Multifamily Coaching Programs - Are they worth the investment?

Multifamily Coaching Programs - Are they worth the investment?

Investor · Austin, TX · Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 7 votes

My wife and I have been investing in real estate for the past 20 years and we have decided we want to focus on multifamily investing in order to scale up cashflow and create wealth at a more rapid pace. We are also entrepreneurs who have run a successful marketing firm since 2011, so we have experience building a business from scratch, hiring, marketing, building and leading teams, high-level negotiating, etc.  We are go-getters who are looking to scale up fast, but we also realize that we need to do it right. We've already taken a few online courses and read some books, so we're getting our head around the multi-family syndication business. And we realize that it IS a full-time business. All that being said, we're considering hiring a mentor who can provide guidance, keep us from making mistakes, and partner with us to close deals since we don't yet have the experience and investor network to close deals on our own. We have come across Michael Blank, Mark and Tamiel Kenny, and Brad Somrock as potential mentors to work with. Can anyone share from personal experience working with any of these guys? Or perhaps another mentorship program? And in general, do you believe it is worth the 25k+ price tag? Or do you think we could network to find mentor/partners and avoid the large up-front investment? 

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Investor · Tucson, AZ · Member since 2017 · 394 posts · 178 votes
4y

@Mike Lawrence  Pay the price.  It will be well worth it as long as you are willing to put in the work and time.  Let me put it this way.  1 year of coaching for me-  136 doors later...

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  • Greg ScottPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · SE Michigan · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    4y

    In the scheme of Multifamily Syndication, $25K for education and mentoring is a drop in the bucket compared to the cost of doing it wrong.

    My wife and I had 6 SF rentals when we found Lifestyles Unlimited about a decade ago.  We no longer own SF rentals.  Instead we are invested passively in 25 different apartments across the United States and manage two large apartments in Indianapolis.  In total we have over 4K units.  We've now both retired from 6-figure W2 jobs.

    Lifestyles Unlimited is based out of Houston, but has offices in several cities. They have been around over 30 years and have over 50K members.  I don't think anyone else can touch those numbers.

  • Investor · Austin, TX · Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 7 votes
    4y

    Thanks Greg for the feedback! We'll add Lifestyles Unlimited to our list to research. Congrats on all of your success!

  • Toronto, ON · Member since 2018 · 102 posts · 61 votes
    4y

    have you looked at Rod Kheif and Joe Fairless's program? might be worth adding to the list

  • Investor · Austin, TX · Member since 2021 · 11 posts · 7 votes
    4y

    Thanks Kash for the recommendations! We'll add them to our list. 

  • Real Estate Syndicator · Milwaukee, WI · Member since 2018 · 1k+ posts · 907 votes
    4y

    I personally never did one of the high-cost courses, but I do think it speed tracks your journey.  The networking in those groups is the most valuable part.  Especially if you are looking for partners.  That being said, there are tons of low cost or free education and networking opportunities out there to learn the business. 

  • Investor · Tucson, AZ · Member since 2017 · 394 posts · 178 votes
    4y

    @Mike Lawrence  Pay the price.  It will be well worth it as long as you are willing to put in the work and time.  Let me put it this way.  1 year of coaching for me-  136 doors later...

  • Toronto, ON · Member since 2018 · 102 posts · 61 votes
    4y
    Quote from @Colby Fryar:

    @Mike Lawrence  Pay the price.  It will be well worth it as long as you are willing to put in the work and time.  Let me put it this way.  1 year of coaching for me-  136 doors later...


     Congrats - who was your coach?

  • New to Real Estate · Miami, FL · Member since 2022 · 9 posts · 2 votes
    4y

    Hi @Mike Lawrence! Just like you I have been thinking into mentorship programs and I have gone to Multifamily Mindset ($40K), Apartment Educators ($20K) which is based in Texas, and now I am looking into RE Mentor (mentor of co-founder of Multifamily Mindset) and it's a 3 day seminar for $1500 (but they end up giving you a *one time discount* if you sign up during the free 2 hour event for $995 but it is possible to sign up for their mentorship program through their website if you can't go to their free event). I also found Brad Sumrok's apartment investing program ($35K for you and your spouse or $25K individual) which is also based in Texas. 

    Links: 

    https://bradsumrok.com/masterm...

    https://rementor.com/homepage/...

    https://themultifamilymindset....

    https://www.apartmenteducators...

  • Real Estate Broker · Coppell, TX · Member since 2011 · 5k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    4y

    One thing I would suggest is before signing up for mentoring is to attend one of their 2 or 3 day events.  Almost all of them have one.  Not online...make the commitment to go in person.  Most of these are fairly cheap education.  Talk to the people who are there.  Network like crazy.

    I also tend to think you should invest passively in 2-3 deals before signing up. Get the lingo down, see what others are doing, see how the communication is, listen to 100 pitches for LPs, get on the deal flow lists, get on some property tours. listen to the podcasts for 2-3 months. Go to the meetups...(although I don't hear about them in Austin, for sure there are great ones in Houston and Dallas. Then you can really hit the ground running with a good base knowledge and not waste time learning all this. That should help you maximize your ROI on the mentoring.

