then they probably weren't really here for the intended purpose of the site in the first place.

  • Flipper · Phoenix, AZ · Member since 2009 · 973 posts · 679 votes
    15y

    I believe we already lost several members prior to the forum being removed, so I'm not sure that I would consider those people gone because the forum was removed.

  • Joshua D.Pro Member
    OP
    BiggerPockets Founder · HI · Member since 2008 · 16k+ posts · 5k+ votes
    15y

    Marc -
    If we lost a member because of our political forums - whether it was before or after we closed them - then there is little we can do about it now.

    Again, this is a real estate site, and perhaps now that we've closed the political forum, some people will once again recognize that.

    We had a few members that posted the vast majority of their posts in the politics forum . . . I'm sure they will either post in our political group or will find a political forum somewhere else that suits their needs.

  • Investor · Westminster, CO · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y

    Wow, what did I miss?

    I always thought the political forums were more "tongue in cheek" then actually feelings for one another. But if there were personal attacks, then it needed to be removed. If people cannot separate a person from their political beliefs, then they should not engage in dialogue. And if anyone leaves BP because of political beliefs, then they are members of BP for the wrong reasons.

    It is a shame the adults behave in such a way that forces Joshua to close a forum.

    I first got on the internet in 1984, using a monochrome screen. One thing that I have noticed, whether it is forum posting, blogs, emails, instant messages, etc... is that many times, a reader will put an entirely different emotion on the written word than the writer intended. Let me give an example:

    Look at this sentence:

    "I did not say he stole the money." How can this be interpreted?

    "I" did not say he stole the money. (It was said by someone else)

    I "DID NOT" say he stole the money. (vehement denial)

    I did not "SAY" he stole the money. (I implied it but did not say it)

    I did not say "HE" stole the money. (someone else did)

    I did not say he "STOLE" the money. (he just borrowed it)

    I did not say he stole "THE MONEY" (I said he stole the car)

    All of a sudden, you have six different ways to read a very simple sentence. Multiply that by many sentences and all of a sudden, mis-communication takes a life of it's own. Assumptions are made, mostly incorrect assumptions, feelings get hurt, and personal attacks, defensiveness and retaliation takes place.

    It is better for Joshua to close the political forum and let's get back to investing in Real Estate Information.

  • Investor · Little Rock, AR · Member since 2010 · 628 posts · 251 votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Bryan Hancock:
    The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles.

    Freeman and slave, patrician and plebeian, lord and serf, guild-master and journeyman, in a word, oppressor and oppressed, stood in constant opposition to one another, carried on an uninterrupted, now hidden, now open fight, a fight that each time ended, either in a revolutionary reconstitution of society at large, or in the common ruin of the contending classes.

    Bryan
    You sure can talk "purty".

    Josh
    I think this is an excellant idea. I know my self, I have struggled with feelings towards some talented people that I could benefit from simply because I learned thier political and religous swings on that forum.
    Good for you.
    Don

  • Investor · Westminster, CO · Member since 2009 · 1k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Don Hines:

    Bryan
    You sure can talk "purty".

    LOL
    Bryan was quoting the opening of Chapter 1 of "The Communist Manifesto"

    Here is the last paragraph of Chapter 1
    "The essential conditions for the existence and for the sway of the bourgeois class is the formation and augmentation of capital; the condition for capital is wage-labour. Wage-labour rests exclusively on competition between the labourers. The advance of industry, whose involuntary promoter is the bourgeoisie, replaces the isolation of the labourers, due to competition, by the revolutionary combination, due to association. The development of Modern Industry, therefore, cuts from under its feet the very foundation on which the bourgeoisie produces and appropriates products. What the bourgeoisie therefore produces, above all, are its own grave-diggers. Its fall and the victory of the proletariat are equally inevitable. "

  • Investor · Round Rock, TX · Member since 2010 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by J Scott:
    I think the most interesting part about removing the public politics forum will be to see who (if anyone) stops or significantly cuts back on their posting now that it's gone...should give us an idea of who's really interested in the main purpose of this site -- Real Estate...

    Hopefully it will turn out to be everyone...

    I think the verdict is out on this on J...I haven't seen anything of the trouble makers in the three months after the forum was closed. BP is such a kinder, gentler place ever since!

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    Is there a "Politics" forum too? I gotta explore the site more!!

  • Investor · Round Rock, TX · Member since 2010 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    15y

    Yeap...there is a private politics forum. BP is a kinder, gentler place now. I have to admit I miss some of the conversation though!

  • J ScottPro Member
    Moderator
    Investor · Sarasota, FL · Member since 2008 · 18k+ posts · 17k+ votes
    15y
    Originally posted by Bryan Hancock:
    I have to admit I miss some of the conversation though!

    That's the problem with you liberal progressive conservative anarchist libertarian fascists...you're all the same...sheesh...

  • Investor, Entrepreneur, Educator · Springfield, MO · Member since 2009 · 21k+ posts · 12k+ votes
    15y

    I disagree Josh, not all the same at all, except that they are all wrong!

    (LOL)

  • Investor · Round Rock, TX · Member since 2010 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    14y

    It has been quite a while since the politics forum was taken down and some of the worst offenders left. BP is so much more peaceful now that they are gone.

    I think this is the best move the site has made since I have been a member of it.

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