Are the seminars valuable or scams?
Most Popular Reply
Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes
7yKiyosaki is no longer affiliated with his seminars. He sold the business to someone else and I've heard they use actors as their speakers and it's a hard up-sell to attend one of their bigger, more expensive seminars where there is a hard up-sell to sign up for private coaching.
All the courses I've looked into are "gurus" trying to up-sell. Their presentations are designed to play on the emotions of sheep, peddling products and upgrades and coaching...all founded on the idea that anyone can do this, you don't need money, financial discipline is not required, etc.
If you find a seminar, do yourself a favor and Google the name of the individual, the seminar, or the company. Search them on BiggerPockets or post a question asking for feedback. You will likely get a lot of negative responses. You may also get a positive response...typically from someone that has no investment property or that recently bought their first one. That's hardly an endorsement.
Everything you need to know is on BP. Read some books that teach you the following:
1. Financial discipline. You need to handle your current finances before you try handling investments and risk.
2. Basics of real estate investing. There are good books here on BP, or you can try the Unofficial Guide To Real Estate Investing or Real Estate Investing for Dummies. Look for a book that provides a general over-view.
Once you have the basics, learn how to find deals, fund deals, and manage deals. Again, you will learn more from one decent book than you would from any $3,000 seminar. If something doesn't make sense, refine your knowledge by reading blog posts or asking questions on BP.
The DIY Landlord Book4.7248 Reviews
35 Replies
- NYC, NY · Member since 2016 · 617 posts · 456 votes7y
I found BP after attending a Than Merrill seminar.
I attended the 2hr event then paid for the 3 day deal. I came out of the 3 day seminar with some new terms and phrases that I'd never heard before i.e. wholesaling, hard money and privatelending. But I also came away thinking that they make $ by selling their $40-$50k program. I also understood that rather than paying them $40-50k, I could probably do better to invest in a property and learn by doing.
I recommend attending local REIA's meetings. They often invite speakers to cover topics related to REI. And you can network.
- Real Estate Broker · Cody, WY · Member since 2010 · 28k+ posts · 41k+ votes7y
Kiyosaki is no longer affiliated with his seminars. He sold the business to someone else and I've heard they use actors as their speakers and it's a hard up-sell to attend one of their bigger, more expensive seminars where there is a hard up-sell to sign up for private coaching.
All the courses I've looked into are "gurus" trying to up-sell. Their presentations are designed to play on the emotions of sheep, peddling products and upgrades and coaching...all founded on the idea that anyone can do this, you don't need money, financial discipline is not required, etc.
If you find a seminar, do yourself a favor and Google the name of the individual, the seminar, or the company. Search them on BiggerPockets or post a question asking for feedback. You will likely get a lot of negative responses. You may also get a positive response...typically from someone that has no investment property or that recently bought their first one. That's hardly an endorsement.
Everything you need to know is on BP. Read some books that teach you the following:
1. Financial discipline. You need to handle your current finances before you try handling investments and risk.
2. Basics of real estate investing. There are good books here on BP, or you can try the Unofficial Guide To Real Estate Investing or Real Estate Investing for Dummies. Look for a book that provides a general over-view.
Once you have the basics, learn how to find deals, fund deals, and manage deals. Again, you will learn more from one decent book than you would from any $3,000 seminar. If something doesn't make sense, refine your knowledge by reading blog posts or asking questions on BP.
The DIY Landlord Book4.7248 Reviews - Flipper/Rehabber · Greensboro, NC · Member since 2010 · 623 posts · 615 votes7y
@Brian Orr - It's always great to go to all FREE seminars and events because you can take notes and learn something from all of them. Kiyosaki is not affiliated with any real estate seminars - he has sold them the right to use his name only. There have been many lawsuits against this company and he has made it clear that he is not involved in any way.
What you need most to be successful is local coaching. All of these "events" sell product and you must be able to implement it on your own when they leave town. I have not found anyone successful using product they purchased at a seminar.
Hook up with all your local investor groups and find out who is coaching locally. Be sure to speak with people who have used any coaching you are considering and used it successfully.
Great question!
- 7yStephanie P.Pro MemberWashington, DC Mortgage Lender/Broker · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
Originally posted by @Brian Orr:
I've heard multiple times on podcasts, people that speak of large value from continued education, conferences, seminars, etc... But i've also seen a few BP blog posts warning that they are scams... The one around here a lot is the Rich Dad education series. A 3 day course that's affiliated with Kiyosaki sounds great of course...