  • Rental Property Investor · DFW TX · Member since 2018 · 179 posts · 260 votes
    4y

    Knowing NOTHING about RE, my wife dragged me to a meeting in 2010.  Met Brad Sumrok, who presented the two day program.  I jumped into MF as the math made sense to me.  I have become a serial Passive Investor; at first I like my job, now retired and I like my free time. Just invested in deal #61 (25 have gone full cycle, so holding about 35). We are invested in a lot of doors, but heck, I really only own the doorknobs, ie, a small portion of each property.  Never went the Sponsor route, but will say they do make more money and do a bit more work. 

    In this hobby, one attends a lot of meet-up to make contacts.  During on such session, the presenter (a sponsor) spent the hour describing all the trials and tribulations of being a sponsor.  Honestly, the message I walked away with was "Invest in the Education!".  

    Add Brad Sumrok to your list, he is worth checking out.

    Regards!

  • Will BarnardPro Member
    Moderator
    Developer · Santa Clarita, CA · Member since 2008 · 15k+ posts · 10k+ votes
    4y

    Have you thought about investing in a syndication passively first and get your feet wet before trying to go at it alone? Experience has always been my best educator and owning a piece of a pie and watching/learning from those who have done it for years is a potential strategy for you in place of or before you spend money on seminars.

  • Rental Property Investor · Chalfont, PA · Member since 2021 · 189 posts · 90 votes
    4y

    I now many of the BP podcasts do not recommend these high cost seminars and coaches however, I guess it depends how much money you have to invest.  I am a little frustrated at how maybe people suggest syndication because most syndication requires you to be a accredited investor, which not everyone qualifies for, especially younger investors.

  • Rental Property Investor · DFW TX · Member since 2018 · 179 posts · 260 votes
    4y

    Brian - I'm sorry that you've had that experience.  Of the now 61 syndication I have invested in, I think 2 or 3 were Reg D 506 (c) required only accredited investors.  The rest were Reg D 506 (b) that allowed up to 35 sophisticated investors, but required a substantive pre-existing relationship with the sponsor.  Look for meet-ups and groups in your area or that are on-line.  I assure you there are sharks looking for chum; and YES, vet those sponsors. I have to admit that I met a lot of future deal sponsors (GPs) in the mentorship group I joined.  There is something to walking into a room where 95% of the folks in that room are interested in MF syndications (5% are lost, in the wrong room).  

    Be aware some meetups funnel you to a particular sponsor, some funnel you to a particular mentorship group, and some are actually non-denominational.  Keep your eyes open.

    Regards.

  • Investor · Round Rock, TX · Member since 2010 · 8k+ posts · 4k+ votes
    4y

    I attend meetings regularly with recent "graduates" of programs like this.  Some are knowledgeable, but many have inflated egos and cite how many doors they "own."  This is generally code for they invested $25k in a sponsor's project among a few million dollars of syndicated preferred equity capital and it generally is in some type of hoped-for reposition project.  Many of these projects derive 50% or more of their overall profits from reversion cap rate assumptions and some type of compression that probably doesn't exist in the current environment.  

    Education is important, but I think the decision of how to invest money needs to hinge on how much capital you're likely to have to deploy to various activities and how much time you intend to invest actively managing deals versus selling your time into other productive endeavors.  If you're solely looking to invest passively longer-term you're probably better off finding a reputable syndicator and investing passively.  If you're hoping to be a co-GP and learn to both operate and raise capital then I think investing money in a good education system is probably money well spent.  

    A lot can be learned by reading books, watching online content, and learning as much as possible about raising and organizing money via a syndication or private fund.  You'll add more value for a co-GP situation if you can raise and organize capital by leveraging the collective GP's track record as an apprentice.  

  • Rental Property Investor · Chalfont, PA · Member since 2021 · 189 posts · 90 votes
    4y

    @Charles LeMaire Thanks Charles...we need a podcast on how to vet out the sharks, lol

  • Greg ScottPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · SE Michigan · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    4y
    Quote from @Brian Plajer:

    I now many of the BP podcasts do not recommend these high cost seminars and coaches however, I guess it depends how much money you have to invest.  I am a little frustrated at how maybe people suggest syndication because most syndication requires you to be a accredited investor, which not everyone qualifies for, especially younger investors.


    When BP first hit the scene, it was packed with lots of people who felt that education should be free.  BP forums were filled with lots of ideas on how to make money in real estate.  The problem was that some of the ideas were good but many were bad, or illegal.  I've run into a lot of people on this platform that were offended at the idea of paying for good education.  Ironically, BP is now organizing content and CHARGING for access to that content, so they've gone full cycle.  (Anyone a Pro member here?)

    As for me, if I were back to square one, knowing what I now know, I would instantly spend the money again for the program we invested in.  Several thousand dollars of training is insignificant relative to the profit it has brought us.

  • Rental Property Investor · Dallas, Austin · Member since 2018 · 246 posts · 213 votes
    4y

    Great question! I own few SF doors.  Last year I became passive investor to MF deal.  And now I’m currently looking into joining under Brad Sumrock.  I went to one of his seminars right before the shelter in place ordeal.  So I backed out.  But since then I’ve done a lot of research and some networking.  I’m now ready to make the jump to MF and sell a few of my doors to move that money to MF.  This has actually been a long time goal for me!  