Can anybody suggest a list of helpful seminars and conferences vs. ones we know are scams?
I have shelves of books in my house from a wide variety of authors from Robert Kiyosaki and Robert Allen to Black and Decker's Book of Basic Wiring. All are important in their own way. I went to a "seminar" for Than Merrill and it was a total waste of time. All they wanted me to do was give them $3000 so I could spend another 30000 later. This was 2008 and the guy was convinced that Detroit was the place to invest with a HELOC from my personal home.
Like others have said; go to the seminars if they're free to see if you can glean any information, but don't get suckered. Go to REIA's and MeetUps in your area and network, listen and learn from people that are actually doing the job in your local market. That's where the real education is these days.
Stephanie
- Mustang, OK · Member since 2018 · 154 posts · 110 votes7y
@Brian Orr I have to concur with what others have said. I attended first a 2 hour introduction to Than Merrill's real estate training, then it was the up-sell to attend a 3-day workshop event where you would learn more. I was suspecting that there would be a push for signing up for something because events like this there's always something they want you to buy.
Now I totally understand the need for having a system in place to efficiently run a business. All businesses need them and they do come at a price. However, of the 350 people that were in attendance at the event I attended, there were maybe 10 people (maybe) who bought into Than's system. Were they experienced in their real estate businesses where they needed that for their business to grow even more? Maybe. I don't know.
Since then, I have found myself listening to more BiggerPockets podcasts and reading more books related to real estate investing too. I've learned more particularly through listening to the podcasts than what an operational system could do for me.
I also joined a local real estate investment club (Inland Empire Real Estate Investment Club - Riverside, CA) and they just want to help other to success in their real estate investing endeavors, by asking for advice on whatever deal someone is working on.
Your best source of help is going to be through joining a local REIA, listening to podcasts and reading books.
Have you read @Brandon Turner's book The Book on Investing in Real Estate with No (and Low) Money Down?All the best to your success in achieving your real estate goals.
- Rental Property Investor · Syracuse NY · Member since 2013 · 83 posts · 16 votes7y
I went to 2 of the Rich Dad affiliated seminars back in the day. They were total scams. Someone at the front talking about how successful they are from taking the courses literally started screaming "everyone run back to the room, financial freedom for only $1K! Go!"
1) If they were truly that successful they wouldn't be doing that gig. 2) Just read BP, $50/year in books, and network locally.
- Member since 2018 · 4 posts · 4 votes7y
My local REIA was also trying to upsell another training course. So still trying to get some coaching that is trustable and not a scam. May be one that splits the fees made 50/50. Not sure if such thing exists.
- Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes7y@Brian Orr Find A local -hardened landlord in your area who has been in the game a long time and offer to take him to dinner . You’ll learn more and it will be a whole lot cheaper than some guru coarse . You will certainly want to use BP as well . There is not one thing you will go through that hasn’t already been addressed on this site by another person
- Rental Property Investor · Durham, NC · Member since 2016 · 7k+ posts · 7k+ votes7y@Brian Orr. If you pay more then a few hundred dollars it’s not worth it
- Rental Property Investor · Brooklyn NY · Member since 2018 · 263 posts · 469 votes7y
Seminars are very, very valuable...
Just ask the person collecting your debit/credit card number to sign you up for the program.
- Residential Real Estate Investor · Kansas City, MO · Member since 2014 · 10k+ posts · 5k+ votes7y
It obviously depends on the seminar. Most of them aren't scams, but some of them are very, very overpriced. My feel on Kiyosaki is that he is probably overpriced. I would just buy his books (or better yet, the books here at BP).
- Real Estate Broker · Seattle, WA · Member since 2018 · 27 posts · 16 votes7y@Brian Orr I attended https://response.com/ 3 day seminar in local hotel. I learned nothing new except that they were trying to sale 40k mentoring program to everyone. It is a scam but they are doing it. They are stealing older peoples saving. They only talk about their dream vacations and lifestyle and try to make fake promises with everyone. It is not that easy to become rich in couple years.
- Rental Property Investor · Tampa, FL · Member since 2016 · 208 posts · 96 votes7y
Thank you everyone for all of the information. I unfortunately fell for the $300 weekend seminar upgrade scam. I've been unable to attend for near a year now and am set to in a couple of weeks. I don't expect I can get a refund but at least I won't waste my time going... I've since read every book published by BP along with a load of others. I'm finding youtube to be a decent resource too as you can view Tony Robbins speeches and the like.