  • Rental Property Investor · DFW TX · Member since 2018 · 179 posts · 260 votes
    4y

    @Brian Plajer  - I find a lot of value (translation: ability to sleep at night) in the Sumrok network, because I get to meet, talk, and get to know the folks I invest with.  I prefer the Reg D 506 (b) model of knowing the GPs.  

  • Rental Property Investor · Chalfont, PA · Member since 2021 · 189 posts · 90 votes
    4y

    @Nina Hayden Let us know how it goes

  • Rental Property Investor · Fairfield, CT · Member since 2015 · 22 posts · 2 votes
    3y

    Late to the game to reply.   Here's my take - find a good group can be well worth it.  A couple of issues, I find a lot of "new" coaches haven't ironed out the wrinkles in their program and are haphazardly putting it together as they go along, which opens the door for a lot of wasted time.   The bigger programs raised their rates ridiculously and provide a lot of generic outdated material.  But if you're going to pay, be ready to integrate yourself so you stand out from the others.  Invest as an LP.   

  • New to Real Estate · Nationwide · Member since 2024 · 4 posts · 0 votes
    1y

    @Mike Lawrence: what have you and your wife decided in terms of MF coaching?  Did you guys decide to solely own MF apartments or go with syndication or both?  I am considering MF solely owned properties first only because of consistent cash flow.  A syndication will only pay out quarterly and the bonus is towards the end when then sell/re-refi etc.  

    I am looking for MF investment(s) with cash flow so that I can exit my W2.  

    And am actively looking for a coach to guide me through (1) identify a market - city/state (2) assemble / shape a deal (3) execute the deal and (4) help orchestrate a onsite team to run my first MF. Many are self proclaimed coaches but only have done SF and not MF and for instance, do not have network of off-market MF deals nor know any wholesalers. I am looking for a coach whi has already done MF investing themselves and have a network of investors that could potentially present off-market deals....

    Love to hear what you guys have decided.

  • Investor · Tucson, AZ · Member since 2017 · 394 posts · 178 votes
    1y

    @Kash Jawed  Jens Nielsen Open Doors Capital.

  • Rental Property Investor · Colorado Springs, CO · Member since 2014 · 47 posts · 10 votes
    1y
    Quote from @Greg Scott:

    In the scheme of Multifamily Syndication, $25K for education and mentoring is a drop in the bucket compared to the cost of doing it wrong.

    My wife and I had 6 SF rentals when we found Lifestyles Unlimited about a decade ago.  We no longer own SF rentals.  Instead we are invested passively in 25 different apartments across the United States and manage two large apartments in Indianapolis.  In total we have over 4K units.  We've now both retired from 6-figure W2 jobs.

    Lifestyles Unlimited is based out of Houston, but has offices in several cities. They have been around over 30 years and have over 50K members.  I don't think anyone else can touch those numbers.

    So you don’t own your own Multifamily buildings? You are an investor right? What benefit is paying a coach if you only intend to passively invest.  

    I agree that the cost can be outrageous, and it may be worth it if they truly live up to their end of the deal with oversight, reviewing your deals, avoiding legal traps, yeah there’s a lot we don’t know starting out.

    But I for one don’t want to be a syndicator. I just want some general guidance on how to buy a 10 unit with my own money or rolling 3-5 of my SFH over in a 1031. So that respect it seems kind of expensive. but again, I personally have not hired any of these coaches.

  • Gino BarbaroPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · St Augustine, FL · Member since 2014 · 2k+ posts · 1k+ votes
    1y

    @Zigmunt Smigaj

    Syndication is only one part of multifamily. You still need to buy the asset, finance it, and manage the deals. I bet passive investors had been working with coaches to underwrite the deals they've been investing in the past two years. I guarantee most of those deals would not have been funded.

    Gino

  • Greg ScottPro Member
    Rental Property Investor · SE Michigan · Member since 2014 · 4k+ posts · 6k+ votes
    1y
    Quote from @Zigmunt Smigaj:
    So you don’t own your own Multifamily buildings? You are an investor right? What benefit is paying a coach if you only intend to passively invest.  

    I agree that the cost can be outrageous, and it may be worth it if they truly live up to their end of the deal with oversight, reviewing your deals, avoiding legal traps, yeah there’s a lot we don’t know starting out.

    But I for one don’t want to be a syndicator. I just want some general guidance on how to buy a 10 unit with my own money or rolling 3-5 of my SFH over in a 1031. So that respect it seems kind of expensive. but again, I personally have not hired any of these coaches.

    I am invested passively in about 50 syndications.

    My wife and I have also syndicated four property purchases:   24-unit, a 272-unit, a 281-unit, and a 277-unit.  The 24-unit we sold in 2020 and the last three we still own and manage. We are the sole GP on all these deals so are not just money-raisers relying on an operating partner.

    Finding and operating a property is pretty much the same whether you are a syndicator or buy it yourself.  I found the education to be very valuable from that perspective.

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