Anyway, thanks again for all of the input. I simply won't waste my time attending that as I've come to realize I probably won't get anything out of it I haven't learned already from BP and you all in the forums
- Rental Property Investor · Destin, FL · Member since 2016 · 91 posts · 55 votes7y
I recently attended a 2 day event that cost me $200. The program was put on by a site that has been on the BP podcast before. Although they are "gurus" I found them extremely approachable and genuine when speaking with them. However, there were multiple "coaching packages" offered for $10k ($20k for premium). I would never consider those options, however I found the seminar itself to be helpful and would recommend it for $200. I was able to network all weekend as well as meet investors that invested in areas that interest me. I also told others it felt like listening to podcasts for 2 days in a row. It was mentally exhausting, however I learned a ton.
- Walnut Creek, CA · Member since 2015 · 3k+ posts · 2k+ votes7y
Time is money, most people have one or the other. If you're short on time then yes you can find value in training BUT you need the money to execute. Training is an investment, just like a house except you're the investment.....
Now, on the flip side of things.... there's TONS of free information out there. If you have the time (and not the money) they you can spend some (or all) of it doing your own research. I can tell you from personal experience that it's slow, long, and at times boring... but the answer is out there. It's unlikely you're doing something new or that hasn't been done.... maybe not many have or currently do, but someone somewhere has/is. If you go the free route ask real questions that have real answers. Something Like hey I want to do a 1031, I have some land, but I want to trade it for a house, I think I can do that but wanted to make sure.......... goes a lot further than a generic I don't want to pay taxes on my land when I sale it, how do I do that. - 7yJohn MorganPro MemberRental Property Investor · Grand Prairie, TX · Member since 2018 · 2k+ posts · 2k+ votes@Brian Orr They all seem to be scams. I go to the freebie 2 hour seminars to learn a few nuggets about REI. But would never sign up for one of those rip off courses. Just research on your own. It’ll save you thousands.
- Rental Property Investor · San Diego, CA · Member since 2013 · 3k+ posts · 4k+ votes7y
Originally posted by @Dennis M.:
@Brian OrrFind A local -hardened landlord in your area who has been in the game a long time and offer to take him to dinner . You’ll learn more and it will be a whole lot cheaper than some guru coarse . You will certainly want to use BP as well . There is not one thing you will go through that hasn’t already been addressed on this site by another person
Dennis is right on. While it depends on how you learn (I’ve never read a book on my life about apartments. Or rich dad or anything else) and do okay. But I ran into people doing what I was trying to do and talked talked talked. Damn it was helpful.
- Rock Hill, SC · Member since 2015 · 1k+ posts · 597 votes7y
@brian Orr
Go to as many meeting or seinars as you can find time but leave your check book at home. For me I go to net work and meet folks. I like to hear sales pitches. Yet I been around long enough to know most dont need coaches. Yet finding good mentors or following along with some one who is a doing real estate not talking real estate. Two different things. Just like the gym 25 years ago I was clue in the gym. So paying for a trainere for a couple weeks was worth it. Yet paying for a trainer for 1 -3 years would have been rip off.
Yet networking in this business is so undervalued
Ask away my friend
Sorry for spelling and grammar been up since 3 am
Alex
Alex Originally posted by @Brian Orr:
I've heard multiple times on podcasts, people that speak of large value from continued education, conferences, seminars, etc... But i've also seen a few BP blog posts warning that they are scams... The one around here a lot is the Rich Dad education series. A 3 day course that's affiliated with Kiyosaki sounds great of course...
Can anybody suggest a list of helpful seminars and conferences vs. ones we know are scams?
- 7yJay HinrichsBusiness MemberReal Estate Consultant · Summerlin, NV · Member since 2014 · 45k+ posts · 66k+ votes
Originally posted by @Dennis M.:
@Brian OrrFind A local -hardened landlord in your area who has been in the game a long time and offer to take him to dinner . You’ll learn more and it will be a whole lot cheaper than some guru coarse . You will certainly want to use BP as well . There is not one thing you will go through that hasn’t already been addressed on this site by another person
one has to determine what their motivation is and what it is they truly want to do with real estate.. If the end goal is to simply be a landlord and build up cash flow assets.. this is pretty much real estate one O one.. a good broker or PM in your area that works in investment real estate will guide you .. and then for sure BP is the place to go to get advice on land lording hands down.. tons of landlords here who have seen everything there is to see in that game..
I think one of the attractions to the TV guru's and that's what i call the 10 or so that do infomercials and huge budgets and travel the country.. like snap flip.. than.. rich dad etc etc. they tend to talk about many things in real estate but at the base its basically the dream of most Americans IE real estate is your path to financial freedom ( and that varies by individual) and if you buy this course you will be on your way.. with total disregard to the individuals acumen to real estate or financial condition or abilities which as we know is a huge component.. some do quite well paying for these expensive courses and its just like the 1 million member BP club.. I can assure you not all 1 million are doing deals or have ever bought a rental.. they pop on get excited realize that this is just another JOB although a 1099 instead of w 2.. and some like it and flourish others well not so much.. much harder than it looks.
I just spent the week and will go back today in what many on BP would classify as a guru event.. ( invited guest speaker) and this is a very niche product.. and so that extent the audience from what I could see is pretty advanced.. most successful business owners looking to pivot and we were talking about deals starting at 2 million basically and up to 10 to 20 million.. but there were also a few that are starting at the bottom and paid to be there and i think while not cheap and most on BP would gasp.. but if they pull it off they will have far more success than most trying to buy a 200 a month cash flow rental.. their starter projects are going to make them 30 to 60k a year net first one out of the gate.. but question can they get there ??? this was and is a very good course with Non of the ra ra and zero up sell. but again advanced stuff much like you see with the apartment syndication guys that teach training..
- 7yStephanie P.Pro MemberWashington, DC Mortgage Lender/Broker · Member since 2016 · 4k+ posts · 2k+ votes
Originally posted by @Eva Brock:
@Stephanie Potter Thanks Stephanie! You just saved me ton of money.Glad I could help:) @Eva Brock
- Rental Property Investor · Sioux Falls, SD · Member since 2015 · 9k+ posts · 18k+ votes7y
@Brian Orr these seminars are scams meant to up-sell you to the next scam. The funniest thing, which I have even heard on the BP podcast, is the idea that some people "need" to spend $50K on a program, because that is the only way they can get motivated. It is a completely asinine concept. It is the idea that unless they go all-in, they will not be committed. Here is what it boils down to, some people get suckered into these scams. In order to save face, they tell everyone it was "just what they needed". It is easier than admitting you were scammed. We all do it. How many of us have made bad decisions and lost money, yet we always call it a "price of education". It is human nature to justify our past mistakes. I do it too, so no worries.
Bottom line is with the quality and amount of free or cheap education available on the internet, there is NO reason you would ever need to spend $50K on a guru program.
That $50K in real estate should be spent on property acquisition. Common sense people.
Next time someone tells you "some people need to spend $50K on a guru", either they are trying to sell you a program or they were scammed by such a program.
I miss @Joshua D. voice of reason on the podcast. His strong anti-guru message saved thousands of people from getting soaked by guru. That is what BP is all about, the idea that people share ideas for free and if you want to spend a few dollars, BP can offer low cost education that is higher quality than any guru.
- Specialist · Dayton, OH · Member since 2018 · 59 posts · 41 votes7y@Brian Orr just know when you go they will try to sell you something. If you have the purpose and intention when you show up that you will be using this seminar the same you do a REI meet up, you will walk away with great connections. I teamed up with a couple people I saw buying the 50k program and know I can use the network they bought into, YOU DONT HAVE TO BE THE SMARTEST GUY IN THE ROOM TO DO THIS... The short is: have a plan when attending and you won’t get burnt.
- Rental Property Investor · Erie, PA · Member since 2018 · 6k+ posts · 9k+ votes7y
I’m naturally a cynic so when I hear about people spending 20 grand to buy into a dream and attend a RE seminar I think “ how can anyone be so stupid and naive to pay this Ludacris amount and have their hand held because they are scared “ the other side of my brain says “!what if ~ for this guy~ he had to put 20 grand of his hard earned money into this to be pushed into a bigger context and begin investing in his future by using real estate . I guess to frame it into a question ; would 20 grand be too much of a price for a man to pay if it meant he would actually begin in investing in his family’s future and got off the couch away from the idiot box ?
Join the conversationCreate a free account to reply, vote on answers and follow this thread.